Positive Advice For Newbies

[Kuna]

Doll,

You're still adding no value and unable to support your assertions.

Are you going to become one of those RW that ends up just being a pain in the a$$?

[Doll]

but if you stick around RWD long enough

I've been reading the boards like this since 2002, hon. Maxx's story including
(Don't beat me while Ed is sleeping!!!!!!!!!!!! )

[Doll]

Doll,

You're still adding no value and unable to support your assertions.

Are you going to become one of those RW that ends up just being a pain in the a$$?

Both Ed and me explained it many times!
Know nothing about a$$

[Jet]

OK I muddled through this entire thread this morning 
I'm pretty well convinced that neither the "risk" camp nor the "no risk" camp are going to budge 

Of course there are risks involved for both the man and the woman, and any one of those risks may not be SPECIFIC exactly to, and only to, searching for love abroad. One may expose themselves to the same financial risk dating locally as dating abroad. One may expose themselves to the same travel risks flying for business, as flying to meet a woman. One may expose themselves to the same risk of falling victim to crime & corruption when travelling as a tourist, as when spending time abroad with a woman/man from another country. One may expose themselves to the risk associated with language barrier when using an interpreter to help negotiate a contract, as well as when trying to determine a potential husband's or wife's true intentions. RARELY do all of these different risks get mixed together in a single endeavor as they do in international dating. This, I believe is what KenC is talking about.

Recently we read the story of Felix's appendix removal. Thankfully, everything went smoothly. What if they had botched the operation? Would he (or his family if he had died) have been able to seek the same recourse as if he'd flown to St. Louis? Absolutely not - it is a RISK associated with international dating.

Taz told us a few days ago of a traffic stop that resulted in a shakedown for cash. Would this have happened if they'd have been stopped outside Philadelphia? Probably not. Would they have the same rights if the cops had decided too press the issue? Absolutely not - it is a RISK associated with international dating.

A few years ago I left Miami with a valid visa on November 2, at midnite that night new visa regulations went into effect and I arrived at 4pm on November 3 to find out the rules had changed. Would this have happened if I were meeting a girl in New Orleans? Nope - it is a RISK associated with international dating.

None of these examples are SPECIFIC to international dating, but all of them are ASSOCIATED with international dating, and newbies should be aware that they exist.

[GreginGa]

Doll,

You're still adding no value and unable to support your assertions.

Are you going to become one of those RW that ends up just being a pain in the a$$?

Over the years I've ran into a couple of RW/UW that ended up being rather pleasant to talk to on these forums. When I say a couple I mean 3 or 4 at the most. I remember Lily being very nice,very easy on the eyes and not at all combative. I think there were maybe 2 more but it's been so long ago that their names escape me. Seems like one lived in Alaska with her husband and he had a ponytail or a mullet. She was good looking as well. Everything turns into a debate and there is no way in hell of ever winning this debate. I do enjoy the ones that post and have a good attitude towards this process.

[Doll]

Эдик, сдаемся  

[Doll]

 Amazing! Those who don't agree are pain in the a$$, those who do- just sweethearts.
Would same work for me (and Ed in this thread)? I guess 

[Catman]

One bit of advice I have learned from here is to make many trips after meeting the right one. You have to make many trips and spend a lot of time with your FSUW so the two of you can get to know each other and make sure she is the one. This is to minimize risk. I recently read another thread somewhere in this forum about guys who couldn't afford this adventure and were borrowing money to make the first trip No wonder there are marriages that fail if time wasn't spent getting to know each other.
I guess I'll have to read your trip report again KenC

[Doll]

I do enjoy the ones that post and have a good attitude towards this process.

Ed, see? If we say that there is not a big risk (if you put your mind in it)- it is NOT positive.
Just heroes of the USA!  :noidea:
Ok, мир -дружба-чизкейк и памятник при жизни 

[felix8787]

I read pretty much all of this thread yesterday and finish reading the new post that have been put up.

IMOPO there are risks involved when persuing RW, I personally have contemplated with this since 96, but didn't really have time or the resources and the proper information for this type of adventure.
When I started corresponding with in early 06, I did all the research that I could possibly do and started learning Russian, I sent flowers to a lady and got her pic to make sure she is real and sent a teddy to another for the same reason, I have gotten all of their contact information and address etc. etc..... But something of great importance came up and I stopped corresponding with them and focused on that for a little over a years time.
Then when I started my search again, I did more research and read all about the red flags before coming to RWD.  Finally after months of weeding down the women who I thought weren't sincere or what not, I made plans to go and that's when I found RWD and joined and read everything that I could read about experiences from other people who have gone to FSU.
Are there risks involved in this.......YES......financially, emotionally, physically (from experience) , to say that the risk is low or none  for an AM is absurd. Anything could of happened to me while I was there and I mean anything.
Her brother is police officer, who's to say that he couldn't of done something to really mess me up with me being there, but he didn't b/c IMO he is a down to earth fellow Russian and I guess you could say that we were friends. My operation could have gone sour (use your imagination) and they could of ripped me off financially. Fortunately I was lucky enough not to have experienced those downsides of the risks involved when going there.
Will this deter me from going back....no way... I'm hooked  . But now I am armed with more knowledge and personal experience when I make my travel to the FSU to meet RW.

felix8787

[Kuna]

Amazing! Those who don't agree are pain in the a$$, those who do- just sweethearts.
Would same work for me (and Ed in this thread)? I guess 

Doll,

It's not that... and now you're just being immature.

I believe RW opinions are given more consideration in here than anyone but you should realise just saying, "there is no risk for men" doesn't mean there's actually no risk for men.

No matter how many times you say it, it still doesn't make it true.

If on the other hand you put some substance, argumentor reason behind your assertion we might be able to understand you - and you might even teach us something.

Others around you may react to the loudest or most assertive comments but personally I enjoy logic, reason and fact.

Now...  would you care to tell us why Eduards services would be required if there's no risk?  

[Misha]

I have been readings this thread with interest. I agree with Doll that the risks that are being listed relate to travel, more than marrying a woman from another country. What are the risks? I will present and evaluate some of the potential risks from a Canadian perspective (our immigration laws are different from the United States and Australia):

Risk 1: Traveling to another country. Yes, there are risks. What are my options? To stay at home and never travel anywhere ever? What can I say, life is risky, there is no need to whine.

Risk 2: I will marry someone who simply wants me for permanent residence. This is a risk that can be minimized by getting to know someone before you get married. And, by getting to know someone, I men spending months with them. Worst case scenario? I have to pay three years worth of financial support. A woman in Canada does not have to wait 2 years to get permanent residence: she gets it immediately and can leave within weeks of arriving if things don't work out. No need to file any false DV charges. However, there is nothing stopping a judge from imposing support payments if a Canadian man marries a Canadian woman and gets divorced. 

Risk 3: Her application for permanent residence will be refused. To avoid this, you require spending lots of time with her to show that it is not a marriage of convenience which brings us back to risk 2.

Risk 4: Because of cultural differences, the marriage will fall apart and I will be left heartbroken. How exactly is this different from a marriage with a local woman? There are cultural differences within Canada as well as class differences as well as differences due to religion and family upbringing. I have known people who were married in Canada and separated within months or a couple of years because of "irreconcilable" differences. If anything, because of Canadian immigration laws, it is easier for two Canadians to elope and get married on a whim than a Canadian having to marry a foreigner. When you a marriage license, nobody will ask you to prove that it is not a marriage of convenience and they will not ask you how you met and how much time you spent together. No, you can meet in the morning and get the marriage license later in the day.

All told, the risks are those related to travel and those risks that are inherent to marriage. The biggest hurdle is culture shock, but that lasts a year or so. The other risks can be dealt with by getting to know your partner before marrying them.   

[Gator]

Enough!  Doll and some others believe that the risks are greater for the RW than for the man.  KenC and others point out that the risks for men are not inconsequential.

Can we admit that there is risk for both the man and woman?!  If anyone says "no,"  you are an idiot.

Given that there are risks, how can men and women mitigate the risks?   Easy, Catman explained it above - spend a lot of time together.   Spend enough time together:

-  to know each other,
-  to develop a solid, enduring relationship,
-  to become focused on aligned goals,
-  and to understand fully what life would be after marriage.  

And most important, love takes time for which there is no substitute.

With these risks comes immense rewards, and  RWD is replete with stories of these rewards awaiting us all if we choose our mate correctly.  The risk::reward ratio compelled me to undertake the venture.  Nevertheless, if a man or woman is risk averse, this venture is not for them.  

[Ooooops]

What I don't understand is why is it so important to convince your opposition that it's very dangerous endeavor - to get married to a foreigner?   

[Misha]

Now...  would you care to tell us why Eduards services would be required if there's no risk?  

Ed's services, from what I gather, minimize the risks of being ripped off by an agency  How many men here have complained that they spent thousands of dollars writing women that were paid by the agencies to lead men on and keep them writing so fees could be charged to translate letters and phone calls.

What Ed does is basically what I did myself as I knew Russian: look on free Russian dating sites. The advantage: the numbers and the lack of expectations. Using the free Russian sites, you can meet women that were not looking specifically for a foreigner. We can debate that point, but I see that as a big advantage.

[Misha]

Can we admit that there is risk for both the man and woman?!  If anyone says "no,"  you are an idiot.

I agree that there are risks inherent to any marriage, but as they say in Russia, without risk, you will never drink the champagne! In other words, without risking failure, you will never know success. All you can do is mitigate the risks and that is true when planning to get married to anyone.

[Gator]

What I don't understand is why is it so important to convince your opposition that it's very dangerous endeavor - to get married to a foreigner?   

I did not find it dangerous and I don't believe it is dangerous.  People get killed every day driving automobiles, yet I do not consider driving cars as dangerous.  Racing cars, yes! 

[felix8787]

I also do believe that there is also a risk with RW, in any case there are equal risk factors for both AM and RW who go down this path of life.
Probably more so financially and emotionally....I don't know...I'm just putting in my 2 cents.
But the rewards is well worth it in the end when you do find that right RW. Through all of the risk taken.

felix8787

[Eduard]

Are there risks involved in this.......YES......financially, emotionally, physically (from experience) , to say that the risk is low or none  for an AM is absurd. Anything could of happened to me while I was there and I mean anything.
Her brother is police officer, who's to say that he couldn't of done something to really mess me up with me being there, but he didn't b/c IMO he is a down to earth fellow Russian and I guess you could say that we were friends. My operation could have gone sour (use your imagination) and they could of ripped me off financially. Fortunately I was lucky enough not to have experienced those downsides of the risks involved when going there.
Will this deter me from going back....no way... I'm hooked  . But now I am armed with more knowledge and personal experience when I make my travel to the FSU to meet RW.
felix8787

Good, reasonable post Felix. I guess what I am trying to say is that there are risks in anything you do in life, from the time you get up from the bed, go to the shower, you might fall down on a slippery wet floor and break your head, you might get into a car crash going to your local grocery store, you might walk in a convinience store as it is getting robbed and get shot, etc. What I don't see is how and why getting a RW is more of a risk then getting an AW.
you wrote: to say that the risk is low or none  for an AM is absurd. Anything could of happened to me while I was there and I mean anything. is it any different here in the US? Anything can happen here as well. I've been held at gun point in NY, crashed into while driving, witnessed robbery, assaults and even death. My point is that  anythingcan really happen anywhere

you wrote: Her brother is police officer, who's to say that he couldn't of done something to really mess me up with me being there, but he didn't b/c IMO he is a down to earth fellow Russian and I guess you could say that we were friends.
let's say we have the same scenario here in the US, and the brother  of the girl you are trying to date really doesn't like you. He also happens to be a Louisiana cop who also happen to make extra money by robbing drug dealers and contracting for organised crime (true story, I know the guy) Do you think that there wouldn't be any risk envolved in dating his sister if he hates your guts?

you wrote: My operation could have gone sour (use your imagination) but it didn't!
and they could of ripped me off financially. but they didn't, because you were smart about it. you mean to tell me that people don't get ripped off financially here in the US??? I personally know a guy that married a gold digger`AW who was married 6 times before him. She is a beautiful blond who only marries rich men and in a couple of years takes them for everything she can, then moves on to the next victim. They speak the same language and are from the same culture, yet they still fall victim to her. Is that a risk? Off course it is!

All I'm saying is that getting a RW is not neccessarily more risky. Harder - yes, more inconvinient - yes, requires more research - yes, in many cases requires hiring 3d party help - yes, but risky...? I'm not so sure. Unless you are a hermit who never leaves his home you'd be pretty much facing the same risks as looking for a woman anywhere in the civilised world. And when you find a good woman it is all worth while. And you sure have a lot more choices in the FSU in regard to women compared to the USA. That's another big risk here in the US, you might stay single for the rest of your life... At this point, I don't see that being a risk if you are looking for an FSU woman.

Fortunately I was lucky enough not to have experienced those downsides of the risks involved when going there. I am sinceraly happy that you didn't and hopefully nothing bad happens to you here in the US

[Eduard]

Эдик, сдаемся  

NIKOGDA!!! "otstupat' nekuda, pozadi Moskva!"
Never!!! "Nowhere to retreat, behind us - Moscow!"

[Blues Fairy]

Hmmmm....
I would say that for me, the risks of marrying this particular foreigner were much less than the risks of staying in Russia and NOT marrying this particular foreigner. 

[Eduard]

Hmmmm....
I would say that for me, the risks of marrying this particular foreigner were much less than the risks of staying in Russia and NOT marrying this particular foreigner. 

I hear you loud and clear
I've been saying this all along that many beautiful, smart and well educated women in the FSU have very limited choices when it comes to local men.
But the original argument wasn't the AM risk VS RW risk. It was about the risk for a WM getting a RW VS a Western wife.

[Blues Fairy]

I hear you loud and clear
I've been saying this all along that many beautiful, smart and well educated women in the FSU have very limited choices when it comes to local men.

Eduard, you have misinterpreted my post.  I had plenty of choices back home.  The idea was not to marry just any foreigner, but this particular one.

[Eduard]

Eduard, you have misinterpreted my post.  I had plenty of choices back home.  The idea was not to marry just any foreigner, but this particular one.

I'm sorry that i missunderstood you. I guess you trully found your "second half'! that's wonderful

[Jet]

But the original argument wasn't the AM risk VS RW risk. It was about the risk for a WM getting a RW VS a Western wife.

OK I'll give you just one specific risk - The risk of family and friends meddling and using their influence. While this may happen with AW, there is the distinct advantage of a shared language where a husband has the opportunity to talk and reason with her family and friends. Unless your wife's entire social network is fluent in English, or you are fluent in Russian you will never get them to fully understand things from your perspective. Yes there are interpreters, most of which are highly professional, but there is a reason they are called interpreters and not translators.