Risky Business

[steviej]

Groov,
Great point!
My standards for marriage are a little higher than just knowing the woman isn't a scammer.  The problem as you pointed out is that some guys cannot get the concept of the old MOB's out of their head.  Check the catalog: Is she pretty enough? check!  Is she young enough? check! Is she dumb enough? check! Is she desperate enough? Check!  OK honey, lemme tell ya bout what a K-1 is all about. :selfharm:

As anyone with the slightest bit of common sense should understand that knowing that the woman is not out to use you for nefarious purposes is just the minimum qualities to begin a real relationhip. There is a long long way to go from there.
KenC

I like the way you put that - what that "check-list" thing - great!!

[felix8787]

After reading these post from everyone including ambach's, I have got add to this. I am not married, I have a child out of wedlock, I am not wealthy, I have 3 jobs, day job/night job/military. I have been to FSU to be with one woman. I plan on going over again.

I didn't have a plan, nor will I ever have one, I went there by the seat of my pants. I have written my TR to the best of my ability (yes I know that it sucked) but the most important thing for me was that I hit the ground running and never looking back. My experience was minimal at best compared to others on the board. But coming home from being in FSU for almost a month was well worth it and then some.

I don't describe myself to these women that I am rich, well off or anything that describes that I have money to burn. I will tell them exactly was is going on and if they can't handle it, then I will just move on.

To read ambach's post....I would have to laugh everytime....He wants a RW not because he loves her and visa versa, but because it is obligated to her to stay in the marriage bc he can offer her a better life...I have read the posts about the prenup that he keeps saying in his post. This is to protect his financial security and if things don't work out then he will throw her back in the pond kind of deal and then cast his line out again.

He doesn't want to be with a doctor or probably anyone that has good credentials (university degree), doesn't want divorced woman (probably damaged goods in his mind), nor does he want a woman with a child.

I my mind, I am trying to formulate what it is that he is looking for.
So I came up with this: Woman must not have good job or good credentials in the initial interview process, for purposes of having better life with him and no possibility of leaving him bc of the better life that he gave her, she should FEEL obligated to stay with him.
She can't have been previously married bc lord knows it will lead to another divorce regardless of how much she loves him errr...money.  
So what if she has a child, that child will have a better life bc of you! You should pat yourself on the back for taking this child away from such a poverish situation and opening up a whole new world of living the good life. You know, a corvette power wheels w/working head lights and radio (how cool), gap kids clothing, forget the wal-mart stuff, brand spankin new top of the line toys from Toy R Us.

I am trying to picture how this would work? She signs the pre-nup basically stating you are S.O.L should you leave the marriage for whatever reason. You are so afraid of her getting her hands in your cookie jar if it fails. Won't she have her hands in the cookie jar as your wife? Or are you going to put her on some sort of allowance?

All the planning in the world to find a RW will not guaranty anything your first time out, it is a shame that all of these other very experienced members are giving you sound advice and yet are deaf to them....AND....you are giving advice like you have been there and done that w/years of experience, which makes no sense to me.

Dark suit $600

interview and k-1 in a year or less 5000+

Trainwreck= PRICELESS  

Groovls
I get a laugh on reading your post regarding ambach.

felix8787

[Ronnie]

Scott,

You do understand the extreme exception you and your wife are at this point in time.  I don't think you guys are even 1 in a 100, I would put it closer to 1 in 5,000 or so.

Even so, can you honestly say there is no way that at some date in the future, you and you wife won't look at each other and "say, enough of this stuff, let's settle down in one place...Utah." ???

I don't think you can.  As much as I loved living in Italy (in the good old days of 500 Lire haircuts and 1,000 lire for pizza margherita (620 Lire = $1), I it felt good so good to be back in the USA.  Ah heck, you tell 'em Linda!

[youtube=425,350]http://youtube.com/watch?v=Bf5uKyFDzRs[/youtube]

[catzenmouse]

Groov, KenC, AJ,

 Great stuff there! 

 Can't claim the 5 year thing just yet. We're a few months short of 4 years but I have no doubt at all that we'll easily pass that mark by a good margin.

 Like AJ I did all kinds of dumb things along the way and her needs were much more important to me than mine were, regardless of whether we stayed together or not. I would never put her in a situation where she would be struggling to survive after she gave up everything in her life and moved half way around the world to a completely alien culture to be with me. To do that someone would have to be worse than the lowest slime on earth.

We knew each other for about 8 months before we married and the key thing, for me anyway, was what KenC mentioned about love, respect, and trust. We've been through plenty of struggles with adjustment issues etc. and each one of them has continued to solidify our commitment to each other and our future together. I did not, nor would I ever have considered a prenup as IMO that is a sissy way out of doing the right thing. If we ended tomorrow she is more than welcome to all that we have and I would happily give it to her. She deserves it.

Sometimes you can do everything right and everything smart and still fall face first in a pile of sh!t. Other times you can put a blindfold on and walk through a mine field without a scratch. I was somewhere in the middle but leaned towards the blindfold scenario.

The difference I see in some folks recently is that they have the ability to take off the blindfold but choose to pretend it isn't there and go happily along their path believing that they can actually see what is going on.

Ken

[Ronnie]

I think the reason arranged marriages work out better is that 3rd parties are doing a job of objectively evaluating each person.  We can't do that for ourselves and still be vulnerable to strong emotion.  It's why doctors are not permitted to operate on their own parents, children or spouses.   Lack of objectivity.

[Jumper]

ronnie-
just to play devils advocate..
how do you know scott's wife doesnt feel EXACTLY that way everytime she returns to ukraine?
it would make perfect sense ?

my wife ,misses Ukraine quite a bit,, of course it is mostly over friends and family.
Granted being here ,establishing those types of ties and personal relationships for 5 years now has lessened that,
and makes this just as much"home"
She actually feels a bit torn,, as in Ukraine at times she can feel a stranger in a strange place anymore....

but in GENERAL ,yes when she retuns to ukraine , there are many small things that make her feel MORE relaxed ,more "at ease" and  at "home"
simple familiarity with the surroundings, sights ,smells.. foods,
dress styles , the culture in general..
somethings are frustating ,, and not so nice..
others bring a warmth and remembrence that is impossible to replace in another location than the one you grew up in.

 Honestly its hard to imagine that your wife doesnt feel that way as well , if/when she visits there?
simply from the ease of language situition for her ?
i would think that a huge relaxation in daily life.


I never had a hometown,
but i can certainly understand the  feeling of returning to ones city, culture or country ...

[ambach123]

Below is an email.

Some background, I asked her to look for an apartment ( per advise given on this forum); I have been communicating with her for a few months. She is 29, beautiful, and a teacher with a University degree, and yes never married and no children. I gave her a list of several apartments that I saw on line and asked for her opinions. She chose probably the least expensive ones. She lives in a town away from Kiev, she refused my offer to pay for her train fare; she did accept my offer to stay with me for three days, my last three days in Kiev.

English is broken but I cut and paste.

Dear, I saw and saw these apartments. Of course, each of them is very good. It is difficultly  to choose something. 
At last I have chosen two apartments, if one of them you like I can contact to office and know some details. I try reserve for you for less money. I want that you knew the main I want to be with you  unimportant where. I do not search for high comfort, I wait for you first of all. I want to be with you my dear.

Kisses

Name Withheld

http://www.uarent.com/apartments-ru.php?id=1 http://www.uarent.com/apartments-ru.php?id=20

Here is a woman who refused money when offered,  wants to save money for me which does not mean that much to me. Does it mean that I should not be on guard? Not yet, we have a long ways to go.

Like a chorus except Steve, and AJ, almost everyone else tells me that I would not get anywhere with any decent woman. I don't know how much more decent you have to be than this woman. I am simply " doomed to fail ".  Kind of reminds me when I was building my business. Those saying that are no longer around.

[gerda20]

Ronnie,
I was trying to send you a personal message through e-mail but this forum doesn't let me to do it for some reason, so I have to write to you here. My name is Olga and today I was at the consultation in the 100 and 1-st immigration attorney and finaly got some decent advise. He found the case of your step-son on the internet ..i am in exactly the same situation now and you cannot imagine how happy I was to hear about your case,,,now I can hope,,
So I tryed to find more info about Verovkin case on the internet and found this forum.
Ronnie, is it possible to talk to you over the phone or get  your e-mail...Please, write me at nikitusha38@gmail.com
Thank you.

[Ronnie]

Olga,
I sent you and email.  Dmitry got his greencard a month or so ago.  Our case has helped others get theirs too.  Be patient, fse budet khorosho.

[steviej]

If we ended tomorrow she is more than welcome to all that we have and I would happily give it to her. She deserves it.

You and AJ are really cute about this ...

[Jumper]

Ambach-
seriously good luck.

 In person you may ,or may not be, anything really like what comes across to readers of your posts.
 What anyone posts here is normally specific to some information they are looking for, or want to relay.
That's not much to judge a persons character on,but all this medium allows.

 


 

[Maxx2]

This might seem a no-brainer to most, but so many guys with a trip or two under their belts read Maxx's stories and seem to think the biggest benefit to knowing a girl well before proposing is to be sure she is not a scammer or GCG

Boy ain't that the truth. I have never had a chance to state what I think is the most important things to watch or look for in order of importance.

1) Mutual physical attraction to each other. Often it's just a one way.

2) Is she compatible with you and your interests? Do you have something beyond sex or common day to day activities to make a life with?

3) Is she nuts? You? or in a bad time of your life? Recent divorce? Having a strong Wife need?  

4) Is she a gold digger or GCG? Is the least of these 4 things to worry about happening.

Frankly everything has to be in place to make one of these marriages work. And by "work" I mean having a happy marriage and not one that just limps by.

Thanks Ronnie for the cool youtube. I remember seeing Chuck Berry for the first time back in 1970 doing a show on TV. I thought "How could this guy be so cool and my dad who is younger than him never got beyond Bill Halley's "See ya later alligator. After while crocodile" but mostly likes swing music of Benny Goodman". I come to appreciate my father's taste in things the older I get.


Maxx

[catzenmouse]

You and AJ are really cute about this ...

I won't speak for AJ but I think you're pretty cute too there big boy...

[Jumper]

shoot Ken,
i'm such a softy i'm ready to send steviej a WU !
 well if he'd just whisper a couple of kind words in Russian..

[steviej]

shoot Ken,
i'm such a softy i'm ready to send steviej a WU !
 well if he'd just whisper a couple of kind words in Russian..

After 5 years, I don't even know any Russian! LOL .. wait, I think I know a few ..
stopka, chaska, affisant, bolshoi, privet (that's what I say to my father in law in the phone "bolshoi privet Nikoli!" Then he says, "Hey, everything's OK").

Oh, I almost forgot the best phrase (in terms of effort verses reward) I EVER learned:  Ja lublu viehchna  (probably spelled wrong)   

[catzenmouse]

Phrase I use most often now is "peer e stan Sergei" for our 8 year old... "e dees su da" comes a pretty close second.

[Shadow]

Like a chorus except Steve, and AJ, almost everyone else tells me that I would not get anywhere with any decent woman. I don't know how much more decent you have to be than this woman. I am simply " doomed to fail ".  Kind of reminds me when I was building my business. Those saying that are no longer around.

Ambach, you did not answer my question about your qualifications.
About this woman, does she know you have reserved a maximum time span of 1 hour over a cup of coffee for her ? Have you explained her you will be 'extremely busy' (or whatever excuse you cook up to avoid telling you are holding job interviews). ?
Do you know the specific reason why a beautiful,29 year old teacher was never married ?

You are showing a part of a letter from someone you never met, that you do not know if you will have a connection with upon meeting, and that is supposed to be one of a number of women. I notice that you have shown something of her writing before (with the same comment about your business). What about the others ? Or are you turning this already into a show to meet this one, with extreme safet precautions ?

[ConnerVT]

Do you know the specific reason why a beautiful,29 year old teacher was never married ?

Thank you, Shadow.  I've been waiting for someone to post this thought.

If a good looking and intelligent (near) 30-something plus FSUW hasn't married, the question that would be on my mind is, "Why?" 

Does she not have the ability to commit to another person?  Is her heart not open to love another?  Perhaps if you understand Russian, you will learn that she is an outright *b!tch*, and no one wants to be with her?  Has she committed her life to her work/money/things that a relationship isn't as important?

Here in the West, the feminist agenda has pushed women to focus more on career than family, with more never married women in their thirties.  In the FSU, this is much more uncommon.  To me, an unmarried woman without kids would be something to question, not something to automatically seek.

[ambach123]

Shadow, you did not read my post completely.

I plan to spend 3 to 4 days exclusively with her, and she would be staying with me.  I will go back  in a short order if needed.

You are absolutely correct that I have not met with her, I am very cognizant of that fact. My other meetings are for back ups. For practical purposes my search is over. So as it turns out my visit is visit one with back ups.

Why a 29 years old, well educated, beautiful girl was never married, that is a question I can't answer, others here probably can. BF here was not married until she was 33, so you are calling BF a " bitch "; I am sorry but whatever the issue, I don't call any woman that.

She is never married, no children, and perhaps more importantly her parents are together, lives at home in a small town. All the conditions I required. In addition to the fact all her pictures on her profile are with full cothes and not skin showing to the world.

And she will be presented by a pre nup if things get any further, I don't see her having any problems with that.

Life is sometimes full of surprises; small town Ukrainian girl finds her other half on line.  She moves to USA into a life of luxury, something she never seeked, almost like a Cinderella story. FWIW her profile specifically asked for "Men from Europe Only"; fortunately I did not see that until later.

[Blues Fairy]

Why a 29 years old, well educated, beautiful girl was never married, that is a question I can't answer, others here probably can. BF here was not married until she was 33, so you are calling BF a " bitch "; I am sorry but whatever the issue, I don't call any woman that.

Thanks for your benefit of the doubt Ambach but for some people here I most certainly qualify as a "bitch" considering the high criteria I used in my search for a husband and the number of prospects I sent packing because they didn't meet them.   If you and I had met 4 years ago, you would most certainly have labeled me one.

[Shadow]

Shadow, you did not read my post completely.

I plan to spend 3 to 4 days exclusively with her, and she would be staying with me.  I will go back  in a short order if needed.

You are absolutely correct that I have not met with her, I am very cognizant of that fact. My other meetings are for back ups. For practical purposes my search is over. So as it turns out my visit is visit one with back ups.

Why a 29 years old, well educated, beautiful girl was never married, that is a question I can't answer, others here probably can. BF here was not married until she was 33, so you are calling BF a " bitch "; I am sorry but whatever the issue, I don't call any woman that.

She is never married, no children, and perhaps more importantly her parents are together, lives at home in a small town. All the conditions I required. In addition to the fact all her pictures on her profile are with full cothes and not skin showing to the world.

And she will be presented by a pre nup if things get any further, I don't see her having any problems with that.

Life is sometimes full of surprises; small town Ukrainian girl finds her other half on line.  She moves to USA into a life of luxury, something she never seeked, almost like a Cinderella story. FWIW her profile specifically asked for "Men from Europe Only"; fortunately I did not see that until later.

Ambach as I see you are learning as you go along, and that will probably give you good chances. Sometimes you amaze us with blunt statements, but behind them seems to be a guy that is not afraid to adjust his plans when he thinks it will fit him.

I asked you if you know the reason, but that does not mean I called her anything bad. My own partner was 32 and never married when I met her. I did ask her for her reasons, and she provided a good story. 

The worst mistake you might still make is looking for trouble. You will find what you look for, do not become paranoid and suspicious for every move. If there is one thing the married guys here share is the knowledge that when you met the right RW there will be no doubt in your heart or mind.

[ConnerVT]

That's what I love hate about this site.  People read what they want to see.

I was the one who originally used the word b!tch.  Now, if everyone will go back and objectively read my post, you may see...

-- That I never globally said everyone would be a b!tch.  What I did say is that you may discover that some of the women in this situation are one.  It has been commented on here before, that lacking fluency in the other's language and culture, it becomes more difficult to recognize your potential mate's personal characteristics.  Of the same language and culture, you can see how a person treats others (family, friends, store clerk, waitpersons, etc) much more easily.  Without this understanding, it could be more difficult to see why such a lovely and intelligent person could go so long without finding love and marriage.

And it is very chivalrous that Ambach would never call a woman that.  I wonder, have you never thought that about someone?

[steviej]

Why a 29 years old, well educated, beautiful girl was never married, that is a question I can't answer, others here probably can.

I disagree a little with the perspective that is so unusual. I think for a lot of these ladies, they've had a couple "long term relationships" but often, the RM doesn't want to marry, and feels he doesn't have to either. Sometimes a woman like the one ambach is referring to, especially if she has a university education, starts to look at Western men because she things they will be more serious about marriage, whereas the RMs have not been.

Ambach, don't forget, as thorough as you are being, there is a real chance you will just flip over this very nice, intelligent, attractive FSUW. You are human after all. So, I'd say enjoy it - open all your feelings and let things roll. Just don't say "I want to marry you!" and don't start the K-1 while you are there on your first visit !!   

[Gator]

Ambach,

In other threads you have voiced ridiculous initial concepts only to have changed after improving your knowledge.  Hopefully you will do the same here.

If you decide to marry someone and bring her to this country, you are responsible for her.  If she can not survive in America on the skills she has learned while married plus the money the prenup awards her, the court will remedy the situation so she can survive regardless of your wishes. 

Compelling her to return to her native country even though she made a decision to build a new life in America?  Think how some judge will view that knowing that you alone were responsible for bringing her here.

I hope that you do meet a sweet RW and do not frighten her.  Please treat her with love and tender care.  If you consider her as your equal, rather than making her feel like a commodity to be discarded, or a sex slave, or an indentured house servant, perhaps you will have a chance for a loving relationship.

I have  a prenup.  It provides and protects both of us.  It is not a tool to make her stand by my side against her will.  Retain a good family law attorney unless you want a new source of toilet paper.  Also, become confident about yourself and this venture.

[ScottinCrimea]

Shadow, you did not read my post completely.

I plan to spend 3 to 4 days exclusively with her, and she would be staying with me.  I will go back  in a short order if needed.

You are absolutely correct that I have not met with her, I am very cognizant of that fact. My other meetings are for back ups. For practical purposes my search is over. So as it turns out my visit is visit one with back ups.

Okay, let me get this straight.  You have already made your choice, but you will meet with 19 other women while you are there as a backup.  Do these 19 other women know that they are talking time off work and coming to Kiev at their own expense to meet with you for one hour strictly as a backup.  Do you think it is fair to these women?  Will you be meeting your chosen one first or after all of the other interviews are completed.  I'm curious to know how you have all of this planned out.