Epidemic of Cold Feet

[BillyB]

Ken, if there's something missing in your life that makes you think physical affection isn't an important topic, please enlighten us.

As for my boasting of a successful business, where? Your mind is playing tricks on you. People reading my posts the last few weeks know I'm satisfied living a modest life and I don't promote immediate advertising of financial status to women guys may want to get involved with, a view opposite of yours.

[anjutka]

. People reading my posts the last few weeks know.......

i don't know what others knows from your post during last few weeks , but during few last day  as a newcomer i notice that you choose  too  aggressive way.....And I m sure that aggressive people at the end never have success..
hopefully all next your posts ll prove your positive points here...

[Shadow]

BillyB, I have to agree with KenC that your 'question' to Olga is out of line and too personal.
While it seems you are currently preoccupied with the subject, I hope you will respect the privacy of other members in these matters and not continue to invite them to disclose such matters...

[OlgaH]

BillyB,

In your post you are talking just about sex.

A RW would forgive a lot if you were a fantastic lover so don't underestimate the physical part of a relationship. Last longer, get flexible and do multiple positions, figure out what she likes best and give her the big O. Don't always be soft, be a bull in bed. Give her a performance to remember and she may give you lots of scratch marks you can wear with pride. You also might hear "I vant you" more often.

I don't deny a fact that there are some women and some men as well who are totally addicted to sex  with multiple positions and they are ready forgive a lot and everything because there is nothing important for them in the life only sex and they can not see and feel other things than sex.

You missed the point when I have posted the data, but it is no wonder why.

The fact that Russian women place before sex such male characteristics as:

1. Intellect
2. Physical strength, health
3. Ability to provide his family with a comfortable competence.
4. not having bad habits
5. Self-reliance
6. Faithfulness in love
7. Sense of humor

says that women first of all would like to see a trustworthy partner in a man, but not a flexible bull in different positions. Also the most important part in a relationship between man and woman is a spiritual conformity, may be because of it the women place man's intellect in first place. There can not be any affection in relationship between man and woman if there is not any spiritual conformity, but there will be probably bull and wild cow.

What about your question to me? I think your question is so low class that doesn't meet the first requirement in the list above, sorry, so nothing to talk about. 

[LEGAL]

BillyB,

[Misha]

Well, when it comes to intimacy, I believe that there is not "perfect" lover, rather what is best for the individual. What one woman likes, another may find abhorrent, likewise for men. It comes down to communication: are both capable of expressing their needs and desires? Will the other side listen? Are they capable of communicating about everything as a couple?

[Gator]

Similar to Olga's list of what women want, I learned a long time ago the five secrets for a Russian woman to be happy.

1. A man who works around the house, helps with the children, and makes enough money that she does not worry about the future.

2. A man who loves to spend money on her and show
her a good time whether a fancy restaurant, traveling, or shopping.

3. A man who satisfies her in the bedroom.

4. A man who excites her intellect, who makes her laugh, who understands her soul, who answers her questions about life, and who comforts her.

5. It is most important that these four men never meet each other.

With regard to sex, all I can say is that good sex will not save a relationship.  Yet, bad sex may eventually end a relationship.  Much depends upon one's definition of good and bad.

[Gator]

Before this thread implodes with personal attacks, I do hope that unmarried men realize that this is no walk on the beach.   It should be apparent that it is more complicated than romancing AW because of language barriers, cultural differences, geographic separation, and age gaps.

So do not expect that a 1, 2, 3, ... recipe will work.

It's very easy to assume that a woman's natural state is warm feet and only some defect of character and/or external influence can make them go cold.  "Feet" are an open system and only continuous influx of energy can keep them warm for extended periods of time.  If the man starts taking her commitment for granted and slacks with his investment into creative, positive, continuous communication, she'll quickly feel the diminishing vibe. 

 

Blues Fairy, for sure a man doing what you describe will probably fail.   However, it seems to me that Jerry and George were making continued investments as were those cited in Shadow's examples and the men in my two examples.

Something else is at work because in the past most RW would still marry the man even with his shortcomings. 

[BillyB]

Olga, I apologize for offending you. I didn't expect you to answer the question the way I presented it but it was asked to give you food for thought that physical affection is important, something you don't seem to admit. Keep in mind, I've never said sex is the only important thing for a relationship. A big reason people have sought physical affection outside their relationship is because it is lacking at home. They may remain in a marriage for financial reasons but look elsewhere to take care of their needs, selfish as it may be. And could be as selfish as their partner who only cares about the amount of physical affection that is to happen in their relationship. I have never cheated on any woman I was in a relationship with but I do observe others around me. An initial poor performance will give some women "cold feet" to move on to marriage. You may not need this advice and it's rarely talked about but it needs to be talked about and those that's reading that's still in the hunt will most likely up their game.

There can not be any affection in relationship between man and woman if there is not any spiritual conformity, but there will be probably bull and wild cow.

Although I believe in God, I believe non-believers can have/show/feel affection in a relationship too and as much or more than believers. I have seen some cold and empty Christian relationships. Just as my question has offended, your comment will offend too.

[KenC]

Billy,
Your entire premise is all wrong.  In a quick search here is what I found:


 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Cheating Husbands and Cheating Wives Give Different Reasons for Having Affairs
By Ruth Houston
Last edited: Sunday, February 27, 2005
Posted: Sunday, February 27, 2005



 

Men and women who cheat on their spouses or significant others give different reasons to justify their extramarital affairs.


The latest infidelity studies indicate that percentage-wise the gap is closing between cheating husbands in comparison to the percentage of cheating wives. However, even though more men are now becoming victims of infidelity, the fact still remains that 70% of infidelity victims are women.  What’s interesting though, is that men and women who are cheating on their spouses give different reasons to justify their extramarital affairs. 




The Top Reasons Men and Women Cheat




The top 3 reasons men cheat all relate to sex.  However sex is not usually the motivating factor for cheating wives.   The top 3 reasons women cheat relate to unmet emotional needs or a desire for attention.   Listed below are the most common reasons cheating husbands and cheating use to justify their extramarital affairs:




Why Men Cheat




The most frequently cited reasons for infidelity among men include




more sex (the desire for a more active sex life)

sexual variety (a desire for different kinds of sex)

opportunistic sex ( taking advantage of an opportunity to have sex without the fear of getting caught)

to satisfy sexual curiosity (about a specific female)

a feeling of entitlement (the belief that it’s a man’s prerogative to cheat)

the “thrill of the chase”

the desire to feel important or special

sexual addiction


Why Women Cheat




The reasons most frequently cited for female infidelity include




a desire for emotional closeness and intimacy (someone caring to confide in and bond with on an emotional level)

a desire for attention (wanting be the center of a man’s attention again)

 to reaffirm her desirability (To feel validated as a woman)

to re-experience feelings of romance

a desire to feel “special”

boredom

loneliness

sexual excitement


Men Cheat for Sexual Reasons, Women Cheat for Emotional Reasons

Billy,
Your whole problem is you think like a man!  And try to apply that thought process to women!
KenC

 

[Misha]

Men and women who cheat on their spouses or significant others give different reasons to justify their extramarital affairs.

Well, the reason women give for cheating may not necessarily be the real reason why they cheat. It sounds better for a woman to say that she cheated in order "to re-experience feelings of romance" than to say that he was hot and she wanted wanted to satisfy her sexual urges.

[OlgaH]

BillyB,

Apology is accepted.

You again missed the point 

Nobody deny a physical affection. But what you have written in your previous post was more about just a sex. I don't know, I just can guess that you confuse love with sex.  The spiritual conformity means to have so much in common: interests, thoughts, views... and you are able to share and make an open conversation with your partner; all these help to build a healthy relationship. Probably some people start to build their relationship with sex and only after they try to achieve a spiritual harmony, and may be they are successful.    Also there is a such term as the sexual dependency, and some people who sexually depend on a partner think that it is a love.

Cold and empty relationship is a relationship where is nothing in common. Sooner or later sex can come to an end because of age or because of an accident, problems with health. Does it mean that love will come to the end too?  Probably yes, if people place the sex before spiritual harmony. But on the other hand how the love can come to the end if there was not any love only the sexual dependency? 

Sex or physical affection without love is nothing, but the spiritual harmony helps to achieve the sexual harmony. 

Yes a man can be a performing bull in bed and woman will sing with enthusiasm the Toreador Song "For pleasure, for pleasure they have fights! The arena is full, it is the day of celebration!", but what is after and before that sexual selebration? Bull-pen or kholodets? 

[KenC]

Well, the reason women give for cheating may not necessarily be the real reason why they cheat. It sounds better for a woman to say that she cheated in order "to re-experience feelings of romance" than to say that he was hot and she wanted wanted to satisfy her sexual urges.

Misha,
  I think you are making the same mistake as Billy in assuming any man has a clue what really goes on inside the head of any woman!  

I have heard for a long time and from many different sources that sex was always one of the last reasons for a woman to cheat.  My first (American) wife was unfaithful to me. She cheated with an old boyfriend from 25 years before.  I did a lot of intensive research on the specific subject then.  I found out that it was a rather common occurrence and that the real reason for the infidelity was that a boyfriend from many years ago made the woman feel the age she was when he was her boyfriend.  So my almost 40 year old ex wife felt 15 years old again.  Her indiscretion had nothing to do with sex or even me really.  More of a middle age crisis than anything.
KenC

[Ooooops]

Lovers both male and female come in hundreds of varieties IMHO.

Absolutely.   And the most important sexual organ is BRAIN!      If there have it and if there is love between partners they'll find the way to be happy.   

[Ooooops]

5. It is most important that these four men never meet each other.

 

[Misha]

Misha,
  I think you are making the same mistake as Billy in assuming any man has a clue what really goes on inside the head of any woman!  

Well, nobody knows what is inside anybody else's head. We barely know what it going on in our own head's most of the time IMHO. However, I would attribute it the "slut" versus the "stud" syndrome. A woman who cheats merely for sex will be frowned upon both in Russia and North America, while a man will not have to  justify why he does it. It is seen as "natural" that men try to sleep around and that "good" women won't sleep around. Consequently, this would make it hard, I believe, for a woman to say: "I cheated on my husband simply because I wanted the sex." To avoid being labeled, she will justify it by calling upon nobler causes such as "romance."

[OlgaH]

6 Reasons Why Women Cheat

[steviej]

Well, for what it's worth, I don't think our mini-epidemic of cold feet has anything to do with sex whatsoever. Also, for what it's worth, and from anything I've ever read or experienced anywhere, Olga's comments are right on. Funny how sometimes some of the men in this forum refuse to listen to the RWs here that actually comment. If you want to know what an RW thinks, well, you can start by listening to the ones here, right?

I think its possible there have been some cultural changes over the past 5 years. My wife's younger sister is 5 years younger, but she almost seems like a girl from a different planet compared to my wife sometimes. I've wondered, what does 5 years of intense exposure to the Western hiphop MTV hyper egocentric media culture have on women in their 20s in FSU? As most AMs know, that culture is toxic, vulgar, egocentric, and very much "live for the moment". Its "Hey, what's going down, dude" and who's hot, and who's not. So, there very well could be some shifting sands here.

But even so, from reading enough stuff from others in the pursuit stage here, there are still ample opportunities for success. But ... from some cultural and economic changes there may be more "cold feet" as well to come.

[Ooooops]

But ... from some cultural and economic changes there may be more "cold feet" as well to come.

Yep.   Blue passport may not be enough to win the lady...   

[WmGO]

The fact that Russian women place before sex such male characteristics as:

1. Intellect
2. Physical strength, health
3. Ability to provide his family with a comfortable competence.
4. not having bad habits
5. Self-reliance
6. Faithfulness in love
7. Sense of humor

Bears repeating for seekers as well as married people. This list is really
the same for AW. The basics of what FSUW desire in a man are not far
different from what an AW desires. Most of these things are hardwired to
women in general, regardless of culture, although historical cultural circumstances
can cause one or more item to be emphasized/more important/more sought after
over others.

Similar to Olga's list of what women want, I learned a long time ago the five secrets for a Russian woman to be happy.

1. A man who works around the house, helps with the children, and makes enough money that she does not worry about the future.

2. A man who loves to spend money on her and show
her a good time whether a fancy restaurant, traveling, or shopping.

3. A man who satisfies her in the bedroom.

4. A man who excites her intellect, who makes her laugh, who understands her soul, who answers her questions about life, and who comforts her.

Also bears repeating and also applies to women in general including AW.
LOL on #5 that I omitted.


**********

Most Western, particularly American, studies/advice experts will say this:

His Needs:

1. Respect
2. Intimacy/Sexual Relations
3. Home support
4. Appreciation/Honor
5. Tenderness

Her Needs:

1. Security
2. Attention
3. Affection
4. Affirmation
5. Conversation/Communication
6. Intimacy

[WmGO]

...  The spiritual conformity means to have so much in common: interests, thoughts, views... and you are able to share and make an open conversation with your partner; all these help to build a healthy relationship. Probably some people start to build their relationship with sex and only after they try to achieve a spiritual harmony, and may be they are successful.    Also there is a such term as the sexual dependency, and some people who sexually depend on a partner think that it is a love.

Cold and empty relationship is a relationship where is nothing in common. Sooner or later sex can come to an end because of age or because of an accident, problems with health. Does it mean that love will come to the end too?  Probably yes, if people place the sex before spiritual harmony. But on the other hand how the love can come to the end if there was not any love only the sexual dependency? 

Sex or physical affection without love is nothing, but the spiritual harmony helps to achieve the sexual harmony. 

 

Good post!

[WmGO]

....  My first (American) wife was unfaithful to me. She cheated with an old boyfriend from 25 years before.  I did a lot of intensive research on the specific subject then.  I found out that it was a rather common occurrence and that the real reason for the infidelity was that a boyfriend from many years ago made the woman feel the age she was when he was her boyfriend..... More of a middle age crisis than anything.

Maybe "middle age crisis", but IMO it is a much much deeper spiritual reality
that relates to the mental/physical/spiritual bonding that takes place when a man
and a woman are intimate with each other............there are those that would
say that that bond is permanent and never completely goes away........that
it is always there lingering deep inside the soul.........a good reason why promiscuity
should be avoided...........

[steviej]

Most Western, particularly American, studies/advice experts will say this:

His Needs:
1. Respect
2. Intimacy/Sexual Relations
3. Home support
4. Appreciation/Honor
5. Tenderness

Her Needs:
1. Security
2. Attention
3. Affection
4. Affirmation
5. Conversation/Communication
6. Intimacy

That seems reasonable and similar to my own experience. Those needs are the time-tested results of 1 million years of survival and evolution of human tribes. However, I would say that modern feminists (a.k.a. feminazis) are constantly propagandizing against this. Further, in the modern hyper-capitalist world culture combined with the hip-hop MTV popular culture, they also work against this. It drives people to be out of touch with their inner soul (either male or female) for the sake of increased productivity and "party now" mentality. We are bombarded with these messages in the West. Progaganda does matter, it does exist, and it does influence people's attitudes and behaviors.

[BillyB]

BillyB,

Apology is accepted.

You again missed the point 

Nobody deny a physical affection. But what you have written in your previous post was more about just a sex. I don't know, I just can guess that you confuse love with sex.  The spiritual conformity means to have so much in common: interests, thoughts, views... and you are able to share and make an open conversation with your partner; all these help to build a healthy relationship. Probably some people start to build their relationship with sex and only after they try to achieve a spiritual harmony, and may be they are successful.    Also there is a such term as the sexual dependency, and some people who sexually depend on a partner think that it is a love.

Cold and empty relationship is a relationship where is nothing in common. Sooner or later sex can come to an end because of age or because of an accident, problems with health. Does it mean that love will come to the end too?  Probably yes, if people place the sex before spiritual harmony. But on the other hand how the love can come to the end if there was not any love only the sexual dependency? 

Sex or physical affection without love is nothing, but the spiritual harmony helps to achieve the sexual harmony. 

Yes a man can be a performing bull in bed and woman will sing with enthusiasm the Toreador Song "For pleasure, for pleasure they have fights! The arena is full, it is the day of celebration!", but what is after and before that sexual selebration? Bull-pen or kholodets? 

Olga, I agree with what you say and I do take care of my fiancee's needs in many ways besides physical. I don't think I'd have much problem satisfying any woman in complete fashion. I'm happy with the lady I have now and the options available to me if things don't work out. This thread isn't about being married and getting old where physical needs naturally diminish and other things that bond a marriage are more important, it's about cold feet and relationships breaking apart before marriage.  I don't care how successful, good looking, decent, kind a man is or how good he is fullfilling a woman's emotional needs, the moment she thinks she just made love to a cold fish or piece of wood, the relationship will go down hill and she will get cold feet. She might even tell the guy she just want to be friends. How many guys have heard that before? If she decides to marry the cold fish regardless of a poor love life with him, she may have insincere motives. Of course sex is not as important to much older women but how many guys is looking for babushka's at this forum?

Most men who already have entered into an relationship with a woman have most likely passed the test that he's intelligent and decent enough and financially stable with the woman who's in the relationship with him. Why does it break up? Could be a variety of things such as change of heart, change of finances, and even doubts about your partner after discovering there's no fun in intimacy among many other things already mentioned and not mentioned. The list could go on and too bad this thread hasn't taken off. Most of us here regularly tell men that if a RW is cold to them physically, it's game over and to start looking elsewhere. For those that continue to ignore the importance of "quality" physical intimacy, you better hope you have enough brains and money to keep her happy. Just remember, brains isn't everything otherwise all young ladies would want to marry mature, wise men who are most likely old enough to be their grandpa.

Why Women Cheat

The reasons most frequently cited for female infidelity include a desire for emotional closeness and intimacy (someone caring to confide in and bond with on an emotional level)

a desire for attention (wanting be the center of a man’s attention again)

 to reaffirm her desirability (To feel validated as a woman)

to re-experience feelings of romance

a desire to feel “special”

boredom

loneliness

sexual excitement


Men Cheat for Sexual Reasons, Women Cheat for Emotional Reasons

Billy,
Your whole problem is you think like a man!  And try to apply that thought process to women!

Ken, the main act in cheating is sex. It's physical, not emotional. Emotion may play a role before sex for women but ultimately the final act is physical. Women can downplay their cheating as if it's not as bad sounding as men's by claiming romance, intimacy, and sexual excitement in your list are all emotions but it's not going to fool me into thinking those poor women's emotions aren't being taken care of by their man so it's their man's fault. If they feel like they need another man to get their emotional physical needs taken care of, they need to get out of the relationship they're currently in first.

[steviej]

I don't care how successful, good looking, decent, kind a man is or how good he is fullfilling a woman's emotional needs, the moment she thinks she just made love to a cold fish or piece of wood, the relationship will go down hill and she will get cold feet.

Billy, the "cold feet" we are talking about here is long after the physical relationship was started (in most cases). This thread originated with a couple recent cases where the fiance visa was well along in processing. Certainly a woman or man would probably hesitate if, after getting involved with someone, they felt there was an irreparable lack of physical compatibility. Surprisingly, in most, albeit random, articles I've read about this, ti is rarely cited as the reason for the break up of a relationship. Meaning usually, it is growing and unresolved anger that leads to a loss of physical compatibility, leading to the breakdown of relations. The thread, as initiated by Gator (who speaks wisely on so many things I am constantly impressed) has nothing to do with the sexual prowess, or lack thereof, of an AM groom-to-be.