How I Beat the Biggest Scam

[BeSmart]

In response to some questions about Part 2 of my Trip Report, I decided to write this post to better explain and detail how I circumnavigated the big scam agencies and made direct contact with several real nice ladies that were basically innocent victims of scam themselves.

I don’t think I am some big innovator. I’m sure my technique is not original. But I have never seen it spelled out like I’m about to do. I discovered it through trail and error, hopeless optimism, close observation and a need to cut through all the BS.

I know there are some that may say that it’s ridiculous to have anything at all to do with these agencies.  Maybe I am enabling or perpetuating the corrupt system because they will get your money. But only a little bit. In my defense, it feels good to spread the truth. I want everyone to know. No man deserves to be ripped off while simultaneously made to believe he is falling in love. It’s just rotten. Maybe I can prevent that a little. And if the agency reads this post and feels threatened, good. Who knows, maybe they will moral up and change their business model. That would be great for everyone.   

I’m not going to mention which agencies I’m talking about here. I’m sure you can figure it out. I am going to say that everything here is based on my personal experience and what I learned and found out during my efforts. Nothing is heresy or rumor. I have no agenda. Although this post may indicate differently, I’m actually not even bitter about it. I found a beautiful, wonderful girl.

To summarize what’s already been posted and is well known: A US based company lends it’s well known name and website to anyone wishing to start a FSU based marriage agency. I’m not posting the link to their Russian “business opportunity“ website, but you should all check it out. You’ll love the photo of they guy on the home page. It lays it all out, down to the profit one can make per letter written and sent. There is an application process, apparently not to thorough because a friend of mine completed it and was given instructions without even a phone call. The new agency provides local attractive ladies for the website and translates the incoming and outgoing letters. The more letters, the more profit. Somewhere along the line, the actual lady is cut out of the equation. All they really need is photos. Even better if they make a video. They search Russian websites, like “Classmates“, for pretty ladies or just find them on the street.  She is invited to do a photo shoot and keep the copies for herself. (I’m sure there’s variations on this) They make a profile for her with the photos and start writing letters, most likely without her knowledge or permission. They admit that they send you introduction letters on the ladies behalf. That’s the three hundred you got when you first signed up. You’re not that handsome. But they don’t tell you that the letters you receive, signed by her, that so thoughtfully answer all your questions, compliment you and your kind words, and wish for your eventual meeting are not written by her at all. Once in awhile they’ll screw up and send you a letter for someone else or mess with your head and send you one about the history of World War 1. It’s okay because you’ll write back just to figure it out. It’s much better for them if you never meet. Just keep writing. I also know for a fact that men show up at the airport wondering where the lady is that said in her letter that she’d meet him there. That’s just wrong.

You gotta love the anti scam websites and tall claims about their impeccable business practices and upstanding status in the business community. I guess it gives them a way to justify their delusion. Remember, the fraud is being committed in the FSU. The main company is blissfully detached from that reality.

(I can not for the life of me understand how they stay in business while so blatantly scamming what must be hundreds of thousands from men who simply want to enrich their lives. And how in the world they can deny it or plead ignorance when guys like me have busted them over and over and over again. You guys would not believe the amount of evidence I have. I found the above to be overwhelmingly true in 12 Ukrainian cities. I guess there are lots of naive men who will believe anything because they want to. It’s that simple, I guess. And believe me, if there is anyone out there who decides to launch a lawsuit, I am first on board, not only to recover my loss, but to speak for the hundreds of beautiful FSU ladies who’s photos were stolen so someone could make a profit.)

First, a big round of applause right now please for all those honest agencies and owners out there. We know who you are. This whole thing should be about bringing men and women together to better their lives and you put that first. You should be commended and emulated. YOU are the ones who should be getting rich. Nothing would make me more happy than to shift more money into your pockets as a result of this post. It’s because of you that this is possible.

Okay lets get to it. It’s simple.

The ladies in the photos are real ladies. They are most likely living their lives in the listed cities and there’s a very good possibility that they are nice, honest, beautiful ladies. They are also very likely perfectly content, not looking for a foreign boyfriend at all. To me, that’s a good thing because they are not of the pro dater variety. But it’s like a cold approach, she may not be interested in you, any outcome is possible. You have to take that chance, just like with anything. And by the way, you won’t be saving any money. But at least most it will be going to good people who deserve it.

Select the ladies you like. Her age and stats are probably correct because the photographer asked her during the shoot. Write a nice intro letter through the website. “She’ll” write back. Continue this as long as you want, I don’t care, it‘s your money.

They don’t let you exchange email addresses or phone numbers in a letter, but you can exchange home addresses. (If they change this policy, it’s hopeless, quit immediately and let then know why.) And why not? Who cares if you mail her something? Just ask for her address in a letter. Give her yours too. You want to send her something. Not a lie. “She” will give you her address. Make sure it’s complete with her surname, street number, apartment number, and postal code. If not, complain to the company till they provide it.

(I can not comment on the phone translation service to ask her contact info because I never tried it. Figured they could put anyone on the line, how would I know? I tried the video chat once because they can’t fake that. She didn’t show up.)

Now you need some friends in her city. Like the good folks I mentioned a few paragraphs ago. They are known on the forum and Jims List to run small, reputable, local businesses. Ask me, I became acquainted with them throughout Ukraine. Write to them, make a friend. Tell them what you want to do. They understand and they want to help.

You want to make a small flower delivery to a girl who is not on their agency. You have her address and some photos so they get the right girl. You expect she will not know you, but you want to introduce yourself and give her the opportunity to start some direct correspondence with you if she is interested. Or through their service if she can’t speak English. You would like a few photos taken to see what she really looks like and would appreciate their input and impression of her. (These folk know, they can ask a few questions and observe her reaction and tell you if she’s a probably a good girl or an obvious shark.)

Make three pages. One with a handful of your best photos, one with a detailed profile with your stats and who you are, what you like and what you’re looking for and all your contact info, phone number, email, everything. On the third write a nice, simple letter that she can read on the spot.

Mine goes something like this: “Hi __________! So glad I could drop by today with these flowers for you, hope they brighten your day. Listen, I realize you may not know me but that’s okay. I’d like to introduce myself to you and see if we might make a connection. I live in _________, it’s a great place and I have a great life. A few more fun details about me. I’d like to meet a woman who is __________ and I wouldn’t mind traveling to another country to find her. Could you be her? If this is interesting to you, why don’t you send me an email and we can see what happens. By the way, if you don’t speak any English, you can trust my friend who brought the flowers, she be happy to translate letters for us. I must insist on only this direct contact between us. Lets take a chance!”

If your lucky, she’s first surprised, then confused, then delighted, then intrigued. You can take it from there.

My experience, so you know what to expect: Only one lady had gone to the agency, knew me and was writing the letters herself. One worked for the agency, writing fraud letters for a living. The rest did not know me. Of those, three knew they were on the website but did not write any letters. Maybe 25% could not be found. Wrong address or away at school. Two were underage, 17! Three were simply not interested. Two were used to getting gifts from strange men and I understood were not the kind of girl I was looking for. Maybe 8 responded  positively, they wanted to meet me. Two looked too different from their photos, I dropped some after they showed little effort and corresponded with the rest in various forms till I found the one I wanted to meet.

By the way, her flower delivery was the best. She was absolutely delighted,  invited my friend in to meet her parents, showed them my photos and put on a cute dress for the photos. She showed up at my friend’s two days later with her first letter for me.

This was not the only way I searched for a good lady. It just happened to work for me. It was all worth it too, but that’s my opinion.

I stand by my conviction that one must have his life as a real man fully together before taking on this adventure. That being said, I wish everyone the best luck and love. I welcome and questions, comments, or suggestions.

[Caddydaddy]

Wow!
One of the best posts I have read here, thank you BeSmart! 

Just realized another thing. As I asked for the invitation letter from the agency I got to hear, there still is plenty of time, aha, hehe.

This forum is priceless!

Regards,
CaddyDaddy

[BeSmart]

Thanks CD!

Yea, I noticed you'll always get the same thing from the pro letter writers. "Let's spend some time getting to know each other." If you mention that you can come see her next week, she's not ready.

I wonder what the record is for a meaningless letter relationship? Any guesses? Two years? Two hundred?

I found that a real girl will almost universally prefer that you come now. After all, once she thinks she likes you, she has nothing to loose. I would say something like "Letters are nice to find out details and general information about each other, but I see no reason to wait if we seem to be a match." and they would wholeheartedly agree, they would say, "A meeting is worth a thousand letters" and so on. Some ladies had zero interest in letters because they had wasted a lot of time in the past on guys who never come to see her. They think you're all talk. Show up and you become something entirely different.

Yea, I'm on the Get On The Plane party here. Just first make sure you know some things:

- That she's real and you have direct contact with each other. Make phone calls outside of the agency with a translator you know and trust. Those video conversations are great and a lot of fun.

- She seems like the kind of girl you want. No red flags. No settling for less. No drama or disfunction.

- She seems excited to see you. She talks about what you'll do together, meeting you at the airport, ect.
 

[BillyB]

I decided to write this post to better explain and detail how I circumnavigated the big scam agencies and made direct contact with several real nice ladies that were basically innocent victims of scam themselves.

I've got some good info on how to get contact info from ladies from scam agencies without having buy flowers for every girl out there. But it's best to keep this info to myself. Any info to beat scam agencies should not be disclosed. Disclosing it would provide more business for these agencies. Disclosing this info will make guy's feel more confident armed with new tactics to beat bad agencies and sign up. Most likely in the attempt to beat the agency, they will get get beat. Bad agency makes more money while the sincere girls at sincere agencies lose again.

There's no doubt in my mind agencies that provide photo shoots for girls and photoshopping the pics making the girls look better than they actually are and dressing the girls up in bikinis and underware are getting the most business. Some men who went to the FSU said the woman they were writing to didn't look anything close to her pics.

Besmart, you are correct that some women doing photoshoots do not know their pics will be used in a marriage agency.

[Sculpto]

I agree with Billy 100%.  If the methods for beating scam agencies are made public then guess who will also find out about them?  The scam agencies themselves!  And then they will figure out new ways to beat the tricks we have figured out.  There are a lot of different ways to contact the ladies without dealing with the scam.

Do remember however that the ladies may have signed agency contracts that can put them in fear of some sort of legal jeopardy, though I doubt any lady has ever been sued or penalized by an agency, but who the heck knows what really goes on over there.

However, on the other hand.. why even bother with girls who have their photos on such sites?  Think about it guys.. there are probably 150,000 women listed on all the sites put together.. that is a tiny fraction of the available women in the FSU.  Why limit yourselves?

And, keep clicking the google ad links on the scam sites every time you see them.  Each click is worht anywhere from a quarter to a couple of bucks.  If we all do it all the time its going to eat into their profits, and maybe make them reconsider their advertising campaigns which might get them out of the face of the newbies and protect lots of innocent but naive guys from falling for the scam in the first place.

[Sculpto]

Thanks CD!

Yea, I noticed you'll always get the same thing from the pro letter writers. "Let's spend some time getting to know each other." If you mention that you can come see her next week, she's not ready. 

This is not always a sign of a scam though.  Some girls can be shy and very cautious.  They have heard about sex tourists, male scammers, wife beaters and abusers.  Maybe she even experienced a sex tourist or her friend did. 

But, then again, why even bother with an agency when there are so many other ways.  How about just getting on a plane?  Last year when I was in Odessa hanging out with a bunch of very cool Odessan musicians/hippies before I train wrecked in Kherson, there was a very nice girl who had her American boyfriend in tow.  They met in Alaska where they had both gone to work for the summer.  She said to me.. "Forget internet dating.. just hang out here for a while and you will find your girl"

something to think about anyway....

[docetae]

In any case, If I was owner of one of these scam agencies, I would be ROFL... why ? You know this business is a scam and you continue to want to use it , trying to find "clever ways" to beat them ?????? When there are so many alternatives available ?

If this is not a definition of stupidity, I need to find a new dictionnary...

[BeSmart]

I was expecting these reactions. By the way, did you guys even read the third paragraph?

My only attempt is to inject some honestly and good sense into the corruption, and hopefully save guys money they otherwise would have wasted by being uninformed, while giving some business to the people that deserve it. That's why this is in the Starting Out section.

Isn't there the slightest chance that having all the knowledge available can actually reduce the profits of those who wish to scam us? 

If my logic is wrong, then maybe this post should be deleted.

Yes there are plenty of other, easier, and cheaper ways. I admit, this is pretty ridiculous. I can only say that some of the stunningly gorgeous ladies I met, I never would have found any other way, short of bumbing into them on the street. 

[whoami]

Mine goes something like this: “Hi __________! So glad I could drop by today with these flowers for you, hope they brighten your day. ...”

"Banana split shake from a secret admirer". Although it will work in 99% cases, unless the girl is already in a relationship, I have to agree with docetae:

trying to find "clever ways" to beat them. When there are so many alternatives available ?

[EnergyAZ]

Thanks for creating this thread!


I have a question...

I am corresponding with a woman through the 'big' agency.  No, I am not positive yet if its really her writing to me, or someone else on her 'behalf'

But I did manage to find her listed at a much smaller agency, in her local city of Odessa.

Knowing this smaller agency had piped her profile/pics to the larger one...should I attempt correspondence through the smaller Odessa agency itself?  It also works with the same pay per email sent/received and offers similar services, just much cheaper than the big agency does.

So what I think I learned from your post, is that it is the smaller agencies who are in fact performing the scam while the bigger agency is just a middleman/portal?  So bypassing the bigger agency in favor of the smaller agency may save some $$ but yield same result? (aka - woman having no idea who I am)

Yes, this girl IMO is unearthly hot!  But I can tell her photos are not photo shopped.  Her images are not featured on the main pages of either agency's site, quite the contrary, her profile is buried pages deep at both sites.

My plan is to call her as soon as I can, but as mentioned - how do you trust the translators? So, back to my question - should I try to be using her local agency, or are they likely to be just as corrupt as the big one?


Thanks!

[Sculpto]

Hey Energy,
If you would like please send me a PM and I can give you some advice for Odessa.  I may know someone there who can help you get to the girl.  You should expect that she has no idea you are writing to her.  There are a lot of agencies in Odessa and with few exceptions they are all corrupt.

[FredC]

Hey AZ, if the large agency you are talking about is the one that I am thinking of, they have webcams of their office on their website. If you use them to make you phone call, just sign on to their website before you call. Then while you are talking tell her you want to see her on the webcam. At least then you'll know who you are talking to.

[Mtnmansummit]

Be Smart said ..."First, a big round of applause right now please for all those honest agencies and owners out there. We know who you are. This whole thing should be about bringing men and women together to better their lives and you put that first. You should be commended and emulated. YOU are the ones who should be getting rich. Nothing would make me more happy than to shift more money into your pockets as a result of this post. It’s because of you that this is possible."

I don't know who they are, I am back after a couple of years. I do like this site, but you code talk alot. So help me out who's honest ........ I know about Jack and respect him, but who else?

[neo]

some good advice there.

I know a lot of my ex's GF's are registered with said site, there is another catagory of girl that I got straight from the horses mouth so to speak. A lot of the agencies do the free pics/english lessons you'll get flowers/perfume etc thing to get the girls to sign up. some do pay them a retainer, most of my ex's GF's said it was a funny job and well if prince charming turns up then very nice otherwise its something else to fill time.

I can tell you straight, any, and i do mean ANY russian/ukraine girl will drop her boyfriend like a hot potato the minute a BETTER prospect shows up.

the operational word here is BETTER. either looking, charming, fiscally or stability.  A western BF is like owning a mercedes in E.E - a lot of people will hate you for it and consider you a capitalist traitor yet, but such things are fuelled by embassy. Lots of girls want the status symbol of a western man on their arm.

The view that most girls sign up to these megasites "without their knowledge" is slightly misleading in many, many cases. Almost every single girl i have known including platonic girlfriends of girlfriends, sisters etc have had a punt at a marriage agency at some time but not in the way you would think.

If you look at the agencies/literature they use to sign the girls up, they are promising the girls lots of eligible george clooney chisel jaw hunks with mansions and beemers, not middle aged guys with pick up trucks, as a result whether your letters are faked or not is directly inline to how realistic you are being with your search criteria. if you are 50 writing to a 19 year old girl in her knickers then 99 percent your letters are written by the agency. If you are a reasonably good looking guy and have something positive to offer they will be actively marketing you to every girl they can, they only get girls to sign up by showing them the positive.  As a under 35 single guy with no problems i was once force dated to every girl in one owners agency before getting to meet the girl i was there to see (she was furious!).

To be fair on the girls, i have met *plenty* of those sites eye candy in reality, and i know the photographers who do those playboy type shoots. the girls see it as a bit of fun, they usually only think better of the fact they had photos taken in their knickers/arse hanging out when you point out millions of men are fapping over said pictures.

Anyway, i'm not saying you should use those sites, personally i think the sites are doing a lot of women a disservice because people make a opinion on them purely based on those racy pictures, a lot of the girls are quite conservative in reality, others arent, but generally they are only going to get a certain type of guy to react to them.

Also a lot of girls get duped by that, they do the "sexy shots" and also more conservative shots. they are usually promised the sexy shoot is "just for them" to give to their new BF when they get together, most think their conservative photos are on their profile.

Also you should be aware they are a "wholesaler". i know of at least 2 or 3 agencies who quit them,  there are genuine agencies in the network and their are dodgy ones. Getting a good experience is pure pot luck unless you are aware who the bad eggs are from being around the scene a long time.

Generally i look at it this way with every girl and every agency: each guy needs to set his own risk profile. work out what you are prepared to lose and work from there.