Vent + question

[StickyFly]

I need to vent and at the same time have some questions. Here are a few conversations with my girl today that prompts me to make this post. I am staying at her place and she had to go to work and asks me to meet her in downtown after she gets off work.
In the Morning:
Me: Lets take some pictures
Her: No, *ties a knot between her eyes, turns away to continue making coffee*, I am not going to take picture looking like this.
In the afternoon:
I arrived one hour early and waited for her to call me in a coffee shop 15 second walk from station. It was my first time taking the train by myself and apparently I missed by one station.I missed one call from her(didn't ring or didn't hear). Reached me on her 2nd call and had the waitress tell her where I am.
Her:*Sarcastically, obviously upset*..."I seem to think we had agreed to meet near the station. This is not near the station and it's not independence square. When someone tell you to wait somewhere you wait there"

I understand anyone can be upset and I probably could have used some common sense but putting me down/insulting(at least that's how it makes me feel) isn't necessary.

Night:
Trying to start a light and funny conversation.
Me: I am really proud of being able to take the bus, then connect to subway and was able to get to downtown without knowing how to read Russian characters.
Her: It's quite sample. Just take the bus all the way then the subway is easy. Anyone can do it
Me: Yea, but I am still proud.
Her: *Looks at me, and looks away*
All this made me feel like she was irritated by me, thinks I am stupid without common sense, putting me down, embarrassed and it was definitely upsetting me and I needed to have a talk with her. Was waiting for a place more quiet, wasn’t being present, I walked too fast and she was behind me about 2 steps. Stopped and waited for her, “finally” she said. I asked why she didn’t say anything, “I didn’t have to, it’s common sense”. Sure, but by being quiet is just proving a point, isn’t helping.
This isn’t working for me. I am big on communication and I decided just have a talk with her there.  “There is something I need to get off my chest. I am not making you wrong, but I need to tell you how it makes me feel so I can put it behind me and be present”. After I finish telling her she got all defensive. I asked her to be more communititive and she said “Very often I can just deal with it myself. I don’t need to tell you everything”.
Ok, now that I have vented. Question is…is this a culture thing with RW or is it just us? Is there anyway I can get her to be more open about communication or do I just have to find a way to deal with it if I want to stay with her?
I have dated many none Russian women before and I have never had this issue.

[docetae]

I can tell you this is not a culture question, but rather a personality conflict between you and her... not want to sound bad, but if you are looking for a life partner, this is not the one.

When a woman is in love with you, you will know it and will never live this kind of situation...

[wxman]

Putting one down or talking down will only continue. I can only respond with what I would do. Adios.

[groovlstk]

I'd agree w/Doc and wxman. If you think it's bad now, wait til she arrives in the US and the roles change and she's dependent upon you.

To make a cross-cultural relationship like this work there has to be an enormous level of patience on the part of both parties, one person can't shoulder the load. She'll make you more miserable than a polar bear in Africa.

[ScottinCrimea]

I don't know all that led up to the current situation, but the result is that she views you, not as a strong man, but as a child and is treating you like one.

When I first moved to Ukraine, due to my inability to speak Russian well and lack of understanding of the system there, my wife had to take the lead on many things that normally are the man's responsibility.  She didn't understand that many things that are commonly understood there were totally new to me and she couldn't understand how I had survived so long without knowing such "basic" things.  In her mind, even a child knew the things that I did not.  It took some time for her to see that I was indeed quite competent but it took me learning the language and the system to the point that I could take the lead.  Of course now that she is in the US and the roles have been reversed, she understands completely.

The difference that I am seeing here is that while my wife had the consideration and patience to work through it, I don't see the same trait in your girl, and her unwillingness to talk about it is not a good sign.  She is basically dismissing your thoughts and feelings as unimportant.

Subconsciously, it is now a mother/child relationship and it would take a lot of one on one time to change that, even if she were open to seeing it differently and you fully understood what you would have to do to change it.

Based on the limited information I have, I would say that things are broken and not likely to be fixed.

[kievstar]

Couple things - pictures first thing in morning not a good idea.  RW are more direct - you should have just blown off being in wrong spot when she told you - is it really a big deal?

Should not brag about taking subway - taxis are cheap.

I think you learned some things and you can move on to another  girl.  This will not work out longterm.

[Misha]

Question is…is this a culture thing with RW or is it just us? ...
I have dated many none Russian women before and I have never had this issue.

I believe you answered your own question. From what I read, I surmise that she is just not into you and does not seem to be feeling much of anything for you. Under those circumstances, I would have moved on pretty quickly. Things are unlikely to change, except for the worse.

[Doll]

The girl does sound she is irritated by you.

[GoodOlBoy]

Hello STICKYFLY. I am new to this particular forum, but I use to post at another forum for a couple of years, so I am not really a "NEWBIE" giving you some of my thoughts. That said, here goes. I read your post and I can tell you about my experience. It is VERY similar to your situation. I met a Russian girl about 7 years ago on the Internet. After several month's of e-mailing and calling, we decided to meet at a neutral site. We met in Europe, I paid for separate rooms at the same hotel. We spent 2 weeks together and as I look back on it there was SEVERAL warning signs then, but I just chalked it up as 2 different people 2 different cultures. We had a good time, but there were some signs I just didn't pay attention to. Fast forward to the next year (spring), I made plans to go to Moscow and meet her and then go on to her hometown. She met me in Moscow, a couple of days of happiness, but still something wasn't right. We went on to her hometown, I stayed at her flat (she wanted me to). My vacation was for 3 weeks (my boss gave me an extra week off, unpaid). When we arrived at her flat everything about our relationship changed. The description that you are posting , is almost VERBATIM, what I went through for 2 1/2 weeks. It was an absolute hellish experience.

Some advise from one American to another. Use this forum to help you!!!! There are people here who can point you in the right direction. It was a brave step on your part to get on an airplane and go to that country, make no mistake about it.

If I had known about these forums 7 years ago, I would have used them on my first visit to Russia.

I am not trying to tell you what to do, but this is what I would of done 7 years ago. Contacted some people on this forum, gotten information about a hotel room where you are at and end this situation now. Maybe get a translator this forum trusts and start looking again for someone more compatible in that town. You have spent several $1000. of dollars to get where you are. I don't know how much vacation time you have left, but DO NOT waste anymore time or money in this relationship. YOU WILL BE MISERABLE, trust me.

Also do not let SEX or ALCOHOL cloud your judgement. After several weeks I noticed that this girl would have a few drinks of champagne at night and get all "Warm and Fuzzy".

This is just my 2 cent's. GOOD LUCK and have a safe trip back to the States.  

[Diplomacy]

Get a plan B or put it into effect.  Women are women, and you already know what everyone is telling you is good advice.  You have done more then most men, by going there and just get out from this girl.  Yes, they are very blunt.  That is just rude though and if you do not like how you are treated that is all you need to say.  the flip side is you do know where you really stand in their eyes and no mind games a lot of the time.

Let me tell you about how I got my butt locked out of a flat, because I had no idea about 4 turns and 2 turns on the lock.  Now that is not a good feeling.  Pretty funny now, but it sucked when I had to call her and ask what was I doing wrong.  I did call though, and she was helpful and did not talk down or think I was less of a man.  I just said, that is not how my locks work and had not seen them before.  I would have asked her if I knew before she left how to open it.

Not the same thing, but it is close.  I also had her follow me to the school,market and back.  Even though we had been there a few times, I did not want to get lost.  She did not act close to that way.  It was not a direct route, and the building all look the same.  Plus you were cutting through apartment complexes and I need a GPS to get most places to begin with.

Btw, good job on finding your way around.  I was not allowed to take a taxi lol.  We need to be careful with money I was told.  I walked most of the time, the people on the bus could gag a maggot sometimes.  Plus they push and shove everywhere.  I dropped my shoulder on one guy in the market, he did not know what hit him lol. 

[OlgaH]

I can tell you this is not a culture question, but rather a personality conflict between you and her... not want to sound bad, but if you are looking for a life partner, this is not the one.

The girl does sound she is irritated by you.

Agree.

[kievstar]

diplomacy, why were you not allowed to take a taxi?  What city were you in you needed a GPS?  just curious. 

[docetae]

About Taxi. my wife is asking me sometime why I don't take metro. Answer is simple, I have traveled a third of the earth to be with her and I prefer to keep my time for us rather than transport....

[Diplomacy]

diplomacy, why were you not allowed to take a taxi?  What city were you in you needed a GPS?  just curious. 

Poorly written sentence.  I need a GPS in America, I get lost driving all the time.  Just not my strength.  My fiancee just thought the taxi was a waste of money, and it was not worth the fight over it.  Everyone has their quirks lol.  I tried to explain if we pay $4.50 UAH to take the bus with 3 people, we were not saving all that much. 

We did take the taxi to and from the airport.

It was like a who's on first translation problem.  Just took bus 150 and off I went.  I could have taken the taxi when it was just me and her son, but at that point it was cheaper to take the bus and walking is free.

She is used to just making it, so I understand why she was saying what she did. 

I like to walk, and there was an added benefit.  I lost 10 lbs on the trip.  It was not a tapeworm either lol.  So I am now at my ideal weight and the doctor is happy.

[kievstar]

Diplomacy, I was just curious.  Some girls I have dated hate when I take taxi's.  Think it is a waste of money. 

I used to get lost in Kiev as I would run 5 plus miles in one direction and than realize where am I? 

[UTRO]

Sveta's prefered methods of Transportation, in order...

Walking
Bus
Dad's car, with him driving
Taxi

a 12 hour train ride to Moscow vs a 2 hour flight 

[Diplomacy]

I think of it similar to the depression era people here in the states growing up.  I appreciate the fact that they went without, and my generation has not seen times like that.  Of course it may be creeping on us now.  Time will tell on that one.

I am an open book, if it does stop an argument for someone else on the boards it is worth posting.

[UTRO]

I think of it similar to the depression era people here in the states growing up.  I appreciate the fact that they went without, and my generation has not seen times like that. 

Diplomacy, you make a very valid point. Most Russian/Ukraine people, especially those outside of the big cities who were at least partially exposed to the Soviet system, are as you describe above. Most are simple and live within their means, due to not having the things we have taken for granted and of course their generally low salaries. They do indeed remind me of my Mum and Dad, who grew up during the Depression and lived through the rationing of WWII.

[groovlstk]

Actually, many times there's a more simple explanation: taking the metro is simply faster than using a taxi. For instance, getting around Manhattan and (especially) Moscow via subway is much quicker than using taxis, yet out-of-towners may not be at ease w/the system so their first inclination is to wave a taxi. If they don't live in a city they will also usually assume that locals use the subway only because it's cheaper.

[mrs.Shadow]

Question is…is this a culture thing with RW or is it just us? Is there anyway I can get her to be more open about communication or do I just have to find a way to deal with it if I want to stay with her?
I have dated many none Russian women before and I have never had this issue.

1. It is not a culture thing, it is her personality.
2. Russian women always count on different culture of countries and language understanding, that is why they will not demand from you more then foreigner can do. Opposite, then will not think it is so simple for foreigner to get to the place by public transport. Once you reached she could be proud of you too that you could do it.
3. This woman sounds like she is tired from you. With this I do not think it will be a good long happy life together. Opposite it will grow more and more if it already started like this nowadays.

Sorry for negative answer.