Wife split!

[Ade]

It is really sad when these things happen, and Wayne seems to be a genuinely nice fellow based on reading his posts. I truly hope that he is not hurt too badly by this (emotionally and financially). However, such cases should highlight the importance of not rushing into marriage with a woman until you are certain that you understand her true intentions.

Yes, it is sad but I think stories like this should be mandatory reading for anyone considering going to "high risk" countries looking for a wife.

And Europeans should also be aware; our systems here may be different but I know of "imported wives" in Norway that plan to leave their husbands just as soon as they get their citizenships and even if they may not be entitled to half of everything, as far as I know they are still entitled to half of everything gained during the marriage in most European countries. Regardless of material wealth that may be lost, the psychological harm caused to most men by being used this way is considerable.

Think with your head on your shoulders guys not the one between your legs and try to remember that old adage; if it seems too good to be true, then it probably is.

[groovlstk]

In another thread a one-week wonder explains his decision to get engaged to a stranger by pointing out that people who live together prior to marriage have a higher rate of divorce than those who don't. In case you new guys don't already see through his house of cards, his logic is fallacious - marry a stranger and this could be you.

Wayne moved proverbial mountains to be with this woman, endured years of waiting because he believed in her. All this time she was playing him, and I can absolutely flat guarantee you she has lost not a moment's sleep over it.

Mishenka, sorry to beat on you again, but there is absolutely zero value in Wayne or anyone else for that matter sitting down with his ex and discussing the reasons why she did this or what led up to it. It would be like having tea with Charles Manson and discussing Proust. Read Misha's post above. There are many RW who truly believe that if you are foolish enough to allow yourself to be deceived, then they are 100% blameless in leading you on. YOU are responsible for your own demise, she was just along for the ride. Even among decent RW there may be mild sympathy for guys like Wayne but in general the verdict will be that he bought it on himself.

Maxx has written tomes on this, and we see it time and again here, whether it's an agency owner looking a client in the eye and telling bald-faced lies, or a pro dater crying on her mark's shoulder asking for money for a sick mom, or a green card girl spreading her legs and holding her breath until AOS is completed: many Western men simply cannot fathom how anyone can lie so shamelessly and so convincingly. Yet it happens, and it happens all too often, so if you take shortcuts on the road to marriage don't be surprised to find yourself in a world of hurt - and don't make excuses that it "can happen to anyone." 

Wayne, I sincerely hope you can extricate yourself from this harpy as quickly and painlessly as possible. She isn't worth the dirt on your boots.

[jj]

You should consider getting photos of her and the boyfriend together, even hiring a PI to give you some backup proof.  Could some expense but better than attempting to do it yourself . Just a thought. 

[Mishenka]

Groovlstk, I'm happy to take a beating, where one is needed. Let me explain where I come from. On this small bit of info we got in only one post from Wayne, then after reading his past posts before I responded, it's not enough for me to pass judgement.  To most of us, looking from the outside with no emotional attachment, we see red flags where Wayne did not. When you add in the emotional attachment, falling in love with the idea of this amazing woman falling for you, it clouds your judgement.

Also for me, being a past family and marriage councilor for years, I always "wish" for people to sit and talk things out. I have seen many marriages saved where failing to talk about things, and misunderstandings were the culprit. Once we sat down together and began to listen, it became clear that old fires were put out and many reasons for dissatisfaction were diffused. In Wayne's case, you are right, there is no reason to talk, no reason to consider second chances. When someone breaks all trust, by her actions, "moving out with another lover"  even if she is lying about this, either way, she can never be trusted again. So my thoughts are as the majority here. It's time to take action, protect what Wayne has ( if she hasn't already taken him to the cleaners with credit card spending and emptied the bank accounts)  and he must move on.

I don't see value in spending hard earned cash to hire detective, take photos, prove anything. Simply withdraw financial support based on  the illegal "marriage of convenience"  that he can prove with her actions. witholding sex, leaving to be with her lover or "lovers", as mmaxx2 posted. I personally knew a RW 8 years ago who had 4 lovers on the side, during her marriage moving from one to the next. She was 26 and stunning, could get any man to take her home in 2 minutes time. 

Follow the list as it relates to this case and Wayne will do fine. The most difficult part is dealing with the devastation of it all. He was fooled by the woman and her daughter.

[Maxx2]

There are many RW who truly believe that if you are foolish enough to allow yourself to be deceived, then they are 100% blameless in leading you on. YOU are responsible for your own demise, she was just along for the ride. Even among decent RW there may be mild sympathy for guys like Wayne but in general the verdict will be that he bought it on himself.

That is true and I found there are a lot of guys that feel the same way. I think people get "the understanding of what has happened to them is a result of their poor choice in a spouse" confused with that "they deserve to be defrauded because they made this poor choice". It is like a woman being blamed because she trusted her date and got date raped in the process. Sure a guy has to be sophisticated and worldly wise but that is not something a guy can go out and get like buying an insurance policy. Then there are these smart guys like Randy2 the high priced New York divorce lawyer who get burned as well by a GCG wife and her criminal boyfriend.   


Maxx       

[Maxx2]

I don't see value in spending hard earned cash to hire dectective, take phots, prove anything.

9 times out of 10 that is the case. Usually the best advice is to minimize the legal costs. The USCIS will not care one wit if you have photos or film for that matter of your wife and her boyfriend. Bona fide marriage laws are not enforced.





Here’s some photos of cheating wives some of the guys have sent me and the INS did nothing. They could care less. IMO it is best not to know some things or to have these images in one’s mind. 

[BC]

9 times out of 10 that is the case. Usually the best advice is to minimize the legal costs. The USCIS will not care one wit if you have photos or film for that matter of your wife and her boyfriend. Bona fide marriage laws are not enforced.

Here’s some photos of cheating wives some of the guys have sent me and the INS did nothing. They could care less. IMO it is best not to know some things or to have these images in one’s mind. 

Cute blonde in the first pic.. could have easily fooled me once.. maybe twice.. maybe thrice.. - and have any immigration judge drooling.  - I'm willing to bet a beer that someone was playing out of their league, in optical or financial terms.

Yeah you're probably right Maxx.. Thoughts of getting someone deported for their actions are futile so just write it off, they are staying.

[Misha]

Then there are these smart guys like Randy2 the high priced New York divorce lawyer who get burned as well by a GCG wife and her criminal boyfriend.       

Well, even smart guys can lose their senses if not careful. Research demonstrates that men can be unduly influenced by a pretty face. According to an article entitled "Pretty women scramble men's ability to assess the future":

Both male and female students at McMaster University were shown pictures of the opposite sex of varying attractiveness taken from the website 'Hot or Not'. The 209 students were then offered the chance to win a reward. They could either accept a cheque for between $15 and $35 tomorrow or one for $50-$75 at a variable point in the future.

Wilson and Daly found that male students shown the pictures of averagely attractive women showed exponential discounting of the future value of the reward. This indicated that they had made a rational decision. When male students were shown pictures of pretty women, they discounted the future value of the reward in an "irrational" way - they would opt for the smaller amount of money available the next day rather than wait for a much bigger reward.

Women, by contrast, made equally rational decisions whether they had been shown pictures of handsome men or those of average attractiveness.

"We have not elucidated the psychological mechanisms mediating our results," says Margo Wilson. "But we hypothesise that viewing pictures of pretty women was mildly arousing, activating neural mechanisms associated with cues of sexual opportunity."

Tommaso Pizzari, an evolutionary biologist at Leeds University, offers another possible explanation: "If there's the prospect of getting a very attractive partner it may pay a man to take more risks than if an average partner was available."

In other words, men as we all know will act irrationally and sacrifice future rewards in the hopes of immediate satisfaction if a pretty face is involved Even smart men will take bigger risks and as a consequence are more likely to get burnt in the process.

[Ade]

That is true and I found there are a lot of guys that feel the same way. I think people get "the understanding of what has happened to them is a result of their poor choice in a spouse" confused with that "they deserve to be defrauded because they made this poor choice".

No, they don't deserve this sort of treatment of course but they are adults, supposedly intelligent professionals in a lot of cases, and if they make very bad judgements or let their dick lead them to places they shouldn't be going then they share some responsibility in what happens to them. Sure, it's possible to do everything right and still end up being played by a master (mistress) con artist but it's far less likely.

How many train wrecks are waiting to happen here? How many (possible socially inept) men that are fat or old or unattractive are chasing stunning women 20+ years their junior and are way out of their league? Really, is it any surprise that the number of wrecks and cons seem to be so large when there are so many guys willing to have the egos stroked by a pretty young thing? As we know, fat old men like Ken can have successful relationships with women that look more like their beautiful daughter but these relationships are the rare exception not the rule.

[BC]

How many train wrecks are waiting to happen here? How many (possible socially inept) men that are fat or old or unattractive are chasing stunning women 20+ years their junior and are way out of their league? Really, is it any surprise that the number of wrecks and cons seem to be so large when there are so many guys willing to have the egos stroked by a pretty young thing? As we know, fat old men like Ken can have successful relationships with women that look more like their beautiful daughter but these relationships are the rare exception not the rule.

I have learned a new sense of 'hot to trot' since hanging around these boards.

[Maxx2]

Cute blonde in the first pic.. could have easily fooled me once.. maybe twice.. maybe thrice.. - and have any immigration judge drooling.  -

She was 22 and he 31. An average looking guy.



Calling 911 on him. Looks terrified doesn't she?





A reward she got for some charity work that was used to help her immigration case. BTW they are from Ireland.


Maxx

[Wayne]

I want to thank everyone who responded and tried to help.  Wife has been coming to the house to check for her mail while I am at work.  Not sure I can stop her from getting the green cards when they come.  Interview was more than a month ago.

My Son is staying with me for moral support.  Wife came into the house yesterday.  Told Son that he cannot stay.  Probably she doesn't want him to witness anything. 

Changed the lock.  Deprogrammed the garage door opener. 

Yesterday, the transmission blew out on my old car with more than 200,000 miles.  So a big repair bill!  Meanwhile, wife drives expensive car while I make the payments.

I need to find a way to get the car back.

She doesn't have a job and I have no idea where to serve her any papers.  What if I wait to see what she does after finding out she is locked out?  I am in very bad position money wise.  When I went through a bad divorce and custody battle in 1991 to 1993, I finally ended up representing myself in court and got better results than the 7 attorneys that were involved in my case before.  Anyway, everytime I contacted her attorney, she had to pay. 

Yes, I was involved with Svetlana from Ukraine starting in 2000. 

[Maxx2]

She doesn't have a job and I have no idea where to serve her any papers.  What if I wait to see what she does after finding out she is locked out? 

Perhaps you can put a note on your door with a phone number for her to call you. When she does make a time and place where she can get a key only have a process server serve her instead. Don't do this yourself as that could set you up and it is usually the spouse can not do the process serving. Also it is a good idea to have a witness around. Having her tell your son to leave is another red flag she might be setting you up.

Sorry to hear about your money problems. This is the worst possible time for those.


Maxx

[Doll]

Yes, I was involved with Svetlana from Ukraine starting in 2000. 

Svetlana who?

[William3rd]

Perhaps you can put a note on your door with a phone number for her to call you. When she does make a time and place where she can get a key only have a process server serve her instead. Don't do this yourself as that could set you up and it is usually the spouse can not do the process serving. Also it is a good idea to have a witness around. Having her tell your son to leave is another red flag she might be setting you up.

Sorry to hear about your money problems. This is the worst possible time for those.


Maxx

Or just request publication of a summons based on your diligent attempts to serve her.

[Mishenka]

I want to thank everyone who responded and tried to help.  Wife has been coming to the house to check for her mail while I am at work.  Not sure I can stop her from getting the green cards when they come.  Interview was more than a month ago.

My Son is staying with me for moral support.  Wife came into the house yesterday.  Told Son that he cannot stay.  Probably she doesn't want him to witness anything. 

Changed the lock.  Deprogrammed the garage door opener. 

Yesterday, the transmission blew out on my old car with more than 200,000 miles.  So a big repair bill!  Meanwhile, wife drives expensive car while I make the payments.

I need to find a way to get the car back.

She doesn't have a job and I have no idea where to serve her any papers.  What if I wait to see what she does after finding out she is locked out?  I am in very bad position money wise.  When I went through a bad divorce and custody battle in 1991 to 1993, I finally ended up representing myself in court and got better results than the 7 attorneys that were involved in my case before.  Anyway, everytime I contacted her attorney, she had to pay. 

Yes, I was involved with Svetlana from Ukraine starting in 2000. 

Wayne, please, don't wait another minute to do anything. Forget about fixing the old car. You need your cash. Get your new car back ASAP. #1 The day she packed her bags and moved out with the new boyfriend, she ceased being your wife. More accurately, the day she moved into her separate bedroom and decided not to have sex with you again, ended it. I would have sent her packing that same day, removed my support and canceled the K1 visa and sent her home. Why did you go ahead with a Green card when she wasn't being a wife months ago? If going months with no sex or affection isn't a red flag, what is?  Something is seriously wrong here. Chances are high she had this guy planned from the start and has been with him from the start.  It's time to call her by another name. I will let you chose that.  She is not a wife to anyone. In her mind she never was.

You need a well thought out plan from start to finish to out smart her. You need to disconnect emotionally ASAP.   You are dealing with a calculating woman who has planned this carefully for years now.  She knows far more than you think. She is always one step ahead of you. Like a chess player, she is ready to make her next move depending on how "she expects"  your " easy going" personality to act.  She will anticipate your moves. Think outside the box. No more Mr. Nice guy. Don't give her an inch. Become a challenge to her.  She will exhaust all your resources, if she hasn't already. Once she has used you up, she is already starting on the next guy. Little does her next victim know, he is next in line.

First and formost, Get smart and get even.  She knows precisely what time the mail man delivers. Stop her from getting her green cards in her hands. Once she has them, you will never see her again.(not a bad thing) To do this stop the mail from coming to your house tomorrow! You need to get yourself a PO BOX, at the same time, put in a change address for all your mail to that PO BOX, including hers and the daughter, in case the cards come separately.  When you intercept the cards, put them in a bank safety deposit box for safe keeping.  You need your son in the house with you as much as possible. He has every right to stay and you need a witness for her actions.  It's not about what she wants. You call the shots. Take care of yourself first.  You can beat her at her own game.  Use the Buddy system! Always keep people around you as a witness.

Is the car only in your name or is she also on the title? If so call the bank, request to remove her name.

The only way I see to get your car back is to distract her,(your son can create a squabble easy enough) grab the keys and go-  Make your first stop at the dealer to change the keys/ door locks remote code. This way she can't take it back unless she steals the keys.   If you have joint bank accounts, withdraw the cash (if she hasn't already) and start a new account at a new bank only in your name.  Leave her no access to your funds. No access to your car, no access to your home. Don't cancel your JOINT credit cards with her name on them, just remove her name.  It is too hard to get credit now and unless your score is high they won't issue a new one with the same low interest.  If her name is on anything with you, remove it. Cut her off without notice. Don't talk to her. Change your car registration title at the DMV to your name only. Do your best at the bank to remove her name from the car loan also if she is on it.  Maybe all this has been said before, fine, protect yourself. It's gonna be a wild ride when she finds out the locks have been changed. You need to control the situation, not her.  If you have papers ready to serve, have your son or a neighbor serve her outside your home while she is there. 
 
Only the best to you,
Mishenka

[Faux Pas]

I want to thank everyone who responded and tried to help.  Wife has been coming to the house to check for her mail while I am at work.  Not sure I can stop her from getting the green cards when they come.  Interview was more than a month ago.

You can go to your post office and request them to hold your mail for pick up or forwarded to a PO Box. If you are expecting it in the short term holding the mail would probably be the way to go. FWIW

[groovlstk]

First and formost, Get smart and get even.  She knows precisely what time the mail man delivers. Stop her from getting her green cards in her hands. Once she has them, you will never see her again.(not a bad thing) To do this stop the mail from coming to your house tomorrow! You need to get yourself a PO BOX, at the same time, put in a change address for all your mail to that PO BOX, including hers and the daughter, in case the cards come separately.  When you intercept the cards, put them in a bank safety deposit box for safe keeping.

I'm no divorce attorney, but confiscating mail that is not addressed to him is not only something that can be used against him, it's also blatantly illegal. I'd think that Wayne should be thinking about protecting himself and plotting an exit strategy at this point rather than looking for revenge.

[Mishenka]

I am under the assumption that since he filed and paid for the green cards they would be mailed in his name.
Yes or no?

Mishenka

[Faux Pas]

I'm no divorce attorney, but confiscating mail that is not addressed to him is not only something that can be used against him, it's also blatantly illegal. I'd think that Wayne should be thinking about protecting himself and plotting an exit strategy at this point rather than looking for revenge.

I would suppose you are right but, drastic measure calls for drastic action. It is his house and he can hold the mail if he chooses or change his mailing address. Of course we only have one side of the story but if he is being forthright with the facts, keeping her out of his house, mailbox, bank and everywhere is a much needed protective measure. The lady has deceived him from day one, he should take action to stop the hemorrhaging. Who is to say the green card arrived and that he received it?

[groovlstk]

I would suppose you are right but, drastic measure calls for drastic action. It is his house and he can hold the mail if he chooses or change his mailing address. Of course we only have one side of the story but if he is being forthright with the facts, keeping her out of his house, mailbox, bank and everywhere is a much needed protective measure. The lady has deceived him from day one, he should take action to stop the hemorrhaging. Who is to say the green card arrived and that he received it?

Great to see you Monday morning quarterbacks who aren't even sure who's name is on the envelope containing his wife's green card spout off and urge him to be aggressive, which will play right into his wife's attorney's hands. 

The only people Wayne should be heeding right now are Maxx and William III.

[groovlstk]

I am under the assumption that since he filed and paid for the green cards they would be mailed in his name.
Yes or no?

Mishenka

Wrong

[Maxx2]

The only people Wayne should be heeding right now are Maxx and William III.

Heed the counsel of an immigration attorney. They hold their nose with their immigration clients but wish the Americans well when they deserve it. I see this with William the 3rd, good man and true American.


Maxx         

[Mishenka]

Is it even possible to get a temporary green card in your hands this quickly? Especially with positive TB?  Something sounds off  base here, May- October,  6months?

Groov, wrong? I guess you speak from experience.   If  Wayne applied with her together for the temp green card shouldn't his name also be on the envelope? Sure only her name appears on the card itself, if there is one coming(TB). I can't imagine enough time has passed to know for sure if she was approved in the end or not.  He has every right to be aggressive and protect what she hasn't taken yet.  In her mind she has already taken his home, car, money and credit cards.  One of my best friends is a dentist, and went through this,  had his marriage annulled, it still cost him $12 grand.

FAQ's from USCIS

Q: If I get a divorce after I get my conditional greencard based on marriage, but before I apply for my permanent greencard, can I still get my permanent greencard?

A:Yes, as long as it can be shown that it was a "valid marriage" entered into in good faith, which ended in divorce or annulment, you can get your permanent Alien Registration Receipt Card or "Greencard". Just remember though, that in the above circumstances, you must seek a "waiver of the joint filing requirement" so that your ex-husband or wife will not have to sign the application.

I think Wayne could show by her actions early on( day after the wedding) that this is not a "valid marriage" It doesn't appear to be entered into in "good faith" on her part. She could loose her chance of receiving the card by Wayne by withdrawing his  sponsorship based on fraud. There are no joint children involved. He needs to be aggressive and act.

Mishenka

[BC]

Wayne,

Do yourself one huge favor.. don't do anything that isn't signed off on by your attorney.