Wife split!

[Sculpto]

Though again- the law and me  think that the marital property belongs to both.
After all they are still married.

Doll, your comment is exactly the type of comment that would raise a gigantic red flag in my eyes if my woman made the same comment. 

Why is the property, not that I have much, that I had BEFORE I met her in any way her property?  I worked, earned, purchased long before I met my woman.  If I CHOOSE to share something with her thats great.. but... she has no claim on my collections or my inherited furniture or my car that I am making payments on...  In my mind, and I certainly hope in the law of the land, she would have no claim to anything I had prior to a failed marriage.  What we may have aquired together is a different story.  And, quite frankly.. if I found myself in such a situation as Wayne, I would go underground faster than a speeding bullet and she would get nothing, nada, cero, zilch and could stowaway on a steamer to Murmansk if she tried to pull some bull like Wayne has gone through.

As a case in point relative to the search process... there was once a girl in Odessa I was very interested in.  She had Azeri blood and was stunning and smart.  She tickled my brain and my soul.  I was starting to feel pretty serious about going to visit her so one day I asked her if we could have a "question answer".. I would ask her anything and she would do the same and ask me anything.  The only rule was we had to be totally honest in the answer.  Well, being the chess player I am I worked the q and a to the point of marriage property, earnings and family material growth and success.  Her answer was honest and I give her credit, even though I admonished her for her answer.  She said (quote paraphrased) "Everything you have is half mine, you will work and pay for all, I will work and keep my money for myself, when we have child I will stay home with child for one year and after You will pay for babysitter, you will buy me car and all clothes I want, you will pay vacation and we must to eat in nice resturaunt two or three night every week.  I will not cook and it better if you pay woman to come to clean house...."  and so on.. she really had a long list and she had it all worked out.  I was especially shocked because I had already explained my financial situation which is in SF the low side of middle class.. no mansions.. no baby sitters.. no cleaning ladies... no eating at Kuletos thrice a week... I told her to look for rich man with no self esteem.  LOL..

With some, a lot even, of the ladies I corresponded it really seemed they did not hear what i was telling them about my situation or my means.  What I did feel very often was the ladies had their own list of expectations and they read into whatever I told them.  They tried to read some secret meaning into my words.. seemed they were looking for some hidden surprise that simply did not exist. 

The Ukrainian Azeri Princess of Odessa persisted in writing to me for quite some time after but I never responded again after the q and a chat.  Eventually she quit RLM and I guess probably married an Odessa oligarch, if there is such a beast, as she did claim to have many local men who were interested in her.

btw.. why do my posts always end up so long.. I really do try to be brief.

[Misha]

If she wants to just walk off with the car, she owes him his portion of what has been paid off so far and then she must assume all payments for the car.

He's in a hard place because if he discontinues payments on the car it will mess up his credit rating.

Let's say hypothetically speaking that he stops making the payments and lets the company know that he is handing back possession of the vehicle to them. When they assume possession, he cancels his car insurance. What then? In Canada, I can't register and insure a car that I do not own. She would then be driving a vehicle that belongs to the credit agency, a car that no longer has any insurance. In Canada it is illegal to drive a car that is not properly registered and insured.

[Sculpto]

True, but it's a safe bet that she didn't enter the marriage in good faith and that was probably her intent.

Felix.. I have to disagree.  I will tell you why.. its simple..

Maybe I am being naive to think the pre-meditation involved to be a totally planned out GCG is too far out to be possible.  Besides being criminal such behavior is clearly sociopathic.  Lets not even consider the disgusting implications of the parasite.. simply the kind of sociopath that would plot such an escapade.  Fill in the blanks.. i don't want to go through the excercize.. I shudder, quite literally, thinking about such a disgusting human.

If you accept my premise it would indicate, and I believe this is the more likely scenario, the woman did absolutely NO thinking about what she was doing.. she lived purely in the moment.. got to Wayne's house and had an attack of panic brought on by who knows what, exhuastion, lack of orgasm, foul odor on the mans breath, she is really a closeted lesbian but can't face it in herself because of Russian morality, who knows...  And from that point on she bumbled from one stupid situation into another for five months until she got someone with enough focus to point her into a direction that made sense to her.  

Although, while at Sheremetevo Airport I did see an offical governmental office with the letters GCG posted on the door and a line of gorgeous blondes in high heels waiting to get in.  

I believe the Russian word is "bliet".  Sorry to the Russian speakers for the vulgarity but my girl spent the better part of an afternoon teaching me Russian cuss words.. Wayne's x woman seems a perfect candidate for this word.. and how do you say parasite in Russian?

[felix8787]

Doll, your comment is exactly the type of comment that would raise a gigantic red flag in my eyes if my woman made the same comment. 

Why is the property, not that I have much, that I had BEFORE I met her in any way her property?  I worked, earned, purchased long before I met my woman.  If I CHOOSE to share something with her thats great.. but... she has no claim on my collections or my inherited furniture or my car that I am making payments on...  In my mind, and I certainly hope in the law of the land, she would have no claim to anything I had prior to a failed marriage.

This is where a prenup would be a wise thing to have.

As a case in point relative to the search process... there was once a girl in Odessa I was very interested in.  She had Azeri blood and was stunning and smart.  She tickled my brain and my soul.  I was starting to feel pretty serious about going to visit her so one day I asked her if we could have a "question answer".. I would ask her anything and she would do the same and ask me anything.  The only rule was we had to be totally honest in the answer.  Well, being the chess player I am I worked the q and a to the point of marriage property, earnings and family material growth and success.  Her answer was honest and I give her credit, even though I admonished her for her answer.  She said (quote paraphrased) "Everything you have is half mine, you will work and pay for all, I will work and keep my money for myself, when we have child I will stay home with child for one year and after You will pay for babysitter, you will buy me car and all clothes I want, you will pay vacation and we must to eat in nice resturaunt two or three night every week.  I will not cook and it better if you pay woman to come to clean house...."   and so on.. she really had a long list and she had it all worked out.  I was especially shocked because I had already explained my financial situation which is in SF the low side of middle class.. no mansions.. no baby sitters.. no cleaning ladies... no eating at Kuletos thrice a week... I told her to look for rich man with no self esteem.  LOL..

Hm, disrespectful, lazy, golddigger and she forgot to mention that while you are at work, she sleeps with whom ever she wants and you keep you mouth shut. LOL.

[William3rd]

Besides being criminal such behavior is clearly sociopathic.  Lets not even consider the disgusting implications of the parasite.. simply the kind of sociopath that would plot such an escapade.  Fill in the blanks.. i don't want to go through the excercize.. I shudder, quite literally, thinking about such a disgusting human.

BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The heart and soul of the green card girl-or green card guy.

[BC]

It seems that the overwhelming attitude of WM is that if the relationship does not work out then she should be deported.

Nothing wrong with that but suggest contacting your congressman or senator to try and change the law instead of all the bickering that's going on here.

[felix8787]

Felix.. I have to disagree.  I will tell you why.. its simple..

Maybe I am being naive to think the pre-meditation involved to be a totally planned out GCG is too far out to be possible.  Besides being criminal such behavior is clearly sociopathic.  Lets not even consider the disgusting implications of the parasite.. simply the kind of sociopath that would plot such an escapade.  Fill in the blanks.. i don't want to go through the excercize.. I shudder, quite literally, thinking about such a disgusting human.

If you accept my premise it would indicate, and I believe this is the more likely scenario, the woman did absolutely NO thinking about what she was doing.. she lived purely in the moment.. got to Wayne's house and had an attack of panic brought on by who knows what, exhuastion, lack of orgasm, foul odor on the mans breath, she is really a closeted lesbian but can't face it in herself because of Russian morality, who knows...  And from that point on she bumbled from one stupid situation into another for five months until she got someone with enough focus to point her into a direction that made sense to her.  

Although, while at Sheremetevo Airport I did see an offical governmental office with the letters GCG posted on the door and a line of gorgeous blondes in high heels waiting to get in.  

I believe the Russian word is "bliet".  Sorry to the Russian speakers for the vulgarity but my girl spent the better part of an afternoon teaching me Russian cuss words.. Wayne's x woman seems a perfect candidate for this word.. and how do you say parasite in Russian?

Yes Sculpto I accept your premise, she could of been not thinking about what she was doing while she was here. But what about the 4 1/2 years she was in her home country? She could of just used Wayne for all that he is worth without evening coming here and leaving her comfort zone or until Wayne decides to end the relationship and move on. Wayne after all was supporting her with what he could.
I believe that she thought long and hard about this but didn't know how to execute her plan and kinda of just went with it.
After being married for a little over a month, sex on wedding night and then moving into the next room to me would be a very big indicator that something is very wrong.
Just my thoughts.

felix8787
 

[Wayne]

Wife picked out the car.  It was much more than i could afford.  She promised to get a job and make the payments.  Now, if she wants the car, she will need to make the payments, so I hope she does find work.

What about her apartment in Russia?  She owns this free and clear as it was given to her by daughter's grandfather.  Before leaving Russia, I remember she told me something about setting up a "power of attorney".  Her sister I think?  Anyway, there is a shortage of rental units in that city, so it is probably rented out.  I never seen any of the money.  I don't think she is planning to go back to Russia.  She could probably sell it?

Sometime shortly after we got the new car, my key disapeared.  Wife did not let me drive the car unless we were going somewhere together.  Someone suggested I could go to the dealer with the title and get another key made.  Wife wanted her name on the title, but because she had no credit history, I could not get the loan with her name on it or on the loan.  The license plates are good until Sep 2009.  It might not get sorted out until the property settlement.  Since we spent more than I earned since the marriage, we are going for spliting the debts.

I guess it could be worse.  She could have taken all the furniture, tools, art etc.  

[Sculpto]

This is where a prenup would be a wise thing to have.

I think the prenup is a false sense of security.  And just for discussion lets turn the pre-nup conversation upside down..

flashback to 1999 and my last GF.  Turned out that my GF was an heiress to a 80 million dollar estate.  I had no idea about this when I got involved with her.  As we got more serious she invited me to her cousins Long Island wedding.  On the plane on the way there she had "the talk" with me about her Grandfather.. the retired Harvard Law grad with an illustrious Manhatten corporate law career and owner of an 80 foot custom built yacht outfitted for long expedition scuba diving..

I could have cared less about the money.  In fact.. once SHE started to show signs of wierdness about the money it put a real strain on the relationship.  Anyway.. we enjoyed her cousins wedding and on the way back to the west coast we spent the whole time cuddles under a blanket looking at the collection of wedding magazines she picked up at the airport.  A week later we decided to get engaged.  Then her GP got all happy and bought us a house.  A week later we had a 5500 square foot house on the hill.. before she let me move in she handed me a 35 page pre-nup.  I was offended by the implication and after I read the document which included specifics in every aspect of life including sexual relations I refused to sign it.  I told her she either trusted me or she didn't and I could care less about her money.  We continued to cohabitate but the relations soured.  then one day her GF called me up and offered me 20K to move out.  I told him I would never take his money and that his attitude about money in regards to the girl were a massive corrupting force that had contributed in a large way to the failure of the relationship.  She was a parasite of a different sort.

Later, I had a good friend who is also a Harvard law grad look at the document.. he told me that not only was it not enforceable as written but could have been turned around to prove coersion on the part of her family.  If I had married her and sued for communal property I stood to have gained a large windfall.  Seems to me a pre-nup is simply an invitation to even greater legal problems.

[felix8787]

It seems that the overwhelming attitude of WM is that if the relationship does not work out then she should be deported.

BC,
My thing is this, if a woman claims to marry in "good faith" but in reality she didn't and her purpose was to get a GC, she shouldn't be aloud here. Now if she were to come here on her own, by her own means without marrying then that would be a different story.

But I have a IMO a very good question.

Let's say that "O" was here already and had her GC. "Would she of ever married Wayne?"
IMO no.

[Sculpto]

Yes Sculpto I accept your premise, she could of been not thinking about what she was doing while she was here. But what about the 4 1/2 years she was in her home country? She could of just used Wayne for all that he is worth without evening coming here and leaving her comfort zone or until Wayne decides to end the relationship and move on. Wayne after all was supporting her with what he could.
I believe that she thought long and hard about this but didn't know how to execute her plan and kinda of just went with it.
After being married for a little over a month, sex on wedding night and then moving into the next room to me would be a very big indicator that something is very wrong.
Just my thoughts.

felix8787
 

Well.. I agree with the scenario you present as well Felix.. it could be just as possible.  

Though it does present a question to me about sleeping arrangements.  This is something I discussed with my girl but I am interested in the thoughts and opinions of others.  sorry for this diversion from the main thread Wayne...

OK, so in my case I snore and I move a lot in sleep.  I would not want to sleep next to me.  LOL.  As it turns out I inherited this uncomfortable sleeping "habit/gene" from both my father and maternal grandfather.  My father and his second wife have seperate bedroooms.  They have now been married longer than my Mom and Dad were.  My Grandfather and Grandmother slept in the same room but had seperate beds.  According to my girl that is not terribly uncommon in Russia when space allows it.  

Thoughts, experiences, opinions?

[Sculpto]

Let's say that "O" was here already and had her GC. "Would she of ever married Wayne?"

So, Wayne.. can you answer this question with a good deal of self reflection before you answer it for us?  Would she have married you if she were already here?

I would say this is probably a good question for all of us to ask ourselves before proposing to any girl.

[felix8787]

I think the prenup is a false sense of security.  

I think that should I ever need a prenup it is to protect what I built before the marriage. And she would definitely need to read it and understand it, whatever was built afterwards in the marriage I understand about it being separated.

That ex of yours sounds silly. LOL  

I had a ex who's parent's were rich, but I didn't care about their money, but we broke up under totally different circumstances.

[groovlstk]

Wife picked out the car.  It was much more than i could afford.

What about her apartment in Russia?  She owns this free and clear as it was given to her by daughter's grandfather.  Anyway, there is a shortage of rental units in that city, so it is probably rented out.  I never seen any of the money.

Sometime shortly after we got the new car, my key disapeared.  Wife did not let me drive the car unless we were going somewhere together.

Wife wanted her name on the title, but because she had no credit history, I could not get the loan with her name on it or on the loan.

Jeez Wayne, you seem like a really nice guy but how in God's name did you allow yourself to end up as a doormat for this woman? You not only allowed her to walk all over you but you willingly turned over on your stomach so she could wipe her feet off on your back. 

I guess it could be worse.  She could have taken all the furniture, tools, art etc.

I'm sure that if she'd wanted these signed over to her while you were still together, you'd have done it in an instant, so you should probably thank her for her generosity.  

For you newbs out there, if a RW (or any woman, for that matter) doesn't return your advances, showering her with gifts or giving in to her every whim is not going to make her feel more affection towards you. This is a huge imperception American guys seem to have that is almost universally wrong, the only place it ever worked was in stupid Hollywood romantic comedies. The only emotion it will breed in a woman is contempt and (if you're lucky) pity.

[Misha]

OK, so in my case I snore and I move a lot in sleep.  I would not want to sleep next to me.  LOL.  As it turns out I inherited this uncomfortable sleeping "habit/gene" from both my father and maternal grandfather.  

Thoughts, experiences, opinions?

Go see a a doctor and get yourself checked out for sleep apnea. My snoring would leave my wife in tears. Went to see a doctor and got a C-PAP machine. Now, no more snoring, and I actually get a good night's sleep.

[ScottinCrimea]

Sculpto,  I agree with your premise for the most part.  Whether or not she started out as a GCG, at some point she decided that she didn't want to stick it out with Wayne and started looking for other options. This was undoubtedly before the wedding because she moved out of his bedroom the very next day (unless they had some huge blow up right after the wedding that caused her to change her mind sometime between "I do" and "I won't"). She married him ONLY because of the green card, then started looking for ways to get away once it arrived.  She jumped the gun a bit by moving out after their last argument, but she already had a boyfriend as part of her backup plan and figured she could rely on him. Unless he moved to New York with her, this apparently didn't work out as she had been planning.  I think at this point she is just winging it like you surmise that she did before, no real plan, just bumbling along on whatever advice she gets, not thinking about long term consequences beyond how it affects her in the immediate future.

It seems that the overwhelming attitude of WM is that if the relationship does not work out then she should be deported.

Nothing wrong with that but suggest contacting your congressman or senator to try and change the law instead of all the bickering that's going on here.

My attitude is that there are laws that state what is required for one to immigrate to the US.  In this case it requires proof of a committed relationship with US citizen.  They came here based on their statement of intent to be that citizen's wife, for the specific time required by law, in part to show that this intent was not fraudulent. If they are unwilling or unable to comply with this requirement, then they should return to their own country, just like anyone else who violates the terms of their visa.

Wayne, if she doesn't make payments on the car, the bank will come after you.  You are still responsible for the car no matter who has it.  Unless you have something in writing that transfers title and responsibility for the car over to her, anything that happens is on you.  Imagine, for example, that she doesn't keep the car insurance current and gets in a big accident where someone is injured.  As owner of the car, you will be named in any subsequent lawsuit and as the deep pockets (compared to her), it will all come down on you.  Then you can say good-bye to your house, tools furniture and everything else.  This is a time bomb just waiting to go off.

[ScottinCrimea]

OK, so in my case I snore and I move a lot in sleep.  I would not want to sleep next to me.  LOL.  As it turns out I inherited this uncomfortable sleeping "habit/gene" from both my father and maternal grandfather.  

Before going for a C-PAP machine or iron lung or anything else, try to avoid those things that create or exacerbate the problem.  If you are overweight, shed some pounds.  Avoid any depressants before bedtime such as sleeping pills, alcohol or pot.  These cause the back of your throat to relax too much, dropping down and partially obstructing your breathing passages. Try putting a 2x4 under the legs of the head of your bed so there is a very slight slope down to your feet (not so much that you end up on the floor at the foot of your bed by morning) or try using an extra pillow. This allows gravity to help you out.  (Lord knows its effects on us as we age aren't so pleasant so at least we can get something back). There are also some simple surgical or laser procedures that can fix the problem.

Just some ideas that might help.  In any case cheaper than buying another bed or bedroom.

[felix8787]

BC,
My thing is this, if a woman claims to marry in "good faith" but in reality she didn't and her purpose was to get a GC, she shouldn't be aloud here. Now if she were to come here on her own, by her own means without marrying then that would be a different story.

But I have a IMO a very good question.

Let's say that "O" was here already and had her GC. "Would she of ever married Wayne?"
IMO no.

Any takers to this question?

[groovlstk]

Any takers to this question?

I think the answer is self-evident. I'd have a better chance of winning the Irish Sweeps (and having not even bought a ticket).

I'd also venture to say that if this question was asked to every RW who is married to a Western man, the answer might surprise you (and cause you to cancel your next trip to Ukraine or Russia).

[felix8787]

I'm a light sleeper, but I have been awakened by my own light snoring, other then that, I really don't snore, that I am aware of. I don't remember playing a nasty prank on my younger brother when we were kids, he would snore his @ss off and I couldn't take it no more, so I went and got a small glass of water and poured it into his mouth......  Yeah, it was mean, but damn it, it was SSOOOOO funny watching him get up, run into the bathroom, him thinking that he threw up on himself. Way to funny.
Besides I know myself and what postions I sleep in not to snore.

Sorry for being off topic  

[Misha]

Before going for a C-PAP machine or iron lung or anything else, try to avoid those things that create or exacerbate the problem.  If you are overweight, shed some pounds.  Avoid any depressants before bedtime such as sleeping pills, alcohol or pot. 

Sorry, this will be off-topic. Scott, it is evident that you do not suffer from sleep apnea   The problem is that you do not really sleep. You end up waking hundred of times per night because you stop breathing. You usually wake up with a headache and are exhausted, hardly putting you in the right condition to lose weight. Also, a good night's sleep is necessary for your body to produce the chemicals needed to lose pounds. I, for one, lost the weight AFTER getting a C-PAP and actually waking up refreshed and energized. Finally, different people are more prone to sleep apnea even if they are paper thin.  

These cause the back of your throat to relax too much, dropping down and partially obstructing your breathing passages. Try putting a 2x4 under the legs of the head of your bed so there is a very slight slope down to your feet (not so much that you end up on the floor at the foot of your bed by morning) or try using an extra pillow. This allows gravity to help you out.  (Lord knows its effects on us as we age aren't so pleasant so at least we can get something back).

This may help for some, but not all. I could sleep on my head, and I would still snore and would still suffer from sleep apnea.

There are also some simple surgical or laser procedures that can fix the problem.

True enough. Depends on personal preferences. I opted for a machine that blows air into my nose when sleeping as opposed to getting operated on which always has some risk, no matter how minor.

[felix8787]

I think the answer is self-evident. I'd have a better chance of winning the Irish Sweeps (and having not even bought a ticket).

I'd also venture to say that if this question was asked to every RW who is married to a Western man, the answer might surprise you (and cause you to cancel your next trip to Ukraine or Russia).

Yeah, it's a shame, but we all are taking a risk here and for those of you who are already in a happy, loving, committed marriage...CONGRATS to you all..........maybe I will be there some day.

[Misha]

For you newbs out there, if a RW (or any woman, for that matter) doesn't return your advances, showering her with gifts or giving in to her every whim is not going to make her feel more affection towards you.

Pretty much. If she is not attracted to you in the first few minutes, she is not likely to be attracted to you ever. Showering a woman with gifts will never get you love in return and will mark you out as a patsy.

[Sculpto]

Go see a a doctor and get yourself checked out for sleep apnea. My snoring would leave my wife in tears. Went to see a doctor and got a C-PAP machine. Now, no more snoring, and I actually get a good night's sleep.

Misha.. thanks for the concern.. its not sleep apnea.. i just snore.. if I am on my back its worse.. yet.. if I am in a hammock on the beach in Mexico it disappears.. LOL.. BTW.. my girl snores louder than me.. she says it started after some thugs in Tomsk broke her nose after taking some photos of them buring down a wood house.

[BC]

My attitude is that there are laws that state what is required for one to immigrate to the US.  In this case it requires proof of a committed relationship with US citizen.  They came here based on their statement of intent to be that citizen's wife, for the specific time required by law, in part to show that this intent was not fraudulent. If they are unwilling or unable to comply with this requirement, then they should return to their own country, just like anyone else who violates the terms of their visa.

Double edged sword.. how many guys use the 90 day as a 'trial' with total disregard to the laws.. Maybe even Wayne.

Fact is that regardless of the laws folks will bend them as far as they will stretch.

So all that is really left is responsibility and risk of the parties involved.

When things go sour though, the first thing that gets shucked is responsibility.

I see very little innocence and yeah.. as it regards risk, would be nice to walk away from the roulette table with all the chips lost.  Life don't work that way though.