Considering looking for a wife in FSU...

[Brianinaz]

Calvin,

Welcome, there are many approaches to this and proponents for each. The successful ones all have a common denominator which is get off the couch and get on a plane.

There is a unnamed philosopher who said "life is what happens while you are busy making other plans". In my opinion never truer words were spoken. So, you can make all the lists and criteria you want but in the end it won't make much difference.

My advice is go take a vacation. Leave your list at home. Get a tour guide of sorts and meet some people. You may want to put an ad in the paper, maybe not. Try to avoid the pro's; it's like going to Las Vegas,  occasionally someone wins but the cards are stacked against you

[ECOCKS]

...

My advice is go take a vacation. Leave your list at home. Get a tour guide of sorts and meet some people. You may want to put an ad in the paper, maybe not. Try to avoid the pro's; it's like going to Las Vegas,  occasionally someone wins but the cards are stacked against you

I would have to say the odds (and the payoffs) are quite a bit better than those experienced in Vegas.   

[OlgaH]

There is a unnamed philosopher who said "life is what happens while you are busy making other plans".

His name is John Lennon, the song "Beautiful Boy" 

[PeeWee]

Pee Wee I don't have any first hand experience with FSU women living here. I can only tell you, what I have read here, and the archives.

There appear to be two kinds of FSU women, one who have discarded the AM who brought her here, and are looking to trade up.

The second are here without a legitimate visa and are looking for a sponsor.

Both should be avoided like the Bubonic Plague of middle ages.

If there is a third kind I would like to know.

If finding a sincere RW was so easy to do here, AM would not be going half way around the world, and spending a substantial chunk of change to find one.

Expand your thought box. There are more than two versions. How about the lady who migrated here with her partents? And what if you found one that had arrived via an American connection? They divorced as do many American women.

Example 1. My friend Svetlana arrived here from Moskva as the bride of an American fellow only later to find out that he was also married to a Ukraine woman, who he also brought here. I saw the marriage certificate so I know that is true. He was married to two women at the same time. Both that he broght here, over time, on K visas. Then she learned that he was a 10 time felon. Check forgery, embeselment, conterfieting, identity theft. She was crushed when she learned this so she divorced him but now she lives in the USA. She was the victim in this case.

Example 2. My friend Lena arrived here as the bride of an American fellow and after found out that he was not what he had led her to believe he was, she returned
 to Russia. I had known her for two years before she told me the story she was so embarassed by the event. She is now looking for the right man.

Example 3. My friend Irishka married a man from Belgium. Went to Belgium only to learn that he too was not what he professed to be. She divorced him and returned to Russia. She is now looking for another man.

In all cases these women were not at fault except that they chose the wrong man. So it goes both ways. A divoreced Eastern European woman living in your country has her own story and is no different as a result than
a divorced woman whom has lived in your country all her natural life. Everyone has their
baggage so do not so quickly discount that dream lady that you spot at the Russian food market one day right in your very own city.

Peewee

[ambach123]

Pee Wee, when there is a breakdown of relationship,  there are always two sides of any story. You should  not believe one side.

I would have no interest in a woman who has discarded her previous husband regardless of the whatever happened, if he brought her here. Think before you leap, that is for both parties.

There are tons of RW in USA, nonetheless everyone here has gone half way around the world to look for them at great cost in money, time and efforts. This must tell you something.

[Ade]

Pee Wee, when there is a breakdown of relationship,  there are always two sides of any story. You should  not believe one side.

I would have no interest in a woman who has discarded her previous husband regardless of the whatever happened, if he brought her here.

You must be kidding? Yes, sure, do not be blind to possible realities but to dismiss every woman out of hand just because she has been married to an American before is bizarre to say the least.

There are tons of RW in USA, nonetheless everyone here has gone half way around the world to look for them at great cost in money, time and efforts. This must tell you something.

It tells me that there are tons of guys that went to the FSU, not much else at all really.

[Misha]

I would have no interest in a woman who has discarded her previous husband regardless of the whatever happened

I presume it would be equally justifiable for a woman to have no interest in a man who discarded his previous fiancee regardless of what happened 

[Daveman]

I presume it would be equally justifiable for a woman to have no interest in a man who discarded his previous fiancee regardless of what happened 

I've run across and had to jump this hurdle sometimes.  I don't offer up detailed information about past relations, but invariably as I communicate with ladies, the question about "been here before" comes up.  Sometimes they are put off by it, to which I ask them, "why are you not married to your first Ukrainian/Russian boyfriend? Why not the second, the third?"  Usually that leads to a great conversation where "sex tourism" is never mentioned again. 

Ambach, I agree with much of the ideology behind your posts.  I agree with prenups written fairly to protect both parties in the event of worst case scenarios. I agree that sexual compatibility is an absolute MUST HAVE in a relationship or marriage.  I agree with being a bit skeptical and learning everything you can about a lady, discovering her true motives, etc., PRIOR to visa/marriage.  They WAY you express your opinions sometimes really puts people off, but the raw underlying data is sound, down to earth, and practical. 

That being said, I have to agree with the others here that to discard a woman out of hand simply because a marriage with a foreigner didn't work it a bit over the top.  Of course, that's your choice.. as it would be to discard a woman as a possibility because she has flaming red hair, freckles, or whatever.  Personally, I'd be cautious, pay attention, try to understand her situation and what she's all about, but I would never toss out someone because of a past relationship unless the reason for the failure is beyond the scope of my tolerance, e.g., something I seriously dislike about her character.

[groovlstk]

I would have no interest in a woman who has discarded her previous husband regardless of the whatever happened, if he brought her here. Think before you leap, that is for both parties.

I've been outspoken before on this topic although I'm sure few will agree w/me, as most guys show great sympathy for a woman who leaves her country to marry a foreigner only to discover that he's not who she thought he was. Unless he's a pathological or very skilled liar, usually the problem is not that he fooled her but that she never knew much about him in the first place. All too often one-week-wonders file their K1s and then find that their beloved fiancee isn't very interested in improving her English during the K1 waiting period or does the bare minimum to prepare for her new life abroad. I agree w/Ambach that it's just as much her obligation to get to know her fiance before coming here as it is his responsibility to know her.

That said, I disagree that these women should be discounted. Sure, some of them may have only wanted a GC, others may have made big mistakes in selecting a partner - but if you spend enough time in this pursuit you'll see there are way too many guys involved who have serious social and physical issues, substance abuse problems, etc.

FWIW, when I was dating local RW I always felt much more secure than when dating in the FSU. The playing field was much more even, the women were already acclimated to life in the US, they were already supporting themselves financially, and there were no major communication issues since they all had good English - ultimately they had less reason to hide an agenda plus being on my own turf made me more confident in how I assessed my prospects.

Guys will cough out plenty of excuses as to why you should stay away from local RW, yet I suspect the real motivation is sour grapes: without an economic advantage they are unable to get past square one with these women. Guys in their 40s and 50s can date beautiful 20something women via marriage agencies in Russia or Ukraine, but very few can do the same in the US. (And some US men on various boards will heap scorn on these women who shunned them as having been spoiled or become too much like their American sisters - completely unfair labels that tell more about their shortcomings as men than about local RW.)

IMHO, men who've done tours or dated FSU women on their own turf are the ones who may be spoiled and have unrealistic expectations, not local RW.

Bottom line is that you have to have some game to date local RW. I also believe it's a good barometer on what a guy can expect as far as dating prospects once the desperation factor is removed.

[Misha]

Bottom line is that you have to have some game to date local RW. I also believe it's a good barometer on what a guy can expect as far as dating prospects once the desperation factor is removed.

True, but it also helps if you live in a city with a large pool of RW to begin with. Just because there are two single RW in your city, it does not mean that you will be compatible. If there are hundreds or thousands of single RW in your city, the odds are better.

[Sculpto]

There are tons of RW in USA, nonetheless everyone here has gone half way around the world to look for them at great cost in money, time and efforts. This must tell you something.

It tells me that a lot of guys want to be a knight in shining armor and believe they have a better chance of being a "savior" with a woman who has not yet had experience here.  It also tells me that FSUW that are already here may have different expectations now that they have adapted to life in this country.  It also tells me that there may be greater competition with other men for FSUW that are already living here. 

I have met several ladies here in SF.  One a legal immigrant from vinittsa, one a semi illegal (status change from tourist visa) and another Jewish woman who came before the fall of the SU and one other woman frm Ukraine who adapted to America real fast and went from being a stunning beauty to a fat lazy american woman in a very short time.  The gal from vinittsa was so focused on getting her life going that she was not interested in a relationship, plus, she had some scammerish tendencies.  The lady doing the status change was hoping for a quick marriage.  The Jewish woman was just strange and seemed offended when I did not buy her a very expensive piece of jewellry she liked on our first and only date.  The one who got fat was also arrogant and full of bile regarding Americans.  The last time I noticed a posting from her on CL it stated she was looking for a body builder who is also a millionaire...  I should also mention that the woman from vinittsa who was the most eligible of the four had A LOT OF RUSSIAN GUYS THAT WERE INTERESTED IN HER ALSO. 

I think most men percieve they have a greater advantage when they go overseas than when they try to find a FSUW here.  Here "we" are just another guy, but, we have the advantage of being an "exotic foreigner" when we go over there.  I think the mystic of the exotic wears off pretty fast once a lady arrives here and that might lead to a lot of the disappointment we seem to hear about from the ladies. 

[groovlstk]

It tells me that a lot of guys want to be a knight in shining armor and believe they have a better chance of being a "savior" with a woman who has not yet had experience here. 

I'd disagree slightly. I doubt men rush to Russia simply to play the role of knight in shining armor, they can do that in their home countries. Most men go to Russia because they can find women who are younger and more beautiful than the pool of local women who are receptive to their advances. 

The knight in shining armor disguise comes out when a guy finds, falls, and proposes to a very beautiful young woman who lives a hardscrabble, difficult life. This woman has no affection for her savior but in his folly he puts that little consideration aside because he's convinced himself that he has a higher purpose as rescuer. All the while he hopes that his selflessness will cause his gf to someday fall in love with him

[Misha]

I'd disagree slightly. I doubt men rush to Russia simply to play the role of knight in shining armor, they can do that in their home countries. Most men go to Russia because they can find women who are younger and more beautiful than the pool of local women who are receptive to their advances. 

In the fairy tales the damsels in distress are never depicted as comely  I agree that if men were willing to settle for women not quite so young or no quite so attractive, few would venture far from home  :evil:

[JR]

It tells me that a lot of guys want to be a knight in shining armor and believe they have a better chance of being a "savior" with a woman who has not yet had experience here.  It also tells me that FSUW that are already here may have different expectations now that they have adapted to life in this country.  It also tells me that there may be greater competition with other men for FSUW that are already living here. 

I think most men percieve they have a greater advantage when they go overseas than when they try to find a FSUW here.  Here "we" are just another guy, but, we have the advantage of being an "exotic foreigner" when we go over there.  I think the mystic of the exotic wears off pretty fast once a lady arrives here and that might lead to a lot of the disappointment we seem to hear about from the ladies. 

Wants to smack SULPTO in the face with a trout but knows he speaks heap big truth

[Sculpto]

Wants to smack SULPTO in the face with a trout but knows he speaks heap big truth

LOL.. if it was a salmon I would hand you the fish..

but, I did forget to mention another BIG motivator... not sure if it is relevant or not.. but.. that is

drum roll....

EGO

How many times are guys who come to the forum advised to "date within your league" when pursuing FSUW?  How many train wrecks can be attributed to guys not following that advice?  And of course.. what an ego rush it is to have a beautiful woman on your arm.. a woman of quality not possible to attract here in the US because the few that are of such quality are in so high demand as to be unobtainable except by those with the most of everything...  a short cut to status = EGO TRIP which frankly goes hand in hand with being a "Captain"...

[Gator]

My wife has introduced me to many, many local RW.  The basis for immigration varies, and perhaps only 60% came as wives or fiancees of AM.  Of those, I know of only three RW who immigrated as fiancees and have divorced their AM husbands.  (Note:  I do not ask such questions).  In all cases, when the man and woman learned more about each other after marriage, they simply were not compatible.  One RW (without children) has moved in with a much younger AM.  The second has a child and has not had a steady boyfriend for sometime (she is interested in my friends even though they are much older).  A third seems a little trashy to me.

Outside of my wife's social circle, I have met only one single RW .  This RW was much younger than me yet gave me the "come on" signals such as the quick press of her breasts against my arm when examining my teeth (she is a dental hygienist).

I am happily married, yet if I were available, I doubt I would pursue any of these RW.  First, none really were interesting.  Second, it is far more interesting and exciting to date a RW in her element (i. e., her country).  

It is like having Thai food in an American restaurant with English menus vs. a steamy, open-aired restaurant on a Thai island.  The ingredients may be the same, yet everything else seems different including taste.  Yes, call me shallow or stupid.  I guarantee you that the attraction to me is not the relative ease of dating them in Russia.  It is not that I am more "exotic" to her, as Sculpto writes, but that everything including her is more exotic, stimulating the senses and enhancing the adventure.  However, this is not about having an adventure, but about creating a family.

Ego?  No, because that would suggest "trophy" and that is the silliest reason to marry.  Nevertheless, I think these RW require for the AM to have a lot of confidence if not a wacky side when going to a party, nightclub, etc.

Has some of the mystic of my wife worn off in her year here?  A little, yet she is still a very interesting woman, which separated her from the other RW (and AW) I dated.  Life with her is not boring, and that is so important.

[Daveman]

I've been outspoken before on this topic although I'm sure few will agree w/me, as most guys show great sympathy for a woman who leaves her country to marry a foreigner only to discover that he's not who she thought he was. Unless he's a pathological or very skilled liar, usually the problem is not that he fooled her but that she never knew much about him in the first place. All too often one-week-wonders file their K1s and then find that their beloved fiancee isn't very interested in improving her English during the K1 waiting period or does the bare minimum to prepare for her new life abroad. I agree w/Ambach that it's just as much her obligation to get to know her fiance before coming here as it is his responsibility to know her.

Well, consider me one of the few, the proud, the unsympathetic to idiots of any gender or nationality.  I'll take this notion a step farther and further damage my "reputation" here with the FSUW worshippers -- I think the intelligent FSUW, at least of those who choose to search for a foreign man, is probably the minority.  Book smarts, perhaps, maybe, some yes, but if the few hundred with whom I've had communication are indicative of the cranial condition of the others, then I must assert that I have yet to witness a larger group of blithering idiots in my life experience.  It's no wonder they cause their own train wrecks same as we accuse the guys of doing.  I have zero sympathy for fools who marry strangers.

A diamond in a basket of CZ, a nugget in a barrel of fool's gold... that's what one must seek and the analogy pertains to both the men AND women.

[JR]

Yes, call me shallow or stupid.

You KNOW I Just Gotta Do This...You are shallow and stupid.

There I did what you asked me to do. Now are you happy? :evil:

[PeeWee]

Pee Wee, when there is a breakdown of relationship,  there are always two sides of any story. You should  not believe one side.

I would have no interest in a woman who has discarded her previous husband regardless of the whatever happened, if he brought her here. Think before you leap, that is for both parties.

There are tons of RW in USA, nonetheless everyone here has gone half way around the world to look for them at great cost in money, time and efforts. This must tell you something.

I too went around the world at great cost in money, time, and efforts. What I found out is that I did not need to do that. I found out that I could save great cost in money, time, and efforts simply by hanging out at the local Russia/Ukraine food market or there are two Russian cuties working at my local post office and three more at the bank that I trade at. I have a nice on going relationship with one teller who has arrived in my community from Vlad-k. I don't know what there past history is, they don't know my past history and I don't know much about the hot looking French woman who I see at my office every so often but we chat, flirt, I tell her that I like her long black hair and her French accent...it just happens that way.

Peewee

[Gator]

You KNOW I Just Gotta Do This...You are shallow and stupid.

There I did what you asked me to do. Now are you happy? :evil:

My happiness does not depend upon interactions at RWD.  Making a few birdies his morning would be immeasuarably better.   

What specifically makes you believe I am shallow and stupid?

[Ade]

My happiness does not depend upon interactions at RWD.  Making a few birdies his morning would be immeasuarably better.   

What specifically makes you believe I am shallow and stupid?

Um. I think he was joking. You know, because you said, "call me shallow or stupid". I guess you could have issue with the fact that he didn't pick one or the other and called you both. 

[GoodOlBoy]

Most men go to Russia because they can find women who are younger and more beautiful than the pool of local women who are receptive to their advances. 

I agree Groovlstk.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, BUT...IMO there is nowhere else on the face of the earth, except the FSU, that a 50 something year "old goat" can go chase and marry a beautiful 20 something year old girl.  :evil:

 Second, it is far more interesting and exciting to date a RW in her element (i. e., her country).

Completely agree Gator.

The excitement of the "hunt" for my beautiful RW over in Russia, to me, was the most memorable part of this whole journey!

I am sure that some of the other married members will agree on this point?


GOB

[Misha]

The excitement of the "hunt" for my beautiful RW over in Russia, to me, was the most memorable part of this whole journey!

I am sure that some of the other married members will agree on this point?

I hate dating. I saw it as a means to an end which was finding a wonderful wife. The most memorable part was getting married, and the life that we now share.

[Faux Pas]

My happiness does not depend upon interactions at RWD.  Making a few birdies his morning would be immeasuarably better.   

How many birdies did you make?

[Gator]

How many birdies did you make?

Two.  One was cut and the other held up in our Thursday skins game.  Thanks for asking.  Now back to RW.