Correspondence - The Good, the Bad and the U...

[Brian]

     At what point do you bring up the “baggage” and get it over with? 

     Everyone’s profile tells what a great person they are.  Some people might wish to write several letters before delving into their past in hopes that the other person might be willing to overlook shortcomings.  I thought it would be good to mention my baggage in the first or second letter.  By doing this the lady gets all the bad items first and if she can get around this then okay let us move on with the more positive aspects.  One of my friends advised against this as I may not even make it to the third letter and I would never find a wife.  Another friend said it makes good sense.  After all who wants to write many letters back and forth and then the lady stops correspondence because I said or did this or that? As well, I would hope that the lady would open up with any issues that I should know.

     I just believe it best to be honest and upfront with a lady very early after only one or two letters and then the lady can decide if she wishes to know me better or to end the correspondence without either of us having exchanged several letters. 
   
    Would it not be respectable and honest to mention my negative points in the first or second letter so the lady could decide if she wishes to continue with correspondence?  I do not want to waste her time nor mine.  When it comes to correspondence I am trying to separate the fantasy from the reality.

    How did you bring up any bad points from your past as well as how did you handle FSUW bringing up any of her bad points?

[Faux Pas]

     At what point do you bring up the “baggage” and get it over with? 

     Everyone’s profile tells what a great person they are.  Some people might wish to write several letters before delving into their past in hopes that the other person might be willing to overlook shortcomings.  I thought it would be good to mention my baggage in the first or second letter.  By doing this the lady gets all the bad items first and if she can get around this then okay let us move on with the more positive aspects.  One of my friends advised against this as I may not even make it to the third letter and I would never find a wife.  Another friend said it makes good sense.  After all who wants to write many letters back and forth and then the lady stops correspondence because I said or did this or that? As well, I would hope that the lady would open up with any issues that I should know.

     I just believe it best to be honest and upfront with a lady very early after only one or two letters and then the lady can decide if she wishes to know me better or to end the correspondence without either of us having exchanged several letters. 
   
    Would it not be respectable and honest to mention my negative points in the first or second letter so the lady could decide if she wishes to continue with correspondence?  I do not want to waste her time nor mine.  When it comes to correspondence I am trying to separate the fantasy from the reality.

    How did you bring up any bad points from your past as well as how did you handle FSUW bringing up any of her bad points?

Jaysus dude you are green huh? NEVER bring up your bad points or your negative baggage when approaching a woman for a relationship. Any woman. Let them ask (and they will) at that time be honest, candid and forthright. Lying or avoiding will get you no where but "back to da'curb". You are selling yourself and you need a good pitch. There are no good pitches full of negatives.

 :ohbrother:

[Blues Fairy]

     I just believe it best to be honest and upfront with a lady very early after only one or two letters and then the lady can decide if she wishes to know me better or to end the correspondence without either of us having exchanged several letters. 

What a lazy bum.  What happened to good ol' wooing and taking at least some responsibility for the course of the relationship?  Do you really want the lady to make all the decisions for you, while you avoid any kind of emotional investment before you make sure she's ready to accept you with all your baggage?

[JR]

positive

Positive

POSITIVE

POSITIVE

accentuate the positive! You are selling yourself. After she likes you she may just overlook your criminal record, come on...you know you're guilty of being a man

And rememer, you don't have "baggage." You "life experiences" which have taught you valuable lessons in life and made you a better person

[GoodOlBoy]

Cleanse your soul Brian and tell us what you have done in the past?  :evil:


GOB

[Brian]

GOB

My "baggage" or bad stuff probably not much worse than many other men.  However, I have been around longer and have some life experiences; not all good. 

However, when I look back on my life there are very few things that I would change.

Most profiles seem to be about 6 lines of everyone saying how great they are.

With all the BS in life I just thought why not just say in a 2nd or 3rd letter/email that when I was younger I did do this or that.

My thoughts are to let the lady decide if she wants to continue correspondence with me or to let the correspondence crash and burn and move on to someone else.

[kievstar]

You should post your baggage here as we can help you.  I have a feeling your baggage is more than most men and people here can help you.  If not, its your loss.

[pitbull]

You should post your baggage here as we can help you.  I have a feeling your baggage is more than most men and people here can help you.  If not, its your loss.

Brian,

I agree... it depends on how "baggagy"  the baggage is. Let us know what it is and people will advise you as to when to let the women know. For example, if you refer to lets say 6 kids you have from previous marriages that you support, this should be said early on, preferably in your profile... Etc...

[Gator]

With all the BS in life I just thought why not just say in a 2nd or 3rd letter/email that when I was younger I did do this or that.

LET SLEEPING DOGS LIE!

Brian says "when younger" so I doubt this is about 6 kids.  Aren't you the one looking for a woman who never drinks alcohol?  If "yes," I expect what you consider is something bad may not bother a RW.  If "no," pardon my confusion.

LET SLEEPING DOGS LIE is the title of a film about a woman who, when asked by her fiance to reveal her darkest secrets, discloses that she once gave her dog a blowjob.      Needless to say....

Brian, what you did when younger does not carry much weight today, I hope.  Does it restrict how how you live today?  Your future?  Your ability to be a husband?  Is it some illness (mental or physical) that has not been cured and could manifest itself again?   Will it bring IMBRA into play?  Are you still bisexual?

If "no" to these questions, don't mention it.  If "yes," there is already plenty of BS as you say, so why plant more questions in her head so early in the correspondence.  Nevertheless, if "yes" and you plan on a WOVO meeting, I would mention it before you buy your tickets.  Pick the right moment, but never just throw it out.  Sheeesh...

Remember, RW respect confident men, much more than stupid honest men.

[ECOCKS]

Brian:

I would agree that you should practice prudent disclosure early on, especially since you are wanting an accelerated period of discovery in your building process. As you know from your earlier posts, not many here are very supportive of your taking the fast lane to a relationship strategy.

Prudence, in the form of judgment, is probably going to be your real question though. As someone says above, if you have 6 kids, mention it early and save time with those who are going to react negatively. If you are currently between jobs but have reasonable expectations of finding one shortly but have savings built up that you are living off of, then maybe you should hold off on the job situation disclosure. If you are driving a 1978 Maverick on bald tires, maybe you should delay that for a bit......

One man's honest disclosure though is often another's heedless negative confession.

[Sculpto]

I tend to agree with Gator.. let it rest.. it seems to me in my experience that most ladies are not very interested in the past, especially if it has to do with other women.  Why destroy the image she is building in her mind.  Tell her too early and she might dust you.. tell her after she asks and she might not care at all.. unless it is something really bad.. so, tell us?  Wait, no don't say anything here.. the high school jocks will make jokes out of it. 

[acrzybear]

Baggage is workable, however freight is not

[Shadow]

Most women will not be interested in your past bad habits, unless they cause you to be currently jailed and there for making it hard to travel. 
Anything that is not in your current life, does not matter. Anything that is in your current life which is negative, save it for when you sit at her kitchen table.

[Vinnvinny]

Brian says "when younger" so I doubt this is about 6 kids. 

Hey Gator, nothing wrong with having 6 kids!   Something I'm proud of and don’t class as baggage. Never mentioned it in letters though unless they specifically asked, just said I had kids. Preferred to wait till I met them and see the look on their faces ... priceless. Usually had dessert on my own though. 

[Shadow]

Hey Gator, nothing wrong with having 6 kids!   Something I'm proud of and don’t class as baggage.

Not even when travelling ? Its much cheaper... :evil:

[Gator]

Hey Gator, nothing wrong with having 6 kids!   Something I'm proud of and don’t class as baggage. Never mentioned it in letters though unless they specifically asked, just said I had kids. Preferred to wait till I met them and see the look on their faces ... priceless. Usually had dessert on my own though. 

Vinny,  there is a place reserved for you in Heaven. 

I have two sons, one still at home.  One of my regrets was not having more kids.  Now I have added a Russian stepson and stepdaughter.

Two more and I will have six........ .....NOT! .....there are enough mouths to feed for now.

Maybe your RW dates thought that just having dessert with you would make them pregnant.   

[facetrock]

What a RW considers baggage is not always the same as what an AW considers baggage. I have had quite a few women I was communicating with suddenly not want to anymore when I told them I had 3 children. They all said the same thing. There is no way I could support her and a child when I already had 3 children.
  I am starting to wonder if the real issue is them thinking they would be competing with my previous children for attention and financial support. Any of you guys have that happen?

[JR]

Any woman who is seriously considering you as a life partner will ask you the questions she wants answered. Be honest but remember, your past is just that.
Are you who you were or who you will become? The future is more important than the past. It will surface when it needs to. Show her who you are. Let her decide if she likes you then you can both deal each other's pasts, remember she'll have one too

[pitbull]

What a RW considers baggage is not always the same as what an AW considers baggage. I have had quite a few women I was communicating with suddenly not want to anymore when I told them I had 3 children. They all said the same thing. There is no way I could support her and a child when I already had 3 children.
  I am starting to wonder if the real issue is them thinking they would be competing with my previous children for attention and financial support. Any of you guys have that happen?



Hi Facetrock,

Are you surprised at their reaction? Many women and likewise men are only interested in prospective spouses without children. Especially if they themselves do not have any. Kids are very expensive in the US. Support for three generally eats up a huge chunk of a man's income, hence your new family's potential budget.
As a rule, your ex will be always present in your life if you had kids with her, and yes, if you are a good father a big part of your time and emotions will be spent on your children. Many women just do not want all these in their lives.
 
For example, when I was looking, I didn't consider men who had even one child, no matter if the kid lived with them full-time or part-time.

If a man didn't tell me he has kids until the first meeting, I would have been seriously pissed at him for wasting my time.

In short, my suggestion is to always reveal such basic facts as the number of kids from previous marriages early on, not to waste your and the woman's time.

[Brian]

Pitbull

What do you think should be discussed before the first meeting?

I agree that the info on kids is very important up front.  What are the ages? Who has custody?  You mention that kids are very expensive...certainly with child support payments. 

As well as knowing the ages of the children of a FSUW I would be interested in knowing if the kids plan on coming over the pond or staying behind.  There are advantages and disadvantages to any scenario here.  If the kids come to North America there is the cost of providing for them.  However, of the kids choose to stay behind there is cost or pressure to send the kids money and an even greater cost to keep mother happy while her children are back in FSU.

I think it might be best if mother and kids all come to North America.

I was able to support 3 kids who are now grown and living independently (with no student loans I might add).

My main purpose in starting this topic was to get info on just what should or should not be said and when to say it. 

You said you didn't want someone to waste your time.  I agree with you.  But how do we know how to handle the info and dish it out a little at a time? 
No person wants to waste anyone's time ... it is perhaps the uncertainty of what to say and/or how to say it coupled with when to say it.

Your suggestion "is to always reveal such basic facts... "

I would appreciate hearing from anyone who would like to list their basic facts of what they want to know or to reveal.

[Shadow]

Basic facts :

What you do for a living.
Who depend on you financially.
Your habits that you will not change .
What you expect from a wife.

[Vinnvinny]

Maybe your RW dates thought that just having dessert with you would make them pregnant.   

I don't think so Gator but their alarm bells might have been ringing when I ordered my 3rd bottle of Domaine Ruet. 

Seriously though, I always thought if a woman was concerned about my excess baggage then she wasn't the right one for me. Fish, sea, plenty etc ........

[2tallbill]

positive

Positive

POSITIVE

POSITIVE

accentuate the positive! You are selling yourself. After she likes you she may just overlook your criminal record, come on...you know you're guilty of being a man

And remember, you don't have "baggage." You "life experiences" which have taught you valuable lessons in life and made you a better person

This is the answer