College Educated v. Non College Educated Women

[Gator]

Ambach,

I forgot to clarify a point.

In the Russian culture and language, "college" is equivalent to our vocational school.  "High education" is equivalent to university.

Also, I believe that the pathway to vocational schools differs from that leading to higher education.  Decisions are made during high school, not afterwards as in America when one discovers his grades and SAT scores  are not adequate for attending anything other than a community college.

Perhaps a RW will clarify.  My usual source (my wife) is in Moscow for three weeks.

[Gator]

LOL! Well, it is possible to find a woman with both brains and (big/bigger) breasts 

But they weigh over 50 kg and would be classified as too fat by half of the RWD members.

[facetrock]

   Ambach, seriously now. Its apparent you still have not found the one. Have you any plans on changing your approach? I said before you should not tell any women about your wealth. Just tell them you have a nice 3 bedroom ranch house and a chevy impala that is debt free. Tell them you work for an insurance company and make 80 grand a year and have a good retirement plan.
 This way you leave out the lure of fabulous riches. You will be sure she will fall in love with you for who you are. When she comes over on a K1 then she will have some pleasant surprises.
  You should try this because you cant get the suspicion out of your head that these women will just use you for money. You have to admit its really not romantic telling a woman about a prenup during the courting process.

[facetrock]

  Gator I always allow 5kg for oversized tits. 

[Sculpto]

LOL! Well, it is possible to find a woman with both brains and (big/bigger) breasts 

LOL I know.. and I will only say that my lady has all the qualities that would make any straight man.. umm... drool..  There are a few guys here who have seen her photos and I am quite sure they would confirm my assessment..  but.. its her crazy aggressive intelligence that makes me want to be around her more than anything else because she is interesting to talk to and has great jokes and is not afraid to challenge me on my more bizarre ideas nor does she get too bent if I challenge hers..(most of the time)  If she was the same appearance but a dumbass.. I wouldn't even give her the time of the day.  Trust me on that one.. back in 96 when my friends and I spent a crazy summer running an underground nightclub I had opportunities with a lot of exceptionally beautiful women, most of whom were idiots.. and I passed them up.  There is one that still chases me to this day.. you have probably seen her on TV.. she does the commercials for the ladies razors.. drop dead gorgeous.. every dude in that club was after her and she was liberal with her assets.. I ignored her and turned her down when she asked me to spend an evening in her bed watching movies.. I run into her nowadays on occasion.. she still follows me around like a puppy dog.  Probably I am the only guy that never came on to her and turned her down when she offered.  She still offers, almost every time I see her.  But she is just straight up stupid.. gorgeous but a moron.  If I had done her.. given the vibe I already had established.. I never would have gotten rid of her and she annoyed me to death with her squeaky voice and dumb laugh and lack of perception on anything intelligent.. but man what assets..  She is a great "chick magnet" I always get a lot more attention from other women when she is around because she will hang on my arm like i am her boyfriend and then once she isn't on my arm.. women approach.. never happens when I am alone at an event..  In fact, that is another encounter that should be real interesting once "A" is here..

I forget the name of the film.. it was a french Canadian flick as I remember.. the male antagonist who is a married professor decides to go to a massage parlor and discovers his masseuse is his star student who only works there to pay for her Uni... when it is time to offer the "extras" she asks him if he prefers "manual" or a type of service that would prevent her from talking.. he chooses manual service and begs her to keep talking..

[Sculpto]

  Gator I always allow 5kg for oversized tits. 

at risk of driving this thread further into the gutter.. 5kg per each?  hahaha

[viking]

I have known women with high intellect and masters degrees who cannot keep a job because they just cannot communicate. And I have known women who barely made it out of high school who own thriving businesses because they have the street smarts to make it happen. And everything in between. However, none of this has anything to do with being a good woman or a good wife. Correllation beween intellect or education, to marriage, in my opinion, is for some brainiac who needs to make a detailed cause/effect analysis because he has nothing better to do.  One thing has nothing to do with the other. Its more chemistry being two individuals, interests that can keep conversations going and so forth. If I met you on the street and began a conversation with you and enjoyed that conversation, would it matter what level of education you had?

If you have a desire to meet a woman with a higher education, regardless of her current occupation, then search in that direction. Its that simple.

[Misha]

I forget the name of the film.. it was a french Canadian flick as I remember..

I believe it would be Denys Arcand's film "Les Invasions barbares."

[SANDRO43]

Though I must admit, a woman with a degree in either astrophysics or psychology really excites me...   

IIRC, the Elena that went off in a huff from RWD some years ago had one, and worked tracking satellites - or more likely ICBMs, considering her lovable, hard-as-nails personality - she'd have probably given you second thoughts about RW astrophysicists .

[Lily]

Ambach,

I forgot to clarify a point.

In the Russian culture and language, "college" is equivalent to our vocational school.  "High education" is equivalent to university.

Also, I believe that the pathway to vocational schools differs from that leading to higher education.  Decisions are made during high school, not afterwards as in America when one discovers his grades and SAT scores  are not adequate for attending anything other than a community college.

Perhaps a RW will clarify.  My usual source (my wife) is in Moscow for three weeks.

I think it would be good to clarify what is meant here by college. Sort of professional school may be?
I have heard that there are colleges now in Russia, but not sure on what level they stand.

A Russian first has to receive a mandatory general education that leads to a 'school leaving certificate', or Abitur in German. It lasts about 10 years. This is called in Russian word-by-word 'middle education'. However, if a young person choses to enter a certain profession, often the one that does not requires a university degree, he or she leaves the school after the 8th grade in order to enter in a technical school (technikum in Russian) for about 3 years. After that he or she gets an Abitur with which he or she can apply for an university. In Russian it is called 'middle special, or middle professional education'. If a person of middle education graduates from an University, than he gets a higher education.

Of course there are a number of new educational patterns in Russia now. One may have a bachelor degree now. There are also some institution called colleges.

[ECOCKS]

Thanks , Lily. It IS important to clarify that there is a real difference between what we refer to as college-educated and what FSUW will hear.

Perhaps you could correct anything wrong with the following equivalences? Paper at finish is in parentheses.

American                                      FSU
Middle School (no diploma)            6th, 7th and 8th year of school
High School (Diploma)                   Middle School (Abitur)
Union Apprentice/Trade School        Teknikum (Abitur)
Community College 2 year degree   
4 Year College                              5 year degree (Certificate or Baklava <sp?>)
University                                     5 year degree (Certificate, Baklava or Magistere <sp?>)
University + 1-2 years (Masters)
University + 3-5 years (Doctorate)

Can you fill in the blanks or make what corrections you think would make this more accurate?

[Lily]

American                                      FSU
Middle School (no diploma)            6th, 7th and 8th year of school
High School (Diploma)                   Middle School (Abitur)
Union Apprentice/Trade School        Teknikum (Abitur)
Community College 2 year degree  
4 Year College                              5 year degree (Certificate or Baklava <sp?>) ???
University                                     5 year University degree  (Diploma of High education)
 University + 1-2 years (Masters)      Masters as an additional professional degree in a field
University + 3-5 years (Doctorate)    University + 3 years-1st science degree, Kandidat Nauk
                                                  Outstandinng achievements in science - Doktor Nauk
 

A Master is a learned degree that is achieved by some time ( about a year) of study in a given field. It is done in order to achieve particular specialization. Non-existent in the SU but appreared in the post -Soviet time. Often received by Russians in the West.

I'd add that a Doktor Nauk is not a learned degree but is given in the FSU for some really meaningful contribution in the field of science. In the later Soviet times, one of about a 100 Kandidat Nauk's could make it to a Doktor. This is a purely Soviet realia, without a Western equivalent. In the post-soviet time, it is considered to be easier to became a Doktor, as the competition is lessened due to migration of brains in business instead of science.

[Ade]

I have known mostly college educated RW, some with Masters and and some with several degrees. I have noticed in some posts in the archives that non college educated women with regular jobs like hairdressers, bookkeepers, shop assistants, etc. make better wives.
My question is do they? Or it does matter?
This is a general question, there are other things to consider in specific individual.
The rationale given is that because of the lack of employment opportunities for RW in USA, a very highly educated woman is likely to be disappointed with a downgrade in social status, but for a shop  assistant in Russia, there would not be much difference.

Also, the percentage of college educated women is very high in FSU, and specially those who seek foreign husbands, are for the most part college educated.
By comparison, USA has 29% women with college degrees and Colombia 18%. In Colombia it is the reverse, not many college educated latin women seek foreign husbands.

Education is irrelevant to anything related to finding a loving partner.

What you need to do is find a woman that you love over and above your money and that loves you for everything but your money. The other things in a relationship and in life are trivial if you are crazy in love with someone; for one thing, people that are committed to each other will prioritize the relationship above and beyond everything else making sacrifices and compromises in favour of the relationship.

Going by your past posts I'm not entirely convinced that you know the meaning of the word "love" though so I guess I may as well be speaking Greek.

[ECOCKS]

Lily, in the US system, Middle School is equivalent to FSU 6th, 7th and 8th grades.

You crossed out College as equivalent to the 5 year degree but that is what would be equal to the 5 year FSU degree. I should have marked it and the University degree as follows to limit confusion (my bad, it's late at night):

4 year College (Bachelors)
4 year University (Bachelors)

American system makes no distinction between Universities and Colleges

[Lily]

Lily, in the US system, Middle School is equivalent to FSU 6th, 7th and 8th grades.

You crossed out College as equivalent to the 5 year degree but that is what would be equal to the 5 year FSU degree. I should have marked it and the University degree as follows to limit confusion (my bad, it's late at night):

4 year College (Bachelors)
4 year University (Bachelors)

American system makes no distinction between Universities and Colleges

I admit I don't understand much in colleges. If you know it for sure, it 's allright with me.

I think that Russian systems differs between Universities and Colleges. Perhaps nowadays some Russian colleges have a right to give high education diploma, but not sure.

There used to be no distinction as Bachelor in the FSU. But again, perhaps lately some educational institutions start to bestow their graduates with Bakalavr.

[ECOCKS]

American                                          FSU
Middle School (no diploma)                 6th, 7th and 8th year of school
High School (Diploma)                         Middle School (Abitur)
Union Apprentice/Trade School             Teknikum (Abitur)
Community College 2 year (Associates)  
4 Year College                                    5 year degree (Certificate or Baklava <sp?>)
University                                           5 year degree (Certificate, Baklava or Magistere <sp?>)
University + 1-2 years (Masters)      
University + 3-5 years (Doctorate)         Candidate Nauk
                                                         Doktor Nauk

This specialist certificate always seemed to be similar to our 2 year Associates Degree although I know some who have spent 4 years getting them. Also, the Baklava and the Magister, at least in ukraine are little differentiated from our Bachelors degree from the discussions I have had with others.

I had forgotten that candidate status. It strikes me as more equivalent to our ABD status but having a more firm position in the hierarchy since ours is intended to be a temporary position. Anyone here had a spouse or know anyone who put one of those through the US evaluation system?

[Lily]

Soviet and Russian Kandidat Nauk status is equal to western Ph.D.

[Simoni]

This specialist certificate always seemed to be similar to our 2 year Associates Degree although I know some who have spent 4 years getting them. Also, the Baklava and the Magister, at least in ukraine are little differentiated from our Bachelors degree from the discussions I have had with others.

The specialist certificate is above the Masters but not as high as the doctorate.  It tends to be 8 to 12 courses beyond the Masters degree but does not require a dissertation.

[OlgaH]

Russian educational system:

1-4 grades is primary elementary education

5-9 grades is general general secondary education. If a student pass exam he receives a certificate of basic general education (аттестат об основном общем образовании)

10-11 grades is general (senior) secondary education and a certificate of Secondary (Complete) General Education (аттестат о среднем (полном) общем образовании)


GENERAL ELEMENTARY EDUCATION

http://www.russia-ic.com/education_science/education/system/103/

http://www.qualificationsrecognition.ie/recognition/int_qual_databse/Russia/school.html


PROFESSIONAL EDUCATION (Professional education: vocational, Professional education: non-university level higher education, Professional education: university-level higher education)

http://www.russia-ic.com/education_science/education/system/1/

http://www.qualificationsrecognition.ie/recognition/int_qual_databse/Russia/vocational.html

[ECOCKS]

So, no one else knows anyone who has come over with a Kandidate Nauk and done equivalency evaluation? The one guy I know, went back to school and received his PhD from Columbia for career reasons. His conversation makes me think this is not equivalent to the PhD.

Simoni, you're saying the sequence is Baklava, Specialist and then Magister? That is the first comment that the specialist is between the B and M in their system. The folks I know who had specialist degrees indicated they were almost equivalent to bakalavre (sp?) and I had the impression they did not always go as long either. Some indicated they finished in 4 years. Note that I am giving what I understand to be the Ukrainian picture so maybe it is different from the Russian over the last decade and a half.

[pitbull]

So, no one else knows anyone who has come over with a Kandidate Nauk and done equivalency evaluation? 

ECOCKS,

I came with the the degree of Kandidat Istoricheskih Nauk, went through degree evaluation, and my degree was evaluated as PhD... by ECE, and Boston College.

[ECOCKS]

How do you think BC sees the Doktor Nauk?

[SANDRO43]

Just a linguistic point to add to the confusion: Baklava (sp?) seems to derive from French Baccalauréat, i.e. what one gets in France when completing their high school (lycée):

The baccalauréat often known in France colloquially as le bac, is an academic qualification which French and international students take at the end of the lycée (secondary or high school). It was invented under Napoleon I in 1808. It is the main diploma required to pursue university studies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baccalauréat

Whereas a Bachelor's degree, altough probably deriving its name from the above French title (a person granted a Baccalauréat is called Bachelier):

is usually an undergraduate academic degree awarded for a course or major that generally lasts for four years, but can range from two to six years depending on the region of the world. It may also be the name of a postgraduate degree, such as a Bachelor of Civil Law, the Bachelor of Music, or the Bachelor of Philosophy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bachelor's_degree

Two different kettles of poisson .

[Blues Fairy]

Baklava (sp?)

Bakalavr = Bachelor

[ECOCKS]

TY BF.