Need help in Odessa!!

[Muddy]

Billy, escorts do not always walk around in thigh high boots and short tops.  Most are not good looking.  The escorts actually have apartments in that building that they use but do not live there.  There are massage parlours in there as well.  Massage parlours are just a normal apartment which they try to be discreet about to not piss their neighbors off.  I think there is even a sex tourist agency located in there that caters for bachelor parties.  

kievstar,
If you are looking for escorts in Kiev and want to play the best place to go is River Palace night club and casino
10 minutes by taxi from Kreschatic

[Sculpto]

kievstar,
If you are looking for escorts in Kiev and want to play the best place to go is River Palace night club and casino
10 minutes by taxi from Kreschatic

showing your true colors Muddy. 

[mies]

of course the OP can let her wash his clothes. And then  -as a decent man he will ought to marry her. 

[mies]

sorry, wrong post.  

[392ihc]

Hey, sounds like you guys picked up a few more topics on this thread while I was gone!  Sorry I have been unable to post here for a few days.  I had to change apartments and there was no internet.  Now, today I move again and I have internet back.  I have been in eight different apartments this trip!
Lady #1 is back in Moldova and I have heard nothing from her and I have not written to her.  After finally bringing her to Odessa and spending time and money on her for four days I got a kiss on the cheek!  
Since she has left I have spent all of my time with Lady #2 and it has been wonderful for me.  We have agreed that we are friends and I am happy with this designation.  I agree with the post above about other things clouding a person's judgement.  I am very comfortable with her and we spend all of our time talking and walking.  She has shown me things in Odessa I could not have found with the best tour guide.  Some places we return to a second time.  We have our favorite restaurant we have eaten at three times already. The waiters know us there already and what table we like.  Mostly it is about her mind and her expression of her ideas.  It has been totally different from other women I have met in Ukraine.
Now, about some of the personal questions a few of you have asked about "on the washing machine".... you gotta get more of a life for yourself!  I never kiss and tell!  
This morning she helped me buy a train ticket from Odessa to Kiev...one of the all-nighters.  It arrives in Kiev the same day I fly to JFK. Then to Denver, then drive home.  For the next two days I hope can spend it all with this delightful lady.  Tell you more later!
Signing off!  Mike in Wyoming

[Gator]

We're happy for you.  Good recovery from a busted trip plan!

[BillyB]

I have spent all of my time with Lady #2 and it has been wonderful for me.  We have agreed that we are friends and I am happy with this designation.  

 For the next two days I hope can spend it all with this delightful lady.  Tell you more later!

Mike, If you're designated as "just friends" with lady number two, then I would keep your eyes open for lady #3 if she shows up walking down the street. You want to find someone solid that you can communicate with when you get back home that will be more than "just friends". I know I'm not in this to find pen pals/friends.

[Sculpto]

Mike, If you're designated as "just friends" with lady number two, then I would keep your eyes open for lady #3 if she shows up walking down the street. You want to find someone solid that you can communicate with when you get back home that will be more than "just friends". I know I'm not in this to find pen pals/friends.

True love begins with real friendship.

[BillyB]

True love begins with real friendship.

Sculpto, do you know what "just friends" means when a woman says it? It means she just put up the red light and that's where it stops. Guys are smart to start looking elsewhere instead of commiting massive amounts of time to have a relationship with a woman who says she wants to be "just friends".

Being friends instead of "just friends" can lead to a meaningful relationship.

[Sculpto]

Sculpto, do you know what "just friends" means when a woman says it? It means she just put up the red light and that's where it stops. Guys are smart to start looking elsewhere instead of commiting massive amounts of time to have a relationship with a woman who says she wants to be "just friends".

Being friends instead of "just friends" can lead to a meaningful relationship.

Where did he say she said "just friends"?  You read what you wanted to read Billy.  They established a warm friendship.. thats what I read.  Seems to me he is romancing her and she is letting him.  Hopefully she isn't just being a GTG.

[BillyB]

Where did he say she said "just friends"?  You read what you wanted to read Billy. 

You are right Sculpto. I read what I wanted to read. I assumed Mike had the "let's go steady" or "let's advance into an exclusive relationship" talk and the results were she had the "just friends" talk.

Mike, if you didn't already do so, since you like the woman, you should ask her to be in an exclusive relationship(not marriage) with you to the point you both focus on each other to start building trust and devotion when you go back home and are separated. If she hesitates and says let be "just friends", start communicating with other women when you get back home because she is keeping her "options" open too.

[JR]

Hey Mike, very glad you met someone you enjoy being with. I agree with Billy, get that question out in the open. You've both had enough time with each other that you should be able to discuss it. If you get the "Just friends" card then indeed you need to continue to look for what you've got in mind.

Anyway great job of not getting entangled with someone who's probably got soem major issues and moving on to find someone of quality.

[392ihc]

It is about 2:00pm here in Odessa and Lady #2 has had to go to work.  I am back in my flat about 7 blocks off of Yekaterinasaky Street (some of you know this area).
In a way I agree with all of you...I can certainly accept that good relationships and marriages begin with a warm friendship. However, being "just friends" is kind of like saying that we will always be like brother and sister!  This is not why I traveled 14,000 miles!  After my initial experience I would have even accepted "just friends"!  But with this lady I sense that she is more interested than she will tell me.  Yesterday, for example, we talked of expectations each of us had for a spouse....I told her many things about our culture in America.  Frankly she is stunned at this point!  She cannot believe that American women have such freedom and independence.  But always these conversations are couched in language such as, "And when you find this man....  Or, this woman I search for will......"  I am guessing that it is a Slavic tendency to avoid speaking of the obvious!  We talked even about a tourist visa for her while we were at the beach at the Black Sea. She had applied for a business visa once shortly after 9/11 and was rejected as were all but one person in her office. 
Of course I have told her I wish to email her and to continue correspondence with her and she readily agreed to this. Please remember that the web site she had posted her profile is not necessarily for foreign men.  She really had not even considered leaving her country so all of this is very new.  Later, after her work she will call me and we will meet at McDonalds (only for the wifi feature) and I will show her the posts on here from RW about what they haved missed the most about leaving their country and moving to America.  She speaks English pretty well but she has trouble reading it...so I can assist.  I know she listens to me because each morning she asks me questions about discussions from the previous day.  The only problem I have had is that she took me to the huge farmer's market this morning and she started choosing fruits, nuts, candies for me to take home and I had to stop her (of course because I pay for everything and I do not eat much candy anyway).  I admit it is odd to have a woman negotiate a sale with the vendor for something for me and then turn to me and tell me "50 grivna for these".  I did not complain, I simple told her it was enough!

I take the night train to Kiev tomorrow evening and then go to Borispol to fly to JFK.  All I can tell you is that for today, it is good here--I will worry about tomorrow when it arrives!

It is also worth mentioning that I received an email from Lady #1 in Moldova thanking me profusely for bringing her to Odessa and my generosity with her.  She acknowledged her "coldness" and still wishes to work on maintaining our relationship.  She apologized for not meeting my expectations during our visit.  I actually feel very sorry for her but I still admire her honesty.  However, some other man will have to be the one to warm her cold heart.  It will not be me.  If I write her back it will be only when I am back home.

I will keep in touch.
Mike

[GoodOlBoy]

Congratulations General Mike, for your first trip to the FSU, you did OK!  

Have a good flight home.

GOB


BTW....From what you have written, I think #1 is a nice lady, BUT...She is severely "damaged" and I think Gator may be correct about her:

A father who would pursue other women in front of his daughter may have done worse to her, and that would be horrible if true.

[Gator]

The best wife IMO is one who is also a true friend. 

I am not sure about your attitude about sex.  And I know that some men express the thought that sex confuses everything.  I also know that some RW have a problem with that concept and will think less of such men as if something is wrong. 

There is no need for you to disclose anything to us.  Just wanted to give you some food for thought as you conclude your trip.  Be yourself.

[392ihc]

Thanks guys. I owe you all a beer!
Mike

[Sculpto]

Well done Mike.  This trip should be a script for how to recover from a bad start!

I hope it all works out for you and this lady and I am glad you got to enjoy a very cool city.

[Misha]

She really had not even considered leaving her country so all of this is very new. 

It is natural that she will need a few days to think things through once you are gone. Again, better to have such a woman who will marry you because she wants to be with you once she understands that she loves you, than a woman who will marry any foreigner with a warm pulse  :evil:

[BillyB]

better to have such a woman who will marry you because she wants to be with you once she understands that she loves you, than a woman who will marry any foreigner with a warm pulse  :evil:

Certainly a RW who never intended to find love outside her country is less likely a green card girl but Mike could be in for an uphill battle when everything cools down when he goes back home. Mike needs to determine if this woman is going to let herself fall in love with him or will continue to prefer the first fine Ukrainian gentleman that comes into her life over Mike simply because with all things equal between the two  men, the Ukrainian gentleman lives in Ukraine and that could be the deciding factor.

This experience of Mike, who's from out of town, showing up in her life is new, intersting, exciting, and maybe wonderful. When time and distance separate them, Mike will begin to see if things fall apart or if they grow hungrier for more of each other.

I've talked to a few ladies who isn't interested in leaving their country and they said they could follow the man they love but first they must fall in love. I also got the impression their first priority was to allow themselves to fall in love with an FSU man before someone outside the country. Hopefully Mike could get a positive answer without hesitation from his lady that she could relocate easily. We don't want women to fall in love with our country over us but they do have to want to live there.

[Sculpto]

After the problems i had with agencies I decided to specifically seek out women who were not specifically interested in coming to the US, or, who were even against the idea.  The lady I am involved with is exactly such.  One of the reasons the correspondence went on so long is I had to wait for her to show some willingness to even consider it before I was going to get on a plane to see her.  One day, about 3 months before I went to see her, after 12 months of almost daily chats and phone calls, her she surprised me and said, "Ereek, if I love you I go anywhere in world you wish".  I immediately started planning my trip.

One of the reasons I stuck with her when we were having problems, against the advice of the more suspicious of this group, was because of this fact.  When people were thinking she was pulling something, I knew in my heart she wasn't and was not exposed to the scamming culture around the MOB biz.  JME

[Misha]

Certainly a RW who never intended to find love outside her country is less likely a green card girl but Mike could be in for an uphill battle when everything cools down when he goes back home.

Maybe, but when he is gone, she thinks things through and at that point she can better understand whether she is into him or not. Then they can decide what they want to do. Some women fall in love immediately and know the moment they see a man that he is the one. Other women need a few days or even a few weeks or months.

Mike needs to determine if this woman is going to let herself fall in love with him or will continue to prefer the first fine Ukrainian gentleman that comes into her life over Mike simply because with all things equal between the two  men, the Ukrainian gentleman lives in Ukraine and that could be the deciding factor.

As I noted in another thread, I just don't get this need for men to have a woman declare undying love for a man by the second date and agree to marriage on the third.

This experience of Mike, who's from out of town, showing up in her life is new, intersting, exciting, and maybe wonderful. When time and distance separate them, Mike will begin to see if things fall apart or if they grow hungrier for more of each other.

I agree, which is why I said that once he is gone and she has thought things through for a few days, she will have a much better idea as to how (and if) she wants the relationship to progress.

I also got the impression their first priority was to allow themselves to fall in love with an FSU man before someone outside the country.

Sure, if all things are equal, women will invariably prefer to marry a local guy. But, things are rarely ever equal.

[Misha]

Hit the wrong button

[GoodOlBoy]

One day, about 3 months before I went to see her, after 12 months of almost daily chats and phone calls, her she surprised me and said, "Ereek, if I love you I go anywhere in world you wish".  I immediately started planning my trip.

One of the reasons I stuck with her when we were having problems, against the advice of the more suspicious of this group, was because of this fact.  When people were thinking she was pulling something, I knew in my heart she wasn't and was not exposed to the scamming culture around the MOB biz.  JME

No offense Sculpto, BUT....I wouldn't run around declaring SUCCESS! (just yet). 

We shall read on RWD what the future holds for you and "A".

I am sure that there are many more "interesting" chapters to be written.  :evil:


GOB


PS....Take my advice and save the "victory lap" around RWD, for at least a couple of years down the road.

[Sculpto]

No offense Sculpto, BUT....I wouldn't run around declaring SUCCESS! (just yet).  

We shall read on RWD what the future holds for you and "A".

I am sure that there are many more "interesting" chapters to be written.  :evil:


GOB


PS....Take my advice and save the "victory lap" for a couple of years down the road.

There is no victory lap GOB, ever.  Its not about bragging, its about sharing experiences.  When will you get that in your head?  I have gotten this far with her.. thats worth sharing, especially since it has not always been a smooth road.

[mies]

Thanks guys. I owe you all a beer!
Mike

Mike - it looks like you are close to blow it off.
You contacted this woman telling that you came to meet somebody else, so from the beginning you gave her the #2 role. This is why she is very cautious and only acts as your friend.
If you want more - you should come forward.
She would not be spending time with you unless she liked you.