My trip to Ukraine

[JamesDH]

Sitting in the airport in Paris just fresh from my 7 day visit to Odessa, Ukraine.
Against a lot of advice I went to Odessa to meet one woman. This woman and I had been emailing, skyping and chatting for 3 months prior to me going and I felt I did not need nor want to meet anyone else.

So far it seems as if my hunch was right.
From the moment I saw her I knew I was in trouble. Tall, slender, beautiful red hair, deep bronze tan, big eyes and so alive looking. We hugged and mumbled some hellos and she dragged me to the taxi. Off we sped to the hotel she had picked out (and paid for). Hotel Victoria. She booked the top floor "lux" suite and it was pretty nice. Beautiful view out the balcony and plenty of room. Huge bathroom, fridge and nice bed.

I said I was hungry so we went down to the bar area and she ordered something for me. We drank a beer, local draft that was superb, and made idle chit chat.
One thing to note.. she has very limited English. So.. when someone says "only date the ones that speak English..." take it with a grain of salt. Right from the start we developed a mixture of sign language, broken English and body language to get our points across. Sure we didn't have any deep conversations but so what... ( we did later using the translator).
A little background might help.. I grew up living overseas and am fluent in Spanish, French and Portuguese. While none of that really helps I think the experience of communicating with people of a different language helped.
The food came, pork chop smothered with mushrooms, layered with cheese and baked. Delicious!! The meal was good, the beer was good and looking at that wild red hair and those big eyes. Perfect way to start a trip!!
One advantage I had is that I work in Africa which is only two time zones away so no jet lag!!! I was on her time zone from the start. (another is my company paid to fly me to Paris.. only $500 to get round trip to Odessa from there)
We went to the computer room of the hotel and pulled up the translator. She writes so elegantly using words like a painter uses a paint brush. While she typed I took it upon myself to get closer and establish the boundaries of how far I could go physically. I touched every patch of bare skin (bronze, smooth skin), kissed every patch within kissing distance and she loved it. She was practically setting in my lap and we were giggling like school kids. She would point out that she had goose bumps and then point at me implying that it was my fault. I responded with that "I'm not guilty" look and we bust out laughing.
Then it began.. the "I'm going to push you away but I want you to come closer" thing. What fun that was.. it wound up with both her legs over mine and one arm twisted around mine and her trying to type and both of use laughing like crazy.
I dwell on this because we had one little bit of friction over talking about the book "five languages of love" I told her that I was "touch" and asked her to read it. She did and determined that she is "quality time". This upset her because she felt we would not get along.. I explained to her that they are not rules cast in stone and that no one is completely one way or the other and we are all a combination of the 5 but some traits are more dominate. Also that they are more guidelines and not compatibility rules. She calmed down after a day of high emotions.
So.. I'm finding out that she is a lot more "touch" than I thought and I'm liking it.
Anyway.. around 11pm we call it quits and go up to the room. Up to this point I didn't know her plans. I assumed she would drop me at the room and head back home.. wrong.
Back at the room we turned on the TV. She said take a shower and I did.. to my surprise she took one too (yes I remembered the shower thing). She came out of the shower wearing only a towel.
That's about as far as I can go describing the first day. You'll have to use your imagination for the rest of the day/night. Suffice it to say it was good. REAL good.

The next morning I wake up, she's laying there sleeping with that beautiful red hair and bronze skin contrasted against the white sheets.. Nice! Now I'm ready for coffee. I put on some pants and go down to the bar for a couple of double espressos.
When I get back she's there with her towel on and the whole place has been gone thru. Bed made, all my stuff out of the suitcase and hung in the closet, bathroom spotless.. as I will grow to know.. amazing woman.
After more this and that, more showers and food we decide to go out. She flags a taxi and for the first of many times, haggles with the driver on the price. Off we go on what seems like a suicide mission. Dodging and darting, passing cars as if we're in some kind of race then all the sudden slamming on brakes to let an old lady cross at the cross walk (not a whimper from the driver at the crosswalk).
I forgot exactly what it was we went out for but what I would like to convey is the underlying report we were developing.
I can't explain it other than to say we were like a couple that had known each other years. We joked and pushed and prodded the other like we had been doing it forever. I don't think either one of us made a wrong move. It was magic and I could feel it growing stronger by the second.
Something I noticed was that she touched me all the time. If we were standing, she had something touching me, elbow, finger, butt.. something. In the taxi.. she was close and had one arm wrapped around my arm. Some people may not like that but I thrive on it and it seems she did too. It never slowed the whole 7 days I was there.

I'm not getting across the spunk and fire this woman has. She has no problem telling me what to do, what she thinks or rattling off junk to the taxi drivers when they don't do to suit her. She starts rattling off to me and I rattle off right back at her and before you know it we're both laughing like mad people and finish it off kissing. She pushes me, I push her back. She tells me to do something. I refuse and she starts rattling then I start rattling and soon we're kissing. I love it. I love that I can say something to her and she doesn't bust out crying or get her feelings hurt. She get's in my face and gives it right back.
Lord where has she been all my life?????

Does it sound like this trip is going well? YES and it just get's better!!!!!!!!!!!!

After three days in the hotel she invites me to come stay at her place. I had no idea what to expect.
Her place was a run down old building (just like the hundreds in the city). The entrance was so dark I couldn't see the steps as we entered. I looked around and my first thought was "we don't know just how good we have it here in the US". Although I've seen worse.. much worse (I work in Africa, cardboard huts are not uncommon.) I wasn't expecting this. When she opened the door it was a different story. Bright, clean and modern. 3 TV sets. One in the living room, one in the kitchen (modern appliances) and one in the bedroom. Telephones everywhere plus she carries two cell phones. Nice computer in the bedroom with high speed internet.
I don't know if this is typical but she seems to be doing OK. Closet full of nice clothes, hundreds of shoes.. the same you would expect anywhere in the US.

Off we go to meet the mom.. We meet at the local pizza place. Her mom then her sister show up. We introduce and eat. Her sister is 16 years younger and a knock out and she speaks great English. Mom is nice and looks me over head to toe. She gives the nod of approval and everyone relaxes. After pizza, beers and conversation we're all headed out. I grab mom and give her a big hug and I think it shocked her but she liked it as she couldn't stop grinning.

This is about to turn into a book so I'll wrap it up by saying..
I went against some advice by only going to see one woman.
I felt it was right so put the moves on her early and it seemed like the natural thing to do. (no regrets).
I let things advance as far as they wanted to naturally and it feels good.
I stayed at her place the rest of the trip and it worked out really well.

What about her and I?
To me it was like a date, a 7 day date and I loved every second of it. The best date I've ever been on... ever.
I honestly think she loves me and I honestly feel I love her.
I've been away from her 12 hours and I feel a part of me is missing.
She is an amazing woman and so unlike any woman I've dated in the US.
Capable yet feminine, strong, sexy, sweet and tender, full of energy, bright and bubbly. I get the feeling she can take care of her self but she really likes that I'm there to be her man.
Am I going back?
YES!!! I just bought tickets.. in 7 days I'm headed back for 10 days. She's happy, her mom's happy and her family is happy. They have planned a lot of things for us to do and I can't wait.

What advice would I give?
Follow your heart and JUST DO IT!!!
If you find a woman like this one you will know what I mean.
There are a LOT of very attractive women in Odessa. I think a man could just show up there, walk around and basically pick which one he wanted (not that picking a woman based on looks is a good thing).

Is there some kind of virus they infect you with? If there is I"m badly infected and I don't want the cure!!!

[Gator]

James,

A perfect meeting!

Your trip report brought back wonderful memories of when a couple of my meetings were perfect.

I do caution you about the language gap.  I tried what you are trying and gave up.  There are times when a serious, intelligent conversation is imperative.  My RW and I had a couple of misunderstandings that I could not overcome.  The problem IMO - she would not give me the benefit of the doubt and would withdraw rather than try to develop a better understanding, much less reach a middle ground. 

If your Odessa woman shows the same, be very cautious.  If, however, she is forgiving and open minded, then you have a good chance of success.  If the two of you become serious,  insist that she take English lessons (and you pay for them).

[JR]

ALRIGHT DUDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You made the trip...now I'll go back and read about it  heheheheheeeee

[JR]

Very KEWL

For every trip method they'll be detractors. I'm glad this worked for you and you've found something that feels special.

I'd second what Gator advises. You need a common language to carry you beyond the bubbly phase of things. Eventually you'll need to TALK. Or more specifically, she will
Work on that and I hope things just get better

[groovlstk]

Great story, James.

[ECOCKS]

Glad it went well James, congratulate yourself, now you're beginning the road to "experienced".

Best of Luck!

[myrddin]

Congrats, James! 

It sounds like a perfect beginning, and it's great that you're already booked for your return!

[UTRO]

Good start James! I was always WOVO and never regretted it.
Now that you are appart the communication thing will be a huge test for you both. Especially with her limited English...... Been there previously. I wish you well

[Kuna]

Thank Goodness we're back to TR's that make us feel good!

Congrats on a great start James... Nothing will ever measure up to that first trip!

I too would urge you to be careful over the language gap as it's easy to forget it is communication that will get you through the rough patches of a relationship.

My only other advice is to enjoy these early days and weeks... and as you're close take advantage of that lack of dstance to spend as much time as possible with your lady.

I can't tell you how glad I am to read another successful TR here at RWD.

[janic]

Off we sped to the hotel she had picked out (and paid for). Hotel Victoria. She booked the top floor "lux" suite and it was pretty nice. [...] Bright, clean and modern. 3 TV sets. One in the living room, one in the kitchen (modern appliances) and one in the bedroom. Telephones everywhere plus she carries two cell phones. Nice computer in the bedroom with high speed internet.
I don't know if this is typical but she seems to be doing OK.

No, both is very unusual for Ukraine and could even be a possible red flag. (Although it would be the first time that I hear of a scammer or skimmer who pays for the room of her victim....

You don't mention it in your TR and so I ask: What's she doing for a living?

The entrance was so dark I couldn't see the steps as we entered. I looked around and my first thought was "we don't know just how good we have it here in the US".

That's very normal in UA (dunno for the rest of the FSU but would think so too). Entrances, stairways, elevators look like (and are) crap. Dirty, stinky, shabby and run-down. You enter an apartment and voila, it shiny, clean and tidy. It's part of their mentality. The apt is yours and so you treat it well. The rest of the house doesn't belongs to you, so somebody else should take care of it. It's probably the same reason for the condition of the rest of the country....
It's a devil-may-care approach you will have to accept. - Also in another country this mentality has quite a probability to stay visible.

One thing to note.. she has very limited English. So.. when someone says "only date the ones that speak English..." take it with a grain of salt. Right from the start we developed a mixture of sign language, broken English and body language to get our points across. Sure we didn't have any deep conversations but so what... ( we did later using the translator).

Be careful and really think about it! Can you really imagine living for a lot of time with somebody with whom you can't really communicate? - The UW I lived with spoke no English at all (well, some 5 or 10 words), had no talent to learn English and even if that really helped me to get a good knowledge of Russian it was a major problem because conversations never went really deep.

If you go on with her, try motivating her to take some lessons and see how she does.

Not a red flag but for me it would be a thing to bother me.

Thanks for the TR and have fun and success when revisiting her!
(Ah, and don't forget to write a sequel... )
j.

[GoodOlBoy]

Welcome back to RWD JDH.

I thought we may have "lost" you after your last soiree with an FSUW!

You TR sounds good, glad you are happy.

Yeah....I know what you mean about redheads!  

Especially the "natural" ones!  :evil:  :evil:

I have a question, if you don't mind.

Now this has nothing to do with this lady or any other lady in particular...it is just a question.

When you finally find "the one", what are your living arrangements going to be?

I mean, obviously you travel A LOT.

So will she remain in the FSU (around her family) until a later time (retirement) or are you going to insist on her moving to Texas and spending a lot of time alone, without you?

Just curious.

GOB

[JamesDH]

Not much time for a real reply to some of the questions but...

She started taking English lessons before i got there and will continue.
She has a very good command of words but is the type of person (just like I am) that if they can't do something perfect they don't attempt to do it. In the last few days she put a lot of effort into speaking English and she does really well.

Her apartment was nice but not extravagant. She is the manager of the accounting department at the gas company so probably makes a little more than most. Scammer? No way. Not even close.

Living conditions? That is to be determined by a mutual agreement between us. I am open to anything almost. The little we talked about it gave me the impression that she would move out of the Ukraine if I asked.

I agree that the biggest hurdle will be the language. I don't mind learning Russian and she's already in English classes so we'll see.

Thanks for the positive feedbacks!!!

[BC]

James,

You seem to have a lot going for you, well traveled, lived in foreign countries, language etc.  Huge plus IMHO.  Having adjusted yourself many times will help you understand more about her adjustment or maybe even yours depending on how far your relationship goes and decisions where to settle down.

But that's putting the cart before the horse.. guess what I'm trying to say is great potential.

Considering the relative ease and cost of travel, I would highly suggest not pushing the marriage angle at all, but let it develop on it's own.  She seems well situated and settled so an even more solid relationship base will be necessary to provide enough motivation for change.  Keep remembering that you are dating, no more no less with still much to be discovered.

Unlike many that join this venture, you seem to have trusted the 'flow', chose to swim rather effortlessly downstream to the other bank.  That's the way it should be IMHO so don't let your enthusiasm convince you at some point to change course, rapidly depleting your energy and resources, in the end only to flounder.

I've always maintained that life will provide everything due to us without requiring huge efforts.. keep it that way and enjoy! 

I see many trips ahead for you both and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

[Mars]

As a side note, usually many guys here jump all over a trip report where sex seems to occur quick, like on first date.  I am not one of those who does this, but seems a little strange that we haven't gotten those comments??

Have the rules and morals changed in last few weeks?

But to OP, great story.

[Faux Pas]

As a side note, usually many guys here jump all over a trip report where sex seems to occur quick, like on first date.  I am not one of those who does this, but seems a little strange that we haven't gotten those comments??

Have the rules and morals changed in last few weeks?

But to OP, great story.

I don't seem to have the same memory as you. I have seen a distaste for sex tourism displayed on the forum quite a few times. When one chooses to have sex is their own private business whether it is the first date on the first trip or the 10th trip. Of course a real gentlemen IMO is not going to disclose his sexual exploits anyway.

[Muddy]

After three days in the hotel she invites me to come stay at her place. I had no idea what to expect.
Her place was a run down old building (just like the hundreds in the city). The entrance was so dark I couldn't see the steps as we entered. I looked around and my first thought was "we don't know just how good we have it here in the US". Although I've seen worse.. much worse (I work in Africa, cardboard huts are not uncommon.) I wasn't expecting this. When she opened the door it was a different story. Bright, clean and modern. 3 TV sets. One in the living room, one in the kitchen (modern appliances) and one in the bedroom. Telephones everywhere plus she carries two cell phones. Nice computer in the bedroom with high speed internet.
I don't know if this is typical but she seems to be doing OK. Closet full of nice clothes, hundreds of shoes.. the same you would expect anywhere in the US.

Did you even ask her what she does for a living?
Its not in your report

[Kuna]

Did you even ask her what she does for a living?
Its not in your report

hahahaha... has the computer in the bedroom got you going???

*drool*.... computer.... bedroom... keylogger....  *drool*

I read your question and went back to the quote you were referring to...  I didn't work out EXACTLY what you were getting to but then I realised someone with a controlling nature and low self esteem would automatically assume the worst.

[Muddy]

After three days in the hotel she invites me to come stay at her place. I had no idea what to expect.
Her place was a run down old building (just like the hundreds in the city). The entrance was so dark I couldn't see the steps as we entered. I looked around and my first thought was "we don't know just how good we have it here in the US". Although I've seen worse.. much worse (I work in Africa, cardboard huts are not uncommon.) I wasn't expecting this. When she opened the door it was a different story. Bright, clean and modern. 3 TV sets. One in the living room, one in the kitchen (modern appliances) and one in the bedroom. Telephones everywhere plus she carries two cell phones. Nice computer in the bedroom with high speed internet.
I don't know if this is typical but she seems to be doing OK. Closet full of nice clothes, hundreds of shoes.. the same you would expect anywhere in the US.

Ravens posted his wife worked as a nurse in Odessa last February and she was making only $90 per month

[MatryoshkaMan]

Awesome dude! I just hope my trip in 7 weeks goes as good as yours!!!

[JamesDH]

Awesome dude! I just hope my trip in 7 weeks goes as good as yours!!!

Good luck on your trip!
Where are you headed?

[JamesDH]

It's been brought up several times about the difference in language.
What we found was using imtranslator (www.imtranslator.com) worked really well.
It gives her and I a way to look at what our translation looks like translated back into each other's language.
Give it a try.

Tomorrow I fly to Paris then the next day to Odessa.
I can't wait.

[NJ]

Congratulations James! I hope your next trip will be as nice as a previous one. Very nice to see a person that is so happy and excited about something big starting in his life.

I don't think that hints about her job and the things she can't afford are fair. I'm not sure about Ukraine but working for a gas company in Russia means a very good income (especially Gasprom). If she doesn't have kids there is no wonder she can afford good clothes and shoes.

[JamesDH]

Thank you NJ.

Remember she is the manager of the accounting department of the STATE gas company.. not the CITY gas company.
She has 12 accountants under her.
I will find out exactly how much she makes in a few days..

Sitting in Paris airport at the moment waiting on the flight to Kiev then Odessa.

Something interesting is I just wrapped up a 7 day trip to southern Portugal (Algarve region) with a woman from the US. Total contrast to the Ukraine woman. After about 3 days I could hardly stand to be around her. Complained constantly. Would not allow me to be the man. "I can take care of it myself". Loud mouthed. Flirted constantly with my best friend that lives there (he's married and told me to "calm her down"). Made rude comments when I did things like get her coffee etc.. She was probably not a good example of the typical American woman tho. Very liberal, very woman's lib but commented that she was offended that I didn't make a move on her...
We did have some interesting conversations tho..

The trip cemented my desire to be with the Ukrainian woman.
Loved Southern Portugal and will be going back.

I wrote my original post from this airport after flying all day and no sleep all night.
After reviewing it I want to change a few things so I'm going to edit out some of the things I feel strange writing about.

[Kuna]

Last things first...  good stuff mate.  You won't regret it!   

I wrote my original post from this airport after flying all day and no sleep all night.
After reviewing it I want to change a few things so I'm going to edit out some of the things I feel strange writing about.

Thank you NJ.

Remember she is the manager of the accounting department of the STATE gas company.. not the CITY gas company.
She has 12 accountants under her.
I will find out exactly how much she makes in a few days..

James,  you don't need to know how much she makes.  If you've found a good match and she feels the same about you it just doesn't matter what some will say.

Be aware when you return state-side you may also have people react strangely, or poorly.  At the end of the day you don't need to react to them.

I will comment though that it IS POSSIBLE that men from the west can meet ladies in FSU who are doing quite nicely for themselves.

SOme men would like to think all Ukrainians/Russians are poverty stricken because it make them feel superior.  Truth is...  some people there are doing quite nicely and living quite comfortably.

Something interesting is I just wrapped up a 7 day trip to southern Portugal (Algarve region) with a woman from the US. Total contrast to the Ukraine woman. After about 3 days I could hardly stand to be around her. Complained constantly. Would not allow me to be the man. "I can take care of it myself". Loud mouthed. Flirted constantly with my best friend that lives there (he's married and told me to "calm her down"). Made rude comments when I did things like get her coffee etc.. She was probably not a good example of the typical American woman tho. Very liberal, very woman's lib but commented that she was offended that I didn't make a move on her...
We did have some interesting conversations tho..

The trip cemented my desire to be with the Ukrainian woman.

Interesting that you had the opportunity to do a "reality check" before your next visit.  Just before my first visit I was in a situation where I needed to make a decision about a girl I met through friends and following through with my plans to meet my now wife.  I was tempted... and I really weighed up the possibilities, but ultimately I knew my future family was waiting for me in Ukraine.  I'd not met my wife but I knew if it wasn't her - it would still be there.




Very cool you're heading back again...  have fun!

[Aloe]

Thank you NJ.

Remember she is the manager of the accounting department of the STATE gas company.. not the CITY gas company.
She has 12 accountants under her.
I will find out exactly how much she makes in a few days..

Sitting in Paris airport at the moment waiting on the flight to Kiev then Odessa.

Something interesting is I just wrapped up a 7 day trip to southern Portugal (Algarve region) with a woman from the US. Total contrast to the Ukraine woman. After about 3 days I could hardly stand to be around her. Complained constantly. Would not allow me to be the man. "I can take care of it myself". Loud mouthed. Flirted constantly with my best friend that lives there (he's married and told me to "calm her down"). Made rude comments when I did things like get her coffee etc.. She was probably not a good example of the typical American woman tho. Very liberal, very woman's lib but commented that she was offended that I didn't make a move on her...
We did have some interesting conversations tho..

The trip cemented my desire to be with the Ukrainian woman.
Loved Southern Portugal and will be going back.

I wrote my original post from this airport after flying all day and no sleep all night.
After reviewing it I want to change a few things so I'm going to edit out some of the things I feel strange writing about.

am i understanding correctly that you went on a romantic trip with another woman after meeting the ukrainian woman? Does the ukr woman know about it ?