A Friend of Mine is Probably getting (Really) Scammed....(read on)

[Sculpto]

Oh, I almost forgot!!

Quack Quack.

I thought you were supposed to be in Russia?

[Kuna]

You are not one to speak about ANYONES judgement Kuna.  And you know exactly what I am talking about.  I will show you a heck of a lot more courtesy and respect by not revealing what I know.  All I will say is you are not one to criticize ANYONE given your actual and unreported history, so, keep your mouth shut unless you have something positive to contribute.

Ohhh dude... are you threatening me again???

Have a read of what you wrote next and see the reality of how impotent you really are:

For everyone else who actually has a brain.. I am just playing devils advocate.  Plus, I do actually think without getting a first hand report from the guy sending the money it is not possible to really make an accurate determination of whether or not he is being scammed.  There are too many variables and too many unknowns.  Here is why I justify that comment...

A month or so ago I posted some questions for a lady in Lugansk who I know via vkontakte.  She was having some doubts about her man in Texas.  All surface evidence pointed to him being a potential bad guy looking to lock a pretty young naive and economically disadvantaged girl up in his house.  But, I kept digging and she had a scheduled meeting with him to arrive several days later.  Well, with more digging I did finally find him on the web and his story did check out relative to his business dealings etc.  In fact, he appears rather upstanding and well established with a variety of nice businesses.  I even found several posts on a site similar to yelp where he is recommending his Russian language teacher.  The man was methodical and found his girl.  He went to visit her again, she layed it on the line with him about transparency and he came clean.  They are still together and going forward with their K1.

Things aren't always what they seem on the surface.  There is a lot more to this story that we don't know.  We do not know what her English level is.  We do not know under what circumstances the financial arrangements were made and understood by either party.  We do not know what promises she made to the man.  Without that information any judgement is premature.  Due diligence.

All that said, based on what has been reported here, it doesn't look good.  But, before I am convinced I need more information.

If you just stopped the totally flaky story writing and got to the part of the post I've highlighted in red we wouldn't think you were such a fool.

Your continual crap advice to others comes from a person who has a poor grasp on reality.  Why are you so obsessed with fantasy.  You even seem to claim a win for romance for your "Friend" from lugansk - but still you have no clue if your detective work is more like Dick Tracy or Mr Magoo!

You create vast stories to explain simple situations - but finally you close out this fantasy with the only thing that matters...  Based on what was written it does not look good!

If that's the case WHY DO YOU NEED TO FIND EXCUSES FOR REALLY BAD BEHAVIOUR?

Anyway, it's OK if you %$#@ up your own life by doing dumb stuff but in here your stupidity may be misunderstood by newbies.  they don't know how many times you've been scammed even after being warned!

Even when you've made mistakes in the past you - STILL CAN'T ACCEPT OR ADMIT IT!  You need to blame someone else.

I know others are saying the same stuff to you... but your obsession with fantasy prevents you from seeing it.

Why can't you get it in your head that it is possible to avoid scams rather than just becoming a perpetual victim?

Why do you need to lead others into painful outcomes?

[Gator]

I vote "scammer" based on what the OP wrote.

I assume her plan is to string the man along for a year, maybe more. 

First there is no birth certificate.  Just before he reaches the end of his patience, she will obtain a copy.  Then something else will be found missing. 

Eventually he will file.  Then six months later, just before the consulate interview, she will say the police were late in providing the necessary certificate, so they need to reschedule the interview.  That should add another 3 months. 

When she receives the K-1, she may delay departing.  Eventually she calls him and says “Paka. I have changed my mind because _______”

[Admin]

Sculpto/Kuna - please look for my PM.

- Dan

[BillyB]

The problem with not having a devils advocate is too many assumptions are made based on incomplete information.

But, it does bring up another question that should be of value to newbies and that is, when is it appropriate to offer financial support to your lady and how much?

Sculpto, we have to give advice here based on what the OP says. I'm willing to bet his friend withheld more embarrassing information since he's doesn't want to look more stupid or naive than he's willing to admit. If we ask for a two party debate here, then there will be little or no debate. So if a person comes here and holds back or gives bad information, he/she is going to get bad advice.

If you want to play devil's advocate, what sincere reasons do you think she's missing her birth certificate and why she currently can't come up with one? Do you know anything about how the government works to the point citizens are out of luck when they lose a birth certificate? With enough bribe money, I'm sure she could come up with one in days.

On the financial support issue I say a man pays for the dates. When she is a fiancee or wife, then you can begin to share finances. Do not get suckered into paying for the right to be a RW's boyfriend. It may be harder to win her heart but try to win her over with yourself and not your wallet.

[Sculpto]

Sculpto, we have to give advice here based on what the OP says. I'm willing to bet his friend withheld more embarrassing information since he's doesn't want to look more stupid or naive than he's willing to admit. If we ask for a two party debate here, then there will be little or no debate. So if a person comes here and holds back or gives bad information, he/she is going to get bad advice.

If you want to play devil's advocate, what sincere reasons do you think she's missing her birth certificate and why she currently can't come up with one? Do you know anything about how the government works to the point citizens are out of luck when they lose a birth certificate? With enough bribe money, I'm sure she could come up with one in days.

On the financial support issue I say a man pays for the dates. When she is a fiancee or wife, then you can begin to share finances. Do not get suckered into paying for the right to be a RW's boyfriend. It may be harder to win her heart but try to win her over with yourself and not your wallet.

Billy, you are correct on all accounts.  I am simply questioning if the friend of the OP ever really understood what the woman in question has told him.  What if she said:  I dont know if I am ready to marry you because I don't know you that well and by the way I can't afford to live.  A guy really smitten with the young booty he is getting is going to pony up and assume the next step is she will marry him if he proves to her he is reliable.  Anyway, hopefully he has gotten enough information from this thread to make his own decision and confront the situation head on.

[JR]

Billy, you are correct on all accounts.  I am simply questioning if the friend of the OP ever really understood what the woman in question has told him.  What if she said:  I dont know if I am ready to marry you because I don't know you that well and by the way I can't afford to live.  A guy really smitten with the young booty he is getting is going to pony up and assume the next step is she will marry him if he proves to her he is reliable.  Anyway, hopefully he has gotten enough information from this thread to make his own decision and confront the situation head on.

And what if she said to him "I'll F--- you all you want when you're in town for $1000 a month." He agrees to it but tells no one? SPECULATION!!! No one knows. We can only deal with what the OP said.

Advice needs to be limited to what is submitted by the OP and posted in regards to just that. Otherwise lurkers will be led astray thinking there is more to the story and the "MORE" somehow makes it OK. And that is all it is, a story. We don't know it ANY of it is true. But in the context of what was posted it needs to be stated unequivocally that this kind of behavior is that of a SCAMMER! There can be no confusion on this.

Quack Quack

[Sculpto]

When are you getting on a plane JR?

[JR]

When are you getting on a plane JR?

What does that have to do with this topic?

[Sculpto]

well someone keeps saying they are going yet they haven't gone..  someone using superficial logic to draw assumptions might arrive at some less than accurate assumptions. 

[Misha]

Plus, I do actually think without getting a first hand report from the guy sending the money it is not possible to really make an accurate determination of whether or not he is being scammed. 

Why? As Doll pointed out, it only takes a few hours to get a new birth certificate. Even if she "she NEVER had a birth certificate," her birth would have been recorded. Unless she was born in the forest and raised by wolves and somehow found and cleaned up the day before meeting the friend of our OP, there is no way she can't get a birth certificate in hours, days at most. I follow Occam's Razor: the simplest solution/answer is usually the correct one, and the simplest solution here is that the friend is being scammed. 

[JR]

well someone keeps saying they are going yet they haven't gone..  someone using superficial logic to draw assumptions might arrive at some less than accurate assumptions. 

Sculpto, I made my first trip to the FSU in 1992, married a russian woman in 1994 and was married for 10.5 years. You are barking up the wrong tree with that one.

I will go again when there is a reason for me to go.

[Vaughn]

There IS much we don't know, but from what Kraft related I gather that one or more
of the following holds water...

1) He believes her and she's deceiving him. The classic "scam"...  Quack Quack as Jolly wrote.
2) He believes her and she's being straight with him. Chances slightly better than a Powerball ticket.
3) It's his fantasy that he can well afford. Delaying the "elusive" birth certificate only delays
    the process with the desired result - a prolonged fantasy, with occasional flesh benefits.

 Assuming the Gravy Train goes bust one day - will he learn from it?
 

 

[Daveman]

Why? As Doll pointed out, it only takes a few hours to get a new birth certificate. Even if she "she NEVER had a birth certificate," her birth would have been recorded. Unless she was born in the forest and raised by wolves and somehow found and cleaned up the day before meeting the friend of our OP, there is no way she can't get a birth certificate in hours, days at most. I follow Occam's Razor: the simplest solution/answer is usually the correct one, and the simplest solution here is that the friend is being scammed. 

What a different world it would be
if everyone followed Parsimony.

absolutely agree. of course, sometimes there can be tapestry complexities, but each one can be unraveled into single threads of simplicity.

or as JR eloquently puts it... QUACK QUACK!!!  This one is awfully ducky.

[Admin]

You are not one to speak about ANYONES judgement Kuna.  And you know exactly what I am talking about.  I will show you a heck of a lot more courtesy and respect by not revealing what I know.  All I will say is you are not one to criticize ANYONE given your actual and unreported history, so, keep your mouth shut unless you have something positive to contribute.

 

Sculpto's post is out of line. There are not going to be any threats to divulge personal sensitive information at RWD whether veiled or otherwise. Threats of any sort are inappropriate in civil discourse. Please refrain from making threats of any sort.

- Dan

[Muddy]

Too many unintelligent posters on the internet forums!
Low IQ!

[groovlstk]

Too many unintelligent posters on the internet forums!
Low IQ!

Muddy, you seem to like calling others stupid and unintelligent, often in barely coherent English. Do you see any irony in this? Also, I shouldn't have to point this out, but proposing marriage and filing a K1 visa on behalf of a woman who regards you as little more than an insect might fall into the "stupid" and "unintelligent" categories.

[Muddy]

blah blah blah

[Slings_and_Arrows]

Holy Mother of God..... One Thousand dollars a month? (1,000)  Seriously? seriously?    Whether you mow lawns or counsel court cases, 1,000 dollars is still a 1,000 dollars a month.   For goodness, OP, get your friend to hire a detective.  Do something, anything.  One way or the other, he will thank you.  JollyRats,.... dude....you're a true hero.  I'm glad you posted in this thread like a madman.

I originally joined this site in 2006, as a youngling, struggling through school.  I gave up on finding an FSU gal because I was so completely in despair from all the news of scamming.  I decided to take a look at this again, yea I know, 3 years later.  I consider myself a complete newbie when it comes to this whole foreign lady concept.  But even I know that you don't send cash.  I mean seriously... 1000 dollars a month to some he sees 3 times a year?  Even if the money doesn't phase him in the slightest, like BillyB and some others have said... the girl is getting spoiled.

And just because its the popular thing to do (and I agree completely with JollyRats)............ Quack Quack! (cough-scammer-cough)

[zigmund65]

I read this thread from the start, and from a mile away I can see this for what it is. Of course this is a SCAM or at the least she is playing this guy for a fool, and she probably has other sugar daddies on the string too no doubt! If he wants to throw away his money though for a few rolls in the hay every once in awhile and some companionship online, that's his business IF he understands that is really what this is all about. If he's dreaming of marriage and a family life with her, he better wake up and smell the coffee quick! As others have said, slide a few dollars to some government bureaucrat over in the FSU and you'll have any kind of legal papers in no time. Greasing the palm works wonders over there most of the time. So that is a real BULL story she has to wait a year for a birth certificate.

Also if you need to go as far as hiring a private detective to spy on a "girlfriend", then I think you already know it's a waste of time continuing a relationship with her before you even go that route. That's a foundation to build a relationship on? He'll need a full time spy over here if he ever did marry her too. Move on and lick your wounds man, and learn from the experience. There is more and better fish in the sea!

[ScottinCrimea]

I don't know, based on what has been presented, that this is a scam.  It all depends on the expectations of both parties. If the mutual understanding is that they will wed, that is fine.  If he is investing in a fantasy and understands that he is just paying for a fantasy and a hot body in bed every so often, that is also fine.  If she is leading him on as to her intentions where he thinks he is investing in a long term relationship, that is wrong and would be classified as a scam.

Based on what had been written here, his intent, as evidenced by his desire to file the k1, is to to provide the monthly support to prolong his dream.  Her intent, as evidenced by her lies about the birth certificate, is to prolong his dream in order to continue to get the $1,000 a month.  She is playing on his fantasy and he is willing to pay to avoid having that fantasy come crashing down.  She gets the money for a bit longer and he keeps his dream.  Ultimately, she is providing him a service that he is willing to pay for.  She sees reality and he sees fantasy.  A fool and his money are soon parted.

[neo]

I dont think what shes doing can be called a "scam", she is really just playing the traditional role of a paid mistress, if she gives him companionship and sex on his limited visits in return for him keeping her financially then by definition she is a mistress, she may be a mistress to several others but thats beside the point. Is she scamming him by keeping him dangling? no, not really, any more than all the men in the west who keep their girlfriends dangling on a string for years waiting for marriage are scammers, she is simply lying and making exscuses to avoid telling him the truth and losing her comfortable position, therefore she is prolonging judgement day as long as possible.

The person most to blame is the man, he has deluded himself into thinking this relationship is more than it is which is pay for play. at the moment he has a pro-dater/mistress/pro and if he succeeded in his plan all he would do is turn her into a GCG. shes not into him, hes got the smell of her panties in his nostrils and therefore immune to the truth. its his cash - leave him to it, its a lesson learnt for him.