My trip report: In Odessa - part duex

[NickB]

I'm starting a new trip report even tho it's basically the same trip.
I'm doing it out of respect for the first lady I met. She is a sweetheart and I had a wonderful time with her.

If you want to read that report it's http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=10394.0

This trip started with me already in Odessa.
I rented a different flat. This flat is downtown on Rishelyevskaya street. It is not as nice as the first flat and is more expensive.
First impressions are.. it was dirty, lacked all the items needed for life such as bottle opener, cork screw and it only had one plate and two cups. All in all not a great impression.
The good thing is that it's right in the middle of things. Two blocks to everything and the bed is more comfortable.
300 channels on TV? Most are pay per view sex channels or in German. Bloomberg, CNN and a few more are in English. The internet is fast but took some creativity to get it going. No DHCP on the router so my laptop had to be manually configured using settings from the computer provided.

I noticed there was no shower curtain and wondered if that would be a problem later on..

I unpacked and set out to find some groceries. Two blocks over was a large supermarket under the mall. I loaded up on beer, pistachios, bread, cheese, ham etc.. I forgot coffee!
I came back and unloaded the bags of goodies. Immediately I realized I should have taken inventory first! No napkins, no sugar, no coffee, no bottle opener, no cork screw, no butter, no mayonnaise..
Another trip was needed but not today. I made a sandwich and set about getting internet going.

This lady was one I had met on a site a few months earlier. We had emailed back and forth almost daily. Never Skype or any other form of chat. I was taken by her long red hair and freckles and the nice tone to her emails. She was reluctant to leave the agency for communications stating that her English was not good. I insisted because I was tired of paying $5.00 to read one email from her.

Upon arriving I was immediately hit with the ineptitude of the agency.
Despite me sending multiple SMS from my US phone telling them that I would NOT be able to receive SMS in Ukraine they kept sending me SMS and would not use the email address I provided.
This manifested it's self in the arranged meeting. I never received the message of where and when to meet the lady. This resulted in her showing up to meet me and me not being there. They came to the flat to find me but I was out shopping at the time.
I didn't find this out until I opened my US phone, went thru the previous SMS and found the name of the service and did an internet search. Found them, found "contact us" and found a local number.

The woman I contacted knew of our meeting and immediately started blaming me for not showing up. I turned it around and pointed out the SMS I sent stating my email and the fact that I could not receive SMS on this number in Ukraine. She calmed down and we setup a meeting for the next day.

Between the time I left the US and the time of our meeting I had started suspecting a scam so my spider sense was on high.

The next morning I went out for a walk to find coffee, scope out the meeting place and to go shopping again.
While I was walking this short man came up to me speaking english. He offered to show me where this place was. Off we went. The man could not shut up. He kept telling me he was Meninite (SP?) and needed money to get home and would be my guide and interpreter for a low price. After we arrived at the meeting spot I gave him 50rph and told him to get lost. He kept on and on and I kept telling him to leave, getting more and more irritated. He left me and I made my way back to the supermarket.

I came back and started getting ready for the 3pm meeting.
I was 15 minutes early to the meeting place. The translator showed up almost right at 3pm. The date was about 30 minutes late. During the wait I talked to the translator. She was from Muldave and attending the university here in Odessa. Interesting conversation and she turned out to be a nice girl. According to her it was her first job and she didn't know exactly what to do. Ok that's cool. I gave her the $70 required by the agency for the meeting and we waited. The date showed up.

First impressions were. Nice body, petite, nice hair.. looks older than her pictures but not too bad. Beautiful eyes. Dressed very well. nice hands.
When she spoke her voice was a little smokey and bigger than her body.

She immediately started talking and the translator started translating. She asked a few questions and I answered. It was very strange trying to look at her but listen to the translator.
She seemed quite intelligent and asked the right questions.
After a little chit chat I took us to the book store to get an English-Russian dictionary. I wanted to drop the translator to get to know the real woman.
After hitting 4 bookstores in the area we found the dictionary and I said I'm hungry and want to taste Ukrainian food. We walked to a restaurant a few blocks away.
I set beside her with the translator across from us.
We had some sort of ravioli stuffed with cherries at her request. It tasted OK but to me was more of a dessert dish. The restaurant gave us a shot of vodka as a gift. She said she didn't want it so we left them on the table. As the meal ended she went to the ladies room. I asked the translator to leave us after the restaurant so when we walked out she said her goodbyes.
Now it was the lady and I alone in the big city.
We tried to talk as we walked but it was not getting very far. As we walked she seemed stuck to me, lot of rubbing and bumping. Hmmm... What's going on? Is it typical Russian behavior? Is it part of the scam? She can't be into me after only 2 hours together even if we had been emailing for a few months.
We made our way to Sobornaya park and walked around it looking at the flowers and various statues. She tried to explain them to me but it was not working. Finally she called her daughter who was studying languages at the university. She would say something to her daughter and pass the phone to me for translating. Crude but working a little.

We walked and tried to talk for about two hours. It was dark and we couldn't read the dictionary anymore and I was tired of talking to her daughter on the phone so I called it a night.
She walked me back to my flat and I requested that she get a taxi. I walked her to the street she wanted and on the way I went to give her money for the taxi. I made the mistake of stopping in the middle of the sidewalk and pulling out my wallet to give her money. I immediately felt the mistake and put my wallet away with money in hand. I handed her some money in a discreet way as we walked and she took it. The plan was to meet again tomorrow at 1300 minus the translator.

I walked back to my flat, took the laundry out of the machine and hung it up to dry.
The agency SMS me asking how the meeting went. I replied that it was good. They replied that the lady thought it was wonderful but wanted the translator for the next day.
I ignored the SMS wanting time to think this over.

Now here I am... is it a scam? Do I stop it now and find another?
was the body contact, eye contact and friendly chat part of the scam or is she really interested? Am I interested?
If she can't speak English then I am not really interested. But.. she has taken 8 days off of work to be with me.
I've kept communications with several ladies I would like to meet and they are poised to meet with little notice.

Ok plan B
I'll meet her today with the translator and see how things go.
I called the agency and told them $20 an hour for translator is too much. They said they would do it for $15 an hour. Ok that works.
I messaged three of my top picks from Singles.ru

In contrast to the first segment of the trip this segment has felt awkward and not just because of the lady. Mostly the agency. Never again with an agency.
More later.. Off to shower and get ready for today.

[Shadow]

You have to ask yourself one thing. If you were not paranoid about it being a scam, would you have felt differently ?
The thing you ate in the restaurant was Vareniki, natinal Ukrainian dish.

And btw why to you refer to a bottle opener and cork cres as 'necessities of life' 

[Taz]

Glad things are going well so far. Language issues can be overcome if there is a common desire. Your complaint about apartments lacking basic things is unfortunately a common one. In an expensive apartment, you would think that most of these things would be supplied. I can't remember another members name exactly but I think it was CCowboy who complained about this same thing in his apartment even though he asked a translator to check it out first for him. Apparently it was lacking a lot of things and had almost nothing to cook with. He apparently wasted a lot of time tracking down what he needed.

Good move on not giving her the money in the open. Most men would have continued on and gave her the money in full view of everyone. This often can give the appearance that the woman is a prostitute.

As for the woman being into you after a short period of time after meeting, tough to say. If you believe all the people that wrote lots of letters and then met their woman and fell instantly in love, then it is possible. One thing I can say based on my personal experience is that RW are more open about the fact they are in to you more so than many other types of women. So she is either actually into you or it is a scam. If they don't show much interest then typically they are definitely not in to you. On occasion though they might just be shy. Look into her eyes and you can definitely tell what is going on. In general RW like men that have a steady gaze and look into their eyes as if to pierce their soul. Not in the bad sense such as interrogation but in the sense you want to make a deep connection.

You have plenty of time to sort things out. Maybe another meeting is in order with this lady as it seems there is a lot to like about her from your perspective aside from the language difficulty. You might be surprised how well you can communicate even without a common language. I think here body was saying a lot to you and you weren't too blind to pick up those signals...

Keep up the trip reports. It seems like you aren't rushing anything or putting the cart before the horse so far. It isn't a bad idea to take flowers to a first meeting to help make a good impression. Even a single rose speaks volumes.

[NickB]

Just returned from the second meeting.

My overwhelming feeling is that the translator is like a wall between us.
She talks to the translator and I talk to the translator and that's it.

I enjoyed being shown around town with two lovely ladies but that's not what I'm here for.

As far as the meeting. We danced around each other and one minute she would put the translator between us and the next she would be in the middle. She seemed ill at ease. I felt out of place and like one of those guys you read about. The dork.
We had some interesting conversations about women and men in Ukraine. She thinks men are spoiled because there are too many attractive women in Ukraine. I think US ladies have moved away from the traditional role of woman because to stay at home with the children has become a job with no value.

She would not hold my gaze much today. At times she would but at other times she wouldn't. She didn't bump into me and I didn't her.
We walked down to the port and walked the 192 steps then down to the Hotel Odessa and on to the port area. Again more of the position changing but by this time I had already given up on things in my mind.

We walked back to a Ukraine restaurant and this time I had the same ravioli but with meat inside, borscht and some kind of meat and potatoes smothered in cheese. All very tasty and I was very full after that. We talked a lot. Mostly about kids and life in the US vs life in Ukraine.
Again I could not hold her gaze much so stopped trying.
We left and they were going to walk me to the apartment. I said I didn't need to be walked that I could find my way and that I needed to go by the supermarket and get a few more things.
We walked a little further and she asked if she could hold my hand  <<SHOCK>> Why ask? Why now? I said yes and we held hands for a while.
A few blocks and I said I would go right and onto the supermarket and hoped they had a safe trip home.

That's enough of that torture treatment.
I will let the agency know I am not interested in her.

The translator is a major obstacle. Never subject yourself to that!

[Taz]

Since it was the first job, she was amateur and not a professional. As a result she has a lot to learn. I’ve seen good terps just blend into the background and always seeming to be available without being the center of attention.

In generally the more you can communicate with the woman without a terp, ultimately the better it will be to understand the chemistry between you both. Again chemistry isn’t 100% dependent on language as a lot of communication is non-verbal.  It seems you are also paying a top rate for a terp that should definitely be a pro but you are likely getting an amateur. No offense to the terp.

It goes without saying but many guys don’t think about it but if you don’t like your terp, ask for a different one.  A bad terp can easily break your budding relationship or prevent it from even growing. A good terp is part psychologist and part translator. With a “difficult” client (on either end) it becomes even more paramount that she has all the required skills.

While I am pretty fluent in Russian, I still have found the need to sometimes seek out a terp. In that situation I am very careful about whom I choose to help.

It seems like you are really focused on what is important, find the right woman. Sure it is nice to walk with 2 beautiful women but as you said, that isn’t what you are there for. Good luck and keep the TRs coming. It can help other guys a lot more than you know.

So what woman is next on your list??? Good thing you had more than one woman that you wanted to meet.

[Mars]

After one horrendous experience, I will never again meet with a woman where an interpreter is needed.

But, having said that, I see a glimmer of hope for you with this woman.  Some people just don't like to look others in the eye, for prolonged periods.  Wanting to hold hands cancels out the no eye contact, I think.   

I would suggest another meeting with her without the interpreter.  Suggest to her that she come to your apartment and the two of you cook a meal, watch some silly DVD that she might understand, listen to music on your computer, play chess or checkers and maybe even do some laundry together.  These are all things that require little in the way of interpretation and allow some closeness to develop; if the feeling is right.

An hour together in an apartment doing common things (even without sex or anything close to it) is worth 5-10 hours anywhere else (with respect to moving the relationship ahead), in my opinion.

Of course the biggie is . . . will she come to your apartment.  I have only had one woman out of dozens refuse to come to my apt, but my ladies have all been over 40 y.o., so it may be different for younger gals.  Don't know if you said how old this gal is.

[JR]

If you're not vibin on the lady move on. I don't it's a scam, just a less than top notch agency. Regardless, if it doesn't feel right it is time to cut your losses and expolre other possibilites.

Why not go back to the lady with whom you shed mutual tears? Seems like something's there...?

[NickB]

I had resolved to stop the progress with this woman but....
Last night she came on Singles.ru and we started chatting. She agrees that the translator is hindering our progress and wants to try again without the translator.
I asked some pointed questions and was frank with her that I did not want to waste time chasing rainbows. She liked that and wants to meet again. Ok. Today at 3pm we'll meet, no translator.

Mars: I am one step ahead of you on bringing her back to the apartment. My thoughts went that way after the first meeting. "I need to get this woman in a one on one situation where we can communicate using the universal language". We'll see how it goes. Third date, time to put up or shut up.
I think she needs to cook me some borscht (isn't it an aphrodisiac?)

In the mean time I set up a meeting with two other ladies. One today at lunch and one tomorrow. My top pick was out of town on business at the time but this morning I find a message from her. She's back in town and ready to meet. I have a slot for her tomorrow evening. (she's an english teacher so no translator needed)
Singles.ru It's the only way to go!

The translator. You are right on Taz. She is very amateurish and, in my opinion, caused more harm than good.
If the woman doesn't have any english skills I think it's a waste of time. If she has some skills and you want a translator to fill in the gaps, it would work.

Jolly.. The first girl and I are still in contact. She is the best and I have a feeling she will be hard to top.

A little advice for anyone who enjoys coffee. Bring your own!
I've tried three different brands of brew coffee and none have been worth drinking. I've had many espressos in cafes and the only two worth drinking so far are the Cow steak house (you'll know which one it is. Everyone knows it) and the Top Sandwich places. The rest have tasted horrid. Although Tokyo House coffee is not so bad.

Time to get ready for my lunch date.

[NickB]

Second woman on this leg of the trip.

Her pictures did not match reality.
They had to be 10 years old or more.

She looked like an alcoholic and smelled as one too.

Next!!

Out to buy a coat and then the 3pm meeting with #1.

[NickB]

Update:

As agreed we met at the opera house at 1500. I could immediately sense the change. Much more attentive. We walked and tried to talk but it was not getting far. There was a lot of bumping and such as well as hand holding. So the physical aspect was going well but the communication via spoken word was not.
I had bought tickets to the Opera the day before and we wandered around for a while then made our way toward the Opera House.
In the opera we sat in the balcony which was nice. I had vowed to make the third date count and I proceeded to do just that. I made sure we sat very close and I immediately took her hand. She seemed to like it and I kept going. Soon I had my arm around her and she had snuggled up to me.
After the opera we went to the Russian restaurant. She ordered us Borsch and Pelmeni (mutton, pork and ??) and vodka. We drank the vodka during the borsch, it was different but good. The borsch here was better than the Ukrainian restaurant.
I locked her gaze several times. She would lock me and hold for a long time, very sexy!
I was starting to figure her out. She was old fashion!
We finished at the restaurant and walked around a bit. We went thru Sobornaya park again and during one section the opportunity came to kiss her so I did.
I held it for a second and she put her arm around me and made it count. As I pulled away I looked her in the eyes and she looked right back. My god those are the most beautiful blue eyes I've ever seen.
More walking and more kissing until finally it was time for her to head home. I walked her to the road and hailed a taxi for her. I discretely gave her a wad of bills and she took it discretely. More kisses before she got in the taxi. I gave her a firm hug and I swear I felt her knees buckle. Sexual tension had developed between us.
Off i walked to the supermarket and then to the apartment.

The next morning I woke to a stomach ache and headed to the toilet. Uh oh... Stomach cramps and all.
I emailed to say that I was not going to make our date today and crawled back into bed. I stayed until almost noon!
Finally got up, made coffee and ate a ham sandwich. A few hours later I picked up the phone and noticed that she had called 6 times but the phone was on silent mode from the opera the night before. I messaged that fact to her. She said she would have come to my aid if she had been able to get ahold of me but figured I was out because I did not answer the phone. Probably better she didn't come over anyway. I was either on the couch or in the toilet.

Next day I was up and feeling good. She messaged that she would like to meet and I agreed. 1400 at the Ukraine restaurant.
I made my way there and took a small table next to the window. A few minutes later she showed up. Small kiss and we sat down. She wasn't hungry but I was famished. She ordered Shashlik for me and chai for her. The meal was great for me but she was not doing well. She said she would go home after the meal because she didn't feel well.
Ok. I can see she is in distress and all is good.

I go home and get on Singles.ru and find one woman I had emailed, and talked on the phone with, before I left the US. I asked if she wanted to meet and she gave me the "maybe". I persisted and she agreed. She would meet me in 30 minutes at the cafe outside my flat.
I met her and my first impressions were good. She was attractive with beautiful brown hair, nice face, smooth skin, nice lips, nice teeth and pretty brown eyes. I could see, even with a coat on, that she had a nice body. She was very nervous and could not pick up her tea with one hand! I talked to her a bit and put my hand on hers and in a few minutes she was calm and could drink. I finished my coffee and suggested we walk. I asked if she knew where a book store was so I could get a pocket English-Russian dictionary. Women like to help and asking for a book was asking for help and she was eager. Off we went. I noticed right away that she was the perfect height.
As we walked it started to rain and she took out her umbrella. I stayed out of it for a while then she pulled me in, I took the umbrella from her and held it for us.
Right off the bat it was like she was glued to me. I held the umbrella with my right hand with her on the left, she nestled right into me. My left arm touched her from shoulder down to the hand and she kept it there. My hand kept hitting her on the butt as we walked. Her hand kept hitting me on the inside of my leg a few inches below the crotch. Does she realize what she's doing to me? I am sure she did.. We walked and walked and found one book store. Heavy duty physical flirting going on. She rubbed me, I rubbed her. She got in my face and looked at me. I held her gaze until she broke it (long). She would move away and I would chase her then assume the assertive position (slightly behind and looking over the shoulder). She was right there and played it perfect by picking up a book and putting her elbow between my arm and chest. It was a dance. A sexual dance that had me breathing hard. She was intoxicated and talking crazy, picking up the same book two or three times, asking me what I wanted over and over. I knew her attention wasn't on the books and neither was mine.
After a while I came to the realization that the book I wanted was not here so I suggested we find another book store.
We walked and flirted some more until she said she had to go home. I said I was lost and needed guidance back to the flat. More walking, more rubbing, more flirting.. My mind was way gone. I could have been in BFE.. (men will know what I mean) She couldn't think and kept stopping to look around (I liked when she stopped because our faces came real close as we talked and I could smell her heady smell. With all the traffic and noise I had to lean in so she could hear me, right? She had to lean in so I could hear her, right?). We were both high on hormones, the air was thick with it. It was like primal instinct.. I the hunter, she the hunted. beautiful.
We came to the corner of my street and another. She asked if I could make it from here. I said yes.
We turned toward each other and I handed her the umbrella. I took her other hand and pulled her close. She did not resist. I locked her gaze again and after a bit I moved to kiss her. She sensed it and moved to kiss me. A lot was communicated in that kiss. Warm, soft lips. Subtle movements of her head and body as well as her fingers. The Kiss, held for a bit but not too long... She wanted me and I wanted her. But.. not now.
She mumbled something and I mumbled something, I turned and walked toward my flat and did not look back. I had no idea where I was nor did I care. I just walked. After a few minutes my head cleared and I came back to earth.
I love this place!

[Taz]

Sounds like things are going about as well as you could ask for so far. I hope the trips conclusion continues the progress you've made so far.

[Misha]

Interesting trip report. You are clearly proving that it is not hard to meet nice, decent women using singles.ru 

[NickB]

When I was on Singles.ru after getting back to the flat I had also messaged another prospect.
This woman had a very nice picture of herself and her profile indicated she spoke english. I had messaged her a few times in the days before. I saw she was online so I asked if she would like to meet. She said call her after 1700 and we could talk about it.
After leaving the woman with the umbrella and walking back home I debated whether to call her. One more look at her picture convinced me to call her. Her picture was of her on the beach in a bikini. She didn't have an ounce of fat on her. You could plainly see her abs and it looked like she took nice care of herself. (163cm 44kg)
I know.. shallow, read on.
I called her and she spoke great english. We chit chatted a bit with her asking me all the right questions. How long are you in Odessa? Where do you live in USA? Do you have a good job?
Then I started asking her questions.. Come to find out shes been chatting with men from all over the world and has been to meet one. One flew her to Austria and she spent a month there! Two of her girlfriends have married foreign men already. One in Germany and one in California. Her voice was very deep for such a petite woman and the more I listened to it the more I became turned off so I wound down the conversation and said it was nice chatting with her and good luck.

First thing this morning the woman with no english has messaged me thru Singles.ru that she wants to come and prepare borsch in my flat. Interesting.
Red or green she asks. I say green because I've had red already. She asks if I have pots and pans. I say you'll have to come here and take inventory. What we need we'll run to the super and get.
Honestly I do not see this as going very far with the communication problem and I'm not sure why I even keep meeting her until I remember that waist long red hair, those big blue eyes and those nice kisses from the park.
To bring it back down to reality. This woman seems uneducated. Her messages to me are hard to decipher because of bad spelling and punctuation. When the translator was with us I tried to talk of current events and local news. She seemed uninterested and uninformed.

I noticed that some of the websites I frequent will not load. Seems they are blocked for Russian IP's.
To get around it I went to http://www.freeproxy.ca/ and was able to access any site I wanted.

[Zhena]

Nice report,had fun to read
Only I dont understand why didnt you like a woman who asked you too many questions? All those questions are important. You think why the other girls didnt ask you anything,because its not interesting for them? I think they didnt,because of the lack of english or they dont know anything about a life in usa. And you seem to be concentrated on the sexual attraction due to your hormonal intoxication. You need to get rid of that condition so you can think clearly Otherwise we will have another story about how she changed after coming to the US and blaming the age gap or something like that.

[Mars]

Nice report,had fun to read
Only I don't understand why didn't you like a woman who asked you too many questions? All those questions are important. You think why the other girls didn't ask you anything,because its not interesting for them? I think they didn't,because of the lack of English or they don't know anything about a life in USA. And you seem to be concentrated on the sexual attraction due to your hormonal intoxication. You need to get rid of that condition so you can think clearly Otherwise we will have another story about how she changed after coming to the US and blaming the age gap or something like that.

Zhena, I don't know exactly what were the questions asked.  I agree nothing wrong in general with asking questions and it is even a good thing.  However, one problem with women (and I think it is more from women than men) is the actual questions they ask.  I found that some FSU women ask questions more in an accusatory mode and with procedures akin to the KGB.

Also,  of course, sexual attraction is very important, so I don't think it should be ignored or pushed into the background by one or both parties.  I don't really believe, contrary to many others here, that sexual intoxication will somehow lead to bad decision making.  Think about the rules of good procedures for prostitutes.  That is, always get the money first.  That is because, after the orgasm, the man becomes less sexually intoxicated and may not be so willing to part with the money as he is before orgasm.  Achievement of orgasm allows the person to return to a more rational frame of mind.

The same holds true for general decision making for finding a mate.  The sexual aspect will influence the man (and to some extent the woman) up until the orgasm, but then the man will revert to more rational thinking.  So over a few days or weeks, I don't really think the sexual intoxication will overwhelm rational thinking, if in fact, there is some sex.

Now, for the case of the man who goes on this venture and does not attain a lot of sex with his chosen gal . . . yes he can continue to act in a somewhat irrational manner; what has been referred to here as 'thinking with the small head.'  This can be overcome by merely satisfying the sexual urges.

Of course women have sexual urges also but, on average, the urges are of a smaller magnitude than for men because of the relative testosterone production.  So women have a clear advantage when it comes to avoiding the problem of 'letting the small head rule.'  But as I outlined above, I don't think this is a problem for sexually satisfied men, in the long run.

[docetae]

Of course women have sexual urges also but, on average, the urges are of a smaller magnitude than for men because of the relative testosterone production.  So women have a clear advantage when it comes to avoiding the problem of 'letting the small head rule.'  But as I outlined above, I don't think this is a problem for sexually satisfied men, in the long run.

  I should not write this here, but it seems your sample of women is not very representative ...

[Mars]

  I should not write this here, but it seems your sample of women is not very representative ...

So are you denying the fact that in every known country and from the beginning of time that female prostitutes outnumber male prostitutes by an almost infinitetestimal amount?  If you do not deny this, then what is your explanation for this overwhelming preponderance of female prostitutes?

[Zhena]

I found that some FSU women ask questions more in an accusatory mode and with procedures akin to the KGB.

Well....the communication skills. The experienced women tend to be more strict and dont want to waste their time. But I think the live conversation probably would work better than a telephone. Maybe the sexual attraction would make its good influence

Also,  of course, sexual attraction is very important, so I don't think it should be ignored or pushed into the background by one or both parties. 

No,of course not :oBut should it be placed first-that is the question. But I know,I know-men are such animals... As somebody said-once we will have to get out of the bed and talk anyway,no matter how good it is.

So over a few days or weeks, I don't really think the sexual intoxication will overwhelm rational thinking, if in fact, there is some sex.

Right,thats what I actually said-get rid of that condition....You know,a one week is not enough actually for many men period of time to start to think rationally.
Anyway,its his business,what to put first,just seen so many stupid decisions done

[NickB]

Update:

Yesterday I met the woman with the umbrella. She arrived at our meeting place at 1300 and we proceeded to go to the Russian Restaurant. I had borscht and we both had a fish, crawfish and veggie mixture covered with cheese (very good!). We shared a salad and cheese. Plenty of body contact on the way over, plenty of eye contact at the table. I enjoyed the interaction and prolonged it by eating slow and engaging her in conversation.  We left and I immediately put my arm around her waist and she snuggled up to me. We walked slowly in this manner up into the city garden area and enjoyed some live music in the gazebo area. There were some older people dancing to the music. I lingered in the area watching the dancers and their movements, very entertaining as those old people could really move.
We walked a little more and I guided us toward my street. When we got to my street she asked if my flat was close. I guided us toward it.
Around 1900 she said she had to go home. We walked slowly over to the street she wanted to catch a taxi, talking. (twice I've noticed that the women have caught taxis on the street with traffic flow away from the city center. I suppose to catch the taxi on the street headed toward your destination is less expensive? More convenient?).
A very interesting woman. Educated, attractive, classy and we had some great conversation.. but she has two children, one 12 and one 15. I am trying to stay away from a pre-made family but she might be an exception.

After I returned to my flat I watched a little TV, drank a beer and went over the days events. Nice day.
I got on line and looked in my Singles.ru messages.. "Do you want I come and cook borscht?". "Yes". "Ok, I will arrive tomorrow at 1600 and we go shopping". "OK, see you then!"
I love this place!!

Zhena: I enjoyed the hormone induced euphoria but I will not make a decision to marry based on hormone reaction. I agree it is a vital part of a relationship but not the only part. I want it all.

Every woman has asked me questions. I didn't mean it to sound like I was irritated by the questions. I only mentioned it because she started with the questions less than one minute into our initial phone conversation and they were direct questions meant to size me up as a potential mate. I am guilty of the same thing but with a little more tact.
You can tell a lot by the questions a woman asks. What are her interests? What is important to her? Just open your ears!

Today I woke up remembering a dream from the night. I dreamed that the cheese had these little worms in it. Yellow with thin black strips running down their body. Weird!
Weather is bad. Cold and damp with light rain. Guess I'll stay in until time to get ready for Borscht tonight.

Since I've got some time on my hands I'll jot down some observations.

There are a lot of nice looking women in this city!

Odessa is a great place! I enjoy that everything is in walking distance. There is a wide variety of foods to choose from. Plenty of shopping. Plenty of culture and the city has a nice international feel to it. People have all been friendly and genuine.

Mobile phone service is years ahead of the US.
Buy an unlocked phone in the US (newegg or ebay). Pick up a SIM card and refill card in Kiev and you're in business.
For mobile Internet get a Life:) SIM and 100rph refill card, plug it into your phone, activate it, make a quick call to 111 to start the service, use the refill card to charge up the number, put the SIM in your USB modem, go online at the internet cafe in the airport and go to www.life.com.ua , select ENG as the language, select Life:) Internet and turn your 100rph credit into 1GB data. Using a Huawei E169 USB modem (ebay) I connected at 7.2mb. I've seen download speeds of 335kps or about the same as good DSL back home. Outstanding!!!!

Bring dark clothes and shoes. You'll blend in better. People tend to dress more formal. Three bright shirts have not left the closet.

If you have facial hair bring some form of trimming it, preferably manual as power is 220v.

Don't load up on a bunch of new stuff. My shoes became useless after rubbing 4 blisters on my feet the first day. My deoderant turned out to be useless as it would not come out of the tube, one pair of pants turned out to be much too big.

Get a couple of these plug adapters at Target ($15 each)  Embark All-in-1 Adapter. Caution.. they will not change voltage so make sure what ever you bring will take 220v!!!

ATM machines are common and easy to use (English!). Some dispense USD so if you need them for something you can get them.

Study the Russian language. Learn how the letters are pronounced. It will save you!! Learn a few words, the women got a kick out of me saying a few things to them in Russian and I was able to understand some of what they were saying to the other people (didn't let them know that!!)

Small things seem to be the same here and priced lower. Razors, deodorant, batteries etc.. I forgot my nail clippers and I had a hard time finding a suitable pair of traditional clippers!

I highly recommend renting a flat. The price is nice, they are much bigger than a hotel room and you get all the amenities of home. Plus.. how are the women going to cook you borscht in a hotel???
If you do rent a flat. Immediately take inventory and go buy what you are missing!! Stock up on the needed items. Snack goods, drinks, bread, cheese and meat for those late night hunger pains. Don't forget washing powders for the wash machine and paper towels (hard to find).

I thought I was up on the 10 commandments but I broke a couple and paid the price. Read them!!!

Give Singles.ru (mamba.ru) a try! You will like it!!!

Relax and have fun!!

[docetae]

So are you denying the fact that in every known country and from the beginning of time that female prostitutes outnumber male prostitutes by an almost infinitetestimal amount?  If you do not deny this, then what is your explanation for this overwhelming preponderance of female prostitutes?

1) because women don't need prostitutes.... they have just to ask their neighbors...
2) I don't know why you mix need of sex for men and women and prostitution. There is something weird here....  

and to answer your question, for most of western cultures, women pleasure did not exist and was a medical condition

[NickB]

Last update.

I met her at the supermarket at 1600.
She looked better than she looked any other time we had met. tight jeans, high heel boots and nice outfit. Long red hair and those big blue eyes. I almost felt intimidated!
We went thru the supermarket gathering what she wanted. It wound up with two big bags for less than half of what I spent for one bag. On the way back to my flat we tried again to chat but it wasn't working.
At the flat she took off her coat and sweater and set to work preparing green borsch. We had some laughs and joked around. I turned on the computer and set up the translator so we could communicate a little. It was much better than walking around trying to give hand signals etc.. To clear up.. she was not very imaginative and would not try any sort of hand language to get her point across where as the other ladies had no problem doing charade type movements to get the point across.
Our second to last meeting had us kissing a little in the park. This time I felt a cold barrier and kept my distance. She never presented herself in a way to suggest anything so I didn't try anything.
It was an uncomfortable evening for me. I felt out of place and as if she was forcing herself to be with me.
The soup turned out very well and I enjoyed the food.
We went to the computer and typed a few things to each other then she said she needed to go. I walked her to the taxi and gave her more taxi money. Kiss on the cheek and off she went.

What happened?
The communication barrier is what happened. We could not talk, we could not establish anything in common. Although she was very attractive I didn't feel the chemistry as I did with Lena (lady with umbrella, not real name).
After a bit I went back on Singles.ru to check messages. She came on after a while and started chatting.
She shocked me with a message.

Nick мне кажется вы не плохой человек и воспитанный и чистоплотный и порядочный для меня все эти качества важны. Не знаю поймете вы меня ?Я хотела бы что бы мужчина мне немного облегчил жизнь, мне сейчас не легко материально, вы могли бы мне помогать в этом?

Which translated to "will you support me?"
I replied that if we had established a relationship I would happily support her but even after 8 days we had not established a relationship of any kind and that it felt to me like we would not establish a relationship.
I was left with a very strange taste in my mouth so to speak.
I appreciated her frankness and her position but had never been approached like that.

Tomorrow I fly.
All in all the trip was a success. I met some nice ladies. Had a wonderful time touring Odessa.
Did I make a love connection?
The lady from the first week has really made an impression on me. We've communicated daily and the more we communicate the more I want to see her again.
I'll be back in December. If things keep going as they have I'll spend the entire time with her.

[JR]

Then NickB one, Odessa lady one !

Good for you Nick, you made the trip and made it worth while! Hope it keeps getting better.

[NickB]

Two weeks later.

Now I hear Ukraine is in a quarantine for the next 3 weeks!
700 deaths due to swine flu. People are in a panic and the pharmacies are packed. Tragic.

Just a quick note. "Red", the woman who came and cooked on my last night, and I have broken through some kind of barrier. She has become much warmer and friendly. I've really enjoyed chatting with her and it's getting more frequent by the day. Yesterday we spent 4 hours chatting and it felt like minutes. I've learned things about her I would not have guessed. She is more intelligent than I first suspected. She is more playful than I felt when I was there. We have great conversations about most everything.

I'll be seeing her again when I return.

[Stirlitz]

My overwhelming feeling is that the translator is like a wall between us.
She talks to the translator and I talk to the translator and that's it.

The first sentence is a problem. The second one is the reason.

Just talk to the woman and look at her. Don’t think about the translator. A good translator will interpret your words and if you click with the woman you will soon forget that there is someone else there and you are talking different languages.

But you must
- have a good professional interpreter,
- talk directly to the woman, look at her,
- get the translator thing off your mind and think about the date.

That’s the trick. Of course, if you instead
- have a bad/beginner/amateur interpreter,
- look at the interpreter all the time and say things like 'tell her that…', 'ask her if…',
- keep thinking that the interpreter is the wall between you and your date,

you will have a truly horrendous experience…

700 deaths due to swine flu. People are in a panic and the pharmacies are packed. Tragic.

Well. Do you believe if you hear that I am a superman but Bush is having sex with Putin every other day?

Will you believe me if I state that there are 27,000 deaths? :chucking:

[Sculpto]

you will have a truly horrendous experience…Well. Do you believe if you hear that I am a superman but Bush is having sex with Putin every other day?

Will you believe me if I state that there are 27,000 deaths? :chucking:

are you going to say that things aren't shut down and that pharmacies aren't price gouging?