Why Do Some Men Think a Vacation is Good in the Beginning Stage?

[Markus]

What happened to just going to your lady's hometown and visiting with her on her turf? Where do the vacation ideas come from? I could ask more questions about the title but
will provide statements that can be easily dissected through opinion. I'm not chastising this method but am curious as to why some men choose to take the lady they are beginning
to know away from her hometown on a vacation.  I realize that there are different time frames within the "deciding" stage where a vacation could be appropriate.

When I first visited my now wife, she wanted to choose the hotel for me. Later, I asked her why she chose the hotel she did for me. The hotel was mediocre,
but she was concerned about my safety and, now get this, she was concerned about the COST of the hotel to me. She wanted to choose a hotel for me that
didn't bite into my wallet very much, yet provided a comfortable and safe place to stay. She was concerned about the cost of the hotel to me even before we met in person
(hint to FrankFrank: and this through letter writing). When we were married in Russia we stayed at a much more expensive hotel on our wedding night, a hotel she again chose.

For reasons unknown, men that take their lady on a vacation may not be looking far into the future. Vacations can be expensive and a precedent could be in the works in expectations.
I'm not implying she will expect an expensive vacation a lot, but...(see next statement).

Find a lady that is trying to keep how much you spend to a small level and you may have a lady that tells you to turn the light off in a room where nobody is present after
you are married (and this happens at your current home).  She may also learn very quickly about the coupons in Sunday newspapers. When she learns to shop in your city, she may
learn to buy during sales. The list continues...

Meeting her in a vacation spot is much more easier than visiting on her turf because let's face it, she's pretty much in control on her turf.

This whole process is not like pushing a button: Don't make it more difficult with a vacation, which involves where you will go, who needs a visa, ignoring the cost without
thinking about the future, ignoring the jetlag factor, ignoring cost again, aligning your vacations together, possibly setting a precedent, missing out on spending time with her
family and friends, missing out on knowing her city, missing out on seeing how FSU people live, missing out on riding the buses, trains, and metro, the food, the different
way of flagging down taxis, learning how much you know nothing about FSU culture, seeing the big fur hats in the winter, seeing how women push their babies around
in strollers in very cold temperatures and there's no political correct police around, seeing the forest outside the city, seeing the country homes, the saunas, experiencing people
that talk to you as family and you can't understand them, seeing those flats with 2 bedrooms where 1 bedroom is a living room during the daytime, some kitchens that look like
camper kitchens, seeing how happy her family is living in 2 bedrooms (or 3 or more), talking to the kids in your newly learned Russian and they can't understand you, visiting
a Russian Orthodox Church, eating at Russian restaurants, getting your clothes washed without a washer in the flat, walking and walking and walking, declining hot tea because
you're a coffee drinker, watching your lady's mom fillet a fish like professional fishermen, and I could go on.

A vacation is not necessary to get to know your lady.
 

[Misha]

Markus, very well said. I agree with you 

[Chicagoguy]

I have often wondered the same thing.

Some guys start by sending girls they have never met flowers. Did they bring flowers to their last American friends  on their first date ?

Did they take their American friend to a Broadway show in New York or go to Disney World on their first date ?

Why do they take such a leap of the imagination once they have a date with a foreigner ?

[Seeker]

I have often wondered the same thing.

1)Some guys start by sending girls they have never met flowers. Did they bring flowers to their last American friends  on their first date ?

2)Did they take their American friend to a Broadway show in New York or go to Disney World on their first date ?

3)Why do they take such a leap of the imagination once they have a date with a foreigner ?

(1) Yes, but more than once she was allergic to them. 

(2) Well, the best available in a village like Tampa.

(3) Why not if it is what she wants, and you are willing to do it?


Yes, I may be lame, but like the rest of you I am doing the best I can... and the best I know how to do.

I guess we have to ask her (various her(s) over the years) to know if I was right at the time.   

Of course I am here if that says anything about my success so far. 

[Doll]

Well, first of all when you date an AW you don't "watch" her in her home. I mean - you meet for lunch or something like this. You do it quite a few times.
Next of all, when an AM wants to see how an RW acts on her "turf", he actually sets sort of unfair situation because he IS on vacations anyway.
 So, I don't get Marcus' "question".
Either both are on vacations or both are "on the turf", otherwise it is shopping (for women).

[Doll]

Find a lady that is trying to keep how much you spend to a small level and you may have a lady that tells you to turn the light off in a room where nobody is present after
you are married (and this happens at your current home).  She may also learn very quickly about the coupons in Sunday newspapers. When she learns to shop in your city, she may
learn to buy during sales. The list continues...

Do you really want to know the truth? RW know all these little tricks- most of them.
Who doesn't know how much Americans are into money! Everybody knows. So, the woman can be "concerned about the cost of the hotel" and this will not stop her to spend money like a crazy after she is married to you.
Come on, boys!
RW have their own "don't"- like you do. Don't send money to RW, don't take her shopping  or what are they- these warnings (never read them all).
Don't ask American for money, don't ask for gifts or expensive vacations.
90% of RW know it and they are really careful.

[Doll]

Markus, you say you got married in Russia. So, how did she know you were the one if she'd never watched you in your hometown, in your "real" life?
Not too smart. Don't you think so?

[I/O]

otherwise it is shopping (for women).

Someone got it. In 40 pages or less, will someone please explain what else meeting on an introduction site and travelling across the world to meet would be? Love before first sight? 

[Doll]

Someone got it. In 40 pages or less, will someone please explain what else meeting on an introduction site and travelling across the world to meet would be? Love before first sight? 

There is shopping and shopping. You read my post once again.
One thing you are the KING, you come to watch the woman on her turf! Because you don't want to make a mistake. Sure- this is the way people pick the pets.
The woman in this case has no chance to shop under same conditions.
What do not you understand?
Markus was in Russia, "watched" the woman then chose her. Did she have a chance to see how he (or anybody else) acted in his "hometown"? Nooooooooo.
  Why so?
 I do understand men who take the woman for vacations. I did it myself for a reason- for both of us be "equal" (out of our everyday life).
Makes sense?
Or clap?

[Doll]

will someone please explain what else meeting on an introduction site and travelling across the world to meet would be?

What is meeting and introduction? You introduce yourself, she does same under SAME conditions for both.
(When I shopped for the puppy I watched him  to see how he acted "on his turf", he didn't have this chance. What if I was mean and abusive? I "saw" him, but he didn't "see" me)

[Doll]

Find a lady that is trying to keep how much you spend to a small level and you may have a lady that tells you to turn the light off in a room where nobody is present after
you are married (and this happens at your current home).  She may also learn very quickly about the coupons in Sunday newspapers. When she learns to shop in your city, she may
learn to buy during sales. The list continues...

I guess I can "continue the list"
 You arrive to his environment and see how he works 7 days a week (one or more jobs), comes home stressed or/and irritated, wants nothing but eat and stare at TV (with something stupid on), how his kids are jealous and sloppy, how he shops for the cheapest stuff (with a bunch of coupons), how he keeps saying that "he pays the bills so he is always right", how he watches every fr-n penny you spend,
how his family treats you just because you speak poor English or have an accent...
To be continued?
 
(before you only saw him in your country- nice and generous)

[boaterguy]

Markus, I can give you 1 good answer! Many women don't want the 1st meeting on their home turf because of all her peers around her. My wife didn't refuse to meet me in her hometown....I decided to meet her in Moscow because I thought neutal ground was the best option.

Before we met she was very serious with an England dude. She was envolved with him for over a year. Everyone around her knew she was dating this guy. He never visited her home 1 time! She traveled to europe to meet him...went to England twice...last time on a fiancee visa. She decided he was not the man for her. When she came home everyone she knew ridiculed her.

Now for the fun part! I spent over 2 months with her at her home. Everyone was prying,curious,etc. Mum's the word! About 2 months after my wife came to the states 1 of her neighbors finally asked her brother: " Where is (my wife), is she staying in her room because the American man didn't want her?" LOL...My BIL said: "She's married to the American man and living in the US" with a big grin! He said the look on her face was undescribable...worse than being 

[thompsongunner06]

Jesus Christ guys!!! Plan on going to her town,,seeing where she is living/born/working and enjoy the area. You make it sound like work! I would also hope you have spoke and sent letters or e mails before you meet face to face, so some nice flowers(very cheap there) is a nice thing,,most guys bring flowers to the airport so why question a guy giving a girl flowers,,most like it.
Make your trip your vacation,,,enjoy it. RW will try to find a moderate price for most things,,,if they want the most expensive items be careful. If a women you are thinking about asking to be your wife does not want to show you her area or just wants to spend all your money,,keep looking. You should enjoy your time with her and she should be comfortable with you. Last,, treat her the way you would want to be treated.

[Avis]

Cheers everyone,

I'd say let people do whatever is comfortable for them, follow their guts.
There are no ultimate principles in this game. What suits me fine might be a nightmare for someone else.

P.S. my man travelled to me twice by now, i just took time off from work when he was visiting me. All went perfect for both of us

[Chicagoguy]

I don't know if Immigration has the 90 day fiance visa for a purpose or not but it does give both the man AND the  woman to sort of "try it out".

[Doll]

I don't know if Immigration has the 90 day fiance visa for a purpose or not but it does give both the man AND the  woman to sort of "try it out".

It does but not in the OP case- he married a woman so she came over as his wife.
I am surprised he brought this subject up.
Also, I don't understand what let's say Misha doesn't understand.
I hope, guys, there is no assumption like "I know I am very good, so I only need to see how good she is". If there is then I call it "assumicide".  

[Misha]

Also, I don't understand what let's say Misha doesn't understand.

I agree with you Doll. In an ideal world, he would spend a few months living in her country and she would then spend a few months living in his country. Then, they would get married at some point in the future (i.e. not because they have too because of fiance visa requirements). Then again, in an ideal world, perhaps we will all fall in love with the wonderful boy/girl who is our neighbor and childhood friend and be together until the day we die  Sadly, we do not live in a perfect world and try our best to muddle through a very imperfect one.

[Gylden]

I agree with you all, if fact it was the main point with me. Really IMO it is so much more important for the woman to have the opportunity to live with the man in his house meet his friends and experience life in the environment that she would be finding herself if she were to marry him. Of course it is nice and some sort of learning experience to see her in her environment and to meet her relative/friends, but IMO not the most important. Now my wife and I are enjoying vacationing together and enjoying every adventure because we are not busy with beginning relationship nuances.
 

[Blues Fairy]

The woman in this case has no chance to shop under same conditions.

Why not? Getting a visa to the US, or elsewhere, is difficult but doable, buying your own ticket is expensive but still doable.  I did both. 

If the woman puts herself in an unequal dating situation by refusing/being unable to get her visas and buy her tickets, than yes, she must accept the fact that the man will have the advantage of shopping in comfort while she won't.  Equality should be earned, not expected as a gift from the other party.  Alternatively, everyone could focus on the local candidates and not try to "upgrade" to a foreigner.

[GQBlues]

You arrive to his environment and see how he works 7 days a week (one or more jobs), comes home stressed or/and irritated, wants nothing but eat and stare at TV (with something stupid on), how his kids are jealous and sloppy, how he shops for the cheapest stuff (with a bunch of coupons), how he keeps saying that "he pays the bills so he is always right", how he watches every fr-n penny you spend, how his family treats you just because you speak poor English or have an accent...

S-U-R-P-R-I-S-E! and if she doesn't like it, men will simply just tell the man to drive her to the airport. LOL.

Who doesn't know how much Americans are into money! Everybody knows. So, the woman can be "concerned about the cost of the hotel" and this will not stop her to spend money like a crazy after she is married to you. Come on, boys! RW have their own "don't"- like you do. Don't send money to RW, don't take her shopping  or what are they- these warnings (never read them all). Don't ask American for money, don't ask for gifts or expensive vacations. 90% of RW know it and they are really careful.

LOL. There's actually a recent thread in one of the message board FSUW uses where someone stumbled upon RWD and gave the link out. The woman thought a lot of the do's and don'ts was just hysterical. One of the topic they were laughing at is the flower/photo delivery. Another is the money issue. They found it amusing how AMs tell each other never to share their finances, give appearances they're well-off, etc to avoid scammers and gold-diggers; which would conveniently include, as one RW said, facts like alimony, child support, being heavily in debt, etc... most AMs rely on credit cards, as opposed to available funds, during their shopping days that when so many FSUWs arrive, she's already in debt without even knowing about it.  LOL.

For the topic. I met my wife on neutral ground before I spent time in her hometown and met the folks. That's just me. It wasn't to test her or see how she acts outside of her surrounding, friends and family. That's a very silly reason. For me, that was an opportunity for both of us to be one-on-one since we're still trying to get to know one another. If we mutually liked each other enough to introduce me to her 'home', then no problem doing that. Folks always say seeing her at 'home' is the only way to understand who she really is....I'll be a contrarian about that. I agree with doll on this.

[Doll]

S-U-R-P-R-I-S-E! and if she doesn't like it, men will simply just tell the man to drive her to the airport. LOL.

It IS the surprise, but not that funny- as you probably know, RW often comes with kids. It means she has in most cases to quit her job and the kids are out of school.
Yes, the Government does give these 90 days and the woman can return to Russia.
It hurts but it is ok. The thing is that "works 7 days a week, comes home stressed, cheap when shopping" usually occurs after these 90 days.
Oh, well.
Or you think that after you quit your job it is easy to get another? I wish.
Yes, this kind of dating is risky for both sides but we're talking why men take women for vacations. Why? Because it is the equal start.
This "return policy" is not that enjoyable, believe me.

[Doll]

For the topic. I met my wife on neutral ground before I spent time in her hometown and met the folks. That's just me. It wasn't to test her or see how she acts outside of her surrounding, friends and family. That's a very silly reason. For me, that was an opportunity for both of us to be one-on-one since we're still trying to get to know one another. If we mutually liked each other enough to introduce me to her 'home', then no problem doing that. Folks always say seeing her at 'home' is the only way to understand who she really is....I'll be a contrarian about that. I agree with doll on this.

One more for Misha

[Boethius]

Equality should be earned, not expected as a gift from the other party.  Alternatively, everyone could focus on the local candidates and not try to "upgrade" to a foreigner.

I disagree.  You shouldn't have to "earn" equality, or respect, from a potential mate.  

[Doll]

I disagree.  You shouldn't have to "earn" equality, or respect, from a potential mate.  

I also saw this but didn't answer because it is not so.
Meaning I agree with Boethius.
Very nice! Women have to earn the equality, men don't. I don't think so.
It is not that a woman "puts herself in an unequal situation", men and woman are both in this situation, so let us be fair.
No comments about "doable" getting USA visa and going to this country on her own expenses.
So, gentlemen, the ones who take RW on vacation- there is nothing wrong in it.
Me, personally, told my AM right away that I didn't want my sons see their mother dating. When it was decided then they got to know the details.
Again, my present husband was not the first AM I dated, so get my point.

[Blues Fairy]

I disagree.  You shouldn't have to "earn" equality, or respect, from a potential mate.  

I said nothing about respect.  But equality either exists, or it does not.  If you are shopping for a richer, more educated, more independent, more mobile mate, chances are, he will dictate some conditions of your meetings if he's paying for them - and he will be right to do so.  Therefore, to stay in an equal dating situation, you should either target your equals or try to equal those you target.  Expecting them to cater to your pride while paying your expenses is rather presumptuous.