Are RW emotionally cold?

[Seeker]

Thanks for everyone who posted up here. It made me think about some things I have not thought about in the past. When I proposed to her, I had no doubts about her. The things I described has all been since I have left Russia 7 months ago and us not living together (apologies if this was not conveyed previously). We have applied for fiance visa and only 1 more month to wait. Skype as good as it is, is obviously not the same. Some bad stories I have read on here, I start to question her recent behavior, which I mentioned, and I did think was odd at the time.

If it all works out for us, I will look back and think that maybe posting here was not right to write such things on a web site but then if it fails miserably, anyone can say 'hello, the red flags were right in front of you!'.

I wish you luck, and hope the best for you.  It seems you are human, just like the rest of us, full of questions and self doubts.  Welcome to the club.   

[GregfromGa]

Thanks for everyone who posted up here. It made me think about some things I have not thought about in the past. When I proposed to her, I had no doubts about her. The things I described has all been since I have left Russia 7 months ago and us not living together (apologies if this was not conveyed previously). We have applied for fiance visa and only 1 more month to wait. Skype as good as it is, is obviously not the same. Some bad stories I have read on here, I start to question her recent behavior, which I mentioned, and I did think was odd at the time.

If it all works out for us, I will look back and think that maybe posting here was not right to write such things on a web site but then if it fails miserably, anyone can say 'hello, the red flags were right in front of you!'.

Whatever you do don't and I mean don't tell her you came here seeking advice. And for the love of all things true and holy, don't and I mean don't give her the link to this place where she can read about all the doubts that everyone else had while trying to prove to her that you were not alone in doubting her. She will never understand. Not even years later. In my opinion 7 months are entirely too long to wait in between visits. I wish you all the luck.

[rambler]

Mialia has given you insight into the unfathomable contortions of the female mind.

I will add that you have to be very proactive, a lot stronger and totally positive in all respects.  More so than in the west. Your doubts will feed hers. Your total lack of doubt will inspire her.

I can't figure the exact time-lines regarding how long you have been engaged.  But if you don't know already -in Russia  marriage follows engagement within a few - like 3 months later.  You will likely find a whole different attitude once you are married.

In the eyes of her friends and family she has no kudos from this state of affairs.  Why are you not married?  

No excuses - just do it. Scale to what you can afford, do it somewhere where you don't have to invite a large number of people if finances are a limiting factor. While you are just a boyfriend you are nothing. These girls almost expect to get dumped for a younger more beautiful version on an annual basis, even if they are stunning by our standards.

So why should they allow themselves to be emotionally dependant on you unless you have walked the walk?  It's not going to happen. You know, after my proposal,  before the champagne was finished, I was asked by a family member, "When will the wedding be?"  This was mid December and I replied "How about on my birthday" which is end February. It turned out to be later but only by 3 weeks. Until then you are just a boyfriend and the men treat their women like -- badly.  Set a date and make it the best day of her life.  Don't forget - a Russian friend will spend their last penny on their friend so any reservations or delays based on finances are the worst possible excuses. There is none of this let's wait till we can afford it BS.  Get on with it while you still can.  Every day you wait - she is losing face.


R

[Seeker]

Whatever you do don't and I mean don't tell her you came here seeking advice. And for the love of all things true and holy, don't and I mean don't give her the link to this place where she can read about all the doubts that everyone else had while trying to prove to her that you were not alone in doubting her. She will never understand. Not even years later. In my opinion 7 months are entirely too long to wait in between visits. I wish you all the luck.

And this is the best advice you have gotten here.  If at some point it comes up, or you feel you need to tell her, you had better be pretty sure that she will understand it was a moment of question and not doubts about her that still linger.  No matter where she is from, (or he... I think this one might be equal on that level) to think you aired your feelings and doubts among strangers will make her uncomfortable.  If she reads it, it might be better (or worse)... it depends on how she interprets it.  I have seen examples of this recently.  Some working out better than others.

Better just not to bring it up.

[Miri22]

.. Close the barn door after the horse runs off much?
Hope your screen name isn't something she knows you use.

[I/O]

oziuncs: As per usual, I'll depart the beaten path here and understand, I am not the original encourager as a general rule. I'm not seeing much in your post/s that I didn't see with my now wife whom I am very sure is very much in love with me. Unlike everyone who claims when a RW is in love with you, you'll never doubt, I found another thing, a very 'nother thing. I recall Mrs I/O (Long before becoming Mrs I/O) meeting me in Novosibirsk airport where she almost brushed me off as I exited customs and I was more than a little miffed at the moment but as I stopped outside for a smoke, I noticed her shaking and although it was -4c, that wasn't the reason. We'd been apart for several months at the time. For once, I was smart enough to pretend I didn't notice and turn away for a few seconds giving her time to regain her composure and most importantly, maintain her personal dignity. Honestly, I am not at all surprised by her response in Thailand.

I will add that as our relationship approaches 5 years, twice in that entire time has my wife told me she loves me and both times have been in text, not in voice. Having said that, I'm similar and it doesn't mean the reality is any different or the meaning is any less. Each is different and what may be coming across to you as cold may be quite another thing. Remain committed but vigilant.

[Daveman]

Whatever you do don't and I mean don't tell her you came here seeking advice. And for the love of all things true and holy, don't and I mean don't give her the link to this place where she can read about all the doubts that everyone else had while trying to prove to her that you were not alone in doubting her. She will never understand. Not even years later. In my opinion 7 months are entirely too long to wait in between visits. I wish you all the luck.

And this is the best advice you have gotten here.  If at some point it comes up, or you feel you need to tell her, you had better be pretty sure that she will understand it was a moment of question and not doubts about her that still linger.  No matter where she is from, (or he... I think this one might be equal on that level) to think you aired your feelings and doubts among strangers will make her uncomfortable.  If she reads it, it might be better (or worse)... it depends on how she interprets it.  I have seen examples of this recently.  Some working out better than others.

Better just not to bring it up.

Agreed.. but just to be on the safe side, he'd better post those naked sleeping photos of her ASAP to avert any possibility of  Purgatorian Provincial backlash.   :evil:


joking aside, there have been several excellent posts in this thread... and it usually goes back to that little feeling in your gut.. if something feels weird, it usually is.  Don't be paranoid, but don't rationalize something away either.  

There's a country song I heard not long ago that was completely cool (though I'm not a huge country fan)... the hook went something like this:

"One of God's greatest gifts is unanswered prayers"...  which goes right along with what groov said... yeah, maybe a person wants to be with another, wants it so much... and yet..  maybe there's a better destiny awaiting you and the right travel partner on the journey.  Only you know your situation.... and only you can find your answers...  and only I can talk so much philosophical nonsense in one day..  soooo.... exit stage right!

[Seeker]

.. Close the barn door after the horse runs off much?
Hope your screen name isn't something she knows you use.

True... but maybe she will read what I/O says in the next post:

oziuncs: As per usual. I'll depart the beaten path here and understand, I am not the original encourager as a general rule. I'm not seeing much in your post/s that I didn't see with my now wife whom I am very sure is very much in love with me. Unlike everyone who claims when a RW is in love with you, you'll never doubt, I found another thing, a very 'nother thing. I recall Mrs I/O (Long before becoming Mrs I/O) meeting me in Novosibirsk airport where she almost brushed me off as I exited customs and I was more than a little miffed at the moment but as I stopped outside for a smoke, I noticed her shaking and although it was -4c, that wasn't the reason. We'd been apart for several months at the time. For once, I was smart enough to pretend I didn't notice and turn away for a few seconds giving her time to regain her composure and most importantly, maintain her personal dignity. Honestly, I am not at all surprised by her response in Thailand.

I will add that as our relationship approaches 5 years, twice in that entire time has my wife told me she loves me and both times have been in text, not in voice. Having said that, I'm similar and it doesn't mean the reality is any different or the meaning is any less. Each is different and what may be coming across to you as cold may be quite another thing. Remain committed but vigilant.

And realize it was not all negative... And that he still went with his heart, and married her.

I can see it going both ways.  As the optimist, I hope for the best outcome... for both of them.

[Faux Pas]

Thanks for everyone who posted up here. It made me think about some things I have not thought about in the past. When I proposed to her, I had no doubts about her. The things I described has all been since I have left Russia 7 months ago and us not living together (apologies if this was not conveyed previously). We have applied for fiance visa and only 1 more month to wait. Skype as good as it is, is obviously not the same. Some bad stories I have read on here, I start to question her recent behavior, which I mentioned, and I did think was odd at the time.

If it all works out for us, I will look back and think that maybe posting here was not right to write such things on a web site but then if it fails miserably, anyone can say 'hello, the red flags were right in front of you!'.

Armchair quarterbacking is what we do best  You are the only one with a dog in this fight and the advice is worth every penny you paid for it.

[GregfromGa]

And this is the best advice you have gotten here.  If at some point it comes up, or you feel you need to tell her, you had better be pretty sure that she will understand it was a moment of question and not doubts about her that still linger.  No matter where she is from, (or he... I think this one might be equal on that level) to think you aired your feelings and doubts among strangers will make her uncomfortable.  If she reads it, it might be better (or worse)... it depends on how she interprets it.  I have seen examples of this recently.  Some working out better than others.

Better just not to bring it up.

Thank you, thank you very much. I'm just happy to be able to positively contribute to a poster needing advice every now and then. I do what I can. I get a nice warm feeling all over when I dole out advice a poster can actually use in this quest.

[Seeker]

Thank you, thank you very much. I'm just happy to be able to positively contribute to a poster needing advice every now and then. I do what I can. I get a nice warm feeling all over when I dole out advice a poster can actually use in this quest.

Don't let it go to your head.   

I am the least of your worries.  Look at the respect I get.  Sheesh... getting a thumbs up from me might get you ignored by some.  Okay... bad joke, but I think Greg will understand it.

[GregfromGa]

Don't let it go to your head.   

I am the least of your worries.  Look at the respect I get.  Sheesh... getting a thumbs up from me might get you ignored by some.  Okay... bad joke, but I think Greg will understand it.

LOL, you're probably right. Any allegiance or vote of confidence from you might mean I'll have 7 on my ignore list by daybreak tomorrow. Maybe more. I'll take my chances elsewhere. Thank you very little. LOL

[Seeker]

LOL, you're probably right. Any allegiance or vote of confidence from you might mean I'll have 7 on my ignore list by daybreak tomorrow. Maybe more. I'll take my chances elsewhere. Thank you very little. LOL

 

Always glad to help. 

[Boethius]

And this is the best advice you have gotten here.  If at some point it comes up, or you feel you need to tell her, you had better be pretty sure that she will understand it was a moment of question and not doubts about her that still linger.  No matter where she is from, (or he... I think this one might be equal on that level) to think you aired your feelings and doubts among strangers will make her uncomfortable.  If she reads it, it might be better (or worse)... it depends on how she interprets it.  I have seen examples of this recently.  Some working out better than others.

Better just not to bring it up.

Marriages should never have secrets.  It's unhealthy, and usually, found out. 

The chance of hiding something from most FSU woman is especially remote.

[Seeker]

Marriages should never have secrets.  It's unhealthy, and usually, found out. 

The chance of hiding something from most FSU woman is especially remote.

Oh no, I agree.  And I would substitute 'usually' for 'always' found out.  That is why I am less than open about my plans... experiences, etc.  I am not trying to hide anything.  But I also don't want to have to explain misunderstandings later.  Or worse, other peoples advice and words will be seen as my own.

But now it is too late for being cautious and careful in this situation.  If it is to be presented to her, he had better trust in her love and know that she believes, trusts, and most of all, that she loves him and will not judge the entire relationship on what she reads here.

And this in some ways is a warning for future posters.  Be honest, okay... have questions, okay....  but be prepared to stand behind your words in the eyes of the readers, no matter if you have a relationship or not with that person.  I always want to respond to each first post with a "Be careful what you say".  But I don't. 

[GregfromGa]

Marriages should never have secrets.  It's unhealthy, and usually, found out. 

The chance of hiding something from most FSU woman is especially remote.

There's a difference between a secret and telling her he came here and spilled his guts about her acting in her manner. I mean he's hopefully not going to tell her about the time the old gal talked him into the saddle, jumper cables and a quart of Quaker State motor oil. Some things are just better off unsaid. Both of these being high on that list.

[Boethius]

There are enough facts here that, if she happens to come across this site, she will be able to identify herself. 

Bottom line, suggesting someone keep secrets, in the hope it remain so, is bad advice.

[CanadaMan]

... I recall Mrs I/O (Long before becoming Mrs I/O) meeting me in Novosibirsk airport where she almost brushed me off as I exited customs and I was more than a little miffed at the moment but as I stopped outside for a smoke, I noticed her shaking and although it was -4c, that wasn't the reason. We'd been apart for several months at the time. For once, I was smart enough to pretend I didn't notice and turn away for a few seconds giving her time to regain her composure and most importantly, maintain her personal dignity. Honestly, I am not at all surprised by her response in Thailand.

 I/O I am very curious about your reply above.
You never gave any indication as to why she almost brushed you off AND also why you were miffed?

 

[Faux Pas]

There are enough facts here that, if she happens to come across this site, she will be able to identify herself. 

Bottom line, suggesting someone keep secrets, in the hope it remain so, is bad advice.

I disagree. The forum is relatively anonymous and Russia and the US are big countries . The descriptions could be many people. The paranoia about getting "found out" is just that, paranoia. Anyone that paranoid doesn't have any business in this hunt. ozidunc has stated nothing to be ashamed of. He is engaged to be married and having some doubts. That can happen literally to anyone. If his lady wishes to find something and break it off, I'm pretty sure she can find other things much worse than this

[Boethius]

The fact the OP lived in Russia, the information booth description, the Thailand trip, and the facebook description - one or two, independently, likely is not but, taken together, they are probably enough to put 2 and 2 together. 

[Seeker]

There are enough facts here that, if she happens to come across this site, she will be able to identify herself. 

Bottom line, suggesting someone keep secrets, in the hope it remain so, is bad advice.

She probably will be able to identify herself.  That is why I would prefer to teach caution (and do it for myself).

Yes, keeping secrets is bad advice.  But at this point, what is the best way to approach it and open up to her?  That is my only warning.  And the worse possible thing would be if she finds it for herself, before the poster has a chance to tell her.

Sorry to be the downer here, but how to prepare for, or deal with the possible outcome of posting and having others read it has been an issue here before.  Recently.  I would NEVER tell someone to lie or deceive ANYONE, much less someone they claim to love.

But once the words have been posted, even if innocent, how would you explain it to your partner?

Well, that wasn't really a question to you... just in general.  Sometimes we have already built the bridge we have to cross.  What is the best way to deal with it?

[mialia]

Mialia has given you insight into the unfathomable contortions of the female mind.

I will add that you have to be very proactive, a lot stronger and totally positive in all respects.  More so than in the west. Your doubts will feed hers. Your total lack of doubt will inspire her.

I can't figure the exact time-lines regarding how long you have been engaged.  But if you don't know already -in Russia  marriage follows engagement within a few - like 3 months later.  You will likely find a whole different attitude once you are married.

In the eyes of her friends and family she has no kudos from this state of affairs.  Why are you not married?  

No excuses - just do it. Scale to what you can afford, do it somewhere where you don't have to invite a large number of people if finances are a limiting factor. While you are just a boyfriend you are nothing. These girls almost expect to get dumped for a younger more beautiful version on an annual basis, even if they are stunning by our standards.

So why should they allow themselves to be emotionally dependant on you unless you have walked the walk?  It's not going to happen. You know, after my proposal,  before the champagne was finished, I was asked by a family member, "When will the wedding be?"  This was mid December and I replied "How about on my birthday" which is end February. It turned out to be later but only by 3 weeks. Until then you are just a boyfriend and the men treat their women like -- badly.  Set a date and make it the best day of her life.  Don't forget - a Russian friend will spend their last penny on their friend so any reservations or delays based on finances are the worst possible excuses. There is none of this let's wait till we can afford it BS.  Get on with it while you still can.  Every day you wait - she is losing face.


R

[oziduncs]

hi there here is a look from the other side

about "i miss you" words ... it was easy for her to write it but difficult to say... i have had exactly the same thing with my ex. i couldn't say anything nice to my boyfriend after i haven't seen him for more than 3 months. Why? you will laugh now:))). as it was for so long that we didn't see each other - i started to share my ex from the person i write to. difficult to explain... for me it became like there are two different people.. so when we finely met - i was struggling to say something nice to him, as i felt like I'm betraying the one i was writing to, even if i knew that it is the same person.. that what happens with LDR.. skype chat and letters become your reality and replace in your mind the real person... it doesn't mean that she behave so for the same reason and this reason is common for the all RW, of course. it was the way i felt myself .

what about her, didn't pay for anything - yes it is normall. We still have this thing in our society that man should pay for woman, even if they earn equally..  we grew up with this.. some women may be more pro-western in those questions, they share expenses, but the majority is not even thinking about paying, for some of the guys in my country its even kind of humiliation ... they won't let the women to pay for themselves, so that's why we are never offer it. If it is such a problem for you - talk to her, let her know, I'm sure she doesn't give a clue you expect her to pay for anything, because she was never expected to pay.

what about any signs of affection... did she ever refused your kiss or your touch? if no - she is not cold and she does have feelings for you.. Have you ever thought that maybe she is just that type of women who needs to be taken? like if you want her kiss - you shouldn't wait till she will do it - she won't, even if she wants it more than you do, but she needs you to come and take this kiss from her? so in this case her cold behaviour is the biggest sign of affection you could get from her. by this behaviour she is provoking you to touch her more, to show more affection. so, the colder she is - the more she wants you to take her. how about that? also, it is just some of my thoughts, but not the law of behaving of all RW. )

Special thanks to give me time and perception from a womens point of view.

[mialia]

Special thanks to give me time and perception from a womens point of view.

 
you are welcome anytime

[Aloe]

oziduncs, about the pictures.. I also never posted pictures of me and my husband together on vacation. Because in my opinion i looked very crappy in all of them. I am very critical of my own photos Although my husband thinks im silly and i look good in those photos, i think i look awful. Maybe she is also critical of her photos.
Mialia is very right about money thing, its 100% normal that a man pays for everything, and frankly its very weird you would expect her to pay for anything, why should she? You are the man, arent you? When i was dating and a guy would ask me to pay for something, or i got a feeling he expects me to pay, the guy would immediately lose A LOT of points in my eyes. He's supposed to be the man, isn't he  Making the woman pay is quite unmanly in my eyes