Do scammers offer phone numbers?

[info_man]

This is the 3rd letter I have recieved from K and I wanted to share it  with the board to get your opinion. I met her thru Free Personals.

The 2nd letter I wrote to her was describing myself in more detail and  answering some of her questions. She had mentioned her favorite Artist  is Salvadore Dali. So when I replied with the second letter I had a  print of one of his paintings of Rose and she failed to even mention  this in her 3rd letter, but she did give a number to contact her. Do  scammers offer phone numbers?

I asked some detail questions and in the 3rd letter failed to answer  anyone of them, especially the one about me having a daughter.

Here is the letter and a photo of her. I am of course skeptical and has anyone here ever came across this lady from the Ukraine?

Thanks,

Info_Man

Code: [Select]

I there! I like your name. It sounds very sweet and romantic -
.. The russian names sounds different and that's why it's
a little unusual for me to pronounce your name. I have got your reply
on my letter and like your thoughts very much, your words and now I
know a little bit more about you. I am interested to know you better!!!!

I want to tell you, that Internet is a little unusual way of communicating
for me and I still cannot get used, that we cannot meet just tomorrow and
you cannot present me a flower!!!

You could ask me, why have I decided to search a man of my dreams abroad!
Well, I don't want to limit myself just with Ukraine! I believe, that my other
half could live anywhere, that's why I'm using Internet! And why have you
decided to use this way of communication? I was thinking, that if we have
serious plans for future life togetehr, I would be ready to move to your
country! Distance doesn't frighten me!

I also think, that age is not important in relationship, the most important
is to feel the person and to understand each other fully! Moreover, I think,
that elder men are much more wiser and experienced and I think, they know
how to treat a woman right way!!!And I want to find a man, who knows how to
make me happy!!!!

I also dream about family. I want to create cosy and comfortable home.
I think Family is the main thing for everyone. It's so nice - to know,
that someone is care about you and love you.

I have a lot of dreams and goals and I'd like to share them with the
beloved one. I am very glad I've met you and hope our comunication
will  continue.  It's hard to express my thoughts and feelings in
letter, as you can't  see my emotions and ambitions, that's why   I'd
love to talk to you, if you don't mind, you may call me. My phone
number is  Please, call me from 12a.m. till 4 p.m. ,
ukrainian time!I think that throught telephone talking it's much more
easier to know each other.

Kiss you
Kateryna

P.S. in the attachment you can find the picture of me at my home! It was
made last year next day after my birthday!!!!I got so many flowers that
day!!!!            
I am 35 and she is 26 is that  considered elder?

[Todd]

Telephone times are weird.  What does she do from 4 to midnight? 

Also, the 3rd letter is still boiler plate, which is a bad sign.  Still, there is no downside to picking up the phone and calling.  In fact, at the very least, callling will eliminate the hairy Boris thing.  Also, while this girl is probably low probability, it is a good idea to get some practice in talking with a Russian woman over the phone.  Also, one phone call is worth 10 letters any day.  In general, you should try to get a phone number by the third letter so you aren't wasting time writing too much.

Finally, 35 vs. 26 is not really an age gap in my opinion.  Kate, my wife is now 25, and I am 38.  Her most common observation is that I'm really 15 still and stop playing video games.  She has NEVER been seriously involved with anyone LESS than 10 years older than she is.

So, don't worry about the age gap.  I don't notice it and neither does Kate.

[groovlstk]

Like Todd says, much of her letter is boilerplate so it's almost certain that she's writing to a large number of men. You can't knock her for that since we do the same, but if she continues to write generically and fail to answer your Qs, either call her on it or move on.

A phone call is probably a good idea as it might bump you up in the pecking order, past the guys unwilling to invest the time or money. If she is using a mobile you can also communicate via SMS.

[Phoenix]

Guess what info_man?

Lets see if these sound familiar...

Letter 1:

Hi Phoenix!

First of all I would like to thank you for the attention! It was pleasant for me, that such a man as you are has noticed me!!! I would like to know you better and I hope, that our correspondence would lead us to more closer relationship! Because that's what we are both looking for, am I right?

Reading your letter, I have found out that we have a lot in common! I think that every person has a chance to be happy and this chance should be used. I hope we'll be able to use this chance. The fact that you read this letter is already a miracle; I mean the real miracle of our life.

So I would tell you more about myself As you know my name is Kateryna. I am 23 years old, I study at the University by correspondence! It means that I study myself and than just come to the University to pass the exams. My specialty is finance.

I was born In Kiev! Do you know about this city? I think, it's well known and very popular all over the world now after the Eurovision song contest that took place in Kiev!!! My city is very beautiful and may be one day I can show you all of my favorite places here!

To my mind a lot can be said about person by the hobby, that's why I'll tell a little bit about mine. I am many sided person, I am Cancer by horoscope (I was born July 1, 1982). I have a lot of hobbies. From the one hand I like such calm things as playing the piano or drawing, from the other hand I like to take risk and to undergo extreme situations. I really don't know for myself how I can match all these. :-) I have also graduated from musical school, I was studying singing there and now I work as a singer!

I sing national songs in Ukrainian restaurant! I love this work, it gives me so much inspiration and I'm happy, that I can cheer up the mood of people with my voice!!!

I lead a healthy life, go in for fitness, do not smoke or drink, as I think it is very harmful for the health of such a young girl like me.

I also like to laugh and to get fun; I think I have a good sense of humor. I adore jokes, of course, if they are funny. :-) I like the life I have, the only thing that I lack in my life is a special man with whom I'd be able to share all my joys and misfortunes.

But the main reason why I use this way of communication is to meet the only one who'd be able to make my heart bit faster. I want to meet a man about whom I'd be able to take care and who'd be able to take a good care about me.

What about you, what are you looking for? Write me about your desires and wishes, about your work and hobbies. I am so interested in our communication; I'd really like to know you much better. You may write to my personal address, which is: felinely@...

KAteryna

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Letter 2:

 

Greetings dear Phoenix! 

Thank you very much for your interesting letter. I liked it very much. I am fine, and my day was very nice. I have some free time before to work and I'm here in the Internet café writing to you!

I am glad to get your reply. I want to know more about you as a person, your mind, your way of thinking. It might be too early to make any conclusions, but I think, that may be you are that man I am looking for!!!! I'm seeking for a kind hearted man, someone I can love and trust all my life.

Human and emotional qualities as understanding, kindness, frankness. Do you think the same???? I suppose you will agree with me that partners should trust each other and only on this basic they can build healthy and serious relationship. The main goal for me is to find my soul mate and to create a family. I am very sensitive person and looking for honest and sincere relationship. The world has changed a lot. And my dream is to live in IIX-IX century, where is a lot of love and romance. For me the soul of people means much more than material things. I hope to find the person with such soul here in this time and to be happy with him.

As for my usual life, I live with my parents, and will tell you with pleasure more about my family. I am the only one their daughter.  I have no brothers or sisters, but I am not spoiled child I love them very much and thankful for everything they did and do for me. They are very careful and gave me the best education they could. My father - Vladimir, is very intelligent and smart person. He always gives me a lot of interesting information and I never feel bored with him. My mother - Tatyana, is very calm and loving person, she is very communicative and understanding. I learned how to cook from her and to take care about the house and family.

About preferences, I like classical music, it inspires me. I adore art. My favorite painter is Salvador Dali. As you know already my other passion is folk songs. I also spend a lot of time in the library as I have to study without any teachers! I study there not only finances, but also art books and novels. And what are your hobbies and how do you like to spend your free time????

I don't smoke or take drugs; occasionally I have one or two drinks in good company, but do not make it a habit. I enjoy a healthy lifestyle. For outdoor hobbies I like swimming, hiking and bicycling often. I love nature very much and think it is essential that we understand ecology and take responsible steps to preserve our unique planet. I enjoy astronomy, photography and identifying birds and plants.

I wish to know more about you and I see that now I have a wonderful opportunity to tell you some important things about myself, my life, my interests, my preferences. Write me more please about your dreams, your wishes, your idea of happiness, your favorite virtue ... What do you value mostly in a woman? Where do you usually spend your summer vacation?

Have a great day. With warmest regards

Kateryna

P.S. I am sending you the picture that was taken in the park near my house this spring. I hope you'll like it!!!

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Letter 3:

 

HI there! 

I like your name. It sounds very sweet and romantic - Phoenix... The Russian names sounds different and that's why it's a little unusual for me to pronounce your name. I have got your reply on my letter and like your thoughts very much, your words and now I know a little bit more about you. I am interested to know you better!!!!

I want to tell you, that Internet is a little unusual way of communicating for me and I still cannot get used, that we cannot meet just tomorrow and you cannot present me a flower!!!

You could ask me, why I have decided to search a man of my dreams abroad! Well, I don't want to limit myself just with Ukraine! I believe that my other half could live anywhere, that's why I'm using Internet! And why have you decided to use this way of communication? I was thinking that if we have serious plans for future life together, I would be ready to move to your country! Distance doesn't frighten me!

I also think that age is not important in relationship; the most important is to feel the person and to understand each other fully! Moreover, I think, that elder men are much more wiser and experienced and I think, they know how to treat a woman right way!!! And I want to find a man, who knows how to make me happy!!!!

I also dream about family. I want to create cozy and comfortable home. I think Family is the main thing for everyone. It's so nice - to know, that someone is care about you and love you.

Darling, as for your questions, it's so great, that you are so interested in me! I promise, I will answer most of your questions, in my next letter! As I have given you a lot of info this time and I don't want my letter to you would be very long and informative!!! Ok?

I would say that I definitely love to travel and of course I have heard about California! Where would I love to go? Everywhere, I didn't travel at all, so every place would be interesting for me to visit!!!

I have a lot of dreams and goals and I'd like to share them with the beloved one. I am very glad I've met you and hope our communication will continue.  It's hard to express my thoughts and feelings in letter, as you can't  see my emotions and ambitions, that's why I'd love to talk to you, if you don't mind, you may call me. My phone number is +380-9xxxxxxx6. Please, call me from 12a.m. till 4 p.m. Ukrainian time! I think that through telephone talking it's much more easier to know each other.

Kiss you

Kateryna

P.S. in the attachment you can find the picture of me at my home! It was made last year next day after my birthday!!!! I got so many flowers that day!!!!

[/size][/font] 

I asked for her phone number in my third letter because I felt her first two letters were a bit "over-the-top" in regards to how excitied she was to know me and that she was already calling me dear, darling, and saying she is willing to move for me!

Thanks for posting this info_man, I was considering doing the same but I decided to wait and see what was going to happen (I will be in Kiev next week and was planning to meet her - cautiously), but now I know my doubts are confirmed.

Too bad too, she is gorgeous!


(lol, picture works now - no idea what the problem was :?)

[Phoenix]

I tried to post a couple pictures of her, but for some reason the attachment isn't working for me.

Is there some trick that I don't know about to post a photo? I double checked the size, they are far below the 300k allowed.

[Admin]

I tried to post a couple pictures of her, but for some reason the attachment isn't working for me.

Is there some trick that I don't know about to post a photo? I double checked the size, they are far below the 300k allowed.

If the attachment (photo) is 300 kb or less, it should attach no problem. If the width of the photo is greater than 800 pixels, the photo will attach as a LINK. If it is 800 pixels or less, the photo will attach inline and viewers will see it with your text.

Perhaps you are trying to attach more than one photo to your message? If so, attach only one and you should have no problem.

If the problem persists, please send me a PM and explanation of any messages you are receiving.

Sorry for the inconvenience.

- Dan

[info_man]

Phoenix,

yeah it is too bad. she is very attractive. So have you spoken to her?  Good luck in Kiev. I plan on traveling over there sometime this year.  The letters are identicle and we both live in California.

I been looking at some of the recommended agencies on this board.  Ukriane Love has a  match making service called soulmate and looks  promising and most likely go that route and also just purchasing direct  addressesfr om other sites like Angelica Network.

Thanks for all the input by the members on this board and of course any  useful information you can direct my way would be appreciated

Info_Man

[Todd]

She is attractive, but you will be delighted once you get there.  I've only been to roughly 40 states and 60 countries, and I was absolutely floored by how attractive the average woman on the street is.  Do not get discouraged.

Todd

[Oosik]

That babe is hot.

Some scams are Hairy Boris writing to you.
The phone # thing is a good sign in that you can rule out hairy boris. Imagine how hard it would be to hire women to BS guys on the phone and keep the stories straight.

There are plenty more scams though.

If she has written to many men, so what, as someone else said, a call moves you up in the pecking order bigtime. They say 10% of men actually go over. There is probably 50% too chicken to even call.

If you want to eliminate more categories of scammer, do the rose delivery with pictures thing.

[jb]

I guess it's worth repeating here, (we do this about 10 times a year).

I met her thru Free Personals.

If a really hot babe contacts you first, based upon an ad you placed on  a free personals site, or any other kind of free dating site,,, unless  you are absolutely Brad Pitt movie star handsome, abs of steel, all  your own hair and teeth, etc., standing in front of your new  multi-million dollar pad, showing off your new Lamborgini Diablo and a  classic Rolls, it's probably a scam.  You should ask yourself;  "Whoa, what does she see in me?"

You are probably not even writing to a female, just a picture and a  fake name.  Fat Yuri is behind most of the letters sent to these  unsuspecting men.  Nice try, Yuri, but you were foiled again by  the information super highway.

The girl shown in the photo does not look 26 to me,, barely over 21, if  that, was my impression, and she is probably a photo model, and the  photo was probably lifted from some magazine advert that you would  not ever likely ever see in California.

Better luck next time.

[Phoenix]

I am sure she is a real girl and those are probably her photos. But...

Judging by the quickly growing "affection" and writing that she is willing to move to my country in only the 3rd letter makes me suspicious of a soon to be unveiled visa scam or possibly a pro dater (or both depending on if the guy visits or not).

Even the idea of a GCG comes to mind; she is writing to 2 California guys, maybe she wants a mule to a warm state .

Too many other beautiful and sincere girls there to mess around with this one, who I think has an agenda of some sort.

LOOK OUT KYIV - HERE I COME! :cool:

 

 

[Oosik]

So then is is worth it to pay $50 for flowers to prove JB wrong?

The flower trick would eliminate that scam completely. She did look young to me, but still,

As far as her automatically being a scammer, I'd discount that. Odds may be high, but not 100%

[jb]

I would suggest a google search using her full name and the town she says she lives in, it might be revealing.

[jb]

jb is never wrong, sometimes mis-informed, but never wrong.

[Phoenix]

She told me 23 (birthday July 1, 1982) and that seems accurate; maybe info_man mistyped if our letters are the same.

I wrote her first - Will do the Google and scam site search once I ask and get her last name (haven't asked yet ).

I would consider the flower and photo, but I am sure she is a real girl, just with the possibility of an agenda. I have a total of 6 photos of her, all in different places and clothes. Quite normal pics, not model type.

Also, I will be in Kyiv next week - I will call her and see if she wants to meet and try to get a feeling if she is sincere or playing me.

If she wants to go shopping after coffee... well, you know

[LarsXYZ]

[user=686]info_man[/user] wrote:

Here is the letter and a photo of her. I am of course skeptical and has anyone here ever came across this lady from the Ukraine?

 

Hi info_ man as JB writes, you can use Google Advanced search (extra efficient) with various combinations, like full name as "exact phrase" + city etc:

http://www.google.com/advanced_search?hl=en

You can also check the email-header for an IP-adress, and check for location with Ripe/Arin etc.:

http://www.geektools.com/whois.php

If you need "more advanced tracking" capabilities, you can use Netscantools (not free):

http://www.netscantools.com/

http://www.netscantools.com/nstpro_whois.html


By these you can verify the location:)

regards Lars

[jb]

The point I was trying so badly to make is that free sites are a  scammer's feeding grounds.  Any woman contacted through such a  site should be suspect.

Peruse those sites with extreme caution.

[Phoenix]

The point I was trying so badly to make is that free sites are a scammer's feeding grounds.  Any woman contacted through such a site should be suspect.

Peruse those sites with extreme caution.

Agreed.

But I do believe you can find good ones there if you are smart, observant, and patient. I think common sense is the key, and if your instincts tell you something is wrong don't be too quick to dismiss the possibility no matter how beautiful she is. :cool:

[RacerX]

[user=118]jb[/user] wrote: jb is never wrong, sometimes mis-informed, but never wrong.

They haven't made Lamborghini [correct spelling] Diablos in about 5 years, so he's unlikely to have a "new" one.

[jb]

So I was mis-informed.... what's your point?

[Bruno]

The point I was trying so badly to make is that free sites are a scammer's feeding grounds.  Any woman contacted through such a site should be suspect.

Peruse those sites with extreme caution.

I am a ex owner of free sites and i can assure you that i was with a lower rate of scammer that some pay agency...

The problem is not free or pay site... it is automated site or site with some working people... the control of the add was my main work... But some site are fully automated, without any control before publish the add... in so situation, people are scammed before the add removed after several complain...

[TigerPaws]

[color="blue"][size="4"]Bruno,[/size][/color] [color="blue"] [/color]  [color="blue"][size="4"]

 While in principal I agree with you  the vast majority of free sites (and many of the agencies) are nothing but an  easy venue for scammers.[/size][/color]

[BillyB]

Don't you love when a woman ends her letter with "Kiss You!!!!!"? It'll make a man horny.

Sincere RW don't fall in love through letters with strangers. Only us men do that. The women that have written me with romantic words early on always ended up having issues. My fiancee didn't write anything romantic until after we commited to each other.  She didn't even write "Dear Billy" until her 46th letter. The more beautiful the woman is, the more letters they get from crazy men and the the more reason for them to not fall in love with a man over the internet. There will be plenty more kisses from a sincere woman after a relationship develops than one who kisses every stranger on the internet.

Move on and don't look back at that woman.

[Photo Guy]

Referring to himself in the third person, jb wrote:
jb is never wrong, sometimes mis-informed, but never wrong.

[size="3"][color="darkred"]He is often right on target, but..'Never wrong'?!  LOL 
...never without an over-inflated ego. Sure.[/color][/size][/b]

[bgreed]

BillyB,

I am beginning to somewhat dispute the "they don't fall in love with letters" theme just a little.  Especially after so recently having a falling out with a lady from Odessa.  All indicators are the she did fall in love with my letters, and is angry with me because I dated other women while in her city yet she would not break agency rules to meet me outside the agency so also is angry with herself for missed opportunity.  It shows in the letters I get from time to time and in what i have been able to glean from those on the ground that have spoken with her.

Now are they more warry about letting such a thing happen? yes.  Are they going to give their heart to someone they have never met? No.  But all in all they are human and like most of us hunger for affection.  So I have to take that carte blanche statement with a grain of salt.  Just my .02