Putin calls USA a parasite on the world economy!

[Faux Pas]

Why?
 
Who else would stay at Martha Vineyard's posh 28.8 acres complex the US taxpayers are paying for? This, during the arguably most tumultous economic state this country had ever seen since the depression.
 
It's definitely a far cry from the days of the Crawford / Santa Barbara ranches that were respectively owned by the then-presidents which the taxpayers didn't have to dole out for.

Do you suppose the First dog will fly to Martha's vineyard separately again? $10 bucks says it does

[GQBlues]

Do you suppose the First dog will fly to Martha's vineyard separately again? $10 bucks says it does

$10 bucks bet? Hell no...why don't I just write you a check now and quit with the formality, LOL.  I'm sure O is just getting in touch with his, eherm, white roots...even the black caucus aren't too happy with him hitting the predominantly white Midwest without a stop in Detroit before cooling toes with the Ralph Lauren and Calvin Klein clans apparently!
 
He's really in trouble now, LOL...
 
Btw, speaking of Perry, if it wasn't for him I almost forgot how quick Al Sharpton's and MSNBC's knee-jerk reaction can really be.

[Gator]

GQ and FP,
 
Show some sympathy.   Approval of Obama's handling of the U.S. economy has fallen to a new low of 26 percent. If you had the same approval ratings as Herbert Hoover, you too would need to get away.
 
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44182844/ns/politics-white_house/

[BC]

BC,
 
Meanwhile it would seem that Rick Perry would give you enough material.

Yeah Gator he sure does.

I'm trying to figure out how one 'created' all those jobs for TX and wants to do the same for the nation.  Unemployment is up and employment is down.

http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2011/08/15/perrys-employment-record-in-texas/

http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/rick-newman/2011/08/16/how-rick-perry-created-jobs-in-texas

are just clues.

I think he actually stole them from other states with low or no corporate taxes and incentives for companies to move there.

Net effect zero and only managed to increase cash flow a bit - no real profits.

He does look like the kinda guy that could get away with selling snake oil.

[Gator]

I'm trying to figure out how one 'created' all those jobs for TX and wants to do the same for the nation. I think he actually stole them from other states with low or no corporate taxes and incentives for companies to move there......
Net effect zero and only managed to increase cash flow a bit - no real profits.
 

Your charts and job growth are explained by Texas's oil resources and high number of illegal immigrants.

He does look like the kinda guy that could get away with selling snake oil.

Yes indeed, a  barker  at a carnival.  Nevertheless, he is not in Obama's class; Obama is smoother and could get away with selling a Ponzi scheme (as evidenced by the past two years   8 months). 

[Gator]

BC,
 
Merkel and Sarkozy met Tuesday.  They are the heads of two largest economies in EU.  They are the "rich" in the tax the "rich" solution.  They must provide the money to stop the economic crises in Europe from worsening. 
 
What happens after their meeting?  EU stock markets nose dive, led by EU banks.  Worse month at DAX in 10 years. Fears of recession seem well founded.  Even fears of contagion abound because the banks do not have the reserves.  American banks have reserves, yet fear lending  it to the EU banks.  This is bad situation for Europe, and it affects us too as we affected you in 2008-2009. 

[GQBlues]

Geeezz...Dow at -500; unemployment @ 10% (post stim bill); new jobless claim at 500,000; the bloodiest months in Afghanistan; S&P rating down; 26% approval rating; rampant liberal Congressional swindling and corruption; global contagion looming; inflation rising....
 
 
...and this empty suit have the audacity to call on another nation's president to step down? WTF? Can someone please tell this guy he's got his own issues to resolve here at home before he goes on peeking at the neighbor's home...
 
Talk about .

[GQBlues]

While the NMI report showed a fairly benign tally of -3% this month, the manufacturing index report however is getting badly beaten at nearly -31%. This is huge if you consider analysts had predicted a +3% showing. Consumer confidence Index at -34%, -12% in monthly comparisons when to compared to July of last month.
 
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-18/philadelphia-area-factory-index-falls-to-30-7-lowest-since-march-of-2009.html
 
This will undoubtedly 'add' MORE to the half a million jobless claim so far this month.
 
Change we can all definitely believe in. What a 'croc'!
 
 

[BC]

BC,
 
Merkel and Sarkozy met Tuesday.  They are the heads of two largest economies in EU.  They are the "rich" in the tax the "rich" solution.  They must provide the money to stop the economic crises in Europe from worsening. 
 
What happens after their meeting?  EU stock markets nose dive, led by EU banks.  Worse month at DAX in 10 years. Fears of recession seem well founded.  Even fears of contagion abound because the banks do not have the reserves.  American banks have reserves, yet fear lending  it to the EU banks.  This is bad situation for Europe, and it affects us too as we affected you in 2008-2009.

Gator,

for the common household in much of Europe, all these shenanigans mean little to them.  There are some fundamental differences between the US, Canada and even UK regarding personal debt vs other parts of EU.

Lets start from the bottom up.. the EU citizen

Payday loans - practically nonexistent
Overdraft - provided by bank based on employment, usually 1 to 2 months salary
Credit cards - usually paid off at the end of every month direct from bank account
Home 'revolving' refinancing - very rare
Refinancing for health, college
Student loans - not needed
Auto loans - a clunker will usually do, or one you saved for
Store credit cards - a few, but not commonly used
Credit card applications received in the mail not via your bank - very few
Credit card refinancing / consolidation offers - zero

http://www.cnbc.com/id/30438711/America_s_Biggest_Types_of_Personal_Debt?slide=1

savings rates

http://www.gfmag.com/tools/global-database/economic-data/10396-household-saving-rates.html#axzz1VOKpgVPP

In other words, I believe that EU citizens were not immune to a lot of credit thrown at them, but that the banks acted in a conservative manner and there is a hesitancy to use credit in the manner it is used by US citizens.

I think this presents a fundamental difference in perception by the general public as to stock markets and government debt - sure it's an issue, but does not become a personal one for most.

In the end, it means that in crisis, EU folks are a bit more capable of pulling in their spending belt without having to worry about conflicts serving their personal debt.

Right now there are probably a lot of US folks that due to the economic downturn have met the critical line where servicing personal debt reduces their ability to spend on other things.  We're talking middle to upper class folks, not the poor. This might be what is driving huge profits in the banking industry, but not in other economic sectors like services - a major part of the US economy.. thus resulting in higher unemployment.  The extra hundred bucks or so are spent paying interest rather than buying burgers.

This along with my long post a few pages back regarding EU pretty much describes the overall picture as I see it.

“They hear it on the news but for most Germans what they experience in their lives is completely different. The crisis is virtual,” said Renate Köcher, the institute’s director. “What’s decisive for most people is their own situation and for many people that has improved noticeably in the past three or four years.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/17/world/europe/17germany.html

The sentiments may not be as strong other places in EU, but it's certainly not depressing for most.

quello che sarà,sarà..

Aside, the US pumped gazillions of dollars into the financial system to recover, but those funds could no longer be pushed upon the US citizens already over extended with personal debt.. that is what I believe is causing the double dip in terms of economic growth and employment.  Trickle down doesn't work because too much trickled down before.

Look up terms like 'household debt vs disposable income', personal debt vs GDP and the likes.. the picture is not bright.  I'm convinced that it will be like this for some time to come.

[Gator]

BC,
 
You make many good points except that American banks do not make "huge profits," and Euro banks are depleting their reserves (i. e., running out of money).  Nevertheless, Euro personal debt is lower than in the US, so you have wiggle room.  The smarter heads are not predicting a recession (double dip).  The irrational stock market makes one wonder.
 
Returning to Rick Perry, this article describes an interesting situation that few Europeans would expect about the two biggest Republicans from Texas:
 
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/08/17/rick-perry-s-war-with-the-bushies-why-karl-rove-is-fighting-his-2012-bid.html

[BC]

You make many good points except that American banks do not make "huge profits," and Euro banks are depleting their reserves (i. e., running out of money). 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/30/financial-profits-percentage_n_841716.html

Also,

http://money.cnn.com/2011/04/29/news/companies/big-oil-gas-price-response/index.htm

after all, those that are still employed have to get to work...

Regarding politics, Rove etc, yeah.. it's a messy business but there are those that are big enough to turn a buck on that also.  Are there any credit default swaps on elections?

Business is like a whore.. start treating her nice and she'll be the first to turn on you.... 

[Gator]

 
BC,
 
Not all financial companies are banks.   American banks are recovering, but not yet back to 2007 (and 2006 was better IIRC).  Bank of America grabs much of the attention, making me perceive the situation is worse than actual numbers.
 
EPS for America's four largest commercial banks:
 
2007     2008      2009      2010
 
JPMorgan (more than a commercial bank, Chase  subsidiary is the commercial bank)
 
 

$4.38

$0.84

$2.66

$3.96

 
Bank of America (problems with mortgage portfolio)
 
 

$3.30

$0.55

-$0.29

-$0.37

 
Wells Fargo (one of best managed)
 
 

$2.38

$0.70

$1.75

$2.21

 
Citi (some problems, mainly international)
 
 

$7.17

-$64.24

-$7.61

$3.45

[BC]

BC,
 
Not all financial companies are banks. 

Gator,

my mistake.. I meant financial industry.

My bad.

In any case, banks are but monetary interlocutors, a 'front end' to the public or low end of financial hierarchy.  Chumps to be saved by the FDIC and sold with benefits to larger chumps.

Sorry if I sound so negative, but the more I dig in to the matter the more apparent the whole picture becomes... and it really stinks..

If one considers the Nation as an automobile, try to figure out who is really at the wheel...

Once you get to the top of the ladder, I think you will find it well in control of but a handfull of entities.  You don't see them, you don't hear about them but they are there.  World economies are but lemons, there to be squeezed, time and time again.  Turmoil on the ground is instigated and serves to enhance buying and selling opportunities.  They don't really give a crap which direction things are going as they win either way.

[SFandEE]

Change we can all definitely believe in. What a 'croc'!

There is a stubborn nature in many of the Hero RWD posters.  After over a hundred posts back and fourth about political corruption in the US and efforts to get Americans to see the US through the eyes of others such as Putin, I still see a post that mourns about the failure of a political campaign slogan as if things would be better with McCain/Palin.


The Republicans offer no improvements or change either.  Until we can remove corporate corruption out of our political system by having politicians accountable to Americans and not China, big oil, Wall St., and religion then there will be no change.


Having been a "true believing" conservative and surrounded by many I guess I have done what I can on this thread and maybe can just hope that the entrenched can be marginalized.  If we can't all agree that American politics is bought and corrupted we will never agree on how to move forward out of this mess and will be paddling around in circles to the left or to the right while we all go down the drain.


Is there an age someone is so closed minded that they can't embrace compromise or change.  I wonder if that type of personality is a good companion for FSUW.  Seems like that is what would be required for a successful relationship with a strong woman from a foreign culture.

[Gator]

There is a stubborn nature in many of the Hero RWD posters.  After over a hundred posts back and fourth about political corruption in the US and efforts to get Americans to see the US through the eyes of others such as Putin, I still see a post that mourns about the failure of a political campaign slogan as if things would be better with McCain/Palin.

McCain?  No one has been retrospective except for Obama who continues to blame Bush.  We must look to the future and that seems to be the general direction of this thread.
 
I find your comments about stubbornness among the RWD Hero members to be dismissive.  A really stubborn person is someone who will not consider a new idea, not even listen to information about the alternatives [Your comment about RW is hilarious because many RW can exhibit exactly the kind of stubborness I described]. 
 
We have the information we need - Obama's first three years in office.  I wanted Obama to succeed because America needed to pull itself up from a deep recession.  Instead, I have witnessed him fail and fail again.  And I am the stubborn one?!    Enough is enough.  Obama is not a new idea.  We need to focus on options in the form of candidates to lead us from this mess, and Obama is already eliminated based on his record in office.   
 
 
Regarding corruption, for sure our government would be ideal if lobbyists and donations and power brokers had no influence.  Is it reasonable to think such could happen?  Is it reasonable to believe political decisions would be better?  It is not bad to hear from those affected by government proposals. 

It seems the Tea Party is closer to that ideal than the other members of Congress.  Look at them - focused on a single issue with preconceived ideas of what it is needed.  They are not the answer IMO but I do admire their impetus for what they believe in.  However, if we suddenly reduced our debt, the austerity would harm an already sick economy.

[GQBlues]

There is a stubborn nature in many of the Hero RWD posters.  After over a hundred posts back and fourth about political corruption in the US and efforts to get Americans to see the US through the eyes of others such as Putin, I still see a post that mourns about the failure of a political campaign slogan as if things would be better with McCain/Palin.

Yes, I am definitely stubborn. So stubborn in fact I simply refuse to take a sip of that kool-aid. But my reality is I could give a rat’s arse whatever Putin sees, hear, or say. Besides, if he subscribed to the ‘Hope’ and ‘Change’ campaign, like the many gullible Americans did, then excuse me for my lack of compassion, OK?
 
As for the McCain/Palin speculation, however irrelevant that is to the present condition, and since things right now can’t possibly get any worse (unless you believe like Obama that it really isn’t that bad), the thought did occur to me once or twice that maybe this country would have been much, much better off. But, no matter where that sentiment is, it is hardly applicable and the only reality we now all realize is the one we’re all living in under the impotent leadership we currently have.
 

The Republicans offer no improvements or change either.

You mean that actually was an option? LOL. Where were you when the suited DCers were passing legislations like a used condom these past 2 years?
 

Until we can remove corporate corruption out of our political system by having politicians accountable to Americans and not China, big oil, Wall St., and religion then there will be no change.


Having been a "true believing" conservative and surrounded by many I guess I have done what I can on this thread and maybe can just hope that the entrenched can be marginalized.  If we can't all agree that American politics is bought and corrupted we will never agree on how to move forward out of this mess and will be paddling around in circles to the left or to the right while we all go down the drain.

Oh I agree with you about the problems of corruption. It's rampant. In the private AND public sectors. You were a bit stuck on the private sector on this thread when the real doozy were getting banged on the beltway. I thought I'd give you a little push, but chalk one up effort. You can't stop corruption on the private sector unless you first do so with your elected officials. Putin knows all about that I'm sure. It takes a parasite to understand another, you know.
 
As if the Daschle chapter wasn't enough of a cursory bell of things to come. Bling, bling! Why else do you think Alan Grayson changed parties after the inauguration? It's honey harvest time in DC, man. Thank goodness his district didn't send him back for an additional tour. You guys should've done the same in the Bay Area with Nancy. It's these scenarios that just repeats itself.
 
To quote a commander on a battlefield addressing his soldiers to maintain pose and directive under fire and survive..
 
"Don't get stuck on stupid"
 

Is there an age someone is so closed minded that they can't embrace compromise or change.  I wonder if that type of personality is a good companion for FSUW.  Seems like that is what would be required for a successful relationship with a strong woman from a foreign culture.

This is the most hilarious part of your post. Yes, I admit it! Apart from stubborness, I also refuse to be delusional! I realize the majority of MOBers don the delusional suit, but hey, I promise not to hold that against you. I feel good knowing you once had hope and you easily embrace change....

[GQBlues]

...To quote a commander on a battlefield addressing his soldiers to maintain pose and directive under fire and survive..
 
"Don't get stuck on stupid"...

Correction at press time...
 
It was General Honore during the post-Katrina mobilization of the feds and national guards.
 
 
 
LOL, still funny listening to the guy however.
 
 

[SFandEE]

?
 
Oh I agree with you about the problems of corruption. It's rampant. In the private AND public sectors. You were a bit stuck on the private sector on this thread when the real doozy were getting banged on the beltway. I thought I'd give you a little push, but chalk one up effort. You can't stop corruption on the private sector unless you first do so with your elected officials. Putin knows all about that I'm sure. It takes a parasite to understand another, you know.

I would and have never argued against or disagreed about the corruption in public interests exists as well too.  I would put forward first the Baby Boomers who have been the principal force over the past 50 years just by their size.  They voted for this and even to this date, regardless of party you will hear no politician discuss taking away Medicare or SS from a Baby Boomer.  All proposals are for changes to Gen X or younger.


My protest post is because flare ups of party persist.  I don't get why sniping at Obama is relevant to the parasite question.  He is part of the institutional problem, but I hear of no energy behind the concept of replacing him with a non-corrupt player or removing a Congress that is corrupt.


To me the politics of this thread is do you support business as usual or institutional change.  Institutional change is irrelevant to party, it will be about personality.  I see no one championing this platform--possibly Ron Paul, but only somewhat.


Both parties should put forward a candidate for whatever position that is supportive of removing finance from politics. 


So if Change is a funny platform then things will go on as usual.  Dismissing foreign leaders of consequence or people with different political beliefs is sadly a very olde (misspelled on purpose) tradition that will hopefully go away in a few years.  The sooner the better.  A corrupt America is a parasite on the world economy.  Americans should care and should be ashamed that we let it get this way, some of us with more votes over time than others.  Even if other nations are worse, it makes no difference.


http://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/2011/08/17/special-interests-are-big-backers-deficit-super-committee-members/

[BC]

Maybe what ails is too many checks and balances - so many that nothing real can get done.

If one considers the US politics as a closed system, maybe the second law of thermodynamics is prevailing and a state of equilibrium has been nearly reached.

The second law of thermodynamics is an expression of the tendency that over time, differences in temperature, pressure, and chemical potential equilibrate in an isolated physical system.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_law_of_thermodynamics

Early US politics up to the Constitution was during quite tumultuous times with many outside and inside influences so the goal was try and create a system of government that would allow a state of equilibrium. 

Maybe Separation of Powers was simply too successful.  The President, any President enjoys only the right to propose an agenda and either approve or veto laws passed by Congress.  In fact, as far as domestic policy goes, he/she can't do squat except veto what Congress spits out.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_presidential_vetoes is pretty interesting..

First term GW 0 Obama 2

Franklin Roosevelt made more vetoes than any other president in history. (635)This is partly because of the many new ideas for solutions to the problems caused by the Great Depression and World War II, and partly because he was elected to four terms.

  Obviously FDR made Congress work for him.  I bet they were hustling.

Putin obviously has somewhat of an edge when it comes to getting things done - maybe not so bad after all.

[SFandEE]

BC,


If you look at the US as I have been presenting--it's doing well too.  Big oil since 2000 fantastic, Wall St., record profits and the executives are paying themselves exceptional profits, health insurance same thing--rates escalating exponentially, war industry 3 debt wars, business is booming--inventories depleted and a lot of generals.


All of these counter to what Americans want.  So the answer is that the US government is serving its' masters just fine.  The US has its' own little oligopoly too.  Does not matter who is in office.  The hedge fund managers have hedged their politics.

[diverboy70]

In a bigger perspective this is probably the start of the end of the US dominace as the leading superpower in the world.
Historically this should be coming right about now anyway, just like all other dominant nations at some point in time has lost their world dominance. The huge and sometime very  unwise spending by the US in diferent parts of the world, acting as a "world police" is just speeding up this process. The Us is today at the verge of bankrupcy and "up and coming" nations like China and India are, rightly, questioning the US$ as a reference currency. Also the Us politcal system where the quarelling between Republicans and Democrats at the cost of the nations vital interests cant really be unterstood in those nations and cultures.
I think we in a 20 years perspective will see a shift of world leadership (at least financially) from the Us to the far east.
In my opinion what we see now is the death struggles of the Us as a super power. The country can not longer finance this status on it own and the rest of the world is not longer willing to finance it by very unsecure loans, since the shape of the Us economy is so bad.

[GQBlues]

....So if Change is a funny platform then things will go on as usual.....

Republicans/Democrats are nothing more than the Bloods/Crips in designer suits. They all aspire for the same color – green. The only difference between the two groups is the former gets lifetime pension while the latter gets life in prison. The irony is, there’s an injustice there somehow, believe or not.

Case in point I:

Madoff got 150 years in the slammer for scheming investors into giving him their monies on the front it’ll earn interest. He then takes a fraction of the money from the same pot (their own money) and sends them back small sums as investment returns. These investors believed they are actually earning dividends when in fact not one of them will ever see their entire monies ever again. When accounting was done of his entire scheme, it amounted to 20 billion dollars. So he got caught and justifiably, he’s in jail. Happy story.

But here’s the doozy.

GM (UAW) gets 50 billion of taxpayers’ bailout money in return for majority of GM’s stocks and the condition it’ll earn interest. GM takes a fraction of the money from the (bailout) pot and gives it back to the taxpayers (via Treasury for the ‘investors’: you and me and John Q Public) as payment (using our own money) towards the bailout fund. To add insult to injury, they not only had the State Treasury boasting how good a decision we made to ‘invest’ on GM, they also got their praise and blessings. Hell, GM even got a low-interest loan from the very same government (that’s still technically you, me and John Q Public) so they can re-tool their facilities to boot. If we never ‘see’ that 50 billion dollars again, which is highly likely, I’ll bet you all my worthless GM stocks no one will ever see a day in prison for this scheme.

But that’s not even the sad story here. The real sad story here is, John Q Public is simply stuck on stupid still hanging unto ‘hope’ and ‘change’. You can take the boys out of their Chicagos, but you just can’t take the politics out of these boys.

Change? We can’t change the color of our politicians. One and one is three. Blue and red is green. Come election time, ‘we’ need to listen and pay attention to the usual suspects. The change is in ‘us’. Not in these scumbags.

Case in point II:

Michelle Bachman proudly proclaimed recently that if she’s elected president (called herself President Bachman, LOL) she promised that the price of gasoline will be under $2.00/gal. Then, stuck on stupid, the crowd cheered and roared…



Yeah…it’s sounding more and more like the Obama train of ’08 - again and again. Lather, rinse, repeat.
 
“WE” need (to) change, man. We need to stop getting stuck on stupid.
 
As for Ron Paul, Maxx presented that to me last election. I admit knowing too little about him. Paul Ryan's name had been mentioned and my first thought was, any politician who sleeps in his DC office in a sleeping bag cause he stays up late 'working' couldn't be all that bad.
 
You think? 
 

[Muzh]

To me the politics of this thread is do you support business as usual or institutional change.
 

First, if you haven't figure it out yet I'll just tell you; it is business as usual. Get rid of the "socialist" and put in a "fascist."
 
Nothing will change. Why?
 

 Institutional change is irrelevant to party, it will be about personality. 

Personality. We vote for who is most electable, not most qualified.

[Muzh]

Putin obviously has somewhat of an edge when it comes to getting things done - maybe not so bad after all.

(sigh)
 
Putin has installed the same system that imploded the USSR.

[Muzh]

Paul Ryan's name had been mentioned and my first thought was, any politician who sleeps in his DC office in a sleeping bag cause he stays up late 'working' couldn't be all that bad.
 
You think? 

Going back to personality and appearances. Is he qualified? You think a person who proposes to eliminate safety nets, at a time where they are most needed, that could result in an uprising (a la London) is qualified to lead the nation?