A piece of good advice, anybody?

[Sophocles]

Well before I received Pseudomene's latest letter (last week), I had started applying some thought to the material at hand, and had come up with the following hypothesis:

(a) I had not been corresponding with Pseudomene, but with an interpreter (or two) from her agency in Melitopol. She (they) wrote all the letters and also pretended to be Pseudomene on the Anastasia chat.

(b) This interpreter (these interpreters) had access to Pseudomene's photos.

(c) I had not been talking to the real Pseudomene on the phone, but to the interpreter.

(d) The agency pays Pseudomene in return for the use of her name and her pictures.

(e) The real Pseudomene is aware of the fact that her name and her pictures are used, but doesn't care and has no time to follow the correspondence (with who knows who many men), and would probably not know who I am if I called her at her office in Melitopol (I managed to find this number without "her" help or knowledge.)

(f) The reason for Pseudomene's (i.e., the interpreter's) refusal to leave the Anastasia chat is money. (She agreed to chat elsewhere, but then "forgot" about it.)

(g) The reason for her (i.e., the interpreter's) refusal to talk on Skype is that the game would then be revealed. (She says she has no webcam.)

This was my hypothesis, and I decided to test it by calling her at her office on her birthday last week.

(To be continued.)

[Muzh]

Sopho, no offense meant, but why on Earth, if you already suspect all this, you don't move on somewhere else instead of wasting your time?

[ML]

Sopho, no offense meant, but why on Earth, if you already suspect all this, you don't move on somewhere else instead of wasting your time?

Probably by now it is like a detective story for him and he wants to 'solve' the case.

[Sophocles]

So I decided to call Pseudomene at her Melitopol office to wish her a happy birthday. The alternatives were clear: (a) If I recognize her voice (and she mine), then my hypothesis would be wrong; (b) If we don't recognize each other's voices, then I may regard my hypothesis as more or less correct. Whatever would happen, I could wish her a happy birthday.

She gets on the phone. I introduce myself in the same way as when calling her (or the agency interpreter) before. I don't recognize her voice. She doesn't recognize mine. I ask her if she knows who I am and if we have talked before. She refuses to answer. She is just upset that I have found her work number ("where did you get this number?") and refuses to discuss anything that is not work-related. (The person I have been corresponding with has gladly written me e-mails and initiated chats with me from her office; and just a few days before this phone call she wrote to tell me how much she missed my voice; well of course: she is, after all, my "Ukrainian girl".) After maybe one minute she hangs up on me without saying good bye - I didn't even find opportunity to wish her a happy birthday.

I now thought my hypothesis was confirmed at least in the main points.

A few hours after the phone call I got a new mail from the person claiming to be Pseudomene. She didn't mention our phone call at all - not even the slightest hint. It was in this mail she told me how she was afraid of losing me and that she still wants to meet me, but not until mid-December.

I answered her, once more, and told her that I can come to see her in Melitopol in mid-December. I also reminded her of the necessity of talking on Skype (she "forgot" about that detail, once again, in her mail.) I didn't mention the phone call but wished her a happy birthday. I attached a photo of a birthday present: two nice espresso cups from Caffè Sant'Eustachio in Rome, still wrapped up in plastic. "Only your hands can open it."

I haven't heard from her again. Maybe she decided to take the present and run.

[SteveOR]

 
So I'm confused.
 
What's your goal again?
 
Meet her - Why?  She's not interested and Boris only wants your money.
 
Loose money - OK, it's yours to loose.
 
Waste your time - Again, yours to waste.
 
Prove us wrong - Then why did you ask for advice?  Trolling maybe?
 
Entertain us - Cool.  The clueless are always so much fun to watch.
 
 

[Sophocles]

So I'm confused.
 
What's your goal again?
 
Meet her - Why?  She's not interested and Boris only wants your money.
 
Loose money - OK, it's yours to loose.
 
Waste your time - Again, yours to waste.
 
Prove us wrong - Then why did you ask for advice?  Trolling maybe?
 
Entertain us - Cool.  The clueless are always so much fun to watch.

You are confused? I am so sorry. My goal? To know the truth. Meet her? No. Lose money? No. Waste my time? Finding the truth is a good way to use one's time. Prove you wrong? No. Entertain you? No way - I don't understand the American sense of humour (as far as I know it from TV); I prefer the British one any time (even if I am not British myself).

[Vincenzo]

So, you pay $7 to open letters from a lady who doesn't want to deal with you, you pay $7 to send her birthday postcards.

Then you want to spend thousands to travel to her. Yes, she'll be dragged by interpreters to the first date. Then she'll feel ill for the week that you stay there.

In a year, you'll still find her chatting at 4am Ukrainian time while she has a day time job.

[Eduard]

Then she'll feel ill for the week that you stay there.

This is where you may be wrong, Vincenzo! It's just as likely that her poor old mama will become gravely ill that week, and the girl will have to spend all the time at her bedside while the OP is visiting. Happens all the time! 

[Sophocles]

So, you pay $7 to open letters from a lady who doesn't want to deal with you, you pay $7 to send her birthday postcards.

Then you want to spend thousands to travel to her. Yes, she'll be dragged by interpreters to the first date. Then she'll feel ill for the week that you stay there.

In a year, you'll still find her chatting at 4am Ukrainian time while she has a day time job.

LOL. What's the matter with you guys? Can't you understand a text written in your own language? If you don't care to read and understand, then why comment at all?

[Jumper]

ed--
or she would meet him and take him shopping..
nice reastuarants and the taxi fees and interpreter , even the wait staff at the restuarant might each get a small cut of the increased pricing..
 
 
to the OP-
 
You called her at work, she isn't interested and you know the very common agency scenario.
 
Why you would feel the need to confirm any *truths* is beyond me.
 
It wont change the corrupted system,
such business models are intentionally built around an easy means to distance the business ,from any shananigans you think you can *prove*.
 
I can tell you from  experience in the FSU, that all your suspicians in general about such agenciers are true.
A truth,that many have already told you,  you seem to be trying to *confirm*.
 
This scenario has played out  countless times.
Even certain cities better known for it.
Odessa, Nikolaev, Melitopol probably now top the list
(I'd add poltova,kherson  and zap as well as many others.)
 
I understand yiour enthusiam, but there's little need to confirm an already  well known scenario.
 
Your time would be better used researching genuine women, than confirming that this particular situation *fits*.
 
 
 
  It is good that you shared another good example of this ruse
as a warning for others...
 
 
 just advise you to move on to better methods... which I'm sure you will
 
 
 
 

[Sophocles]

Why you would feel the need to confirm any *truths* is beyond me.

Well, you see, as one of my older colleagues put it:

“He who grasps everything himself is best of all; he is noble also who listens to one who has spoken well; but he who neither grasps it himself nor takes to heart what he hears from another is a useless man.”

[jeancarlos_fer]

Thanks Sophocles for your interesting post.
I have found it useful and educational.
It shows the clear process from the doubts when the initial red flags appeared, then your seek for advise and the resolution and closure you have found by uncovering the scam all the way.
Although it might seems an obvious move for the hardened guys by the experience in this matters, for people not used to such elaborated schemes, falling in that web could have devastating consequences.

Good luck in your search!

[JR]

LOL. What's the matter with you guys? Can't you understand a text written in your own language? If you don't care to read and understand, then why comment at all?

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.
Me thinks he came here not seeking truth but re-inforcements )))
Livin the dream...take the blue pill.......

[kmin]

How to run a scam 101;

1. Get the victim emotionally invested by;
   a.  Playing to his/her needs and deep emotional desires (in this case lonely old man who is at the end of his life looking to get married to his dream girl

2.  Groom the victim into habit
   a.  Start with simple small amounts of money, money to join club, money to chat, money to write, money to talk....

3.  Continue baiting the fish along by;
   a.  Give a little more each time, use stronger terms like; only one, love, marriage, children, wonderful future...

4.  Try to delay and stretch out the scam as long as possible by;
   a.  Making up delays which also provide #3,  oh I was sick, my phone doesn't work, relative is sick....

5.  When the gig is up and the scam is exposed get;
   a.  Angry with the victim, tell them "how can you say such things to me, I thought you really liked me, I can't believe you are such a cheep guy, etc.....

6.   When that fails than just keep trolling the victim along to soak up all the money you can.  If you can keep them going for a few more letters and phone calls, that could be another $100.....   Chump change right.  WRONG bread and butter, if they can do this to 100 guys they just picked up another $100,000, chances are they do this to a 1,000 guys so this part of the scam nets them another $1,000,000 a year.


BUT don't let this little issue get you down.  There are great women out there, but be realistic about your search.  Go for girls who are in your age range, ones you are attracted to, but are not out of reach for you.  Also use sites and talk to women in ways that cost NO MONEY AT ALL.

I personally have had many scams played on me, but I was lucky enough to spot them right away with out loosing one cent.   

I also have used freepersonals.ru and without spending one penny I have met a wonderful woman who is a great match for me and I am a great match for her.  I will be on my way to see her in January for the first time.  With her I have had nothing but green flags;

1. No Agency

2. Free Dating Site

3. She only posted to one site freepersonals.ru and we started talking the first week she was on the site. (also there was not one sexy picture of her on her profile, think "bait-ing-suit" and not bathing-suit)

4. With-in two or three emails we were talking on Video Skype

5. She never asked for money for anything, (in fact it was the opposite, when talking to her about the flat I needed she seem stressed out about the price range I was asking for.  When I asked her why she said she didn't think she could afford so much for the flat for me.  I told her that it was my trip and I would pay for the flat and that she would not have to pay for it.)

6. We have plans to meet her friends and family while there.

7. With-in the first week of talking on Skype she gave me her real cell phone number.  I sent her a text while on Skype and she received it so I know it was her cell phone number.

8. A little while after the phone number we became friends on Facebook and she gave me her real address.

Well I think you get the idea, there are more green flags I have from her, but also remember the lack of a green flag or the presence of one or two red flags doesn't mean she is a scam.  If there are three or more red flags, drop that guy quick.

Remember that you have a PhD, but not in psychology, those who run Anastasiscam dot com do have a bunch of PhD's in psychology. 

[Vincenzo]

2. Free Dating Site

Free websites also have their own problems.

People lie more in their profiles. A woman can "forget" about her 3 children. A man can put a 10-year-old photo.

[kmin]

Free websites also have their own problems.

People lie more in their profiles. A woman can "forget" about her 3 children. A man can put a 10-year-old photo.

That is why it is so important to start talking on a video chat like Skype right away.  Chances are if you talk enough you will get to see what she looks like.  It also lets her see you too, so she knows you aren't using a 10 year old photo.  Free sites and Pay for Sites both have fakes.  But with a free site you know they are not there to get you paying for use of the dating site like you have with anti-stays-a-scam. 

Also by video Skype, if you have enough social experience, you should be able to pick up on body language (facial expressions).  After a 100 hours of video talking you will know how much this girl is actually into you.

IMHO  pay by letter dating site has 80-90% fakes, absolute free dating site has 8-10% fakes.   

[JR]

You are confused? I am so sorry. My goal? To know the truth. Meet her? No. Lose money? No. Waste my time? Finding the truth is a good way to use one's time. Prove you wrong? No. Entertain you? No way - I don't understand the American sense of humour (as far as I know it from TV); I prefer the British one any time (even if I am not British myself).

LOL, the truth is that you aren't smart enough to see what is right in front of you

[Sophocles]

LOL, the truth is that you aren't smart enough to see what is right in front of you

The truth is this: many Americans are not as smart as they think they are.

[Gator]

The truth is this: many Americans are not as smart as they think they are.

I don't believe Americans have a monopoly on this. 

[Sophocles]

I don't believe Americans have a monopoly on this. 

Yes, Gator, looking at JR's comments above I can understand you feel the urge to underline this.