I think I just officially became "old"

[noelscot]

Well, 33 years young. lol.
I’ve never been married, but I wanted to express some general thoughts I have on marriage to the Russian ladies on the board.  So tell me how this all sounds to you?



Marriage is not a business relationship. In a business relationship, the business partners contribute 50-50 to a joint venture (at least, in an ideal business partnership). A marriage can become very bitter if the partners behave like greedy money-lenders, not a husband and wife, tallying up every little shortcoming of the other person.


Married people become ONE person. That’s the whole traditional symbolism of a wedding ring-it’s a link in the chain of two people who are chained together. Marriage requires thinking in terms of “we,” not “I.”


Marriage is the most serious contract a person can enter. In the main, both people should listen very carefully to the words of the marriage vows before saying “I do”: “I, N., take you, N., to be my husband/wife. I promise to be true to you in good times and in bad, in sickness and in health. I will love you and honor you all the days of my life.”


That’s all I have for now, maybe I can think of more later.

[Ade]

There are men that will never understand equality and parity in a healthy relationship of equals. Some men, like BillyB for instance, have a weird and distorted view that goes something like this*; in a marriage of "equals" everything is split 50% down the middle. You have to split up "duties" and chores equally and you have to "keep count" to make sure each are doing their "fair share". You have to have meetings and discussions on every decision. If you disagree, you'll get nothing done as no one is the "leader" to force the issue. And woe betide anyone if they don't do their fair share, as there will be arguments and much gnashing of teeth, possibly leading to divorce proceedings and/or DV charges.

Men like that don't understand that it has nothing to do with 50%. You give 100%. And so does your partner. If you marry someone that you are compatible with, there is no fuss or struggle, no competition about who leads or who takes out the trash. It's a cooperative effort based on trust, respect and compromise from both. Like two pieces in a puzzle, you just fit with no effort at all. The controllers, the insecure, the egomaniacs and dominators will never understand though. But that's okay, for every dominator, there is a broken person that feels the need to be dominated.


*Derived from the ravings of BillyB

[Nat]

Well, 33 years young. lol.
I’ve never been married, but I wanted to express some general thoughts I have on marriage to the Russian ladies on the board.  So tell me how this all sounds to you?

In general I have a feeling that you sound a bit negative about the whole idea in general As if you think you MUST get married but you don't really wanna do it Am I correct?
And, honey, 33 is not old. It's a middle age crisis, that's all When you turn 35, you'll feel young again

[GoodOlBoy]

Marriage is the most serious contract a person can enter.

Yeah, I thought the same as you until I became a Father. 
 
GOB

[noelscot]

In general I have a feeling that you sound a bit negative about the whole idea in general As if you think you MUST get married but you don't really wanna do it Am I correct?
And, honey, 33 is not old. It's a middle age crisis, that's all When you turn 35, you'll feel young again

Actually, no. I think marriage is a good thing, but I think people have messed it up by not taking it seriously.
I do not feel that I must get married, but I would like to find the right girl and see what happens.
In the main, my feeling is that marriage is good, but very serious.

[Shadow]

Actually, no. I think marriage is a good thing, but I think people have messed it up by not taking it seriously.
I do not feel that I must get married, but I would like to find the right girl and see what happens.
In the main, my feeling is that marriage is good, but very serious.

Marriage should be taken serious, but what should be taken more serious is the task to find someone that makes you feel you want to get married.
" The right girl"  does not exist, strange as it may seem. A number of women are compatible with you to the extent that you may consider marriage. However to find one of them you need to look seriously for a life partner, not a piece of decoration with some added benefits.

[noelscot]

Marriage should be taken serious, but what should be taken more serious is the task to find someone that makes you feel you want to get married.
" The right girl"  does not exist, strange as it may seem. A number of women are compatible with you to the extent that you may consider marriage. However to find one of them you need to look seriously for a life partner, not a piece of decoration with some added benefits.

So I reckon you are saying that the journey is more important than the destination. Ditto about looking for a life partner.

[Shadow]

So I reckon you are saying that the journey is more important than the destination. Ditto about looking for a life partner.

Marriage is not a destination, it is the beginning.

[mies]

Well, 33 years young. lol.
I’ve never been married, but I wanted to express some general thoughts I have on marriage to the Russian ladies on the board.  So tell me how this all sounds to you?

for me marriage is the social contract that makes other members of society respect the relationship between me and my partner. For example, when I come to the border officer at the airport with my boyfriend - they tell me: "you should each come individually" but when I do the same with a boyfriend whom i married an hour ago - it is already OK to approach the officer together. Small thing, one would think, but makes a big difference in terms of how people perceive your couple.
I do not believe that the ring makes it special, nor in symbolism bs. about "one person", "two halves made one" and the likes. I am complete person already. I am not a half, nor do I look for any halves. I want to have a complete person as my partner. I also do not believe in the wows that we say at the church or anywhere else. Given the divorce rates, at least half of all newly weds lie at the altar.
In some way, marrying a person is a proof we give to our partner that we found our "perfect one" and we aren't looking for anyone else, that we trust our partner, want to share the life with our partner, and aren't planning on breaking up in the nearest time, and hopefully - never. 
On the other hand, it's a two-edge sword. Say, you take too long to marry your gf, clearly it sends her a signal that you do not perceive her as "the one" and that you are looking for someone better, or that you do not plan to stay with her in a long-term. Most of women would drop you in such circumstances. Because why does she need to waste her life on a person who does not take her seriously or for whom she isn't important enough?

Marriage also makes it much easier with the kid-related matters.
All other considerations, money, contributions, work, etc. - can vary from couple to couple.

Now, back to your "selling speech" - I think it sounds fine. If you put it on your profile or will write in the letters to russian women, they will probably be smitten right away with the fact that you really are a marriage-minded man, and that you think in proper way.

If I were single and received such letter, I would probably be somewhat skeptical: about you, and about the sincerity of your letter. 

[noelscot]

for me marriage is the social contract that makes other members of society respect the relationship between me and my partner. For example, when I come to the border officer at the airport with my boyfriend - they tell me: "you should each come individually" but when I do the same with a boyfriend whom i married an hour ago - it is already OK to approach the officer together. Small thing, one would think, but makes a big difference in terms of how people perceive your couple.
I do not believe that the ring makes it special, nor in symbolism bs. about "one person", "two halves made one" and the likes. I am complete person already. I am not a half, nor do I look for any halves. I want to have a complete person as my partner. I also do not believe in the wows that we say at the church or anywhere else. Given the divorce rates, at least half of all newly weds lie at the altar.
In some way, marrying a person is a proof we give to our partner that we found our "perfect one" and we aren't looking for anyone else, that we trust our partner, want to share the life with our partner, and aren't planning on breaking up in the nearest time, and hopefully - never. 
On the other hand, it's a two-edge sword. Say, you take too long to marry your gf, clearly it sends her a signal that you do not perceive her as "the one" and that you are looking for someone better, or that you do not plan to stay with her in a long-term. Most of women would drop you in such circumstances. Because why does she need to waste her life on a person who does not take her seriously or for whom she isn't important enough?

Marriage also makes it much easier with the kid-related matters.
All other considerations, money, contributions, work, etc. - can vary from couple to couple.

Now, back to your "selling speech" - I think it sounds fine. If you put it on your profile or will write in the letters to russian women, they will probably be smitten right away with the fact that you really are a marriage-minded man, and that you think in proper way.

If I were single and received such letter, I would probably be somewhat skeptical: about you, and about the sincerity of your letter.

Whoah, nelly. I'm not advertising my opinions on marriage on any online profiles, nor am I developing a sales pitch. I happen to truly believe what I wrote. I would never broach the subject of marriage to a woman I do not know in real life. Marriage is a very serious matter, and I would date a lady for a long while, get to know her and her family, make sure she felt the same about marrying, then ask her father to give her away. I'm admittedly old-fashioned.
This is a side-note to another point you have made: about those who wait too long to ask their girlfriend to take their hand in marriage. I know a girl (in real life) who is, by all accounts, a perfect 10 with one of the sweetest personalities ever. Her boyfriend has been dating her for 4 years, still no proposal. I wonder how long is too long to wait to propose? Because there is a fine line between the sublime and the ridiculous, and time is relative to some people.
 
 
 
 

[pitbull]

This is a side-note to another point you have made: about those who wait too long to ask their girlfriend to take their hand in marriage. I know a girl (in real life) who is, by all accounts, a perfect 10 with one of the sweetest personalities ever. Her boyfriend has been dating her for 4 years, still no proposal. I wonder how long is too long to wait to propose? Because there is a fine line between the sublime and the ridiculous, and time is relative to some people.
 
 
 
 

I remember reading somewhere, that the timeline is up to 2 years after a couple became exclusive. Also, time has a different value for a man and woman in this situation (provided both are in their 20s and want to have children some day).
 
On a general topic of marriage  - I hate to sound like a broken record, but once again - what Ade said 

[IAmZon]

33 !!   Time for some tough love.

You are too young to even be on this board:)

Grab your sack and pull till it hurts kid, you probably have not begun to live yet in business, in love, in life.  I don't mean to be disrespectful ... but, I have learned that life is a marathon, not a sprint.  I fought my first fight - in a ring - after the age of 45. Over the last 3 years, I have totally recreated my perspective and orientation with women.  Damn boy! I learned to party all over again (and am much better now that I was at 33)

So, buck up!  Feel no pressure with the clock.  Just try to make yourself the best you can be in every way .... then, things have a way of working out for the best

[OlgaH]

I have learned that life is a marathon, not a sprint.

I apologize for a particular word in the quote below in advance, but I really love our famous Russian actress Faina Ranyevskaya, she was not only a talented actress but a talented cynic too  (Sometimes her phrases put the Soviet authorities in a shock).   
http://russia-ic.com/people/general/r/166

"Life is a free-fall jump from a pus-y to a grave..."

So enjoy your free-fall jump, watch the wind and keep the balance 

[Muzh]

I'll try to give you my perspective. Now keep in mind that at 33, marriage was the last thought in my head. TOO MUCH FUN.
 
It would do you better if you would wipe the fairy dust from your eyes.
 
Most probably you will make the final decision with your little head. Not really a problem. The problem resides in the amount of work you'll have to put into this for it to work.
 
If you have the patience and stamina, you'll do fine.
 
Bottom line, choose well.
 
Ooops, more work you have to do.
 
Carry on.
 
Sheesh, 33.

[Aloe]

Well, 33 years young. lol.
I’ve never been married, but I wanted to express some general thoughts I have on marriage to the Russian ladies on the board.  So tell me how this all sounds to you?



Marriage is not a business relationship. In a business relationship, the business partners contribute 50-50 to a joint venture (at least, in an ideal business partnership). A marriage can become very bitter if the partners behave like greedy money-lenders, not a husband and wife, tallying up every little shortcoming of the other person.


Married people become ONE person. That’s the whole traditional symbolism of a wedding ring-it’s a link in the chain of two people who are chained together. Marriage requires thinking in terms of “we,” not “I.”


Marriage is the most serious contract a person can enter. In the main, both people should listen very carefully to the words of the marriage vows before saying “I do”: “I, N., take you, N., to be my husband/wife. I promise to be true to you in good times and in bad, in sickness and in health. I will love you and honor you all the days of my life.”


That’s all I have for now, maybe I can think of more later.

That is a very poor description. You start out right off the bat with the NEGATIVE. and you finish with a kind of a negative warning. Leaves a bad aftertaste, imo. When you wanna describe something that you find GOOD, you should focus on the positive and what people DO do in a marriage, instead of what they DON'T do. Otherwise you come off as someone hurt and on rebound.

[noelscot]

That is a very poor description. You start out right off the bat with the NEGATIVE. and you finish with a kind of a negative warning. Leaves a bad aftertaste, imo. When you wanna describe something that you find GOOD, you should focus on the positive and what people DO do in a marriage, instead of what they DON'T do. Otherwise you come off as someone hurt and on rebound.

What did I write about marriage that was negative?
Good is what you like, bad is what you don't like.
Perhaps good is a matter of perspective.
Let's re-cap: I said that marriage was 1) not a business relationship, but rather a life partnership, 2) marriage is a very serious contract worthy of well-thought out decision making, and 3) married people should think in terms of "we," not "I" because they become one person.




 

[noelscot]

I'll try to give you my perspective. Now keep in mind that at 33, marriage was the last thought in my head. TOO MUCH FUN.
 
It would do you better if you would wipe the fairy dust from your eyes.
 
Most probably you will make the final decision with your little head. Not really a problem. The problem resides in the amount of work you'll have to put into this for it to work.
 
If you have the patience and stamina, you'll do fine.
 
Bottom line, choose well.
 
Ooops, more work you have to do.
 
Carry on.
 
Sheesh, 33.

What fairy dust, specifically? (I'm not trying to be a smart ass.)
Most of what I wrote is stuff I read in the Bible and learned from marriage counselors (pastors).
None of it is original, but I agree with the main points.

[noelscot]

33 !!   Time for some tough love.

You are too young to even be on this board:)

Grab your sack and pull till it hurts kid, you probably have not begun to live yet in business, in love, in life.  I don't mean to be disrespectful ... but, I have learned that life is a marathon, not a sprint.  I fought my first fight - in a ring - after the age of 45. Over the last 3 years, I have totally recreated my perspective and orientation with women.  Damn boy! I learned to party all over again (and am much better now that I was at 33)

So, buck up!  Feel no pressure with the clock.  Just try to make yourself the best you can be in every way .... then, things have a way of working out for the best

Are you saying it's just a bunch of old grouchy dudes on this board? Surely you jest. lol
Did you win your boxing match?

[Daveman]

What did I write about marriage that was negative?
Good is what you like, bad is what you don't like.
Perhaps good is a matter of perspective.
Let's re-cap: I said that marriage was 1) not a business relationship, but rather a life partnership, 2) marriage is a very serious contract worthy of well-thought out decision making, and 3) married people should think in terms of "we," not "I" because they become one person.

"Mawwage is wat bwings us togevah today... Mawwage, dat bwessed awwangement....  "




if #1 is true then 3) they become one team of individually based strengths and weaknesses, and yes, the 'relationship' or 'team' has characteristics ---  basically there are periods of perceived "oneness" also know as confluence but living in that state is rather impossible unless #1 is false in which case one completely loses self identity into an almost fetish like realization or 'worship' of the Relationship Deity.  blah blah... blather blather... insert hot air icon here... 


A nice romantic notion but a dreamy self set-up for a rude awakening.  Eyes open there on the last one and you'll be fine...  just make sure #2 includes not only lUUuuulUUUuuv, but also compatibility in the little things..  if you're not compatible in the little things, about the only thing love will conquer is you...

[Muzh]

What fairy dust, specifically? (I'm not trying to be a smart ass.)
Most of what I wrote is stuff I read in the Bible and learned from marriage counselors (pastors).
None of it is original, but I agree with the main points.

Relax, I didn't take you for a smart ass. 
 
There is a big difference between the theoretical and the practical in this case.
 
So my advice to you is to spend the time finding a woman who thinks excatly like you. IF she is not exactly like you, then you'll have to work hard at it for both to reach a compromise. It is THAT simple.
 
Good luck.

[Muzh]

"Mawwage is wat bwings us togevah today... Mawwage, dat bwessed awwangement....  "

 

C'mon Dave, let's be nice. He asked an honest question.

A nice romantic notion but a dreamy self set-up for a rude awakening.  Eyes open there on the last one and you'll be fine...  just make sure #2 includes not only lUUuuulUUUuuv, but also compatibility in the little things..  if you're not compatible in the little things, about the only thing love will conquer is you...

Hmm, rude awakening. I'd say you are 50% wrong. 
 
Romantic notions is what worked for the both of us. However, you are 100% correct with the compatibility concept. My wife and I were two romantic fools so we were very compatible.
 
My point was and is, he'll have to work very hard to make a wise choice.

[Daveman]

C'mon Dave, let's be nice. He asked an honest question.

Yes he did... I didn't actually intend that to come across like it must have... it was a "quote" from The Princess Bride which suddenly popped into mind that I found humorous.  Hey, if all my jokes were actually even remotely along the lines of something like ... being funny... I'd be eating a LOT more prime rib!

Hmm, rude awakening. I'd say you are 50% wrong.   

ahhh, it's a good day!  now If I had ONLY a 50% screwup ratio... 

Romantic notions is what worked for the both of us. However, you are 100% correct with the compatibility concept. My wife and I were two romantic fools so we were very compatible.
 
My point was and is, he'll have to work very hard to make a wise choice.

Well, Muzh, we'll just have to agree to agree on that last one...   

[noelscot]

Relax, I didn't take you for a smart ass. 
 
There is a big difference between the theoretical and the practical in this case.
 
So my advice to you is to spend the time finding a woman who thinks excatly like you. IF she is not exactly like you, then you'll have to work hard at it for both to reach a compromise. It is THAT simple.
 
Good luck.

Sage advice.

[noelscot]

In case I was too sappy, here's a more cynical account of marriage for the house ghouls:

[Erwin]

Noelscott,
 
Think about this one:
 
I, (name), take you, (name), to be my [opt: lawfully wedded] (husband/wife), my constant friend, my faithful partner and my love from this day forward. In the presence of God, our family and friends, I offer you my solemn vow to be your faithful partner in sickness and in health, in good times and in bad, and in joy as well as in sorrow. I promise to love you unconditionally, to support you in your goals, to honor and respect you, to laugh with you and cry with you, and to cherish you for as long as we both shall live.

Best,
 
E