How to get started when it comes to looking for an Ukrainian woman?

[Hughtheo]

Hello all,

I have been to Odessa once. Long story but I have been exchanging letters with several ladies off www.mypartnerforever.net and finally decided to book a flight.

What totally put me off was the fact that there was no communication possible without a translator being present. I had hoped for some basic understanding of English, but there was none. I only met 2 girls and cancelled a third date out of frustration.

In fact, I shortened my visit to just 3 days and returned to London. I found it absolutely staggering that all of my contacts seemed to be prepared to leave Ukraine for the right man who in most cases with be from an English-speaking country. None of them had made the slightest effort to get a basic understanding of English.

What is the best way forward? I am inclined to make "good or excellent knowledge of English" one of my search parameters.

[ML]

Welcome.  Yes, many (most) of the guys here screen for minimum English skills and will not meet women where translator will be needed.  However, some notable exceptions to this criteria as a very few guys know enough Russian and some others don't mind working through a translator.

Quite surprised that you didn't learn of the women's lack of English until you were one the ground.  Some lack of planning and awareness on your part?  This pursuit does take some planning and operational skills somewhat akin to a military operation or acquisition/merger analysis.

[ML]

Plan for your next trip.

First, avoid all agencies and any websites that require pay per contacting each woman and/or pay per each letter.

Instead go here:

http://singles.ru/
http://www.luckylovers.net/
http://www.rbrides.com/
http://www.ukrainedate.com/
http://www.allsinglerussiangirls.com/
http://freepersonals.ru/
http://bride.ru/
http://fdating.com
http://www.1vipdating.com/
http://freeukrainianwomen.com/
http://okfreedating.net/
http://luckylifepartner.com/

The below are in Russian language.
 
 http://www.edarling.ru/
 http://vmireznakomstv.ru/
 http://www.your-ideal.com/
 http://www.24open.ru/
 http://loveplanet.ru/
 http://www.maybe.ru/
 http://znakomstva-sitelove.ru/

Go to the above free and monthly cost ($19-30) dating websites.  Make up a nice profile of yourself.  Use the search engines to find about 800 - 1,000 women who are in the age range you want and have the education, height, weight, language, children, drinking, smoking, etc., parameters that you desire and are in a single target geographical area.

Do this screening first rather than look at pictures first.  After you have done the screening; then look at the pictures.

When you are two months away from your trip departure time, then start sending out your first message.

Send a generic but well written introductory message to all with each individual name typed at the top.

Of those  who reply, filter out all who make you worry in any way or give you concerns.

Send second generic but well written letter to all with their individual names typed at the top.  Modify it a bit to answer any questions that an individual woman may have asked.  Yes, this takes a lot of time.

Repeat these procedures over about 6-8 weekly emails and you will have narrowed down your list to 15-30 gals.  You can continue to use a generic letter for each successive mailing, but be sure to modify it a bit to answer specific questions any gal may have asked and to ask specific questions of your own related to the family, interests, jobs, etc., of each individual woman.  Yes, this takes a lot of time, but each week you will be cutting your list down. 

Finalize your trip plans and start scheduling the women into time slots.

If you follow the above procedure, you will not have the need to ask us questions about scammers, etc., as you will have filtered out all scammers.  And if any of the women you are writing to give you any sheeeeet or cause you any concern at all, or ask for money for ANYTHING you simply drop them off your lists and continue on.

[Hughtheo]

Quite surprised that you didn't learn of the women's lack of English until you were one the ground.  Some lack of planning and awareness on your part?  This pursuit does take some planning and operational skills somewhat akin to a military operation or acquisition/merger analysis.

I'm certainly to blame for blindly trusting the girls' linguistic self assessment. I should have known better .

You are right, better planning would have prevented this disappointment.

Then again, I somewhat hoped that there would be an effort on the girls' part to communicate directly with me. Well, lesson learned.

 

[Donna_Pedro]

Hughtheo
 
I understand your frustration. But why didn’t you ask for their phone numbers? Why didnt you use Skype?  These are two good "filters” which you can use to determine 1. Level of English proficiency 2. If you even like the girl's appearance. It can save you some money.
 

[Hughtheo]

Plan for your next trip.

First, avoid all agencies and any websites that require pay per contacting each woman and/or pay per each letter.

....

I truncated the quote but all of it is very solid advice.

Thanks ML.

[Hughtheo]

Hughtheo
 
I understand your frustration. But why didn’t you ask for their phone numbers? Why didnt you use Skype?  These are two good "filters” which you can use to determine 1. Level of English proficiency 2. If you even like the girl's appearance. It can save you some money.

I actually had a skype conversation with one of the two ladies. She was totally nervous and I thought she needed a translator to help her out on that occasion. Then 3 months passed before I flew out and I hoped in that time she would come to grips with the basics of English which are comparatively easy to learn.

Boy was I mistaken!

[Donna_Pedro]

actually had a skype conversation with one of the two ladies.

 
"A" skype conversation wont do. Me and my husband started dating during a pre-Skype era ( we are a couple of dinosaurs), but we spent hours on the phone every day before he even made a trip. I mean 3-4 hours every day minimum. That’s not counting e-mails. If this is so important for you (as it should be) - you need to invest time into all this. Eventually it will save you money.

[Jumper]

 
"A" skype conversation wont do. Me and my husband started dating during a pre-Skype era ( we are a couple of dinosaurs), but we spent hours on the phone every day before he even made a trip. I mean 3-4 hours every day minimum. That’s not counting e-mails. If this is so important for you (as it should be) - you need to invest time into all this. Eventually it will save you money.

 
agree-
if you had one Skype conversation, if there was any *click* between you two,
 it just seems continuing conversations  would have naturally followed prior to your flight...
 
 
 Overall,
I'd try to keep this as close to local dating as possible.
 If an English woman from a distant city/town , skyped with you once,
 and you planned to go visit, it would be highly unusual for you both not to have further conversations..
 
This is the same for FSU women in my experience
and that is pretty much regardless their English skill level.
If truly interested she'll try to communicate verbally , or use skypes text/thru a copy /paste  translator , and she'll want to hear and see you.
 
If communication simply isn't possible, then you'd really have to question a trip ..
 
 
 
Sorry you had a poor time..
 
I'm surprised after only two dates you canned things though..
there are other ways to meet people?Just like in London,and other agencies habdy there if you want to go that route.
In Odessa it wouldn't be that difficult to meet someone with acceptable English.
Kyiv and Odessa , by its nature as a resort and port city for ages,
would likely have the highest prercentage of English speaker opposed to many provincial cities.
 
 
Hey , ask the translator out...just to hear her war stories from the MOB front lines..
 it wouldn't be boring!!
If you built a bit of rapport and she thinks your a decent man, not playing games,
ask if  she has friends with decent English that might be intertested, perhaps  not even signed up at the agency,friends of her mothers etc..
this takes putting in the time so that various local people know your not a sex tourist or odd..
 
 It's only an example. ..
but being open to new situations there,could present possibilities.
 
Patience in this venture, is very important.
 
 

[acctBill]

Hughtheo welcome to RWD.  The best way for you to move ahead is to start learning Russian.  Whether they admit it or not most Ukrainians over 30 will understand Russian.  There are FSU citizens everywhere in England so it shouldn't be all that difficult to practice your Russian. 

As others have mentioned using Skype prior to visiting the women is a great idea to find the most compatible women.  Plus it will give you an opportunity to practice your Russian and demonstrate to the women that you are serious about the idea of a relationship with them. 

[Vinnvinny]

Hi Hughtheo. Arh, the old terp in Odessa scam. It’s a common one unfortunately. The problem may be not the ladies lack of English but your choice of ladies and website.


In my experience many ladies in Odessa speak English. The chances are that the ladies knew far more English than you think.


How old are you and how old were the ladies you were dating?
 
 

[Hughtheo]

 
 Overall,
I'd try to keep this as close to local dating as possible.
 If an English woman from a distant city/town , skyped with you once,
 and you planned to go visit, it would be highly unusual for you both not to have further conversations..
 
This is the same for FSU women in my experience
and that is pretty much regardless their English skill level.
 
Patience in this venture, is very important.

Good points there, Jumper.

[Hughtheo]

Hi Hughtheo. Arh, the old terp in Odessa scam. It’s a common one unfortunately. The problem may be not the ladies lack of English but your choice of ladies and website.


In my experience many ladies in Odessa speak English. The chances are that the ladies knew far more English than you think.


How old are you and how old were the ladies you were dating?

Hello Vinnvinny,

I don't think it was a scam. I only paid for the meals we had together and did not shower them with expensive presents.

No shopping trips either. I knew what I was doing but had hoped the girls would be doing their part, too.

It was solely my mistake. Bad planning, bad preparations, everything.

To answer your questions about age, I have turned 50 this year. I was never married and I don't have children.

The girls were 22 and 24 years old. In hindsight, that again was not the best of choices. Although they were much more mature than local girls their age here in the UK, there was still a continent of experience separating us. I am not sure we would have been compatible in the long run.

Perhaps I should exclude girls who are younger than 30 years. It's somewhat ridiculous, come to think of it.

Still, I'm honestly looking for a long-term commitment, for marriage and children.

Then again and on my way back, I saw a mismatched couple at Kiev airport. The gent was about my age and kissing his girlfriend or wife goodbye before he checked in for a flight. The girl could not have been more than 25 or 26.

[SMS60]

Do you want children? or would you be happy with just finding wife to enjoy life. If the latter do not look for women under the age of 40 and with no children under the age of 19-20.

[Muzh]

 
"A" skype conversation wont do. Me and my husband started dating during a pre-Skype era ( we are a couple of dinosaurs), but we spent hours on the phone every day before he even made a trip. I mean 3-4 hours every day minimum. That’s not counting e-mails. If this is so important for you (as it should be) - you need to invest time into all this. Eventually it will save you money.

DP, thank you for this statement.
 
I know it goes contrary to the "instant gratification" crowd but ask yourself, did it worked for her and how long she's been married? You already know my story (similar to yours Donna Pedro) however, the dogma these days is find a woman you can skype for a week or two and then go visit. OR worse; make contacts and plan a trip immediately to see if there is any "chemistry."
 
I hate to say this but, ARE YOU NUTS?
 
What you have are two strangers getting together trying to come to an agreement if one can sponsor the other into a life away from home.
 
Are you (OP) surprised she "didn't do her part?" My question to you is: Why should she?
 
But what the hell do we know? We're just dinosaurs heading into extintion; TOGETHER hand in hand.

[Hughtheo]

Muzh,

Thanks for your reply but I can't follow most of it.

I got a few questions:

I know it goes contrary to the "instant gratification" crowd but ask yourself, did it worked for her and how long she's been married? You already know my story (similar to yours Donna Pedro) however, the dogma these days is find a woman you can skype for a week or two and then go visit. OR worse; make contacts and plan a trip immediately to see if there is any "chemistry."
 
I hate to say this but, ARE YOU NUTS?

I had the impression that it did work for her, i.e. she could see further meetings. Why do you think the lady I met was married? We were both single, never married, no children.

We had exchanged letters for 6 months and seen each other on Skype. It was by no means a rushed visit. A badly prepared one, yes. But certainly not one born out of "instant gratification".

What you have are two strangers getting together trying to come to an agreement if one can sponsor the other into a life away from home.

That is spot on.

Are you (OP) surprised she "didn't do her part?" My question to you is: Why should she?
 
But what the hell do we know? We're just dinosaurs heading into extintion; TOGETHER hand in hand.

Who is "OP"? In case you are referring to me, I believe she should have done her part (learning English) because she wanted to leave dire Ukraine for a new life in England. With me.

And about the dinosaur bit, I leave that to paleontologists.

[Muzh]

Muzh,

Thanks for your reply but I can't follow most of it.

I got a few questions:

I had the impression that it did work for her, i.e. she could see further meetings. Why do you think the lady I met was married? We were both single, never married, no children.

We had exchanged letters for 6 months and seen each other on Skype. It was by no means a rushed visit. A badly prepared one, yes. But certainly not one seeking "instant gratification".

That is spot on.

Who is "OP"?

And about the dinosaur bit, I leave that to paleontologists.

Hugh, most of my post was referring to Donna Pedro's and my experience, not to you and the lady you met. I spent a long time getting to know my now wife. Countless hours on the phone. We both had some pictures of each other but, and this my wife agrees, we formed a mental image that still lasts today. When we met for the first time, we were meeting as friends who already knew each other.
 
My "instant gratification" comment is a reply to many who embark on this by sending 9 million letters, setting 25 meetings in 13 different countries and do it in a week. (Can you pick the exageration?) Then they are surprised there was no chemistry. DUH!
 
In addition, I believe skype ruins everything. It is too matter-of-fact. This is good for the guys but I believe it damages it for the ladies. My wife told me at the very beginning that men love with their eyes but women love with their ears. I can promise you that regular phone calls to women in the former Soyuz will have the desired effect; find a connection. I don't think skype accomplishes this. It's too graphic, too technical, too quick. Therefore, instant gratification.
 
The ladies are free to correct me in my assumptions.
 
 
The OP is Original Poster; you.
 
Between you and me, the trick relies in the age-old proven technique: you'll have to charm the living daylights out of her (any woman you are after). Locally, you make dates and look for things she like. When she is thousands of miles away, you talk sweet nothings to her ear until she melts. It is THAT simple.

[Hughtheo]

Muzh, many thanks for your informative reply. I really appreciate that.

Just a few comments I'd like to make.

In addition, I believe skype ruins everything. It is too matter-of-fact. This is good for the guys but I believe it damages it for the ladies. My wife told me at the very beginning that men love with their eyes but women love with their ears. I can promise you that regular phone calls to women in the former Soyuz will have the desired effect; find a connection. I don't think skype accomplishes this. It's too graphic, too technical, too quick. Therefore, instant gratification.
 
The ladies are free to correct me in my assumptions.
 
Between you and me, the trick relies in the age-old proven technique: you'll have to charm the living daylights out of her (any woman you are after). Locally, you make dates and look for things she like. When she is thousands of miles away, you talk sweet nothings to her ear until she melts. It is THAT simple.

About Skype. I do not share your views on it being unhelpful as it included video shots. So I could finally see the ladies in flesh and blood with whom I've had the exchange of emails. See their faces, their body language, their reactions, their smiles. It also assured me that the girls really were as beautiful as all their staged photographs.

Also, they told me that they felt the same, a relief that I was for real and truly looked like the pics I had posted.

The workings of sweet nothings will never fail, I agree. But I found with ladies from FSU that most of them would have accepted me in any shape or form, blind, cripplied, both legs missing.

Smooth operations were not required. Then again, their readiness to go forward at any costs made me question their sincerity. They did not really mean ME.

[Donna_Pedro]

their faces, their body language, their reactions, their smiles.

Muzh may be right suggesting just phone calls.  Especially if you have a tendency to "fall in love" quickly. This initial part of your communication better not be clouded by "emotions". Keep your head as cool as possible. When you see a girl and feel there is "chemistry" between you, you might be inclined to overlook certain things. Act like, say, you were dutifully looking for a potential girlfriend for your brother or a best friend. Pick those you are potentially compatible with, then narrow down your choices by more intensive communication on thr phone and via e-mails and then pick candidates for  personal meetings. This way your "homework" is done ahead of time.
 

But I found with ladies from FSU that most of them would have accepted me in any shape or form, blind, cripplied, both legs missing

.
 
If this bothers you, go to Moscow. We, moscow women, are usually not as desperate to get out of the country, but also very high maintenance (or so it is widely believed).
 

[Donna_Pedro]

When she is thousands of miles away, you talk sweet nothings to her ear until she melts.

or gets a diabetes

[Ranetka]

Hughtheo welcome to RWD.  The best way for you to move ahead is to start learning Russian.  Whether they admit it or not most Ukrainians over 30 will understand Russian.  There are FSU citizens everywhere in England so it shouldn't be all that difficult to practice your Russian. 

It would also give you a better understanding of how "easy" it is to get a "basic grip" of a foreign language language in just three months.    You will be surprised.

[Misha]

The workings of sweet nothings will never fail, I agree. But I found with ladies from FSU that most of them would have accepted me in any shape or form, blind, cripplied, both legs missing.

To be more precise, the women on the site you were using would have accepted you in any shape or form....


Do as ML suggested, go create a profile on singles.ru or a similar free site and write to the type of women you were writing on mypartnerforever. I expect that the response rate will be much, much lower as you will be dealing with real women (with few exceptions) without an agenda.

[Ranetka]

To answer your questions about age, I have turned 50 this year. I was never married and I don't have children.

The girls were 22 and 24 years old. In hindsight, that again was not the best of choices.

You are 50 years old. You choose to meet someone less than half your age for a purpose of marry. I am sorry but this is not a poor planning etc, this is just unreasonable.
 
You had to go to Odessa to understand you are too old for 22 years old?????  

[Donna_Pedro]

You are 50 years old. You choose to meet someone less than half your age for a purpose of marry. I am sorry but this is not a poor planning etc, this is just unreasonable.

Those girls certainly didnt think so, why should he? He feels that they "would have accepted him in any shape or form, blind, cripplied, both legs missing". Why in the world should  he date, say, a 45 yo if 25 yos are lining up ready "to go forward at any cost"???? So, the fault (if there is any) is not entirely his. To put it mildly.

[Ranetka]

Those girls certainly didnt think so, why should he? He feels that they "would have accepted him in any shape or form, blind, cripplied, both legs missing". Why in the world should  he date, say, a 45 yo if 25 yos are lining up ready "to go forward at any cost"???? So, the fault (if there is any) is not entirely his. To put it mildly.

The girls did not have to go anywhere, spent any money on travel or hotel or dinner etc. They have nothing to complain about, do they?
 
The other thing in my opin ion as he is much older he should have had much more brains then them.
 
P.S. Glad you like to put things mildly as well.