Is "trading up" really such a bad thing?

[Kuna]

What if it turns out that the RW has a higher net worth than the WM ??? 

It happens... an old, and highly respected former poster here (jb) married a lady who was more wealthy than him.

 

Welcome to RWD by the way... I've seen you posting but was not here when you joined.

[Maxx2]

I say - communicate a few times, collect as much primary info as you can,  check finances, if your expectations are met -  see if other boxes check out, and then it might be worth trying to build a relationship. There might be even feelings eventually. But I strongly suggest that women keep their heads cold and love-free as long as possible, at least till after her arrival. There could be a "no-go" on every level..Sometimes it happens - a rich guy could be an a-hole and its up to a woman if she wants to try to build a relationship with him or proceed to the next one.

Would you recommend that the men deploy detectives in Russia to check out their prospectives? Perhaps using undercover Russian women detectives to try and "befriend" these women and their friends, associates and family?     I bet there is a great opportunity for a similar business here in the US. Get some Russian women here in the US to organize into a business that investigates the motives and sincerity of AM's fiancees and their Russian wives. In short Donna, if I ever get around to finding another Russian women to marry would you check her out for me? And could she be Ukrainian if it happens that way? 

[Misha]

I don't believe it is necessary that the point in time where both parties achieve this state of mind has to be at the same moment.  Also considering that couples, usually one partner, seem to fall in as well as out of love, maybe for discussions here it is irrelevant.

Call me a romantic, but I did not want a marriage founded on a business deal. I sought passion, falling in love and then figuring out whether there was mutual compatibility.

[Misha]

Men fell in love themselves and could not recognize the fact that women were not.

Nope, men simply deluding themselves, blaming culture for example for the fact that the women did not want to even hold their hands in public...

Marriage requires a more solid foundation than just love.

If that is what you believe, then I am happy that you found what you were looking for, but I for one did not want this and I would not recommend it to anybody.

However, it is understandable why you put such a premium on ensuring that the man you marries earns as much money as possible...

[Maxx2]

However, it is understandable why you put such a premium on ensuring that the man you marries earns as much money as possible...

I don't think that is what Donna means. IMO she would want a man who will not put her into circumstances that would be depressing to her like the guy on the previous page she mentioned who brought his wife to a small red neck town and employed as a waitress living off her tips. In America it is possible to have a degrading and impoverished life on minimal the USCIS allows (poverty level plus 50% of that) to petition a fiancee/wife.

[Daveman]

... [size=78%]And my conclusion is - most of "broken heart" stories happened ultimately because of love.[/size]

Ya think?      Kinda difficult to have a "broken heart" without having love isn't it?  Or perhaps you are referring to disappoint when expectation smacks head on into reality?

[OlgaH]

But I strongly suggest that women keep their heads cold and love-free as long as possible, at least till after her arrival.

But I suggest to both sides not to fall in love before they actually start living together.

Donna_Pedro, what should a woman do if love and even any feeling did not occur after 2-3 months before the marriage after her arrival? Should she return home or marry him anyway just to get her GC and stay in the US? What should she do if she never fell in love with him and his presents just was causing a nausea after marriage? Divorce him?  Is she entitled  to any financial support from his side in such case?  to any of his assets? Should he support her stay in the US?

[SANDRO43]

Kinda difficult to have a "broken heart" without having love isn't it?

A "broken wallet" may take even longer to recover from .

[jeff9556]

I suggest to both sides not to fall in love before they actually start living together.

This is a really strange thing to advocate. Do you also advocate that these women tell their man they do not love him and that they'll "see how it goes after I get there". I can't really imagine many men going for that. Maybe none?

If you do not advocate that then are you in fact telling these women to lie, or at the very least perpetrate a lie? As you can see in this thread the men are saying they would not go for a women who did not love them, and neither would I. Surely you are aware of this?

I think its one thing to keep your head on and be prepared for expectations to be shattered, but to out and out tell women not to love is tantamount to subterfuge, which doesn't really sound like a solid foundation for a relationship, let alone a marriage.

[Donna_Pedro]

Call me a romantic, but I did not want a marriage founded on a business deal. I sought passion, falling in love and then figuring out whether there was mutual compatibility.

And this is how  I would have  explained this to my child if smth had gone wrong? Sorry, child, for ripping you off your school, friends, familiar environment.., mommy wanted passion and lov? You want me to call smth like this romantic? I cant. Irresponsible is the word.

[Donna_Pedro]

Nope, men simply deluding themselves, blaming culture for example for the fact that the women did not want to even hold their hands in public...[/qote]


 So men who were quite rational before, and could function in a society quite successfully suddenly in presence of a woman  suffered from delusion, not being able to explain simple social signals.  Hmm..    This particular delusion is  probably located in a guys pants. Bur it could be a more complicated diagnoses.

[Misha]

And this is how  I would have  explained this to my child if smth had gone wrong? Sorry, child, for ripping you off your school, friends, familiar environment.., mommy wanted passion and lov? You want me to call smth like this romantic? I cant. Irresponsible is the word.

There is nothing that guaranteed you success, and you would still have had to explain to your child your failures. Again, there is no guarantee that the financially successful man will be either emotionally or psychologically sound 

[JR]

Lets see, a hot young RW meeting a fat, balding, old and socially inept AM is supposed to fall in love with said man plus not consider that he is either un or under employed and rush off to live in his cardboard box under the freeway overpass?
I think not! It is perfectly natural and normal for a woman (any woman) to take into consideration a man's ability to provide when considering him for a partner.
Face it guys: if you're chasing younger, hotter tail and you aren't a young Don Juan yourself you'd better bring something to the table or you're going away hungry! Unless of course you're packin that 24cm Gator was mentioning upthread. (And it's still in working condition

[GQBlues]

I don't think that is what Donna means. IMO she would want a man who will not put her into circumstances that would be depressing to her like the guy on the previous page she mentioned who brought his wife to a small red neck town and employed as a waitress living off her tips. In America it is possible to have a degrading and impoverished life on minimal the USCIS allows (poverty level plus 50% of that) to petition a fiancee/wife.

I agree completely. Not sure why Misha is picking fly pshyth out of peppers here. Why should a man apologize for being financially secure, or why should a woman, any woman, not shy away from a man who is a deadbeat loser?
 
Bottom line is, if a FSUW somehow have a way to determine what type of man she may submit herself to ahead of time, it's prudent to do so. What's the problem with that?

[Misha]

Lets see, a hot young RW meeting a fat, balding, old and socially inept AM is supposed to fall in love with said man plus not consider that he is either un or under employed and rush off to live in his cardboard box under the freeway overpass?

No, but where is it written that this man must date and marry a hot young RW? Perhaps he can find such a woman, but he should not expect much pity from me when [not if, but when] things don't work out. Again, either you know if a woman isn't into you, or you don't. If you insist of pursuing a woman who is not into you, then you had better accept the consequences...

[Donna_Pedro]

There is nothing that guaranteed you success, and you would still have had to explain to your child your failures. 

Exactly. But I do not want to base everything on love either. Too unpredictable for such an endeavor. Too much at stake.

Again, there is no guarantee that the financially successful man will be either emotionally or psychologically sound

I never suggested that financial success should be the ONLY criteria. I never suggested that women should  date  ANY man they come across who makes $250K and higher. But I always suggest financial stability to be the first criteria. The FIRST out of a long list.

[Donna_Pedro]

I agree completely. Not sure why Misha is picking fly pshyth out of peppers here. Why should a man apologize for being financially secure, or why should a woman, any woman, not shy away from a man who is a deadbeat loser?
 Bottom line is, if a FSUW somehow have a way to determine what type of man she may submit herself to ahead of time, it's prudent to do so. What's the problem with that?

I would like to join you in these questions.

[OlgaH]

And this is how  I would have  explained this to my child if smth had gone wrong? Sorry,

And how should a mommy explain her child that she married a man she did not love, just because of his financial wellness and now she has to divorce him or live with him in the loveless marriage because she never fell in love with the man?

And questions is is the mommy entitled to any financial support from the man she never loved?

Should be a woman honest with a man telling him that she will marry him because of his financial stability and she will see later if she fells with love with him or not?

What do you suggest women who use your service in the case if they will never fall in love with a man after their arrival when you advice them to "keep their heads cold and love-free as long as possible, at least till after her arrival?"

[Maxx2]

It would sure help if the 90 day fiancee visa was 365 days instead.

[OlgaH]

It would sure help if the 90 day fiancee visa was 365 days instead.

Maxx, and how would it help?

Maybe it would be more helpful if the US grants RWs who want to get in the US with GC, sum of money and housing, so there would not bee any need for RWs to marry without love 

[Daveman]

Of course I understand about financial stability and the importance thereof... I can even understand that financial stability be at the top of a list for a woman (stability, not entitlement of top %1'ers)


however, these are very pertinent and fair questions considering the topic and wide spectra of commentary...

And how should a mommy explain her child that she married a man she did not love, just because of his financial wellness and now she has to divorce him or live with him in the loveless marriage because she never fell in love with the man?

And questions is is the mommy entitled to any financial support from the man she never loved?

Should be a woman honest with a man telling him that she will marry him because of his financial stability and she will see later if she fells with love with him or not?

What do you suggest women who use your service in the case if they will never fall in love with a man after their arrival when you advice them to "keep their heads cold and love-free as long as possible, at least till after her arrival?"

[Chicagoguy]

It would sure help if the 90 day fiancee visa was 365 days instead.

My sentiments exactly. Thats what I thought it was for but I have been told - no, it's not. Would make this a cheaper process if we wern't traveling there so much.

[Donna_Pedro]

And how should a mommy explain her child that she married a man she did not love, just because of his financial wellness and now she has to divorce him or live with him in the loveless marriage because she never fell in love with the man?

I understand that it helps your argumentation to ignore certain things the opponent says, but seriously.. 

[OlgaH]

I understand that it helps your argumentation to ignore certain things the opponent says, but seriously.. 

I have not made any argumentation yet, I just asked some questions.

[OlgaH]

Bottom line is, if a FSUW somehow have a way to determine what type of man she may submit herself to ahead of time, it's prudent to do so. What's the problem with that?

No problem with that at all regarding both sides: men and women.

GQBlues,  would you start a fiancee visa process or marry a woman if she said to you: "I don't love you, but your finances and assets suit me fine, let see after my arrival and our marriage if I will fall in love with you or not."