Realistic Expectations

[Donna_Pedro]

Just as it's wrong to say that us, men shouldn't look for a "better deal" in the FSU 

well, use it while you still can, because with standards of life improving,  this opportunity will dry out fast. New generation of RW (those in their 20s) especially in big cities have already changed their mentality. So your children are going to have tough times looking  for wives in FSU.

[Eduard]

well, use it while you still can, because with standards of life improving,  this opportunity will dry out fast. New generation of RW (those in their 20s) especially in big cities have already changed their mentality. So your children are going to have tough times looking  for wives in FSU.

I promise you that my children won't be looking for wives in the FSU!!! 

[Lily]

I promise you that my children won't be looking for wives in the FSU!!! 

Why, do you think that in some 20-30 years there will be no difference in dating dymanics in the FSU and North America?

[Donna_Pedro]

There is certainly a reason why she is still single    There is a reason why in most American (and Canadian) families both work. Two salaries are always better than one, and in most cases will mean that this will allow the family to have twice the house, twice the car, twice the vacations, etc... Even if she accepts a bit of frugality, it will still mean finding a man who earns at least more than she earns...

May be the reason is that she is OK staying single? May be she is not on a mission to get married? May be nobody is pressing her to get married ASAP. She will if and when a good man comes alone. If not - she seems fine too. Do you suggest to lower her standards? Would you lower yours? If I told you, Misha, here is an ugly girl, marry her, she is kind and nice and would respect you and give you fat, healthy children?  Or its Ok for a man to have standards but not OK for a woman?  I agree there is a reason that  in many families  2 people work. But I like the opportunity not to work. You wont believe how different the attitude is when you work out of desire rather than necessity. Last year I walked out of the company  I used to work for for with my mid finger high up in the air because I didnt want to put up with bs. I  did not work for 6 months and loved it!  It gave me time to relax and sleep late, and do some house projects and spend more time with my family. And we still maintained life style. Now that I am bored again (and my son is fixing to leave to the university) - I have got me another job.    This is what checking box #1 gives you. And believe me it feels great!

[Donna_Pedro]

Why, do you think that in some 20-30 years there will be no difference in dating dymanics in the FSU and North America?

Eduard has got a daughter.

[Misha]

Do you suggest to lower her standards?

At some point, we all lower are expectations below perfection, but perhaps it is my Catholic upbringing that drummed into me that perfection is not of this world    I aimed to find a woman that I could love along with her imperfections 

[Eduard]

Why, do you think that in some 20-30 years there will be no difference in dating dymanics in the FSU and North America?

It's not that, I just don't think my two daughters will go wife hunting in the FSU! 

[magnetic_fields]

At some point, we all lower are expectations below perfection, but perhaps it is my Catholic upbringing that drummed into me that perfection is not of this world    I aimed to find a woman that I could love along with her imperfections 

Every man or woman eventually reaches their breaking point. Either be single for the rest of their lives, compromise and find someone in their own country, or go abroad seeking new opportunities/ love romance. Choose wisely

[GQBlues]

....
 Many single western women I have met see marriage as a threat to their freedom..... Maybe that is why there are so many western women going to sleep at night alone... and there are so many western men looking to FSU for a wife!

Must be the Sunday Night Moose Lodge Special.
 
Where do you guys get all these material ? Men trek to FSU and places like it not because of some silly allegations about the ills of western women. Nothing wrong with AWs. The very vast majority of American men support that notion. Darn enjoys it, too. A very scant, tiny, miniscule minority of AM (who, for the most part, are much later in their years, and/or, a bit wide around the girth), go to FSU because economic disparity between regions enable them to date/marry women (much) younger women than what they can only hope wish to date at home.
 
Not because AWs believe marriages is a threat to their independence. That's BS. If a man marries a FSUW and is indeed happy about it, drop the silly innuendoes and don't make anymore silly justification why you found yourself having to go abroad for a wife.
 
It is these types of silliness why this endeavor had largely been stigmatize both in the west and in the respective countries these women hail from. Folks concoct all kinds of reason other than just admitting the very obvious. Yes, even Russians who arrived in the US other than K-visas have a very low opinion of those that did.

[onlyFSU4me]

Must be the Sunday Night Moose Lodge Special.
 
Where do you guys get all these material ? Men trek to FSU and places like it not because of some silly allegations about the ills of western women. Nothing wrong with AWs. The very vast majority of American men support that notion. Darn enjoys it, too. A very scant, tiny, miniscule minority of AM (who, for the most part, are much later in their years, and/or, a bit wide around the girth), go to FSU because economic disparity between regions enable them to date/marry women (much) younger women than what they can only hope wish to date at home.


  ``I'm 44 yrs old, 6'2 and 210 pds. My wife is 40 years old. Wide around the girth? I went there because I was looking for a women much younger than I could get at home???  Yea right!     ``
 
Not because AWs believe marriages is a threat to their independence. That's BS. If a man marries a FSUW and is indeed happy about it, drop the silly innuendoes and don't make anymore silly justification why you found yourself having to go abroad for a wife.


 ``If you would spend a little time reading all of my posts in this discussion you would see that I said not all western women were like this. But what I have found is that most women I've met 35 who were single were. Don't know your situation or experiences but this is mine.``
 
It is these types of silliness why this endeavor had largely been stigmatize both in the west and in the respective countries these women hail from. Folks concoct all kinds of reason other than just admitting the very obvious. Yes, even Russians who arrived in the US other than K-visas have a very low opinion of those that did.

 My whole conversation was based on replying to Donnas post about how she admired AW for basically not putting up with mens BS and being independant. I responded with what I have experienced with women here at home and what I have seen of women in FSU. In my opinion FSU women are probably more strong willed and less apt to put up with mens BS than AW, giving my wifes personality as an example. In fact I believe Donna herself to be a women who would never put up with mens BS just like the AW shes says she admires so much.
 But, you are intitled to think what you want about what I say...  If you`ve had different experiences than I have with AW then good for you!

[Eduard]

Must be the Sunday Night Moose Lodge Special.
 
Where do you guys get all these material ? Men trek to FSU and places like it not because of some silly allegations about the ills of western women. Nothing wrong with AWs. The very vast majority of American men support that notion. Darn enjoys it, too. A very scant, tiny, miniscule minority of AM (who, for the most part, are much later in their years, and/or, a bit wide around the girth), go to FSU because economic disparity between regions enable them to date/marry women (much) younger women than what they can only hope wish to date at home.
 
Not because AWs believe marriages is a threat to their independence. That's BS. If a man marries a FSUW and is indeed happy about it, drop the silly innuendoes and don't make anymore silly justification why you found yourself having to go abroad for a wife.
 
It is these types of silliness why this endeavor had largely been stigmatize both in the west and in the respective countries these women hail from. Folks concoct all kinds of reason other than just admitting the very obvious. Yes, even Russians who arrived in the US other than K-visas have a very low opinion of those that did.

To say that WM who look for an FSU woman to marry are mostly older and fatter is not true in my experience. I've worked with quite a few guys who were looking for an FSU wife in the last 6 years. All but one were in decent to athletic shape, but even that one wasn't really what you would call obese. He could have stood to loose a little weight but nothing too major.
As far as age my experience with my clients also is different from what you state. I only had a few clients who were older than 55. Most guys were in the 35 to 45 age range but I even had a 25 year old client 4 or 5 years ago. Some were seriously athletic, i.e.: marshal artists, body builders, cops and others like doctors, engineers and lawyers who kept a healthy life style and were in great, athletic shape.


For instance, I'm working with 2 guys now (one is a member on these fora). The first guy is a 28 year old West Point graduate who just retired from the military. A wonderful young man, a warier and a gentleman who comes from a very good family, very good looking, very athletic. Not even close to what you describe an FSU wife seeker to be...
The other guy is an IT engineer, 36 yo, not an athlete but in pretty good shape... again, doesn't fit your description either.
So why did you go to Russia to find a wife?

[Maxx2]

Not everyone has a thought out reason to go to the FSU for a wife. They get contacted by a RW on the Net or they see a MOB website and say "What the hey, I'll write this woman and see what happens". The rest just happens. I would say this is case the majority of the time.

[possum]

You may just as well cut the loop and go straight for those RW already in USA, just like Lily advised.

Pitbull,

Most of those RW already in US and looking to get married are divorced from AM who brought them over there.. In many cases, they are even more desperate to get married than their FSU dwelling sisters due to lack of an established career or support network.. They also tend to be more skeptical of AM, and understandably so. Then there are GCGs who have successfully completed their mission to relocate and are looking to 'upgrade'. The level of their 'Americanization' is secondary, IMO..

Not to mention, looking for an RW in the US takes the 'prince on a white horse' fantasy out of the equation for BOTH men and women. 

[Patagonie]

 I think you are looking at AW with rose colored glasses Donna. I'm not denying that AW don't have a much better chance of having a lot more comfortable life and better career than FSU women, but most of those career women could never do it without the support of a spouse to help pay for her education, help take care of children while she is pursuing her career, etc. it is not unrealistic for a person to spend over 100,000 dollars getting their education for that career, and after you get it you will spend years to pay that money back. And realistically, what percentage of these women are available in the dating pool? I can tell you it is a very low percentage.
 I am giving you the view point of a 44 year old man who was looking for women 35 and older. I didn't see too many available women in this age group who had a successful career and were single. Most of the available women struggle to get by just to pay their apartment rental and maybe make a car payment. Especially if they were raising 1 or 2 children. There are government assisted apartments for lower income people here that are full of single mothers who cant afford to pay rent and feed their children both. Many of these women have jobs that are considered average wages but it is expensive to live and raise children here in Canada. Yet many of these women refuse to get married because they feel they are giving up their "freedom".
 To give you some insight about my situation, my wife owns her own house, her own car, owns her own store and a vacation apartment in Crimea. So obviously she is not desperate to marry because of financial hardship. But she still has a totally different mentality about relationships that what I found with most western women here at home. That is what I was trying to explain to you when I said everything you said about western women could be said about my wife... yet they view marriage very differently.   

+1
The demeanor of AW for men who are more than 40 is the following :
When you meet a 35 or more aged woman, you know that she is under pressure because her biological clock is ringing. You ask yourself ? What is her goal ? To fall in love or to have babies ? Generally she would say both because at this moment, suddenly she adds  baby + family + father + her. So a normal woman would make a family (which not necessary involves to get married). The problem is that this type of girls would aim, is possible a high value man (like any woman), but generally this 35 and more aged women are, in average, typically having a  high or a good carreer. They, in average, try to hit the same type of men. For every AM, this sort of woman are very risky because after these women have got their baby they in fact don't fight for a family. They principally have completed, filled what they needed. But when men are fired (more than 85 % of women ask divorce and get children's custody) they suffer for all consequences.

The second type of women you can meet is more generally divorced or separated one, often with childrens. And in many cases, exactly like onlyFSU4me they are not interested to restart a family under the same roof. They often get benefits from divorce, which means that men help them financially, governement help also, and they pay no or very few tax (family policy tax). A lot of them want to have freedoom and a man à la carte. Men à la carte means : when i want to see you you appear, when i want to not see you you disappear (you not appear). This type of demeanor is very rampant among women here. Man are like accessory and you need to drive women's attention to keep it constant in time which is exhausting. They don't want to give up their freedom which means in fact that they don't want to engage themselves especially the divorced one with children. Their "freedom" is also very convenient because it lets them a lot of opportunities open to find a better mate and change of partner.

In fact the situation is the opposite of FSU, for men, and especially wealth men, it is very risky to have a children with a women because the price paid is high with no appreciation for the man you are and no appreciation for the father you had been. This society is more prone to spit on you as man or father. You are considered by default anytime as a mugger and an incapable. The worthiness of the man is very low in western countries and high in FSU. This is a big difference in culture, FSU fight for men (cultivate their interest for them) whereas AW consider them as an accessory in the world scale. 


When childrens have left the mother, things begin to be more complicated for them. They are generally more than 45 and their sex appeal has disappeared for a lot. They also loose the alimony. They suddenly realize that in ten or fifteen years they will retired with not their full wage (which is already not very high in general as FSU4me said). Theirs egos are going in flames and they need to adjust their expectations. They generally put back in its place man by inflating the M.

I have don't talk about the younger, less than 35. I think that young AW can give them a good picture of them. But i think the demeanor of this class age has no reason to be better, probably worst.

[Leelou]

May be the reason is that she is OK staying single? May be she is not on a mission to get married? May be nobody is pressing her to get married ASAP. She will if and when a good man comes alone. If not - she seems fine too. Do you suggest to lower her standards? Would you lower yours? If I told you, Misha, here is an ugly girl, marry her, she is kind and nice and would respect you and give you fat, healthy children?  Or its Ok for a man to have standards but not OK for a woman?  I agree there is a reason that  in many families  2 people work. But I like the opportunity not to work. You wont believe how different the attitude is when you work out of desire rather than necessity. Last year I walked out of the company  I used to work for for with my mid finger high up in the air because I didnt want to put up with bs. I  did not work for 6 months and loved it!  It gave me time to relax and sleep late, and do some house projects and spend more time with my family. And we still maintained life style. Now that I am bored again (and my son is fixing to leave to the university) - I have got me another job.    This is what checking box #1 gives you. And believe me it feels great!

Indeed, but during this no-job period, you seemed to have stayed pretty active!
I think there is a big difference depending on what women choose to do with the financial freedom a wealthy husband can bring to them.

Often my girl mentions the fact she hopes one day I will get a position good enough that would allow her not to be obligated to work. But when we speak precisely about it, she also mentions she 'd like to be free from work obligations so that she can raise our children and be with them all the time (and so we don't have to pay someone to take care of them while we're both working), to take care of the house, to have time to create a good atmosphere and to reduce our housework when we back home after work, ect,...

What I mean is that many women can still bring stuff very valuable, even tough this is not seen as a second salary. There is a difference between a woman who wants the financial freedom of her husband to just do nothing, watch TV, travel and have fun the whole day with her friends, and a woman who still wants to enjoy life but also want to use that free time to educate the children, to take care of the family, to take care of the house,... and that's pretty much a full-time job too

[Leelou]

To say that WM who look for an FSU woman to marry are mostly older and fatter is not true in my experience. I've worked with quite a few guys who were looking for an FSU wife in the last 6 years. All but one were in decent to athletic shape, but even that one wasn't really what you would call obese. He could have stood to loose a little weight but nothing too major.
As far as age my experience with my clients also is different from what you state. I only had a few clients who were older than 55. Most guys were in the 35 to 45 age range but I even had a 25 year old client 4 or 5 years ago. Some were seriously athletic, i.e.: marshal artists, body builders, cops and others like doctors, engineers and lawyers who kept a healthy life style and were in great, athletic shape.


For instance, I'm working with 2 guys now (one is a member on these fora). The first guy is a 28 year old West Point graduate who just retired from the military. A wonderful young man, a warier and a gentleman who comes from a very good family, very good looking, very athletic. Not even close to what you describe an FSU wife seeker to be...
The other guy is an IT engineer, 36 yo, not an athlete but in pretty good shape... again, doesn't fit your description either.
So why did you go to Russia to find a wife?

I'm below 30 and I found her in the FSU

[Leelou]

A lot of them want to have freedoom and a man à la carte. Men à la carte means : when i want to see you you appear, when i want to not see you you disappear (you not appear). This type of demeanor is very rampant among women here. Man are like accessory and you need to drive their attention to keep it constant in time which is exhausting. They don't want to give up their freedom which means in fact that they don't want to engage themselve especially the divorced one with children. Their "freedom" is also very convenient because it lets them a lot of opportunities open to find a better mate and change of partner.

Great ppost and great writing!
"Man à la carte", I will keep that in mind, it's exactly what I felt sometimes and I agree with your idea about being open to change. 

In fact the situation is the opposite of FSU, for men, and especially wealth men, it is very risky to have a children with a women because the price paid is high with no appreciation for the man you are and no appreciation for the father you had been. This society is more prone to spit on you as man or father. You are considered by default anytime as a mugger and an incapable. The worthiness of the man is very low in western countries and high in FSU. This is a big difference in culture, FSU fight for men (cultivate their interest for them) whereas AW consider them as an accessory in the world scale.

I don't know if this si true for a majority of Western ladies, but it is true that this mentality is getting stronger with the years.
There is also this idea now that men are somekind of steps in a progressive social ascension. I hear more and more Wtesern women considering men not for who they are but more for what they can bring to them at a moment in their life, knowing that it's only temporary and that they will soon need something new and that a new man will then be needed. A bit like the idea of constant change your expressed earlier in your post.
I see also more and more ladies developping somekind of admiration for the women living their life in this manner... A bit like if this was all a revenge on the direct power men had on women in the past.

[Patagonie]

Great ppost and great writing!
"Man à la carte", I will keep that in mind, it's exactly what I felt sometimes and I agree with your idea about being open to change. 

I don't know if this si true for a majority of Western ladies, but it is true that this mentality is getting stronger with the years.
There is also this idea now that men are somekind of steps in a progressive social ascension. I hear more and more Wtesern women considering men not for who they are but more for what they can bring to them at a moment in their life, knowing that it's only temporary and that they will soon need something new and that a new man will then be needed. A bit like the idea of constant change your expressed earlier in your post.
I see also more and more ladies developping somekind of admiration for the women living their life in this manner... A bit like if this was all a revenge on the direct power men had on women in the past.

 I strongly agree, for a large part AW (at least 50%), depending of their worthiness on the market (beauty - class - education - youthfulness)  partially or totally play the card "what can i get for my price".   And they don't loose these type of demeanor for a long time.
Men are really (the well off and rich one) a socio-economical lift with ANY chance for AW to loose something (push apart broken feelings and all distateful things which usually come along a divorce, but these things of course applied for both). They don't give any counterpart : they just GET (in case of a man who has a good situation, if nobody has money, it cannot fall from trees).

You are right men are judged for "how useful they can be". knowing that the law push them to be useful even after they have walked away. Not only you have provide them sometimes a good life, but laws tell you that you MUST provide them a good life after she leaves you (and sometimes you also  leave her true).  . This is decaying the society, and especially relationship between westerns men and women. 

It's why in my opinion, with a WESTERN woman, the marriage's contract MUST be NECESSARY signed  as separated one or with a prenup, depending of the law system. Men have to limit women's benefits of what the law system has generated last twenty years. It will perhaps a solution to cut this type of admiration that you wrote about.
I mean more and more women, you are right, admire the ones who have succeeded (nothing wrong with this), but they admire also these who have succeeded by OBSIOUSLY using the marriage lift for their private interest. Men are a source of income, it's legal, approved by law and repress by the law if they don't want to cooperate.

The laws have cut men's wallet, and feminism have cut their balls. And secretly, where women gather you can hear them : "where are the men, i cannot find  a real man, they don't want to be serious, to engage themself".

Also men have to change and adapt. The future can change, but no sure they want to change their behavior. A lot of them had been raised with this idea : you need to be a good boy, be kind and gentle with your mama.
In the life they do the same, and after they cry because nothing works with women. They don't meet love, women are not interested by them, women are bitchy. They don't understand why woman say "i need a good guy" and fuck with the hell's angel one.
In 90 % of time men are lost with women. They don't understand that be nice almost or rarely attracts women, don't raise love and respect. When woman's respect reaches the limit, it's the kiss of a death for a man.  The same for these who are buying women. Women keep and manipulate these fools for their own advantage. Worse : rather than to only prize women who desserve it they throw away the money with the purpose to impress and to get attention, giving a sens of normality to these women, obligating others men who want to stay in the race to bet more.
You can see this in western men ads in internet dating : a lot of them lie about their occupation, their wage, their job rank just to get women interested, because AW  have in general "high standards".

A recent US studies whom involved two psychologists was saying that US gals' egos have really inflate last years. They have some women of 40 who comes who are quite normal, normal situation, normal education, average beauty, and these ladies are spending time discussing with anger and lack of understanding why male F or male W don't focus about them, why male T after two meetings is no longer interested. Phsychologists was saying that they react as someone very specials who used to be treated specialyl, but they are not. They are common. And i have also meet this type of ladies in western, even some very young one. 

In FSU a woman who gets pregnant closes her options. More older she is, more childrens she gets and less options she has.
In the west, a wealthy men, more childrens he has, more time he got married, and less options he has.

[Muzh]

Must be the Sunday Night Moose Lodge Special.
 
Where do you guys get all these material ? Men trek to FSU and places like it not because of some silly allegations about the ills of western women. Nothing wrong with AWs. The very vast majority of American men support that notion. Darn enjoys it, too. A very scant, tiny, miniscule minority of AM (who, for the most part, are much later in their years, and/or, a bit wide around the girth), go to FSU because economic disparity between regions enable them to date/marry women (much) younger women than what they can only hope wish to date at home.
 
Not because AWs believe marriages is a threat to their independence. That's BS. If a man marries a FSUW and is indeed happy about it, drop the silly innuendoes and don't make anymore silly justification why you found yourself having to go abroad for a wife.
 
It is these types of silliness why this endeavor had largely been stigmatize both in the west and in the respective countries these women hail from. Folks concoct all kinds of reason other than just admitting the very obvious. Yes, even Russians who arrived in the US other than K-visas have a very low opinion of those that did.

You know I don't care much for anything you say but, in this case my hat's off to you sir. Well said.

The sad part is that the gents reading this are still cruising somewhere in Egypt.

[JR]

So my question for you all now is how hard is it to develop true feelings of love and chemistry with a woman living in the FSU.
Thoughts anyone?

That's a good one for Daveman. He spent a couple years and many many months face time wooing and winning his wife. They went thru their trials and came out on top.

[JR]

You know I don't care much for anything you say but, in this case my hat's off to you sir. Well said.

The sad part is that the gents reading this are still cruising somewhere in Egypt.

Why do you not care for it? It it absolutely, positively spot on for the vast majority of cases.

[Gator]

 A very scant, tiny, miniscule minority of AM (who, for the most part, are much later in their years, and/or, a bit wide around the girth), go to FSU because economic disparity between regions enable them to date/marry women (much) younger women than what they can only hope wish to date at home.
 

This was not the situation with you and your bride, so there are other factors in the equation.   Everyone is different.  A number of RW with an interest in foreign men are able to earn a decent income.   
Yes, it is easy to date RW; however, marriage is another matter entirely.  Personally, I ran away from desperate women and focused on those who  posed a challenge. 
A rhetorical question:   We always accept the premise that only a small percentage of the men who  write RW ever get on a plane.  I further assert that of those few men who do make the trip, a very small percentage actually marry.   My opinion is based on visiting Cindy Ageny offices and observing the number of men who visit, the number of women listed as engaged, and what the interpreters had to say.  Considering there are many economically desperate women ready to marry almost anyone, why are there so few marriages?     
 

    Folks concoct all kinds of reason other than just admitting the very obvious.   

 
I agree that much of the reasoning smacks of rationalizing and denial.   However, it could reflect a need for a compliant woman, hence the thought that AW are too independent.    [They are in for a surprise with a RW  .]   
 

[magnetic_fields]

Must be the Sunday Night Moose Lodge Special.
 
Where do you guys get all these material ? Men trek to FSU and places like it not because of some silly allegations about the ills of western women. Nothing wrong with AWs. The very vast majority of American men support that notion. Darn enjoys it, too. A very scant, tiny, miniscule minority of AM (who, for the most part, are much later in their years, and/or, a bit wide around the girth), go to FSU because economic disparity between regions enable them to date/marry women (much) younger women than what they can only hope wish to date at home.
 
Not because AWs believe marriages is a threat to their independence. That's BS. If a man marries a FSUW and is indeed happy about it, drop the silly innuendoes and don't make anymore silly justification why you found yourself having to go abroad for a wife.
 
It is these types of silliness why this endeavor had largely been stigmatize both in the west and in the respective countries these women hail from. Folks concoct all kinds of reason other than just admitting the very obvious. Yes, even Russians who arrived in the US other than K-visas have a very low opinion of those that did.

I think a better approach to this discussion would be to acknowledge why in fact western men spend so much time , energy, and money to travel thousands of miles to meet a woman they only met online from a completely foreign culture. It's simple really. Russian women just have so many great qualities ALL men admire: looks, intelligence, a feminine nature, and an overall willingness to be engaged in a long term relationship with the possibility of marriage/kids. If that ever changes (and it will eventually) then all these discussion boards and marriage agencies will disappear. 

There are still many opportunities to find a comparable woman in the west. This is undisputed. But how difficult is it compared to going abroad? I see varying degrees of success. 

Not to sound crude but if you were managing a business and your local market was over saturated with competition wouldn't you seek out other markets? 

If you can't find what you want locally then maybe it's time to search somewhere else? 

Unfortunately society has made it such a stigma to partake in these types of long distance marriages. But if you can get past it you'll find many examples of genuinely happy couples. To me that's the biggest challenge. 

And honestly when I started this search 5 years ago I never felt it was wrong or weird. I was just fascinated with Russian women. It's only after  I mentioned it to friends/family that it became such an issue. 

[GQBlues]

The gist of my point Gator however is, excuses men make to justify having to go abroad for their wife-shopping are just simply absurd. Period. A dose of introspection is in order for many of these men. It really does a great disservice for these women (FSUW) when their men can't seem to separate reality from their self-induced delusions. These women aren't stupid. They'll soon 'see' reality for themselves once they get here and see things for themselves.
 
It is exactly what Lily, and to some extent Donna-Pedro cited above. FSUWs, like AWs, for the most part aspire for better lives. No more, no less. A good husband, a good family, and a good standard of living. However, because of their respective countries' economic conditions, these two sets of sisters have polar societal conditions, and thus, disposition of achieving this common ideal  differ. It has very little to do with what is the right way or the wrong way. So, it has nothing to do with a very convenient excuse of "...these women are too pre-occupied in their careers..." vs "..."...these women are marriage-minded...".
 
It doesn't make one 'better' than the other, it just means given the differing conditions they are both in, they function within those parameters. But, given the exact same conditions, they'll exercise the exact same disposition. This is true with American, Canadian, UK, Australian, Swedish, French women, etc...vs.  Russian, Ukrainian, Moldovian, Vietnamese, Filipina, Thai, Chinese women, etc...
 
It is not a coincidence the the slow economic rise in Russia had slowly dissipated the flow of Russian women in the mail-order-bride industry. Because of improvement in THEIR economy, giving them a more broad choices and opportunities, the bride industry had slowed.
 
AWs do have the better opportunity and choices between the two. It shouldn't be looked upon as a negative, or a curse by these men, rather be taken as a huge positive. I would much rather be with a woman who is strong-willed, independent, ambitious, etc...regardless of where she comes from, as opposed to the opposite. Being ambitious and independence have nothing whatsoever to do with these women's natural tendency to yearn for their own family as FSUWs do. Just that their priorities differ. Given the same opportunity/choices platform available for AWs, FSUWs, in general, would do the very same thing any western women are doing.
 
Having said that, we're left with the 'men' and how they function within this. How they relate to respective women in their societies through themselves. These men would do themselves a huge favor, AND, the foreign women they pursue and eventually marry, to take a long hard look at *why* they have to go abroad for a relationship. Work on that, instead of blindly laying the blame to some deluded excuses.
 
It just looks silly. Being married to woman from Russia, one who now clearly understands, appreciate, and are very much aware of the reality of her experience and her existence within the circle of the women in her present day professional US athmosphere; these excuses are just simply insult to her, and women in the same plight, intelligence.

[GQBlues]

...
Not to sound crude but if you were managing a business and your local market was over saturated with competition wouldn't you seek out other markets? ....

No. You simply make youself more marketable. If you understand that it's a competitive market, then be competitive by improving your 'product'.