First timer headed to Ukraine

[jone]

It is a simple matter of economics. 

Have you been to Moscow or SPB lately?  The costs are astronomical.  Most men do not want the added expense of going to a pricey city.  And most of the women in these two Federal District cities are used to a standard of living that approaches or exceeds western standards.  There isn't repeated interest on the part of the men to go to or through these cities.  And the women there aren't really looking for something they already have.

One last item:  Ukraine is wide open for scammers.  Of any type.  Not just MOB industry.  So the system in Ukraine is flush with pictures of beautiful women, that may or may not be reality.

But on this forum, I must add that many of the men have found Russian brides.  I would think that the percentage is close to 50/50.  But I have seen very few FSU brides coming from one of the two federal cities.

It is ironic, that I am writing from Kharkov when I have business interests in the Golden Ring area of Russia, which I know quite well.  (Ivanovo is, after all, the City of Brides.)  But the question of Russia vs. Ukraine is one that I thought personally about before deciding on Ukraine.

[Anechka]

Jone, I'm from Saint-Petersburg, I go there quite often since my parents live there. Prices there are a bit lower than in NYC where I work, lol (I moved from NYC recently). As per Moscow, not much more expensive than NYC. But, I don't need to pay for the hotels since I stay at my friends' place, same in saint-Petersburg, I usually stay in my apartment.

As per standards, people are different everywhere, I have a few university friends living in the US, one is married to the US guy and quite happy though he just started his career and doesn't earn a lot. If a girl has feelings for a guy, she would accept him the way he is...

If the girls you met were just millionaire hunters, too bad for you...

Posted a couple of pictures of SPb, the ones I have with no faces of my friends and me.

[I/O]

(Ivanovo is, after all, the City of Brides.)

Really? Has it taken the title from Tver?
 
Anechka: Your question has been raised a few times and whilst I doubt there is a definitive answer, economics and geography seem to be the thing at the forefront of most punters minds when they head east and in that area, perception favours Ukraine. I travelled through Russia quite a bit before ever visiting Ukraine and I haven't been back to Ukraine since - I didn't dislike the place, in fact I didn't see a lot of it in the two weeks I was there mainly lazing on Odessa beaches, it just doesn't and didn't hold great interest for me. Ironically, I spent much of my time with a friend from Moscow, his wife and her family who had relocated (relatively short term) to Odessa to capitalise on a commercial opportunity.  Had I been specifically "bride hunting" at the time, I may have seen it differently as female company certainly wasn't hard to find, but neither was it anywhere in Russia on any trip. 
 
As for Putin, amusing comment but to be honest I don't think much of the world is very interested in his showmanship, much less afraid of him and if he bans emigration for marriage (not sure how he'd pull that one off), he'd probably be doing most idiot punters a favour as they would stop wasting their hard earned money in Russia.  Alternatively, like the banning of adoption, it may well create an instant black market?

[CDW]

Gator, I posted just after you.

 The issue is not the money or even her attitude about money. I just view it as her attitude towards life in general. She does not want to go to restaurant because she only eats fruits and vegetables. She does not seem to have interest in much. Does not make much effort to help me out...or make effort to check on me. I don't feel she is adventurous enough.

 Maybe I jump to all the wrong conclusions but this is how I feel. It will never work between us....so why keep trying?

You had plenty of time to ask these sort of questions when you "skyped" her

[CDW]

Just curious, why does everybody go to Ukraine? It's just my impression from the topics I saw... All Ukrainian towns and cities listed...

Too lazy to get a visa to Russia?  or too afraid of mr. Putin? He banned adoptions... So maybe ban of international marriages is on the way...

To get visa, invitation letter and to go to police station to report that I am here!  Too much hassle!!!

Ukraine is a visa free country - no need to have invitation letter or to go to the police.

And, Ukraine is smaller country than Russia, so visiting from city to city will be much easier.

However one of my main dreams is to be on Trans-Siberian railway from Moscow to Vladivostok !!

[Patagonie]

It is a simple matter of economics. 

Have you been to Moscow or SPB lately?  The costs are astronomical.  Most men do not want the added expense of going to a pricey city.  And most of the women in these two Federal District cities are used to a standard of living that approaches or exceeds western standards.  There isn't repeated interest on the part of the men to go to or through these cities.  And the women there aren't really looking for something they already have.

One last item:  Ukraine is wide open for scammers.  Of any type.  Not just MOB industry.  So the system in Ukraine is flush with pictures of beautiful women, that may or may not be reality.

But on this forum, I must add that many of the men have found Russian brides.  I would think that the percentage is close to 50/50.  But I have seen very few FSU brides coming from one of the two federal cities.

It is ironic, that I am writing from Kharkov when I have business interests in the Golden Ring area of Russia, which I know quite well.  (Ivanovo is, after all, the City of Brides.)  But the question of Russia vs. Ukraine is one that I thought personally about before deciding on Ukraine.

+1 well said.

[lonedrake]

 Day three:

 I have some serious concerns and was very upset this morning. It caused me some panic,but I feel better about it now. As I took a shower I immediately noticed a rash on my chest and shoulders. It was creeping up my neck too. This was a problem I had given almost no thought to. What do I do in an illness? Where do I go?  I was thinking about heading home...but then I thought....relax...think about it and don't get all worked up. I looked at the rash and it was definitely not poison ivy. I did fall asleep dressed last night and I was wearing a heavy cotton shirt that was new and had not been washed.

 Possible, but not sure so I laid down and kept it cool with a cold wash cloth. It started to get better. So I decided to proceed with my plans.

 But...I was still alone in Ukraine with no love and now no doctor

 So at 10:30 I called "Lena".  She had wanted me to call her in the morning as she wanted to make sure we were still on for 2pm. She had a 40 min bus ride to get over here. She was happy to hear from me and was going to call me 10 minutes or so before she was there. We were meeting at the giant christmas tree near my apartment. So I was hanging around the christmas tree and a policeman was there. So I spend a few minutes talking with him...or should I say trying to. I did get from him that the job is just ok and the pay is poor. He figured out I was an American and I was meeting a woman there.

 The phone rings and I see Lena walking towards me. This is good....she shows up on time

  Lena is in her late 30s and what interested me in her was her very upbeat and posiitve profile. As far as UK women go...she is bigger than average but still smaller than an average woman where I live by quite a bit.  I keep an open mind and concentrate on getting to know her. The conversation flows smoothly and she is definitely a take charge woman.  We end up in a very nice restaurant about 15 minutes west of city center.
 She helps me with the choices and I end up with some UK meat soup,a salad and "fire cooked" meat. Now with the bread....instead of butter....I guess they use pork fat with garlic? I must say I prefer butter. The salad kind of threw me off as there was no lettuce. Lena says lettuce at this time of year is impossible to get. I concentrate on the fire cooked meat(chicken,beef,pork) and it was delicious.
 We are talking and Lena is very funny. I really like her. She has a great attitude.
 Then she says to me "Steve you are a nice guy but I am looking for someone different. I like you and want to help you out. I have friend who has agency and I give you her number. Many nice girls to choose from"
 I didn't really know what to think, but I heard her out and was thankful for her honesty. I took the number and told her maybe I call tomorrow...maybe not.

 One might think that the date would go south from there, but it didn't. We had a lot of fun talking and she stayed with me until we arrived at my apartment. She insists that I call her just to talk if I need anything.  To me this was a good date. It showed me that there are honest, positive women in UKraine.....so there is hope.

 Is 5:30 when I get back to apartment. Yesterday I had set up a date with "Eva". I had emailed her once or twice a month ago. It had went nowhere. But I had called her yesterday on the telephone and her English was between Anna and Lena's. This is the girl that called me "hero". She is in her early 40s with no children. So I text her at 5:30 and let her know I will call her at 7pm.

 I lay down...and bam...next thing I know I wake up at 7:30. S*** d***  I am such an idiot!

 So I look at email and sure enough "This is not good. You find other woman. Not right"

 I call her and apologize up and down. I hate when people are late and here I did the same thing

 She agree to meet at 8:30 and I tell her I will be circling the christmas tree. She shows up at 8:30 and looks just like the pictures. Not a 10 but very beautiful in my eyes. So we walk a block or two north to a nice restaurant. I am not hungry so I just order a beer. She gets blackened salmon ? with a potato dish and a salad. But this salad had lettuce   Eva gets her food and basically dumps half on my plate. But this food is really,really good.  I will probably go back there on my own.

 The conversation is just as good as the food. I am learning that FSUW can be direct so I just lay it on the line. She says I am better looking in person and we make plans for tomorrow evening. She talks about going to the circus..but I am not sure if she knows how late it is open. I was thinking "a circus in Lugansk this time of year?' I guess it's possible.

 Eva does think I am crazy for coming over here at this time of year alone. It is to early to say...but Eva is the type of girl I can see a future with. I plan to spend as much time with her as I can.
 

[jone]

Jone, I'm from Saint-Petersburg, I go there quite often since my parents live there. Prices there are a bit lower than in NYC where I work, lol (I moved from NYC recently). As per Moscow, not much more expensive than NYC. But, I don't need to pay for the hotels since I stay at my friends' place, same in saint-Petersburg, I usually stay in my apartment.

As per standards, people are different everywhere, I have a few university friends living in the US, one is married to the US guy and quite happy though he just started his career and doesn't earn a lot. If a girl has feelings for a guy, she would accept him the way he is...

If the girls you met were just millionaire hunters, too bad for you...

Posted a couple of pictures of SPb, the ones I have with no faces of my friends and me.

I have never fished those waters.  Now it looks like I will never have the opportunity.  But if someone is making an evaluation as to why Odessa and not Russia, price is certainly a factor.   Have you evaluated hotels?  Swiss Hotel on Kremlin Island in Moscow, I used to get for $250 US a night.  Now is $450.  Similar costs all the way around.  And the Ruble isn't any better than it used to be against the dollar.  The demand is just higher.

Money is not really an issue for me.  But it is with many people I know, on this website or elsewhere.  Would you go to NYC trolling for a bride, knowing that you were from Kiwiland or the upper Midwest of the US, knowing the prices there?  Or would you go to, say, Mickolaev, where a night at the River Side gostinetsiya is only $45 USD per night? 

I am sure all of the women from SPB and Moscow are wonderful women.  But the entry price is slightly higher just to get an audience.  When I am in the Golden Ring I always spend my first night in Moscow.

Glad to see you here Anechka.  I actually have a friend that we call your diminutive.  She is an absolute sweetheart.  So you come with a good name and, for the most part, we are good company here.

Jon

[I/O]

I have friend who has agency

Lol, don't they all - the game hasn't changed a bit over the years. Bait and switch I think it was called 'back in the day'.

[Anechka]

Glad to see you here Anechka.  I actually have a friend that we call your diminutive.  She is an absolute sweetheart.  So you come with a good name and, for the most part, we are good company here.

Sorry, not sure about staying, the posts about guys "shopping" around for a wife make me a bit sick. I'm not sure if I were able to do such online dating and be a "mail-order bride", that's humiliating for the women he is dating, I think. That's regarding the post of lonedrake.

[Eduard]

Sorry, not sure about staying, the posts about guys "shopping" around for a wife make me a bit sick. I'm not sure if I were able to do such online dating and be a "mail-order bride", that's humiliating for the women he is dating, I think. That's regarding the post of lonedrake.

Мы выбираем, нас выбирают...  perhaps this may be the wrong choice of words for a Russian ear, nevertheless both women and men do the chosing when looking for a life partner and in most cases women are the ones who actually have the final say.

[lonedrake]

 Day 4. Slept like crap. I did go to sleep feeling pretty good about my meeting with Eva. It was also nice to receive this message from her this morning. She must have sent it right after she made it home.


Stephen goodnight, I have good mood and wonderful impression of you, I am very glad to meet you, We had a great time! you agree! when you're gone - again I made a mistake with the car and I had to wait for a taxi for a while, I am good to get there Thank you! tomorrow call me in 3 days, it is good, seeing I'll wait! sweet dreams!


 

[Faux Pas]

Sorry, not sure about staying, the posts about guys "shopping" around for a wife make me a bit sick. I'm not sure if I were able to do such online dating and be a "mail-order bride", that's humiliating for the women he is dating, I think. That's regarding the post of lonedrake.

Anechka
Please don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out 

Why are you here, only to protest a photo from 13 years ago? Are you not capable of contributing to discourse other than protesting. From your minute' posts you strike me as as having half of a brain and well above intelligence than your AD brethren. Please do stay. We welcome your input to our little forum. We do however encourage the pissing and moaning be left at AD 

[Belvis]

As I took a shower I immediately noticed a rash on my chest and shoulders.

Must be the allergic reaction for chlorinated water. Or consequences of "poisoned" wood. You've got women there to save you  in the case of emergency

Now with the bread....instead of butter....I guess they use pork fat with garlic?

It is 'salo'. Kind of brand Ukrainian food. Very nice to  take with vodka.

I am not hungry so I just order a beer

Not a good idea if situation unfolds in that way you'll be kissing her. They 're pretty sensitive to beer fumes.

[cc3]

Next time...I guess if there is a next time....I will be renting a car.

Lonedrake, congrats on daring to venture to the far reaches of eastern Ukraine in your quest for a good woman   . I am a Lugansk regular and already have the best woman in the city (brillynt will disagree). I have driven the round trip Donetsk-Lugansk-Donetsk, after driving 400 miles across southern Ukraine from northwestern Krym. It's not a feat that I would like to repeat. When you see the road and traffic conditions in the daylight, you will considerably lower your opinion of Ukrainian roads and drivers. If you become a repeat visitor, learn enough Russian to negotiate the cab fare (should be 35 to 50 gr) from the airport to the train station and to purchase your train ticket to Lugansk. Your chances of survival on the journey will rise astronomically by taking the train (last one to Lugansk leaves around 5 pm). Besides, when you are in Lugansk, as you're probably now discovering, there is absolutely no need for a car. what with marshrutkas, busses, trams and taxis, and the city center is completely walkable.

I just departed Lugansk, Jan 12, after 29 days of western and eastern holiday celebrations...Nina and I met brillynt and his very lovely lady on one of my last days in town. Hope your visit is as successful as his (I haven't read further downthread to see how it's going...I have just arrived home in Colorado and my system is out of whack with the local time + sleep deprivation).   

[cc3]

During our dating stage I gave my wife money to keep and use for expenses we would incur. Buying tickets, paying for taxi and anything else that may arise. I thought nothing of it. Once I gave her the money I considered it spent. When we visit Russia together, I still do. It helps to avoid English conversations at inopportune times

Same here. My fiancee is my 'in country' financial manager because: 1-she's Russian/Ukrainian fluent; I'm not, 2-she's local economy savvy; I'm not, 3-she's a better money manger on transportation, apartment rentals and market/rynok shopping than I, 4-she knows it's 'our' money and is very loathe to squander any.

[cc3]

Just curious, why does everybody go to Ukraine? It's just my impression from the topics I saw... All Ukrainian towns and cities listed...

Too lazy to get a visa to Russia?  or too afraid of mr. Putin? He banned adoptions... So maybe ban of international marriages is on the way...

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/13/world/europe/russian-lawmakers-move-to-purge-foreign-influences.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0   Fourth paragraph: proposal to ban all Russian officials from marrying foreigners. After this is approved, expect the next step to be complete ban on foreign marriages for all Russian citizens. The xenophobic hysteria in Russia is becoming ludicrous. Thank God for eastern Ukraine, where I found my 'Russian' fiancee! 

[lonedrake]

 I don't really feel like posting this,but I believe it is something one always needs to consider.

 Today my rash got worse. It moved up my neck and up towards my ears. I called my contact and he set up an appointment with a dermatologist. The doctor said it's just an allergic reaction to something new. " Have I eaten,drank or been exposed to anything new?"

 So it's pretty hard to narrow down the cause. I received a shot,some medicine and creame.

 I feel good otherwise but have not decided if I should cancel plans for tonight. It's a tough call.

[Belvis]

So it's pretty hard to narrow down the cause. I received a shot,some medicine and creame.

 I feel good otherwise but have not decided if I should cancel plans for tonight. It's a tough call.

Very high chance that the problem is tap water. If you're not an allergic person it may be just too hard water for your skin. As I remember a few AM experienced troubles from FSU water at wife-hunting visits. Nobody died. Do not hesitate to ask your woman for help. Good test of her attitude.

[Anechka]

Мы выбираем, нас выбирают...  perhaps this may be the wrong choice of words for a Russian ear, nevertheless both women and men do the chosing when looking for a life partner and in most cases women are the ones who actually have the final say.

Yes, we choose and someone else chooses us... The post is not about that, I don't see any feelings in the guy's post, I can write the same report of me shopping for a new skirt or dress. He has the same attitude, that is what's appalling. You shop in Ukraine since it's cheaper and less hassle with the documents...

[lonedrake]

 The water sounds logical. Thats what Rich had mentioned.

 No more showers

 I called Eva and explained the situation. As I was telling her I could feel the disappointment in her voice......so I ended it with ....." I still want to see you but you have to promise not to laugh at me"

 We will see. Apparently see has purchased a "surprise" for me. It was cute to me as she could not even keep it a secret.

 She also said" Bring Grivnas, I take you to place I think you will like"

 I went to the bank in the supermarket. What I have found is that I don't need to say one word. Just give them 100 and get your grivnas.

 Another thing I noticed today that I had not picked on up before is the checkout lady always ask if you want a bag...as they charge for the bags. I had thought she was just saying "hi". No wonder they would look at me funny when I would just reply "Hello"

  I stopped at one of the little flowers shops to buy a bouquet of flowers. It appeared to be a husband and wife combo that ran the store. They started talking to me and all I could say is "no Russian" after a few times they understood. Not knowing any prices at all I say grivnas and point to different roses. 5 for this 6 for 7 for that etc. I act like I am mulling the prices over before I ask about prices on bouquets. Ended up picking up a bouquet for 70 grivnas.  The funny thing is I have no idea if it even matters. Maybe they give the same prices to everyone no matter what. Maybe they automatically double the price as soon as they know I speak no russian.

 The rah swelling and itching has gone down so now I just wait for Eva at 7.

 

[lonedrake]

Anechka,

  What you perceive is not reality. Its more likely that I have a hard time communicating my feelings through the written word.

 I am very excited about seeing Eva tonight. Giddy is a better word.

[Faux Pas]

  I stopped at one of the little flowers shops to buy a bouquet of flowers. It appeared to be a husband and wife combo that ran the store. They started talking to me and all I could say is "no Russian" after a few times they understood. Not knowing any prices at all I say grivnas and point to different roses. 5 for this 6 for 7 for that etc. I act like I am mulling the prices over before I ask about prices on bouquets. Ended up picking up a bouquet for 70 grivnas.  The funny thing is I have no idea if it even matters. Maybe they give the same prices to everyone no matter what. Maybe they automatically double the price as soon as they know I speak no russian.

"Nyet Purooski" they'll understand

[Anechka]

Anechka,

  What you perceive is not reality. Its more likely that I have a hard time communicating my feelings through the written word.

 I am very excited about seeing Eva tonight. Giddy is a better word.

If I understand correctly, you were writing letters to each other, Skype, etc, finally, you came to Ukraine to meet her and... Nothing lol, just a plain description of who and where you met...

[Eduard]

Yes, we choose and someone else chooses us... The post is not about that, I don't see any feelings in the guy's post, I can write the same report of me shopping for a new skirt or dress. He has the same attitude, that is what's appalling. You shop in Ukraine since it's cheaper and less hassle with the documents...

Anechka (my younger daughter's name is also Anechka by the way  ), don't you think that "appalling" might be a bit strong of a word to use in this particular situation? What feelings are you looking for? The guy is meeting these women for the first time in his life, remember?
I personally don't focus on Ukraine only when I work with my guys. We look for the right woman and not for the "right" country or city. My guys chat with many women on line, then when they feel a great connection they go to meet a woman no matter where she lives - Ukraine/Russia, Belarus/Moldova or Kazakhstan. It's about finding good connection, good chemistry, good attraction, so I disagree with men who only go to Ukraine to look for a wife. I believe they are limiting their choices tremendously, but to each his own