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Author Topic: Update - 13 years later  (Read 135931 times)

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Offline Doll

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #725 on: November 05, 2017, 01:25:07 PM »
The boys just couldn't stand the "replacement" of their mother.

Offline Boethius

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #726 on: November 05, 2017, 05:20:04 PM »
The boys just couldn't stand the "replacement" of their mother.

It doesn't sound as if the "replacement" interacts with them much, if they eat a late dinner without her daughter, and she doesn't get home until late in the evening.  northkape should be grateful they aren't into drugs or other issues teens at that age have (assuming they aren't), given the length of time they are alone. 

Think of the message  you are giving  your sons, northkape.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2017, 03:22:26 PM by Boethius »
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Offline Doll

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #727 on: November 05, 2017, 05:32:59 PM »
Boethius , NK doesn't tells us even half of what really is happening.

Yet, my posting was NOT about how each of them act- I can imagine how hurtful their mom and dad's divorce was for them when their mother had to leave the house .Why? Why did the boys stay with NK? Do you really know?
For a FSU woman to have to leave two young children is horrible. It's a huge drama for both boys and Lena.
Doesn't matter who eats what and at what time with them- they will never forgive.

« Last Edit: November 05, 2017, 05:37:22 PM by Doll »

Offline JayH

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #728 on: November 05, 2017, 06:29:46 PM »
Boethius , NK doesn't tells us even half of what really is happening.

Yet, my posting was NOT about how each of them act- I can imagine how hurtful their mom and dad's divorce was for them when their mother had to leave the house .Why? Why did the boys stay with NK? Do you really know?
For a FSU woman to have to leave two young children is horrible. It's a huge drama for both boys and Lena.
Doesn't matter who eats what and at what time with them- they will never forgive.

If I recall correctly --this was an amiable parting of the ways with previous wife -- and an ongoing amiable relationship.
That would help the sons--  correct?

To NK -- I am wondering if Tanya's issues with you are the same or similar to previous wife's issues?
Was there another one prior to that?
Not trying to flame you here --  we all have characteristics and mannerisms that do not change much without awareness and concerted effort.  Fwiw-- I get on very well with all my ex's -- some from long ago and more recent - they all still love me !! -- at least a little !
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 translated as: Glory to Ukraine! Glory to the heroes!!!  is a Ukrainian greeting slogan being used now all over Ukraine to signify support for a free independent Ukraine

Offline southernX

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #729 on: November 05, 2017, 07:53:46 PM »
Quote
that was my leniency, my husband would have taken it much longer-he gave them one warning, and that was it.  He once stopped driving, took a toy they were arguing about which he'd told them to stop arguing about, and ran it over.   

i can relate to this totally , i have done the same thing except it was thrown out the window of the car as we travelled after one warning , :D not run over    :D

such direct action has a very imediate impact on their bickering about minor items in life  they quickly learn to resolve things themsleves if they can before looking to parents for authority rullings 

kids learn which parent will talk and which one will act very quickly ...action speaks louder than words   IMO always have and that does not alter over generations 

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Offline kynrazor

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #730 on: November 06, 2017, 12:44:53 AM »

On a similar note, is this a joyful marriage?  Why would you want to be with someone who criticizes you endlessly?


Simple really. It took Northkape over a year to find his wife along with some significant "life changes" (eg. visa, moving and living partly in Sweden) to be able to finally be with current wife. Now at the age of 60, with "economic problems", I doubt he wants to take his chances and do it all over again.  :P

I hope for the best for Northkape. Tanya seems like a good and responsible woman and I know many women who can be far worse till you wished you have never known her.  :devil:

Perhaps it is only human to have some favouritism or prejudice. Personally, I think it has taught me to steer clear of single mothers for now, until I understand the family dynamics better perhaps.  :rolleyes:
« Last Edit: November 06, 2017, 01:01:21 AM by kynrazor »
Sincerely,
Kyn

Offline Doll

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #731 on: November 06, 2017, 03:29:44 AM »

If I recall correctly --this was an amiable parting of the ways with previous wife -- and an ongoing amiable relationship.
That would help the sons--  correct?

 
Jay, you are referring to NK's writing here but let's look at the situation: the mother of two young children is forced out the house and the family when she has to leave two boys to live with their father. Lena is FSU woman, remember? For us, this is the worst drama. Divorce is divorce but to have to leave two children is horrible. I can't see anything amicable in it.
What made it worse- a "new" wife with a teen girl.
The chances that this new marriage could work were slim to nothing.
Again, I am writing all this knowing FSU women mentality.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2017, 05:56:52 AM by Doll »

Offline Madlen

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #732 on: November 06, 2017, 06:51:10 AM »
Again, I am writing all this knowing FSU women mentality.

Doll, you are russian woman :), so, of cource, you know about our mentality.
But look around. There are a lot of good international families.

It's not just a matter of mentality. This is a matter of sincerity and honesty of a woman. Our women are different: kind and not, wise and not, educated and not... This is the same, as in other countries

And else.
Each woman has the right to desire a decent life. But she need understand, that she will pay for this. I mean not finance.
If she want good man, good country, better finational level, she need be ready to pay : to be best friend, lover and wife for husband.

On the other hand, a man also has what he deserves. It is not good or bad. It is his choice.



« Last Edit: November 06, 2017, 07:04:29 AM by Madlen »
Be as You are).

Offline ML

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #733 on: November 06, 2017, 10:32:57 AM »
Jay, you are referring to NK's writing here but let's look at the situation: the mother of two young children is forced out the house and the family when she has to leave two boys to live with their father. Lena is FSU woman, remember? For us, this is the worst drama. Divorce is divorce but to have to leave two children is horrible. I can't see anything amicable in it.
What made it worse- a "new" wife with a teen girl.
The chances that this new marriage could work were slim to nothing.
Again, I am writing all this knowing FSU women mentality.

You have the story completely wrong.
It was Lena who wanted to end the marriage, Lena who wanted to leave the home and make a career in Oslo, Lena who wanted the boys to stay with their father, Lena who helped him find the new wife Tanya.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Offline Doll

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #734 on: November 06, 2017, 10:49:57 AM »
You have the story completely wrong.
It was Lena who wanted to end the marriage, Lena who wanted to leave the home and make a career in Oslo, Lena who wanted the boys to stay with their father, Lena who helped him find the new wife Tanya.
Then she is crazy. Anyway, my major point is that the boys didn't accept the "new mother". I don't blame them.

Offline Madlen

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #735 on: November 06, 2017, 11:26:25 AM »
the boys didn't accept the "new mother". I don't blame them.


Of cource, it is not their task.

To create peace and quiet in the family - it is the duty of a wise woman.

Only woman creates climate in the family, but not husband and children.
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Offline GQBlues

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #736 on: November 06, 2017, 11:27:20 AM »

Question was asked: "This will get better when the boys move to their mother.
How old is Sofia?"



Response: "It certainly will Doll,,,
In summertime when boys are in Ukraine for almost two months, there are much less, and softer conflicts."



I'm not sure who to really feel sorry for, you or your sons? Maybe both.


Such a sad reality you placed yourself unto. Is your attraction to this woman really worth the seeming time lost with your boys at the crucial ages they're in today? Not judging. Just a rhetorical question.
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Offline pitbull

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #737 on: November 06, 2017, 11:52:05 AM »

Of cource, it is not their task.

To create peace and quiet in the family - it is the duty of a wise woman.

Only woman creates climate in the family, but not husband and children.


In this worldview, it is a man's sole responsibility to financially provide for his family - wife and children. The woman should not worry or know where the money is coming from.


Both NK and Tanya seem to be failing in their duties.
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Offline Doll

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #738 on: November 06, 2017, 11:52:25 AM »
GQBlues, I felt sorry for the boys when their mother left. Not now! Now they are rejoining with her.
Jan is staying with his new family. I wish him luck.

Jan, was it really Lena's desire to leave her boys and go build he career?
Actually , it is not bad for her- to be patient for 4 years and have her boys back.

Jan, I might have missed something- why did you get divorced with Lena?
« Last Edit: November 06, 2017, 11:57:36 AM by Doll »

Offline pitbull

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #739 on: November 06, 2017, 11:57:03 AM »
I know why Tanya is doing this. Actually Jan said it already.


I've seen this story with WM's step-kids and RW's kids play out on russian-fiancee over and over again - all along the same lines as Tanya and Jan's story. Very typical.
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Offline Doll

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #740 on: November 06, 2017, 12:01:20 PM »

I've seen this story with WM's step-kids and RW's kids play out on russian-fiancee over and over again - all along the same lines as Tanya and Jan's story. Very typical.
I've seen hundreds stories like this.
 

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #741 on: November 06, 2017, 05:48:14 PM »
Maybe not good or bad but just difference in culture i noticed. I presume the kids are in their teens and it's interesting for me to note that they had to wait till 9 PM for dinner to be cooked for them.

I think I had amassed more than a few recipes in my head by the time I was 10. Shopped for the ingredients too. Just an observation. Means nothing in the overall scheme of life.
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Offline Boethius

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #742 on: November 06, 2017, 06:06:18 PM »
I assumed the delay was so that they could eat together as a family.
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Offline LAman

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #743 on: November 06, 2017, 07:59:56 PM »
I assumed the delay was so that they could eat together as a family.

My kids were going to bed at 8:30ish, after bath and brush teeth. Of course, before dinner at 6ish all homework was checked and explained/helped.

Can figure how kids were eating dinner at 9, were they put to bed directly after dinner....hopefully by 11pm?

Don't know about the OP, but any women I would consider to be my partner would need to treat my kids with care, maybe not as well as her own kids(understood) but a caring open person would help I am sure.
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Offline northkape

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #744 on: November 06, 2017, 10:07:07 PM »
Holy shit,, what a load of critic,
I don't have a lot of time for answering, as it's half past two in the morning, and I'm just out of shover, before going to bed.
As usual, I'm up late, cleaning everything in kitchen and making ready for breakfast at seven, when boys are dressed and ready for eating.

Mhr,,, Yes, a partner that seemingly loves to criticize you, isn't easy to live together with. Tanya has a part of this in her personality, but not all the time.
It used to make me a little upset at times, but now I more or less ignore it, which makes it less strain on our relationship.
There are a lot of good reasons for her to criticize me however, but not necessarily repeating it again and again.
She has her faults, just like me. Weighing the good against the bad, and learning to accept each others faults is a part of building a strong relationship.

Hi Jan, thanks for extensive update.  Happy for the good news, sad for your bad news.

1) Why didn't you immediately switch to Norwegian when she first arrived?

2) You said: "Tanya and me are at work together."
Do you mean at the same work location . . . or do you just mean you two are at work during same time period?

3) You are eating large meal after 9 in evenings??

4) How does this work out logistically  . . .  living mostly in Sweden and partly in Norway.
You have 2 different actual homes?  And how far apart are these homes?
And why isn't the Swedish language also part of the necessity for all of you??
How do the children attend school in Norway, if they live mostly in Sweden?

5) Children start college in Norway at age 15 ???
Is this really a college like children in USA start at age 18-19 after 13 years of secondary schooling (Kindergarten + 12th grade)?

ML,,, Not as bad news as all this critics are reading into it,
maybe I painted it with too much negativity, in a somewhat wide brush.

1. Not possible, have to live in Sweden for at least 6 months before you can use the EU right to free movement.
2. Tanya is using half of first floor in my office building for her business, so we are working together, which we both enjoy.
3. Yes, and for Tanya quite normal, as she was used to working long hours, before meeting with me.
4. Renting apartment in Sweden, my house in Norway 35-40 minutes apart. Swedish and Norwegian languages are quite similar, so close to the border.
5. Not exactly the same as college,,, International business school, The other students are 17, my boys are 15 as they have skipped two levels along the way.
It is usually not allowed in Norway, but sometimes necessary if a student is too far out in front of the others.

Bo,,,
In my opinion, it might be an idea, to add the "in my opinion" to your absolutes sometimes, making it sound slightly nicer.
For me, I wouldn't feel anywhere close to being intelligent, if trying to advice others how to live their lives, based solely on a twenty line view,
into a tiny part of their daily life.

But your optimism has real effects on your sons, who had no say in bringing Tanya into their lives, or how she relates to them.

My boys were born with an optimistic father. it's a personality trait that I was born with. In fact, the number one reason that I'm always happy about my life.
I was unfortunately born with a pessimistic father.

I have often said that parents should not remarry while they have the responsibility of children, and this, and the split family problems, is the reason why.  Children have no say in the step parent brought into their lives, which is why they often act out.  And then, people are upset at the deterioration of "family values". 

The majority of women in Scandinavia has a different opinion on mixed families.
it's not always working good, same as in many struggling marriages where they stay together.
Other families manage well, and then everything in between.
Children have no say in what parents they are born with either.

The daughter should have ZERO say in this.  You and Tanya need to resolve this, and the children need to be told that their views on the matter are not required.

Have no idea what you are talking about here.
In my home, children have the right to voice their opinion about things related to them.

Our children are all close in age, only a year between our two oldest, 3 years between the oldest and youngest.  IMHO, growing up in a family of girls, and having an oldest girl and then two boys, girls are far more vicious, difficult, and bossy.  At the ages of your children, when there was a conflict (almost always involving our daughter and one of our sons, our sons never fought), the solution was simple.  If they were fighting over something, none of them had access to it.  It was removed because they couldn't resolve the issue.  We never had issues with them arguing over chores, it was always over the x-box, or control of the tv remote.  Solution?  It's gone for a day (and to be honest, that was my leniency, my husband would have taken it much longer-he gave them one warning, and that was it.  He once stopped driving, took a toy they were arguing about which he'd told them to stop arguing about, and ran it over.  So, from very early childhood, they learned how to resolve their conflicts before appealing to him.  I was the "soft" one, and their conflicts were always when my husband was at work).  So I suggest if there is an argument over chores, each of them be given a task that must be completed by X day, all on the same schedule.  When the consequences are less pleasant than the argument, the arguments will, eventually, stop.

Not relevant here at all. There are no fighting between boys and Sofia about any physical object ever. First priority for most children this age today, seems to be social media.

I don't know how you can argue over who forgot to do chores, either they are assigned or they are not, and in the latter case, what good is the finger pointing?  Just call them all in, have them all do the chore together, and suggest they all try to remember their duties.

Not relevant, misunderstanding.
No arguing, but Tanya criticizing boys, and Sofia agreeing, even though she might be as guilty as boys.

Why are you avoiding this?  It should be resolved, not avoided.  Avoidance eventually creates resentment.  Also, why is this even an issue for Tanya?  She is coming home late, they are away all weekend, so it seems she barely interacts with them.

Escalating a conflict is like adding fuel to fire, might take days to overcome.
Keeping mouth shut and more or less ignoring the critic, or just agreeing, means no conflict, and all forgotten ten minutes later.

From your description, it appears she is correct on the split, though if Tanya doesn't like it, she needs to be training them to do these things with patience.  It sounds as if she doesn't have patience and has a "my way or the highway" attitude.  It doesn't matter if you didn't teach them, complaining about it is non productive.

Except for the last sentence, which I agree with, you are reading something into your mind that I never wrote.

This to me, is especially sad.  Your boys are really raising themselves.  Do they ever hear a positive word from Tanya?  When you look back at this time, will you honestly be able to say you spent quality time with your sons?  It seems to be a significant change from their life prior to your marriage.  Why not just let them move to Oslo now?  None of their activities or school work will suffer, long term, assuming their mother is home in the evenings.  Wouldn't that be better for them than being on pins and needles in their own home, and spending a majority of their evenings alone?  What kind of family life is this for them?  If payments are the issue, ask Lena if she can forgo some of that while you get back on your feet, with help from you as you can manage.

Really Bo, you have no idea what you are talking about,,,
I have told earlier in this thread about twins, and how they can create their own little family inside a family.
My boys have this, along with the good and the bad effects related to it.
Anyway it makes them very robust for handling external family situations.

They are home after school and activities, if you didn't notice. Boys always had a lot of activities after school.
Nowadays: Piano lessons two times a week (one classic the other modern) same teacher for almost ten years, chess evening once a week, gym center two - three times a week, sometimes painting & drawing where they also have been with the same teacher for almost ten years.
And they voluntarily participate in the homework club at their school, at least once a week after school. The brightest students, along with teachers, are helping the less talented students do their homework.
Sometimes they are barely home before us, other days an hour or two before. They usually make a quick meal when coming home, at the same time they are doing their homework.

And of course Tanya is saying positive things to my boys, she has a good relationship with Mikael, and he likes her.
Daniel is a very bright, intelligent boy, but introvert and difficult to get close to, for me and Lena also, even though he like Lena more than me.
It's easy for Tanya also, to see, that many times, Mikael would prefer to stay with us instead of going to Lena in the weekend.

If it was somehow possible to force boys to move to Oslo now,,
It would be the saddest day in their life, and over Lena's dead body.

On a similar note, is this a joyful marriage?  Why would you want to be with someone who criticizes you endlessly?

Answered partly above,,,, she has her faults and so do I,,,,
But she is a joy to be with most of the time, my mother and sister loves her, same with her customers and all of my friends, this was not always the case with Lena.

Tanya is multitalented designer with a creative mind, can visualize and turn 3D objects inside her mind, before making a drawing of it.
We have a lot in common,,, perfectionist craftsmanship, an eye for details, aesthetic harmony in colors and form, ++
 
It sounds as if she is better with money.  Why not let her manage the finances?

Didn't you read, there is nothing to manage, as there is a hole waiting for every penny.
And she would need to know Norwegian plus a lot more, if there was something to manage.

She should have no problems travelling now on a Ukrainian biometric passport.

Yes, no problems,, needing a visa for going a weekend to London,,,, USA, just forget it, on an Ukrainian passport.

Ouch half past five,,,,
More to follow when time allows..

Offline Boethius

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #745 on: November 06, 2017, 10:46:30 PM »
The majority of women in Scandinavia has a different opinion on mixed families.
it's not always working good, same as in many struggling marriages where they stay together.
Other families manage well, and then everything in between.
Children have no say in what parents they are born with either.


True, children haven't a say in the parents they are born with, but their parents do have a say in minimizing negative impacts on ther lives.

Quote
Have no idea what you are talking about here.
In my home, children have the right to voice their opinion about things related to them.


And how's that working for you?

Quote
Not relevant here at all. There are no fighting between boys and Sofia about any physical object ever. First priority for most children this age today, seems to be social media.


I was merely providing an example of how I dealt with similar arguments between my children.  Your children are, by your account, arguing about silly things (chores).  The point is, they shouldn't be arguing about these things to a degree where it causes a stress in the family.  The adults should be setting the rules so that these disputes do not occur.

Quote
Not relevant, misunderstanding.
No arguing, but Tanya criticizing boys, and Sofia agreeing, even though she might be as guilty as boys.


I can't imagine that ever happening in our family, as our children would have been told the very first time it occurred that their views on this are neither needed nor appreciated.  The fact she feels she can add her two cents on this is troubling, from a family cohesion perspective.

Quote
Escalating a conflict is like adding fuel to fire, might take days to overcome.
Keeping mouth shut and more or less ignoring the critic, or just agreeing, means no conflict, and all forgotten ten minutes later.


True, although you then never get to the root of the problem. 

Except for the last sentence, which I agree with, you are reading something into my post that I never wrote.

Quote
Really Bo, you have no idea what you are talking about,,,
I have told earlier in this thread about twins, and how they can create their own little family inside a family.
My boys have this, along with the good and the bad effects related to it.
Anyway it makes them very robust for handling external family situations.

I am only responding to what you write.

I have several sets of twins within my family (not my nuclear family, but siblings, in laws, and grandparents), as does my husband.  In fact, we thought there was a good chance, given this, that we'd have twins but alas, that did not occur.  While the twins in my family are all close (so close that on both sides, our twin grandparents dies within weeks of each other), they have all been affected by the unfairness of life around them.

Quote
They are home after school and activities, if you didn't notice. Boys always had a lot of activities after school.
Nowadays: Piano lessons two times a week (one classic the other modern) same teacher for almost ten years, chess evening once a week, gym center two - three times a week, sometimes painting & drawing where they also have been with the same teacher for almost ten years.
And they voluntarily participate in the homework club at their school, at least once a week after school. The brightest students, along with teachers, are helping the less talented students do their homework.
Sometimes they are barely home before us, other days an hour or two before. They usually make a quick meal when coming home, at the same time they are doing their homework.


Why do they need so much scheduling?  Can't they just be kids?  I'm not criticizing you, just asking.
Quote
And of course Tanya is saying positive things to my boys, she has a good relationship with Mikael, and he likes her.
Daniel is a very bright, intelligent boy, but introvert and difficult to get close to, for me and Lena also, even though he like Lena more than me.
It's easy for Tanya also, to see, that many times, Mikael would prefer to stay with us instead of going to Lena in the weekend.

This, to me, is the tragedy of a broken family.  And yes, this is my opinion.

Quote
Yes, no problems,, needing a visa for going a weekend to London,,,, USA, just forget it, on an Ukrainian passport.

Ouch half past five,,,,
More to follow when time allows..

Do some Schengen travel, and other worlds will open up.  The fear of those countries is that the Ukrainian is going to stay there.  Proof of other Schengen travel, and residency in Sweden should ease those fears, though you will need a visa.

Finally, everything here is my opinion.  I used to have an avatar to that effect.  I can't believe I have to post that.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2017, 04:19:09 PM by Boethius »
True love begins when nothing is looked for in return.  Antoine de Saint-Exupery

Offline Sting23

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #746 on: November 07, 2017, 02:08:45 PM »
northkape- very interesting thread.  Shows that relationships ebb and flow over time, things happen in life and people split up.  Hope your current situation is well.  Alot of criticism by other posters. Guess that's easy to do on a forum.  Only you and your former wife, current wife and children know.

I read through the first part of the thread, was the main disagreement with your ex-wife about careers and her working? 

Offline ML

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #747 on: November 07, 2017, 05:58:39 PM »
Jan, thanks for answering my questions.

In number 1, I meant why didn't you immediately start using Norwegian language with Tanya.  Forced use leads to quickest learning.
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

Offline northkape

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #748 on: January 03, 2018, 06:51:29 AM »
Happy new year for all and everyone here,, from me and Tanya



Sorry for not commenting on all critics about my last posting,,, but I see no reason,,,
In general, I think that the daily interaction between members in any family is to complex to be diagnosed based on reading a few lines of text.
And even more so within a family like mine,,,
even though its possible for an outsider to diagnose and criticize my family life in such a way, it's mostly non relevant noise in my ears.

Anyway life goes on, so quickly, we are already celebrating our 3 year anniversary today.
And our family is doing well going into the new year.

Even with all the economic misery we are going through,
we tried to go on a short weekend trip to some destination within 10 hour driving time, every month or so.
Amusement parks, skiing, nature, mountains, by boat and so on, for all of our family to have a good time together.

Here are a few photos from last year,,,,















__________________________________________________________________________ ____

For NewYears celebration, Tanya, Sofia and me went on a weekend cruise from Stockholm to Riga.
Boys were with Lena and her new man.



Tanya is like me in many ways, multitalented and capable of learning a large variety of skills with both hands and brain.
She has a master degree in business administration, but is also a professional designer and taylor.
For NewYears eve she wanted something really special,,
so in the morning of 30th of January, she made a drawing and showed it to me, I like :-)
Then she got started, making templates, cutting fabric and sewing.
She wasn't able to finish her dress before we were leaving for Stockholm,
so she finished it by hand inside our cabin, in the last hour before dinner.
Here she is trying it on, just before we go for the evening dinner and party.



Even with the ship crowded with people,,,,
I have never seen so many heads twisted, men and women, all ages, as we were walking upstairs for the dinner.

So many times, people are thinking that Tanya and her daughter are sisters or close friends.
They are usually shocked to hear that there is 21 years between them, Sofia 14 and Tanya 35.



In the late night disco, after midnight for dancing,,,





Offline ML

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Re: Update - 13 years later
« Reply #749 on: January 08, 2018, 12:03:26 PM »
Hi Jan.  Great pics; thanks for posting them and the updates.

In pic where the gals are dancing . . . what happened to the bottom of Tanya's dress that previously dragged on the floor?
A 'hitch-up' feature incorporated?
Winston Churchill.  “The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.”

 

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