She wants me to guarantee her security in the US before she comes...

[vwrw]

OR some men want to show their financial abilities.

Yes, fortunately for those women, there are men who feel great in the provider role and feel emasculated  if the role is taken from them. To each her/his own.

[BillyB]

Hi,  Let's not go off in the wrong direction.  I am going to offer her $5K a month.  This is equal to her take home pay NOW.  She will have legal documentation that states a period of time where that $5K would be paid to her if she decides to leave.   I think that is more than fair.   

Doesn't matter what you think is fair. Your state has guidelines based on what you earn and own that determines what's fair. A prenup gets weaker the more it strays from those guidelines.


If you allowed yourself a $5000 a month for personal use that the wife isn't allowed to touch, would you think that is a good thing to do to your wife? Your wife should have faith in you that you can take care of her and the family adequately. If sex is important to you, do you think it's right to have it in writing that the wife provides a certain amount of sex to satisfy your needs every week? Think about the arrangement you're about to make. If it's not okay for you to make guaranteed in writing demands, then it's not okay for her to do it.

[Misha]

OR some men want to show their financial abilities.
I don't think that a woman with $5,000 will expect a man to pay what he paid for.
OR she does not make this money.

I expect the latter is the most likely scenario. I still don't see how it is possible to earn that much working with children in Turkey.

[Gator]

One of my friends express it this way....only the men who can give birth to children are exempt from assuming the provider role in her views.

  Yet true in a traditional society IF the woman is indeed rearing children.

[JohnDearGreen]

FSUW at forum are pussycats as compared with what you may experience in real life. 

It will probably not end here with these demands.  This is just indicative of her personality type which you will have to continue to deal with.  When it is time to get her a car, she will demand a certain model (not a Chevy).   When time for a new house, she will want to make the choice.  If you have a kid (you don't) she would probably demand a certain university (not the State U).   I just say probably.  Maybe, maybe not.  That is your guess to make. She must have many positive attributes that you like, so it is your decision. 

[Gator]

I expect the latter is the most likely scenario. I still don't see how it is possible to earn that much working with children in Turkey.

[Misha]

Yes, fortunately for those women, there are men who feel great in the provider role and feel emasculated  if the role is taken from them. To each her/his own.

Well, I have yet to meet such men in Russia    How many Russian men pay the living expenses for their girlfriends before they live together? How many will not expect their wives to work once they are married? I don't know of such men. The only men who would pay women monthly stipends were those who "sponsored" women and I have yet to meet any woman who did not work and did not contribute to the family budget when married to a Russian in Russia... Maybe they exist, but I did not really hang around with oligarchs and their wives

[Gator]

She has a condo in Ukraine and will need to sell it.  I offered to match her cash and that we would buy a place together, jointly. 

Reasonable.

I do have to protect what I've built for sure.  Therefore there was never a
question that I WILL get an 'airtight' pre nup agreement.  She knows this.
 I am willing to be open and flexible.  However, this will only occur
after we spend a considerable amount of time getting to a deep level of trust.
 

Stating that you have not yet developed a "deep level of trust" reveals that you are not ready for marriage.  Do you feel that you may be springing too early the financial details of your relationship.  If the two of you are not feeling true love, then any discussion about money is indeed business rather than relationship building.
 

I do not however envision assets created prior to the relationship to be part of a new relationship.  That belongs to my children.  I am not alone in this thinking.

Not alone?  I am sure your children agree.    Keep in mind that you will likely die before her.  If it happens soon, what does she have?  Nothing.  Is this fair to someone who gives up her established life to marry you and make a new life in America?   Will she even be able to support herself if she has not established a reliable income in America.   I guess you think she could easily return to Russia.  If so, she will be behind  where she would have been if she never married you.   
 
I have always thought that estate planning  is the weak part of these AM-FSUW marriages.  You need to provide for her via insurance or something from your estate.   What if you become incapacitated?

I will tell you that 18 years ago I was flat broke.  Someone on this post used the word "tough" and applied it to the tough life of EW and that I should experience it too.  I grew up under very tough conditions, so I CAN
relate. 

I was born with nothing (and at times I feel that I managed to keep most of it )  yet have been blessed. While I tend to be generous I never would be talking about a $5,000 per month allowance.  As husband you will assume responsibility for everything from clothing to education.   She will need her own spending money but that should amount to less than $1000 per month - enough for personal hobbies, gas money, infrequent return trips to Russia, etc.  It will not cover cosmetics and certainly not shoes!   

Also, I am not going to be someone's sugar daddy.  I will be generous, but not to the point where is harms me financially or makes me feel I am being taken. 

A sugar daddy spends only a trifling amount compared to his assets.  Also, he does not feel taken.  He pays because he wants a young girlfriend experience, not a wife, and he wants to be able to cancel the arrangement quickly at no cost.   If anything, the girl is being taken because she has committed to him but he not to her, yet surely the women realize it is temporal.   A couple of my senior friends are sugar daddies and they spend less money on women younger than my wife.  However, the deep emotions, sense of family and long term commitment are missing (plus the two women are not very smart  ).
 

You are building a relatrionship, yet your deliberations are far from complete.

[fathertime]

I think a woman in this situation has to be willing to take a big risk too!  I don't think it is up to the man to make up all of the ladies stated salary. 


Now I can see helping the college child, if the lady is not able to work because the relationship puts her in a position where she moves into a new city.  Preexisting college costs are temporary and reasonable. 


In this situation I can see pausing for perhaps another year and letting things continue to play out.


Fathertime! 

[Doll]

Gator, why is it "reasonable" for her to sell her permarital property while the OP is going to "protect" his by prenup?

[Gylden]

Maybe it is because when they buy something together she will own half of a flat which is twice the value of her current flat.

[Doll]

Maybe it is because when they buy something together she will own half of a flat which is twice the value of her current flat.

How is it "twice"?

[calmissile]

Gator, why is it "reasonable" for her to sell her permarital property while the OP is going to "protect" his by prenup?

I don't think that is what he said.  As I understand it, he will match the money she derives from selling her condo and they will buy a home together.  If that is correct, I think he meant that the new home would be community property.

[Gylden]

How is it "twice"?

Because he intends to match her proceeds and buy a place which ios twice the value of the flat she owns now.
 

[Doll]

Because he intends to match her proceeds and buy a place which ios twice the value of the flat she owns now.

Before the price is "matched" it is hers solely, after he "matches" he and she will own it together (which equals same amount for her)
I have 5 dollars BEFORE, you add your 5 dollars, we have it together (now it costs 10 dollars)-you have 5 and I have 5 (as I had before).

[calmissile]

Before the price is "matched" it is hers solely, after he "matches" he and she will own it together (which equals same amount for her)
I have 5 dollars BEFORE, you add your 5 dollars, we have it together (now it costs 10 dollars)-you have 5 and I have 5 (as I had before).

Exactly, however it is a much nicer property because it is worth twice the value of either share individually.   Retired people in the US often do this to afford a nicer home.

[Lily]

  FSUW at forum are pussycats as compared with what you may experience in real life. 

Oh really? 
 
 

[Gylden]

Paulie, actually her kondo in Ukraine should go to her daughter- just same way as you're going to do with your "premarital" property.
So, she can't sell it.

She will still have the same value to heir to her children. I thought that was your point.

[Doll]

Exactly, however it is a much nicer property because it is worth twice the value of either share individually.   Retired people in the US often do this to afford a nicer home.

OMG! How do you know it is a "much nicer property" if they haven't bought it yet! You didn't see her kondo in Ukraine.

[LiveFromUkraine]

If she plans on visiting home enough, why would she sell the flat?


I think this whole relationship sounds more like a business transaction.  It doesn't sound like she is ready for a serious relationship. 

[LiveFromUkraine]

OMG! How do you know it is a "much nicer property" if they haven't bought it yet! You didn't see her kondo in Ukraine.

In the US, you tend to get bigger properties for the same amount of money you would spend in other countries.  You get more property unless we're talking about New York or other major cities.

[Hammer2722]

In the US, you tend to get bigger properties for the same amount of money you would spend in other countries.  You get more property unless we're talking about New York or other major cities.

Agree!

[Doll]

She will still have the same value to heir to her children. I thought that was your point.

No. My point was if the OP covers his premarital property by prenup (excludes it from the marriage) then why would she sell hers and INCLUDE her premarital property.
Paulie says " she has to sell".

[LiveFromUkraine]

No. My point was if the OP covers his premarital property by prenup (excludes it from the marriage) then why would she sell hers and INCLUDE her premarital property.
Paulie says " she has to sell".

Doll, are you reading the same posts the rest of us are reading?

[Doll]

If she plans on visiting home enough, why would she sell the flat?


I think this whole relationship sounds more like a business transaction.  It doesn't sound like she is ready for a serious relationship.

Now listen. You are going to leave everything behind, sell everything you have and go to live in the unknown country with the almost unknown man. You have a kid, you pay for her education.
So my question is- how are you going to be "ready" for this?