Attempting to find serious women in the east

[ukthesis]

I've been joining a few of these eastern European dating sites, and the biggest problem is finding women on them who take the idea of a relationship with a western man (who only speaks English) seriously and who are reliable.  They say on their profiles they are after a serious relationship, but far too many seem into game playing and for example don't regularly email to advise of their plans, don't email back, or don't turn up as arranged for video calls.  So while there are women who come online to say hello and exchange a few pleasantries, there is a shortage of those who have even begun to think the thing through.  They come and go as they please before a relationship is established, very disappointing.  So you don't get the opportunity to show your stuff.

I'd be interested  in knowing the experience of others.  And in finding out where exactly these eastern women who REALLY want a serious relationship and are prepared to work for it are.

[Lily]

It is possible that you just happen to come across the women who are into the games. There are a number of women with serious intentions, but somehow they did not came into your search.
 
It could also be the case that some of them are serious, but they just don't want to continue with the particular man. 

[Faux Pas]

The response you get is directly attributed to the bait you use and the pond you fish.

"If" and that is a big IF, you are on one of the few reputable dating sites, the problem likely has much to do with your profile/photos/provided info. If you are on one of the more seedier dating sites, that's likely your problem. If you are in your 40's or older and believing the profiles of the young 20-something hotties looking for a husband into his 40's, 50's or 60's, you are deluded and need to re-think your approach.

[Ranetka]

  They come and go as they please before a relationship is established.

Yes, this is how it is. Not only RW but also AW, also RM and WM too. Nobody owes you their attention and you only have one chance to give first impression. I am sorry but why do they have to email you about their plans? I think you might be a little bit unreasonable here....

[Shadow]

What stuff you want to show to them ?

[Anotherkiwi]

...They say on their profiles they are after a serious relationship, but far too many seem into game playing and for example don't regularly email to advise of their plans, don't email back, or don't turn up as arranged for video calls.

Yes, this is how it is. Not only RW but also AW, also RM and WM too. Nobody owes you their attention and you only have one chance to give first impression. I am sorry but why do they have to email you about their plans? I think you might be a little bit unreasonable here....

Ranetka, I think you're being a bit harsh.  Of course, we all know people like this - however, uktheseis is talking about pre-arranged contact.  I don't think it's unreasonable in those circumstances to expect a RW to advise that she'll be unable to keep the appointment because she's having her nails done! 

[ukthesis]

The last point is exactly right.  I understand that people are different.  So there are some that are less serious about this stuff than are others.  There are also men who are less serious, so it works both ways.  When there is an agreement beforehand to email or video call, they don't turn up and there is no explanation, this may suggest that the person isn't serious about having a relationship with the other one.  Not always, but it's one clue.

What does really surprise me is how many on the eastern European sites come to them without actually having bothered thinking through any of the consequences.  As mature people on a site where I make a point of telling them my goal on my profile, they might consider that to even think of living in England would eventually require from her a half-decent grasp of English, and that she would of necessity have to make new friends in England and attempt to find work here also.  But it's just like they come on these sites completely unprepared to consider this, or in some way believing that love alone will make everything come right.

So, I have now made it a practice to email remind those who say hello to me on these sites of my goals, and that if they would be interested in falling in love with a guy from England, they would have to do these things to make this a reality.  Note that I am not expecting her to come to England unless she loves me.  But the practicalities and problems have to be considered too, otherwise the conversation becomes unrealistic.

Like those who don't prove that reliable by not answering emails, etc., I find that others (often the same women) come to the table without thinking of any of the practicalities or whether they really ever want to move abroad.  Because of this, I was a bit shy of mentioning them myself.  But then I got burned by a few who would actually have been better off finding a guy where they lived.  From what they told me, their lives in Russian were pretty nice and all their friends and family lived there, and their businesses were locally based.  They just felt lonely as divorcees.  If they ever moved, they would lose a great deal.

In their position, I would never have even bothered with western guys on these sites, since there was no way they were ultimately going to sacrifice the nice life they have over there.

I'm sure that there are some I've not yet met who are mature and sensible enough to not fall into this trap and to think these things through before contacting guys like myself, but as I say, so far I've encountered a shortage of them.

[pokerintherear]

Ukthesis

Reading your comments I gather you sit back and allow the women to contact you. Try doing more research and reading of profiles you find interesting that would come close to your requirements and make first contact.

Take control and the lead. It always works out better for the man. You will get rejected more by this approach but it is part of the weeding process.

[jazztropy]

Mr. Ukthesis,

1. You need to do more research (as do I)
2. Keep a positive attitude
3. Be quick with your "next" button
4. Keep trying

[Shadow]

UkThesis, women place their profile on worldwide sites, and get contacted from Brazil, Turkey, Japan, Germany, France and other countries. Does that mean that you require them basic linguistics in all languages? I agree that when a relationship starts to form, a developing interest in what might be a future daily language should arise. And yes, I do agree that a woman searching international should have some interest and knowledge of one or more foreign languages. However I communicated with women in German, French, English and even Italian.
Perhaps you should make is a requirement in your profile, and not contact a woman unless she speaks English. That would save both sides time.

[Lily]

So, I have now made it a practice to email remind those who say hello to me on these sites of my goals, and that if they would be interested in falling in love with a guy from England, they would have to do these things to make this a reality.  Note that I am not expecting her to come to England unless she loves me.  But the practicalities and problems have to be considered too, otherwise the conversation becomes unrealistic.

Very true. A woman who seriously considers finding a mate abroad, should probably consider an independent immigration, to move to the country first, and then to start looking. Very convenient in terms of both time after the firts contact, and distance.
 

[Chicagoguy]

The procedure I used was:
1. A good profile
2. Maybe in this include a reasonable age range
3. Very good picture of yourself. Maybe an extra one or two if possible
4. Let them contact you first. At least then you will know there is at least some interest
5. I was older and used all free sites and had very many responses
6. If they seem serious then try and respond even if to say no or for friendship

[ML]

Many, many FSUW (I don't speak of other women) put their profiles on the various web dating sites . . . based on a 'lark.'

They hear about this from other women, etc.; and decide to do it in a manner similar to getting a different hair style, trying a new restaurant, a new flavor of ice cream, etc.  Just try something new.

Some (perhaps many) end up on the websites based on a daughter, sister, cousin, etc., actually doing the work, with just barely telling  the individual woman they are doing it.

I had initial correspondence with many women who were in the above categories.  In some cases, there even developed some serious relationships.  But  in most cases, there was utter shock from the women when they were contacted by me;  and in short order I could determine they were in no way serious about any sort of permanent involvement with a foreign man; and, in fact, had not even given any thought to the consequences, etc.

The above are just a couple of reasons why there must be a massive number of first contacts made with the women.  Just as a wild guess; perhaps only 3-5 percent of the women you make first contact with will turn out to be viable candidates.

So anytime you are contacting just a handful of women; your viable candidates are likely to turn out to be zero.

And just to be fair and honest . . . the same applies from the standpoint of the women.

True, the advent of the internet and web based dating sites has increased the available pool to almost unbelievable numbers.

However,  this is a mixed blessing, because it has also increased the number of incompatible persons to almost unbelievable numbers.

Welcome to the mad fun-house!!

[Ranetka]

Ranetka, I think you're being a bit harsh.  Of course, we all know people like this - however, uktheseis is talking about pre-arranged contact.  I don't think it's unreasonable in those circumstances to expect a RW to advise that she'll be unable to keep the appointment because she's having her nails done! 

look, if i had a tenner every time a man from a dating site (ncluding those i had actually met) just stop replying i would've had paid my mortgage off. How many times men on this very site got advised drop her like a hot potato, she'll get the message? It's nice when people, men or women are considerate but they rarely are to strangers from internet. It's best to be realistic and not to expect too much.

[Gator]

It's best to be realistic and not to expect too much.

Bingo!

Rest assured that if you do find a good one, she will more than compensate for the many times you were disappointed by others.

[Anotherkiwi]

look, if i had a tenner every time a man from a dating site (ncluding those i had actually met) just stop replying i would've had paid my mortgage off.

I think you'll find that swings both ways!

How many times men on this very site got advised drop her like a hot potato, she'll get the message? It's nice when people, men or women are considerate but they rarely are to strangers from internet. It's best to be realistic and not to expect too much.

Maybe, but I'm a really nice, considerate person.  I honestly can't think of any FSUW that I've dumped without telling her.  My

[Ranetka]

I think you'll find that swings both ways!


Maybe, but I'm a really nice, considerate person.  I honestly can't think of any FSUW that I've dumped without telling her.  My:rules:

Yes its both men and women.
How many women did you correspond with, how many contacted you? Have you send to all of them sorry it's not working out reply? Have you never just stopped replying? Have you never left a single email without a reply? Remember the op is talking about before commitment....

[Anotherkiwi]

How many women did you correspond with...

Altogether, well over a thousand.

how many contacted you?

Quite a few, when I was looking seriously - maybe 10-15% of the total I exchanged emails with.  Both the women I visited on my trips wrote to me first.  The one that I dated in Kyiv at the end of my second trip was one that I wrote to.

Have you send to all of them sorry it's not working out reply? Have you never just stopped replying? Have you never left a single email without a reply? Remember the op is talking about before commitment....

Seriously?  Yes, I have ALWAYS written to end it (if they haven't dumped me first!).  However, I haven't really been looking now for at least a couple of years.

[Ranetka]

You have my utmost respect.

[Gator]

Altogether, well over a thousand.

That is a large number, a very large number.

BTW, my experience   starting 12 years ago is that I wrote about 100 women.  Many did vaporize after commencing correspondence.  A few sent me a paka note, a very brief note.   If I wrote the paka note (and like my kiwi friend I never vaporized), a couple thanked me.  Good women. 

I had arranged to meet in person about 15 women.  Only one was a "no show" and she had the courtesy to call and say "I not come" after I called her upon my arrival in Crimea and a man answered, an irate man.      Another showed after I had wired her money to travel to Kiev, yet said she did not like the fact I was on a VM trip.  She knew that before accepting money for the trip.  I presume she did not like the way I looked.   

I sent money to four FSUW, whom I had never met, to meet me in vacation land.  All four showed and we had a good time. All four were sincere and not professional daters.

Have things changed that much in recent years?

[Gator]

You have my utmost respect.

 

You say that to Anotherkiwi as if he is the exception.  That surprises me as it suggests a number of men who wrote later cut off correspondence with nary a word.  One word for that, RUDE.

My Moscow woman would never answer correspondence she received from someone who did not interest her.  She quickly clicked on "DELETE" (end of story).

[Ranetka]

 

You say that to Anotherkiwi as if he is the exception.  That surprises me as it suggests a number of men who wrote later cut off correspondence with nary a word.  One word for that, RUDe

He is.

I stopped being nice to everyone after a couple of unpleasant experiences when men were unhappy with thank you but no thank you messages. Including physical threats (had a mistake in giving Facebook details too soon, my name/surname combination is unique, very easy to find my address ).

[Anotherkiwi]

You have my utmost respect.

Thank you, but I'm sure that there are many others like me - they just get lost in the crowd.

[Anotherkiwi]

That is a large number, a very large number.

Yes, but I'm VERY picky!  I've been divorced once, and I don't want to go through that again (it was pretty painless as divorces go, and we stayed friends, but it was still extremely expensive to buy her share of the house and chattels  ).  My list of requirements is pretty exhaustive, and there are very few women that I would even consider as marriage material - and, of those, there are probably only one or two who might consider ME to be suitable for them.

It was quite funny when I commented on the large number of potential suitors that one of my correspondents had had, and she (not gently) pointed out that I had written to even more.

[Anotherkiwi]

 

You say that to Anotherkiwi as if he is the exception.  That surprises me as it suggests a number of men who wrote later cut off correspondence with nary a word.  One word for that, RUDE.

My Moscow woman would never answer correspondence she received from someone who did not interest her.  She quickly clicked on "DELETE" (end of story).

This is something both ML and I have commented on in the past - RW seem to have this habit of ignoring you if they're not interested, or lose interest after a few emails.  It's a pain in the rear trying to figure out, after further fruitless letters, whether or not you've been dumped or if you need to give her another chance because there just may have been a genuine reason for her not responding.