Exploitation: Real, imagined, or deliberately disingenuous?

[Daveman]

Hmmm, I Googled it and got Money Over Bitches. Must be something else then. Good thing we're not MOBsters at least 

Never heard of that one. But, he's not joking...

[Jumper]

 
That's too general.
 
Think of military personnel overseas who marry a local.
 
I think there is a stigma associated with the term BECAUSE it falls in a very special category.

Did you mean-
That's too uncomfortable?

Military are residing in that country (been there,done that)
Someone working in another country long term (been there,done that)
would fit that same description, residing there, and meeting in a rather natural way..

Few here, including you muzh,   fit it though.
(me neither at the time i met my wife))

Yeap! there is a stigma and a stereotype,
yes i understand why many go failing their virtual arms to avoid being labeled with it.

I fully understand you don't fall under the stereotype as well.
Certainly a sincere guy ,not attempting to exploit a situation.

Yet, your wife dint fall on your head from the upper balcony in your country.
You did not work in her country long term, you wern't in the military stationed in her country when you met.
The fact you had *little* time to socialize locally while raising young children
is mirrored by a lot of MOBers  for various reasons, not unlike your own..
I was raising a young boy on my own as well..

I dated women I met locally,and internationally, some  met from various internet sites, some where from travel interest or hobby sites , some where dating sites , and  it also included MOB sites!

Is it really gong to be defined by the website utilized?

Shouldn't they be ranked by exactly which MOB site uitilized then?
http://mail-order-brides-websites.no1reviews.com/


To John Q Public, you met your (fill in any stereotype MOB country) wife on the internet,
regardless of website. You went to her country, visited her ,and eventually married with her immigrating to your country.In John Q Publics eye that's MOB,
May not  make it technically correct,but wont change the perception or stereotyping.


But hey ,good luck with the caste system.. the one defining how is or isn't an MOBer here,
or the higher and lower levels of it.
You know I always love when its defined very clearly so *they* all know their proper place.

To bring this back to topic, I'm sure the higher levels of the caste , exploited less! Likely in some very exacting ratio/proportions.

[Jumper]

The thread reads like a validation palooza to me.

Sure!
 and it reads like excus'Orama to me, [size=78%]with a nice side bar of BetterThanThou[/size]
 if they  met their significant other via XYZ method vs insert some poorly thought of means here> ______________






same ol' same ol'

[CanadaMan]

You are funny.
 
Why don't you define a MOBer?

Sure with pleasure.
I liked Jumper's definition but I'll give a more concise one.

MOBer = Someone who travels outside their country with the intent to marry a foreign bride.

[Hammer2722]

Sure with pleasure.
I liked Jumper's definition but I'll give a more concise one.

MOBer = Someone who travels outside their country with the intent to marry a foreign bride.

In a nutshell, that would be my definition also.

[Daveman]

Sure!
 and it reads like excus'Orama to me, [size=78%]with a nice side bar of BetterThanThou[/size]
 if they  met their significant other via XYZ method vs insert some poorly thought of means here> ______________






same ol' same ol'

But, I met my wife in an airport!

[AnonMod]

Friendly, perhaps even jovial reminder-


Debate the topic , and drop the personal insults,
or expect your posts removed, or yourself removed.

[Ade]

MOBer: a man that travels to a less developed country than their own with the intent to deliberately exploit that socio-economic difference in order to meet and marry a woman that advertises themselves for marriage in a MOB catalogue. The MOBer will almost always require that the women be younger and/or prettier than women they can attract in their own country.

[Jumper]

But, I met my wife in an airport!

Well, the airport signs were likely also in English, so you get one small rung up on the caste hierarchy of MOB.

Now- was it a  layover and a missed flight? (for BIG honking bonus points)
If it was a destination- you lose points regardless.

Sorry, I don't make the rules , i just live by them.

[Shadow]

MOB: Master Of BS?

[fathertime]

Sure with pleasure.
I liked Jumper's definition but I'll give a more concise one.

MOBer = Someone who travels outside their country with the intent to marry a foreign bride.

Nice!


It is rather humorous that some people start doing handstands to try to distinguish themselves as meeting their wife some 'better' way...or by shear dumb luck...when you boil down their stories you often find they are absolutely typical as those they like to criticize. 


In addition, the poll is really showing how isolated those that are convinced women are being 'exploited' by men looking to get married.


Fathertime!   

[Jumper]

MOBer: a man that travels to a less developed country than their own with the intent to deliberately exploit that socio-economic difference in order to meet and marry a woman that advertises themselves for marriage in a MOB catalogue. The MOBer will almost always require that the women be younger and/or prettier than women they can attract in their own country.

Bravo, now we are getting somewhere!




Ok Ade,
Lets define it with relation to  the thread topic?


In theory at least-
 Is it any less exploitative if the stereotypical old fat bald guy is completely self deluded,
has no real idea there is much economic disparity ( a lot of us colonists are not very savvy on such subjects) and believes in his heart that the girl could ,and does, love him for his inner beauty?

his intent, although deluded, is sincere.

Or is he just as guilty as a young successfull   guy that has full understanding of the  debacle in her country that made her become involved in international internet dating?
yet of course his intent when traveling there wasn't to exploit her or the scenario.

[Ade]

What's really funny is the verbal hoops the typical MOBer will jump through in order to distance themselves from the exploitation.

[Ade]

Bravo, now we are getting somewhere!




Ok Ade,
Lets define it with relation to  the thread topic?


In theory at least-
 Is it any less exploitative if the stereotypical old fat bald guy is completely self deluded,
has no real idea there is much economic disparity ( a lot of us colonists are not very savvy on such subjects) and believes in his heart that the girl could ,and does, love him for his inner beauty?

his intent, although deluded, is sincere.

Or is he just as guilty as a young successfull   guy that has full understanding of the  debacle in her country that made her become involved in international internet dating?
yet of course his intent when traveling there wasn't to exploit her or the scenario.

The negative connotations of "exploit" go hand in hand with intent.

I don't see so many innocents tbh.

[Jumper]

What's really funny is the verbal hoops the typical MOBer will jump through in order to distance themselves from the exploitation.

I 'm amused by both..

and boy howdy!!  that right Thar!! should give me a free pass!! The whole BIG get out of MOB jail free card!!




but no thanks, I'm rather well without it.

[Ade]

I 'm amused by both..

and boy howdy!!  that right Thar!! should give me a free pass!! The whole BIG get out of MOB jail free card!!




but no thanks, I'm rather well without it.

My post was directed at FatherTime - the man that's neither married to an FSUW (South American? Yeah, another deprived area) nor, as far as I can tell, interested in the FSU in general. One wonders what his motivations are for posting here at all in fact...

[Slumba]

What's really funny is the verbal hoops the typical MOBer will jump through in order to distance themselves from the exploitation.

Note the framing:  the default assumption that exploitation is going on, and that it is the Western man doing the exploiting. 

Low information, biased, hackish... a kludge.

[Jumper]

My post was directed at FatherTime - the man that's neither married to an FSUW (South American? Yeah, another deprived area) nor, as far as I can tell, interested in the FSU in general. One wonders what his motivations are for posting here at all in fact...

Yes , you both (and others) seem to enjoy typing *blah*lately,
and that motivation is the one that currently fascinates me.


 

[Gator]

What do I see here?  I see some people who have been insulted in the past acting as if they are poised to dish out some retribution.  Instead, we should be demonstrating RWD is better than that. 


I give credit to Ade for standing here mostly alone all day and taking shot after shot without replying with slanderous insults.  Whether you like the man or not, he is an intelligence observer.  IMO, this place would be very tedious and of no help if all of us thought the same.   Dan the founder of RWD has always stressed inclusivity. 

[Gator]

One wonders what his motivations are for posting here at all in fact...

First, who is he.  Fathertime is a professional hit man who hires out to Internet forum owners.  Evidently he is conducting the ground research necessary for his current assignment. 

[Gator]

Interesting choice of words there Gator.

Surely someone somewhere considers it a compliment, perhaps a term of endearment.   
 
 

I may be the next to bite the dust.

   


I am not a moderator, and I have no more authority than you.  IMO, you should keep doing what you have been doing.    Foremost, you have always refrained from slanderous and malicious insults.   Also, you tend to be constructive (but sometimes to a person who does not think they need to be reconstructed ).

Speaking of biting the dust, I don't understand why someone would not want to help Dave make RWD a more intelligent and less hostile place.  Could the National Enquirer be transformed into the National Review (bad example as the vision for RWD is to be inclusive)?
 

See, some would say that, having been married for so long to a woman from Ukraine and having so many trips under my belt, dealt with their local politics and help in some drafting before my friend's untimely death, I'd be considered an asset to newbies.

For sure IMO. 
 

Now I understand that I'm a know-it-all and looked at with disdain.

The judgmental statements set off my alarms.  Why?  As a kid I was taken by the ear to many Southern Baptist revivals where I heard way too much sanctimony.   I am sure others thought what you wrote to be spot on.  The collective experiences, insights and opinions of RWD are very wise.

[Larry1]

I wrote this some time ago but it seems likely to take this discussion into useful territory.  It's just a proposal, but it might be a helpful framework for discussion among those who are most interested in condemning other guys for finding a wife overseas while having themselves found a wife overseas.  I call it "The Forum Hierarchy of Western Bride-seekers in FSU".

It also provides an assist to new people on the forum, who might otherwise in their naivete get hammered by the proponents of this hierarchy, I have tried to summarize the caste hierarchy.  Those closest to the top of this list are at the top of the heap, generally immune from criticism of the method they chose to find a wife.

1. Those who happened to meet their future girlfriend/wife while living in FSU for a sustained period of time and having a prestigious occupation, but had no prior plan of finding a girlfriend/wife there. An example of this would be a guy doing business in Russia who is introduced to a girl at a party held at the palatial Central Moscow apartment of a mutual friend (English teachers aren't included here but properly belong in the next lower caste).

2. Those who traveled to FSU for a purpose other than finding a girlfriend/wife and happened to meet his future girlfriend/wife (but be aware that you will be cross-examined ruthlessly in order to determine your true intent in going to FSU, to make sure you're not trying to jump up the hierarchy one step).

3. Those who traveled  to FSU for an extended trip (let's say greater than six months) primarily to find their future girlfriend/wife

4. Those who while living in the West met their future wife/girlfriend by personal introduction of a mutual friend or relative, or such other approved method.

Now here is the clear dividing line between the good castes and the bad castes.  The following caste members are the awful MOB lot:

5. Those who registered on vkontakte.com or some other nondating site and met their future wife/girlfriend that way.

6. Those who used an international dating site to meet their future wife/girlfriend in FSU, but actively dated in their countries within, say, 90 days of going on a bride-seeking trip to FSU.

7. Those who signed up for a dating site and met their future wife/girlfriend there.

8.  Those who became married/engaged after only X number of trips, X being two fewer trips than one's forum antagonist, but capped at 6 trips or 3 trips if total time in-country is greater than 45 days

9.   Those who met their wife/girlfriend at a social.

                                                              *****
Everyone is entitled to look down their noses and castigate at will any member who is in a lower caste, especially the MOB caste.  Members who are of a lower caste, especially two steps down, are advised to humbly and respectfully accept their chastisement by their betters.

Relative newcomers, seeing this clear hierarchy, sometimes try to slip unnoticed from their own caste into a higher caste.  But, just as in India, this is nearly impossible.  The offending lower-caste member will be spotted.

This is just a draft, for discussion.  A quick read through this thread shows that some of you are partial to certain other criteria for indicating higher caste.  Feel free to make suggestions.

[Daveman]

Speaking of biting the dust, I don't understand why someone would not want to help Dave make RWD a more intelligent and less hostile place.  Could the National Enquirer be transformed into the National Review (bad example as the vision for RWD is to be inclusive)?
 

FTR:
While I would love to take the credit for a positive change, I can't. I'm not alone and not by a long shot. It's the combination of several moderators and staff members, with support from RWD members who have chosen to make RWD better.  I'm merely the apparent face of it.

[fathertime]

My post was directed at FatherTime - the man that's neither married to an FSUW (South American? Yeah, another deprived area) nor, as far as I can tell, interested in the FSU in general. One wonders what his motivations are for posting here at all in fact...

you seem a little unhappy, that I'm posting here now...I wonder why?   haha


Of course i owe you no explanation, but I delight in letting you know why I'm here....I enjoy reading stories/biography about people...this place is like an interactive biography...I like many of the individual stories...such as Gator's, Billyb's, and ML's...just to name a few.... After a while it became an annoyance to read all the angry/baseless accusations, so I've decided to step up the participation to give a few of the 'agitators' some pause, and some comeuppance.  Not surprisingly, about 1/2 of the previous agitators hit the road within days, or made themselves irrelevant.., and the tone is already improving....I look forward to the day when I am quietly lurking and reading what people are doing/thinking (and relating it to my own life), without reading every third post implying 'sex tourism' 'abuse' and 'exploitation' among other things....

First, who is he.  Fathertime is a professional hit man who hires out to Internet forum owners.  Evidently he is conducting the ground research necessary for his current assignment. 

Thanks Gator for giving away my profession....I expect my final payment soon. lol

[fathertime]

Yeah, what can't say, I'm like an innocent child among real alpha males. Lol

Innocent child...well maybe not, but definitely not an 'alpha male'...Not that being an 'alpha male' is that important to having a meaningful life anyway. 


Fathertime!