Interested to Chat and Learn More About Dating FSUW

[Bounder]

Testing... testing.... 1... 2...

Hello everybody! Is this mic on?  I have been trying to register here for a couple of weeks now.  My only guess is that my username was too short as I reregistered today with a longer username and it seems now that... here I am!

I'll keep this short for now.  I am a member over at one of the other FSUW Forums, but have been following this one for several weeks now.  I was eager to become a member over here as the tone of discussion from what I've seen so far is uniformly respectful to one another and positive (and grown up).  This appeals to me very much!  The other reason is that over here it seems that good and active discussion about dating FSUW is alive and well (unfortunately, I can't say the same about the other place).  So that's why I'm here and very happy to finally have arrived!

I've been learning, learning, learning, and still sooo much to learn 

I've been trippin in St. Pete these past few days, currently made it to the top of page 30, which begins "Thanks, it's good to know that somebody is reading my tale."  Well 2Tall, I have been reading with intense interest.  What an excellent trip report and what an engaging reporter you are!  My heart was starting to break for you, but now I'm at the point where you've met Angel Eyes, so things are looking up 

[HoundDaddyLee]

   Welcome Bounder. Happy to have you here. Please join in on our active chat board also (usually active afternoons and evenings)


Take care,
HDL

[BillyB]

Welcome to the forum Bounder! Since it took you two weeks to register, we can expect you to hang around twenty years at the pace you're going. Since you're still learning, feel free to ask questions and hopefully we can help. We need more related FSU questions to drown out the political talk.

  I was eager to become a member over here as the tone of discussion from what I've seen so far is uniformly respectful to one another and positive (and grown up).  This appeals to me very much! 

We're mostly made up of conservative men. The other forum is made up of mostly liberal men. I wish more liberals were here. I enjoyed debating some of those guys over there.

[Bounder]

Thanks HDL and Billy for the Welcome to RWD.  I'm happy to be here!

Yeah, I'm not sure what was going on with the registration.  When I first registered, I got an email saying it was pending approval.  After a few days, I tried contacting the site administrators without any success.  Attempted to register again with the same result.  Finally, I tried a third time, but changed my username from MB to Bounder, and that seems to have done the trick. 

Maybe I'll be around this forum for 20 years, but I hope that most of that time is going to be in the Married to FSU chat section and giving advice to the newcomers! 

To continue with my introduction, I guess this all started for me back in 1999 when I backpacked around Russia for two and a half months.  I was in a number of other countries as well, including Poland, where I travelled back to the following summer.  I met a very lovely girl there, and this meeting led to a seven year romance, with two of those years living in Poland.  Eventually, it came to an end, but she is now a happy Canadian citizen.

Fast forward to 2015.  I was down and out in a very low phase of my life.  I had learned a little bit about the FSU dating world and found Elena's Models.  Seemed like a pretty legitimate site (and to my knowledge, still is), so I signed up.  Soon I was talking to numerous girls, clumsily stumbling around in the dark, learning about FSUW by chatting with them and making mistakes.  Poor girls!

Eventually I had narrowed it down to one.  After exchanging a few letters on Elena's, she taught me about Whatsapp and I got a skype account.  We chatted on Whatsapp daily, had some skype calls, and skype video once (she only had skype on her mobile phone, so her arm would get quite tired holding out the phone for video calling    Having read many times about the importance of getting on a plane and making face to face contact, in April I was on my way to Kiev.

I don't think that time spent getting to know each other before meeting is necessarily a waste of time, but if there is an interest, I think you definitely want to go meet her as soon as possible.  If the moment you meet, there is nothing, then all that time getting to know each other was a bit of a waste.  Of course, if you hit it off then you are just that much further ahead.  In the ideal world where money and time have no relevance, probably one should be getting on the plane after about 3 days of whatsapp and skype.

I think it would be easy to characterize my 9 day trip in Kiev as a trainwreck.  I made lots of critical mistakes.  The main two I made was: a) depended on the girl I was meeting for my arrangements, and b) no back-up plan.  I ended up in a situation where I was staying in an apartment that she arranged through her friends.  I was seeing her every day and even once I knew this wasn't going to go anywhere, I was reluctant to make dates with other girls as she would get suspicious then and perhaps have me booted from my accommodations.  It was a really silly and naive position to be in, which I realized once I found myself in it.  Plus she had collected me from faraway Borispol Airport and I was relying on her to get me back there as I really wasn't entirely sure how I'd get myself there.  While there was a shuttle leaving from the train station, I couldn't walk there with my luggage, and I had no clue how to get a cab, as they need to be called in advance and ordered to an address in Kiev.

That aside, we did have some fun together and I did get to visit a new and interesting city.  All in all, we weren't compatible, something that in hindsight I should have seen already through our online communication.  But as I said I was low and feeling lonely then.  And a beautiful girl was giving me her attention.

I have no regrets about that trip.  I sometimes reflect on it and I think I learned a lot from it as well as from subsequent experiences.

I used to think this girl was a scammer.  She wanted me to buy her things and this started even before I left to see her.  I don't think she is a scammer anymore.  I believe that either she was sincere and just not my kind of girl - like I said she wanted me to buy her things all the time, pay for this pay for that (e.g. her beauty salon appointment, getting her summer tires put on), she had very strong and sometimes bizarre expectations of me as a Real Man (e.g. she proposed that we go visit some park outside of Kiev, I thought it was a great idea, she asked how should we get there, I suggested that it would be easiest to take her car.... this uncreative response made her livid at me; she was disappointed that I didn't bring her some magazines from Canada and told me that a real man would have known that she would like some magazines), she was extremely impatient and at times downright rude.  On our final evening, we discussed her coming to visit me in Canada.  We agreed I would pay for the visas, but this then evolved into paying for her US Visa application as well so she could go visit NYC.  I believe she was more interested in going to NYC than she was in visiting me.  This all could just be who she is.... 

The other possibility is that she was a pro-dater.  I can't rule it out, although I would have to say that in that case she isn't a very good pro-dater - she could've found someone a lot wealthier than me! 

We didn't keep in touch and at the beginning of May, I was back in Canada licking my wounds feeling somewhat burned by my first FSUW experience.  But not defeated....

To be continued.

[jone]

Great lead in story, Bounder.  Welcome to the forum.  We will look forward to more from you.

I'm sure you know this now, but there were warning flags in the post you made.  But, please.  Don't let me stop you from continuing your story.

[ML]

I used to think this girl was a scammer.  She wanted me to buy her things and this started even before I left to see her.  I don't think she is a scammer anymore. 

You are totally wrong.
She is a scammer.

[jone]

ML, of course, is right. 

We were being gentle with you until you got your sea legs.

[Bounder]

Thanks for the welcome Jone. I agree with you, there were a lot of warning signs. My state of mind then was such that I just really didn't want to see them so I explained them away. Worst case scenario, I was going to get to visit Kiev, and I did that. I have no regrets.

Maybe she was a scammer, but if so she was a scammer with benefits and I got off relatively lightly 😉  And I do think that If she was any good at scamming she could have done a lot better than me.

I'm also grateful for the fact that she had a pretty sharp edge to her and was very direct, not holding back at all. I basically went to FSUW boot camp and although it was just a bit painful at the time, I learned a lot from her. For example, before we went out each day she would come over and dress me. She would tell me what she liked what she did not like, and why. It was actually really helpful and I have much more fashion sense and consciousness these days!  Same with dinner table etiquette - she's on the extreme end of that spectrum whereas Canadians are ridiculously slack. She was a great teacher. 😊

I made a lot of mistakes, met the wrong girl, but I also learned, had a good time, and don't regret a thing.

[Gator]

I met a very lovely girl there, and this meeting led to a seven year romance, with two of those years living in Poland.  Eventually, it came to an end, but she is now a happy Canadian citizen.

Been there, done that, threw away the T-shirt.  I knew there was something better, so I stopped working at the relationship.  My story is longer of course, but that about sums it up. 

I used to think this girl was a scammer.

She is likely what ML labeled her.  If not, she has a sense of entitlement, i. e., high maintenance.   This would become maddening to me on the second day.  I would have said something to her before meeting because no sincere FSUW asks you to buy her something before meeting.  If I met her, I would have said something again at the end of the first day for her to think about overnight.  If she continued the next day, I knew it would be incurable.

FSUW know this is not acceptable behavior.    So if they ask for something early it means they are not seeking a relationship.   Only after you become exclusive, is it time to make your woman feel like she is your one and only woman.   

...she proposed that we go visit some park outside of Kiev, I thought it was a great idea, she asked how should we get there, I suggested that it would be easiest to take her car.... this uncreative response made her livid at me), she was extremely impatient and at times downright rude.

You should have said, "Let's walk so you can slim down your popka." 

Another reason for Plan B. 

I believe she was more interested in going to NYC than she was in visiting me.  This all could just be who she is.... 

This is when we say "No shit, Sherlock."   

The other possibility is that she was a pro-dater.  I can't rule it out, although I would have to say that in that case she isn't a very good pro-dater - she could've found someone a lot wealthier than me! 

... at the beginning of May, I was back in Canada licking my wounds feeling somewhat burned by my first FSUW experience.  But not defeated....

You survived, and have learned a lesson.  Many men have done worse. 

   I appreciate your candor.  With this attitude, I believe you will do well and find Ms. Right.  I made some serious mistakes.   It took me a long time to find mine, and even longer to convince her. 

[Bounder]

Last time I checked, she's still on Elena's Models, so if anyone wants a heads up, feel free to PM me.

[Gator]

Maybe she was a scammer, but if so she was a scammer with benefits and I got off relatively lightly 😉 

Benefits are everywhere. 

I'm also grateful for the fact that she had a pretty sharp edge to her and was very direct, not holding back at all. I basically went to FSUW boot camp and although it was just a bit painful at the time, I learned a lot from her.

Another bad sign.  Rudeness is not forgivable. 

For example, before we went out each day she would come over and dress me. She would tell me what she liked what she did not like, and why.

A good sign probably.  She wants her man looking good.  However, if done in a style as if she is a hard driving perfectionist, watch out! 

[ML]

Quote

    I believe she was more interested in going to NYC than she was in visiting me.  This all could just be who she is.... 

- - - - - -

You were lucky.

15 or more years ago I was on a business trip to SpB.

The great Irina B rented me an apartment.

She told how she had earlier operated a Marriage Agency along with her Apartment help; but gave up the Marriage angle because so many of the gals were scammers.

The last straw for her was . . .

A man in Switzerland was romancing one of her gals.
Everything seemed above board with the gal.
But, when the man paid for her round trip flight to Switzerland . . . upon arrival at airport . . . the gal told the man that she was off to visit with friends . . . and that she  would next see him (if he wanted) at the time of her flight departure.

[Bounder]

Quote

    I believe she was more interested in going to NYC than she was in visiting me.  This all could just be who she is.... 

- - - - - -

You were lucky.

15 or more years ago I was on a business trip to SpB.

The great Irina B rented me an apartment.

She told how she had earlier operated a Marriage Agency along with her Apartment help; but gave up the Marriage angle because so many of the gals were scammers.

The last straw for her was . . .

A man in Switzerland was romancing one of her gals.
Everything seemed above board with the gal.
But, when the man paid for her round trip flight to Switzerland . . . upon arrival at airport . . . the gal told the man that she was off to visit with friends . . . and that she  would next see him (if he wanted) at the time of her flight departure.

Hi ML - you are right, I was lucky, it could've ended much worse.  I did tell her in no uncertain terms that if she wanted to come visit me, I live in Canada, and I would help her with a Canadian visa, but that I would not provide any assistance with a US visa.  Needless to say, she wasn't particularly pleased with this response.

Too bad for that chap in Swiss.  I imagine that must've felt like a good punch in the gut.

Speaking of guts, gut feelings are important as you can never be 100% sure about anything in this or any other worthwhile endeavour.  The next time around, I DID pay for a flight to Canada, but a different girl, different circumstances.  In doing so, I was trusting my gut instincts....

[BillyB]

Bounder, I'm going to say the girl is a pro dater. She did give you lots of time before and during the visit. Pro daters expect men to shower them with gifts and they are always on their period.

[abashka]

Welcome to RWD, Jeremy.

Seems, I will make this topic very hot, maybe I should have done it earlier on rua,  but normally I prefer not to interfere.

Ok let's start:)) Like I already said he  posted his sad story on rua, about a year ago I guess..an impressive story about a Kiev girl who asked for 300$ Gucci glasses. But I am not going to discuss this story here.

As most of you know, Russian women are direct, so, excuse me guys, but I want to ask our topic starter some questions as I know the story from another perspective.

So, Bounder, please, tell us:

1. Have you finally divorced with your Canadian wife? Or at least found some money for a lawyer?

2. Do you still live in the same house with her?

3. Have you stopped taking antidepressants?

4. Do you still listen to your mum who tells you all FSUW are only "Canadian passport chasers" and moreover, tell about to the girls you communicate with?

5. Did you really take 500 CAD from a single mum of 1yo kid?

Thanks.

[LAman]

Welcome to RWD, Jeremy.

Seems, I will make this topic very hot, maybe I should have done it earlier on rua,  but normally I prefer not to interfere.

Ok let's start:)) Like I already said he  posted his sad story on rua, about a year ago I guess..an impressive story about a Kiev girl who asked for 300$ Gucci glasses. But I am not going to discuss this story here.

As most of you know, Russian women are direct, so, excuse me guys, but I want to ask our topic starter some questions as I know the story from another perspective.

So, Bounder, please, tell us:

1. Have you finally divorced with your Canadian wife? Or at least found some money for a lawyer?

2. Do you still live in the same house with her?

3. Have you stopped taking antidepressants?

4. Do you still listen to your mum who tells you all FSUW are only "Canadian passport chasers" and moreover, tell about to the girls you communicate with?

5. Did you really take 500 CAD from a single mum of 1yo kid?

Thanks.

Now I am really going to pay some attention to this thread. Thanks abashka for filling in some details to fully understand this 'whole story'!! where is that popcorn??? )))

[Bounder]

Welcome to RWD, Jeremy.

Seems, I will make this topic very hot, maybe I should have done it earlier on rua,  but normally I prefer not to interfere.

Ok let's start:)) Like I already said he  posted his sad story on rua, about a year ago I guess..an impressive story about a Kiev girl who asked for 300$ Gucci glasses. But I am not going to discuss this story here.

As most of you know, Russian women are direct, so, excuse me guys, but I want to ask our topic starter some questions as I know the story from another perspective.

So, Bounder, please, tell us:

1. Have you finally divorced with your Canadian wife? Or at least found some money for a lawyer?

2. Do you still live in the same house with her?

3. Have you stopped taking antidepressants?

4. Do you still listen to your mum who tells you all FSUW are only "Canadian passport chasers" and moreover, tell about to the girls you communicate with?

5. Did you really take 500 CAD from a single mum of 1yo kid?

Thanks.

Hi Abashka! Thank you for the more than warm welcome! . It is interesting that we resume our collegial communication like this. I'm even more surprised at how much digging you did on me to come up with a few facts which either you are distorting yourself, or came in pre- distorted.

It is the next part of my instalment. I didn't expect it to be so drama filled and I hope it won't, but I'm not yet sure how to respond to such a post which to my mind almost qualifies as a personal attack and an attempt at character assassination.

Peace be with you.

[LAman]

You are totally wrong.
She is a scammer.

At what point is this a scammer ML? Demanding yes, scammer no.

[Bounder]

To continue my introduction....

I met another girl on Elena's models.  She is a 35 year old woman from Moscow (I am 41).  She had a very adorable daughter who wasn't yet two years old.  There was a certain je ne sais quoi that drew me to her.  She was a serious girl and we couldn't get enough of each other.  With Whatsapp and Skype we were in daily, almost around the clock, communication.  She was kind, strong, sincere, as well as intelligent, accomplished, energetic, and motivated.  To me she was beautiful both inside and outside.  There was a strong and mutual attraction.

Soon we began planning how to meet and discussed different options.  We agreed to meet in Canada.  This is a decision I now regret, as it created problems between her and her daughter which I had not foreseen.  This was held against me later, and I can only say that it was not for me to know in advance and that if I could have known in advance, I would have insisted on a first meeting in her home city. To come between a mother and her daughter, even if unwittingly, is something I regret. 

In fact, all our troubles started at this point.  Only a mother can know her child.  My role in it was inviting and organizing her trip to Canada.

We talked regularly and openly.  Trust and goodwill were high on both sides.  We decided on some dates and I purchased her ticket to come to meet me in Canada.  I organized a very nice itinerary for us and booked all the accommodations.  I ensured that nothing was left wanting.  Her 10 day trip here was nothing short of wonderful.  We had a lot of fun and enjoyed each other's company immensely.  We had one small disagreement the entire time, based on cultural misunderstandings.  It was easily patched and, otherwise, our time together was close to perfect.  We parted sadly and reluctantly, already planning when and how to meet next.

I am conscious about providing too many details as Abashka seems to have a personal interest in this story and to what end, I do not know.  I do know, that I don't want to create a he-said, she-said soap opera on this forum, which I think would be the likely result if I began going into details of how our short relationship very quickly unravelled.

Certainly, she blamed me for a distance that had formed with her young girl.  Maybe I should have known better, but I didn't.  I don't have children and don't have a lot of experience with them.  I followed the mother's lead.  Also, when a specific expense came up for her daughter (orthopaedic shoes), I sent her some money to help with the expense.  The response I received left me feeling I was dealing with an unhinged person.  What I sent her was not enough, in fact it was offensive to her and my offer of help made me a worse person than her ex-husband who physically abused her.  She was under a lot of stress and I tried to overlook some of the incredibly nasty things she said to me and tried to calm her.  I had no success, however, and soon I stood accused of wanting to come mooch off of her in Moscow, etc etc.  This seems to be an ongoing theme, but it is nonsense.  In reality, I spent about $4,000 to make sure she had a nice trip to Canada.  Later, I sent her some money to help (I naively thought) with some expenses that had come up.  I did not take money from her, as has been slanderously suggested.

There is no denying that Abashka's contribution to this thread has had an effect on how I have chosen to discuss my experience with this lady.  The story I relate is a truncated version and my eyes are now open wide to the dangers of providing an honest and candid account of my personal journey in the foreign land of FSUW dating.

Several things have been insinuated about me in an attempt to undermine my character.  I have tried to keep my accounting factual and to the point.  And while there are many unflattering things to reveal about the girl I met from Moscow, that remains with me.  I don't want to stoop to the same level.  But, Abashka, do let me know if she knows that you are now representing her here on this forum and if she would also like the same public indecency accorded to her as you just have to me.

As a further introduction to myself and for what it's worth, I am in the final stages of divorce proceedings.  It has been two years in the making and subject to every delay and obstacle my ex has been capable of.  At the time when I met the lady from Moscow, my ex and I had a number of financial obligations, including the mortgage on a very large house.  For financial reasons, we were forced for a time to live in the same residence while being separated (this is a recognized form of separation in Canadian law).  I helped her move out about 15 months ago.  The house too is long gone.  In all but the letter, we are divorced and have been for nearly two years. 

While in Canada, the girl from Moscow forced me to take money ($600) as a form of help with my legal fees.  Refusal wasn't an option and I subsequently returned the money to her electronically.  This is the basis of the accusation that I took money from a single mom.  It is silly and nonsense.

There was a period of time where I was taking anti-depressants under the direction and supervision of my family doctor.  This is no one's business and neither is the fact that I no longer take anti-depressants.  Yet, it has been put on the record here by Abashka for reasons I cannot fathom, and so I am addressing it.  My Moscow date will surely be grateful that I fully recognize that it would be entirely inappropriate for me disclose her medical details here as well.

In my view, there is quite a big difference between "listening to your mum who tells you all FSUW are passport chasers" and having a candid conversation with a lady, in which you express your frustrations at the narrow-minded views of some family members (I'm sure many members can relate to the lack of understanding from family members and friends towards their efforts to find love in the FSU).  Even then, this is an ugly distortion of my own mother's views on the subject.  Abashka, if you really want to know my mother's views, ask your Moscow friend as they had a very friendly and extended chat with one another.

I was in love with the girl from Moscow.  In the end she broke my heart.  I moved on and assume she has too.  Whose laundry are you airing here Abashka?

[abashka]

Bounder,
I am not going to discuss this subject or reply you anymore, so you can keep your explanations for other RWD members, all I wanted to say was that things usually were not what they seemed to be if you looked from another side 

Anyway, the girl never said any single bad word about you, do not worry about it.  And she did not provide any private details but Gucci glasses you bought for a Kiev girl, that is how I recognized you:)

Her story was just a good lesson for her and other girls who are in search. And for the guys too - solve your problems, please, before you start searching.

Now I finished.

[Bounder]

The past is already etched. And it's not possible to un-ring the bell.

As to solving ones problems before beginning the search, I agree with you. In fact, I was getting there in my story.  You presented a very twisted version of facts, apparently based on a set of distorted half-truths that were fed to you.

Anyway, there is now no need for me to get to that part of the story and no desire left in me to continue my story here at all.

[jone]

Please, continue your story .....

I would be surprised if your detractor will be pursuing you further.

[Faux Pas]

The past is already etched. And it's not possible to I ring the bell.

As to solving ones problems before beginning the search, I agree with you. In fact, I was getting there in my story.  You presented a very twisted version of facts, apparently based on a set of distorted half-truths that were fed to you.

Anyway, there is now no need for me to get to that part of the story and no desire left in me to continue my story here at all.

That would be your call but everything posted in the form of TRs is he said/she said.  There's his story, her story and the truth is usually somewhere in the middle. AFAIK Abashka has a pretty solid reputation and have not known her for half truths or mis-speaking. Quite the opposite.

Tell your side of the story and let the reader make up their mind.

[BillyB]

Certainly, she blamed me for a distance that had formed with her young girl.  Maybe I should have known better, but I didn't.  I don't have children and don't have a lot of experience with them.  I followed the mother's lead. Also, when a specific expense came up for her daughter (orthopaedic shoes), I sent her some money to help with the expense.  The response I received left me feeling I was dealing with an unhinged person.  What I sent her was not enough, in fact it was offensive to her and my offer of help made me a worse person than her ex-husband who physically abused her. 

An FSU woman expects the man to have lots of life experience and know what to do in every situation. There are women who are unreasonably demanding. Wise men won't let themselves be taken advantage of. If she was criticizing you for being worse than her ex husband after sending her money, she's playing games.

If you were on anti depressants, you need to get yourself into a healthy state of mind before bringing yourself into someone else's life. Also being able to think rationally will help you make better decisions on the girls you want to get involved with.

[Miquel Westano]

I am conscious about providing too many details as Abashka seems to have a personal interest in this story and to what end, I do not know.

It just seemed to me Anya thought there were a few details you left out that were important to the story.  She asked you some questions that certainly in my mind made a difference in the story.  I don't know whether her interest are personal as you say, or just more in line with feeling there should be full disclosure.

There is no denying that Abashka's contribution to this thread has had an effect on how I have chosen to discuss my experience with this lady. 

It would seem then that her contribution may be a good thing.  I think your story is important, but it will be better told if you realize there should be some constraints.  I don't think most people here are looking for a villain on either end.  But most would like a honest and balanced accounting.

Several things have been insinuated about me in an attempt to undermine my character.  I have tried to keep my accounting factual and to the point.  And while there are many unflattering things to reveal about the girl I met from Moscow, that remains with me.  I don't want to stoop to the same level. 

But yet you just did by that two line comment.  If you didn't want to stoop to that level, why did you?  I imagine there are unflattering things that can be said about everyone.  But if you are going to imply them, don't act like you are above it.

As a further introduction to myself and for what it's worth, I am in the final stages of divorce proceedings.   

This was a key detail I am glad to see come up.  I was surprised to read you were still married and think it was an important detail.

I don't think Anya was attacking you.  I think she just felt some important details were not disclosed.  I hope you will finish your story.  But I also hope you will take more time now and disclose items that could make a difference.

I don't think the lady was a scammer.  But I do think it was a case where there was not chance of chemistry.  But I also think the right one is out there for you, and her.  I hope you both find them.