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Author Topic: The Struggle For Ukraine  (Read 409587 times)

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Offline Boethius

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #675 on: February 26, 2022, 06:04:32 PM »
Apparently there are growing protests in Russia about the invasion of Ukraine.

Let's hope these stories are true.


I read that all protests are banned.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline Hammer2722

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #676 on: February 26, 2022, 06:06:23 PM »
Where is the Russian version of  Claus von Stauffenberg now that he/she is needed ?


We can only hope!!!!
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Offline Trenchcoat

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #677 on: February 26, 2022, 06:23:44 PM »

GQBlues is still posting..so not all the board members with Russian partners are in hiding.

GQ you need to go into hiding ;)
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline ML

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #678 on: February 26, 2022, 06:37:36 PM »

I read that all protests are banned.

Well sure, but they are happening.
420 arrested in Moscow today.
Question is:  Just how much they will grow.
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Offline Boethius

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #679 on: February 26, 2022, 07:22:45 PM »
I don't think they will unless a significant number of Russian soldiers start coming home in body bags.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline GQBlues

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #680 on: February 26, 2022, 08:56:53 PM »
GQ you need to go into hiding ;)

Hiding?!?  Wifey and I went along with friends and stood4Ukraine at a rally along Sta Monica Blvd. in West Hollywood today. It was a darn cold 68 degrees today too. I’d hazard to guess half of the people there are actually Russian. WHolly is a very strong FSU community in LA.

Part of me is so glad the Ukrainians are holding back the assault, but I pray this doesn’t cause madVlad to give the order to go on seek and destroy anything and everything. Hard to say it, but I think Zelensky is a dead man walking. I hope not, but much respect whether he lives or dies.
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Offline Jumper1

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #681 on: February 26, 2022, 09:08:46 PM »
68F,  brrrrr
Ok.i needed a laugh today, thanks

Offline ML

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #682 on: February 26, 2022, 09:33:20 PM »
I had never heard of this guy Smerconish before, but apparently he asks the 'question of the day' on his program.
A friend sent me this about his question today.
- - - - - - - - -
This morning (Sat 2/26) Smerconish's poll question was: 
"Should NATO go to war for Ukraine?"   
The results were jaw-dropping. 
Over 38,000 responses (usually he gets <half of that) with 77% saying yes and 23% no! 
Smerconish was gob-smacked that a CNN audience would react that way. 
Given the demonstrations in Russia, much less around the world, it looks like a lose/lose situation for Putin.  He could well end up like Saddam and Khadafy.
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Offline Bee Farmer

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #683 on: February 26, 2022, 10:19:05 PM »
I don't think they will unless a significant number of Russian soldiers start coming home in body bags.

Figuratively, or literally? You are aware that Russia sent a mobile crematory to Ukraine, right?  No need for body bags anymore.  If the families are lucky, they will get the ashes of their sons.

I still think we should give Putin a taste of his own medicine.

We should cancel every Russian, Belorussian, and Chechnyan student visa, and give them 24 hours to leave the US or be arrested and put in one of the ICE concentration camps for illegal immigrants.  They should also be banned from coming back to the US for 3-5 years.  This destroys the possibility of getting a US education.
Anyone with Russian/Belorussian/Chechnyan citizenship should have their visa revoked and immediately deported.

The vast majority of the Russians in US universities are kids of the elites.  How many Russian businessmen are in the US?  Putin wants regime change?  You don't think all those kids and businessmen will be pissed about getting kicked out of the US because of Putin invading Ukraine and starting a war?

Putin says Ukraine was historically Russian.  It got created by WWII.  What about Koenigsberg/Kaliningrad?  It was formerly German, and the USSR got it as a war prize.  When the Soviet Union fell apart in '91, Russia got to keep Kaliningrad, because neither Lithuania or Poland claimed it.  (Kaliningrad is surrounded by NATO - so much for Putin's claim of keeping NATO from Russia's borders.)  Kaliningrad is home to the naval fleet, and is the center of Russian industry.  It also houses nuclear weapons that threaten Europe.  NATO should have a mass attack on Kaliningrad, and wipe it off the map.  Let Putin lose his naval base and Kaliningrad, and see if he doesn't change his tune on Ukraine.

Offline Boethius

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #684 on: February 26, 2022, 10:41:45 PM »
68F,  brrrrr
Ok.i needed a laugh today, thanks

Yes, :ROFL: .   When hubby first saw this, after his first full winter here, he was shocked.  We lived near the university, and all the Canadian students were in t-shirts and shorts at 0C.  Now, he doesn't bat an eye.


It was -3C or 26F here today.  Young people were out in t shirts and shorts.

Figuratively, or literally?

I meant figuratively.
After the fall of communism, the biggest mistake Boris Yeltsin's regime made was not to disband the KGB altogether. Instead it changed its name to the FSB and, to many observers, morphed into a gangster organisation, eventually headed by master criminal Vladimir Putin. - Gerard Batten

Offline GQBlues

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #685 on: February 26, 2022, 10:55:53 PM »
I don’t even know why these guys are fighting (Russian / Ukrainian ). Even in the heat of war, they seem so casual with each other.

Funny, in a strange kind of way.

Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Admin

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #686 on: February 26, 2022, 10:58:59 PM »
Written in January of this year, this article seems prescient at this point in time .... http://www.csis.org/analysis/russias-possible-invasion-ukraine

Offline Trenchcoat

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« Reply #687 on: February 27, 2022, 12:21:16 AM »
I don't think it would be a good idea for NATO to get involved, it would risk spreading the conflict and NATO possibly having to go onto Russian lands. Then we would be the invader and it could legitimize mad Vlad's claim of the threat of NATO. In addition there would be a string risk of nuclear war and/or hyperthermal missiles being used by Russia.

The situation is best kept as it is localised to Ukraine. If Russia's troops get worn down and defeated there then that will likely bhave consequences for Putin & Russia. It will be seen as a fair cop and Russia will have to come to terms with Ukraine. It's a better position I think for Ukraine to go at it with Russia as after all they are the ones Putin has a beef with. Strategically it's better for us to supply Ukraine with weapons and all it needs to do the fighting. Even if they eventually lose if they put up a string enough fight it will degrade the Russian military and dissuade Russia from further conflicts elsewhere, that depends on the Ukrainians putting up stiff resistance for quite some time though. It really is their fight to my mind I don't buy it that other countries in Europe are next, Georgia & the Stans maybe. In Europe there is NATO and France and the UK have Nukes, the US have Nukes too so with the line drawn in the sand it's too risky for and Vlad to go there. Plus with how badly Russian Armies are doing in Ukraine at present they would be torn to shreds by NATO forces on our home turf. I think Ukraine has got this one and they'll have to fight their corner.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Trenchcoat

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #688 on: February 27, 2022, 12:20:45 AM »
Kharkiv being attacked today, oil refinery & gas pipeline hit, lots of fire & smoke.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2022, 12:24:22 AM by Trenchcoat »
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Bee Farmer

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« Reply #689 on: February 27, 2022, 12:43:27 AM »
Trench, where's your balls?  You need to go find them, because you aren't wearing them.

That attitude is like seeing a woman getting raped, and not wanting to get involved because you might have to fight with the rapist.  Grow a pair.

A lady just sent me a video from an apartment window.  Russian tanks rolling down the street in Kyiv right now, and someone shooting at them with a rifle.

If NATO was there, they would have anti-tank guns to stop the tanks.

Offline Chelseaboy

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« Reply #690 on: February 27, 2022, 02:50:25 AM »
Germany now stepping up..lot's more military aid being sent to Ukraine....1000 anti-tank weapons and 500 Stinger missiles.


They've also stopped the ban on third parties sending German manufactured weapons to Ukraine.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2022, 02:57:29 AM by Chelseaboy »
Just saying it like it is.

Offline Patagonie

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« Reply #691 on: February 27, 2022, 04:41:52 AM »
Where is the Russian version of  Claus von Stauffenberg now that he/she is needed ?
I think that is the logical solution now.
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Offline Chelseaboy

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #692 on: February 27, 2022, 05:14:14 AM »
Mayor of Kharkiv saying the area of Kharkiv now back in Ukrainian control,with news outlets showing film of a column of abandoned Russian armoured vehicles and Ukrainian troops stripping them out.
Just saying it like it is.

Offline Trenchcoat

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #693 on: February 27, 2022, 05:40:38 AM »
Trench, where's your balls?  You need to go find them, because you aren't wearing them.

That attitude is like seeing a woman getting raped, and not wanting to get involved because you might have to fight with the rapist.  Grow a pair.

A lady just sent me a video from an apartment window.  Russian tanks rolling down the street in Kyiv right now, and someone shooting at them with a rifle.

If NATO was there, they would have anti-tank guns to stop the tanks.

Ah you'll be off to Ukraine to fight as one of the many foreign fighters going there will you Bee Farmer? A 'War Tourist'?

Well it could get you the women if you survive and we've seen the Reddit link on here kindly provided by Davo I think it was of those that don't live to tell the tale. But don't let me stop you, you go if you want to.

I think with NATO you're not seeing the whole picture, sure NATO could destroy a lot of their Army reasonably easily but it doesn't stop there, Russia has chemical, thermal and nuclear weapons and there is no guarantee we can stop them. Russia still has thousands upon thousands of nukes that can destroy the world several times over. We can't be assure that we can stop them all or that they won't reach us to say nothing of the radioactive fallout. At best if we destroy Russia's army we may agree a ceasefire and a resolution bin Ukraine's favour as to press on and try to capture Moscow etc would like make Russia use Nukes and hence MAD. I don't think we really want WWIII with chemical, thermal, etc misery just over Ukraine. Ukraine can fight its own battles.

That battle btw may apparently go on years:

http://news.sky.com/story/ukraine-conflict-could-last-years-and-uk-needs-to-be-prepared-for-a-very-long-haul-says-foreign-secretary-liz-truss-12553040

So visiting Ukraine may be off for us guys and my Odessa Dreaming over. Apparently in the UK we are going to set up an International Force comprised of any of the cowards who fleed Ukraine but might change their mind and send them back in to fight.

With all the weapons now being sent to Ukraine they've got everything they need out there now to put up stiff resistance to the Russians for a long time. They will still need food and water and probably bring money in to live off so it's not certain how it will all go but I think now Ukraine has every fighting chance.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline Chelseaboy

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The Struggle For Ukraine
« Reply #694 on: February 27, 2022, 06:08:07 AM »
Russia has lost around 4,300 military personnel and 146 Tanks so far.


BBC are on the Polish border watching the refugees from Ukraine arriving and reported that a large convoy of military aid was seen going the other way.


Ukrainian men who've been working as lorry drivers in Poland going the other way too to fight.


« Last Edit: February 27, 2022, 06:30:18 AM by Chelseaboy »
Just saying it like it is.

Offline fathertime

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« Reply #695 on: February 27, 2022, 07:27:03 AM »
Russia has lost around 4,300 military personnel and 146 Tanks so far.
Russia has lost 4000 and Ukraine 198.   I find that hard to believe, if being reported from western media doesn't lend much credence to its accuracy.   If these numbers were accurate, I'd say the battle isn't going well for Russia. 

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Offline ML

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« Reply #696 on: February 27, 2022, 08:13:06 AM »
We should cancel every Russian, Belorussian, and Chechnyan student visa, and give them 24 hours to leave the US or be arrested and put in one of the ICE concentration camps for illegal immigrants.  They should also be banned from coming back to the US for 3-5 years.  This destroys the possibility of getting a US education.
Anyone with Russian/Belorussian/Chechnyan citizenship should have their visa revoked and immediately deported.

I said this same thing to my wife a week or so ago.

I would go even further and evict those here with Green Card status.

There are several Russian citizens teaching here at the university with Green Card status.
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Offline fathertime

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« Reply #697 on: February 27, 2022, 08:29:56 AM »
I said this same thing to my wife a week or so ago.

I would go even further and evict those here with Green Card status.

There are several Russian citizens teaching here at the university with Green Card status.

Why would we want to take such harsh action against innocents....
Nations might then retaliate and decide to imprison innocent americans living abroad. 
I'm not sure I see how this would help but I can see how it would be detrimental. 

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Offline Trenchcoat

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« Reply #698 on: February 27, 2022, 08:32:36 AM »
Russia has lost 4000 and Ukraine 198.   I find that hard to believe, if being reported from western media doesn't lend much credence to its accuracy.   If these numbers were accurate, I'd say the battle isn't going well for Russia. 

Fathertime!

I think you're right FT that number can't be accurate, Russian losses more than ten times Ukrainian??? Possibly if Russia transported troops in lorries or tank crews being hit I could see it being a bit higher but more than ten times? Like you say either Ukrainians are understating their loses or they are overstating Russian casualties, maybe both.

I don't think it's going well for Russia but I can't see how it would be going that badly especially when the Russian forces are better equipped and trained supposedly. It may be Ukraine trying to hook the west, NATO into coming to their aid. The news report the other day from the soldiers injured at the hospital in Mariupol kind of tells a bit of a different picture, they were desperate for NATO to intervene and said that Ukraine could possibly only hold out about 8 days or so at best. I personally think it would be a disaster for NATO to get involved, almost certain WWIII and many, many more deaths as a result. Apart from Russia I could see China take the opportunity to invade Taiwan then the nations of the South China Sea then finally Australia due to NATO being distracted with Russia and most of its forces sent there. We would then be in a war with China and hence a world war. To my mind this fight is best kept between Russia & Ukraine, it's their fight and we never promised to come in fighting for Ukraine despite Zelensky's best efforts to try and drag us in.
"If you make your own bread, then and only then, are you a free man unchained and alive living in pooty tang paradise, or say no and live in Incel island with all the others." - Krimster

Offline fathertime

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« Reply #699 on: February 27, 2022, 08:37:23 AM »
Germany now stepping up..lot's more military aid being sent to Ukraine....1000 anti-tank weapons and 500 Stinger missiles.
It makes no sense that Russia would allow these weapons to be transported into Ukraine.   Given they have 100's of thousands of men on the ground now, it would seem they could control this sort of weaponry entering a battle zone. 

Fathertime!   
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