Best of Intentions meet the Worst of Intentions

[Muzh]

In my opinion, pursuing an FSU is a high risk, high reward equation.

LMAO


You tie up with the right one and you'll see your day in court answering to DV charges. It's called the 732 day bride. Plenty out there. 

[2tallbill]

Good post Eximio.

Hey Maxx welcome back

How is your Georgian adventure shaping up?

[Eximio]

Good post Eximio.

Thanks Maxx!  And thanks for writing the story of Gary.  There are a lot of stories like that.  They can't be talked about enough.

[Eximio]

I disagreed with almost everything in his post, Maxx.


Eximio exhibits the type of attitudes that give WM a bad name.

Hi Boethius.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I'm wondering how guys like me give WM a bad name?

If we can't learn from stories like that of Gary, we can't learn at all.  There are plenty stories like that with AM and AW.  I have known 2 guys that had their lives ruined for 5-10 years because of this DV craziness. 

Meanwhile, as far as I can tell, WM have a really good reputation among EW.  At least, that what editorials in the Kiev Post say.  And it's what my EW girlfriend says, as well as her friends.

(Maybe your were joking).

[ML]

Ochka is really flummoxed that every time she sees medical people for anything, they ask her if any men are beating her, etc.

I tell her that I think they are required to under some law or at least some program.

But man . . . talk about planting seeds . . . .

[jone]

It is the VAWA blessing.

[Bee Farmer]

It is the VAWA blessing.

The VAWA is dead.  The US Supreme Court killed it in June 2015 in Elonis vs. US.

VAWA depends on the "reasonable person" standard.  It's in the actual text of the law.

In Elonis vs. US, the US Supreme Court said that the reasonable person standard is only for purposes of determining negligence in civil suits, and is not to be used in criminal cases.

[Slumba]

The VAWA is dead.  The US Supreme Court killed it in June 2015 in Elonis vs. US.

VAWA depends on the "reasonable person" standard.  It's in the actual text of the law.

In Elonis vs. US, the US Supreme Court said that the reasonable person standard is only for purposes of determining negligence in civil suits, and is not to be used in criminal cases.

You are technically correct, however, family courts do what they want.  In MA, a lesbian activist became a family court judge.  Out of 500 cases studied, guess what percentage was heavily slanted towards the woman in the divorce?

[Eximio]

The VAWA is dead.  The US Supreme Court killed it in June 2015 in Elonis vs. US.

VAWA depends on the "reasonable person" standard.  It's in the actual text of the law.

In Elonis vs. US, the US Supreme Court said that the reasonable person standard is only for purposes of determining negligence in civil suits, and is not to be used in criminal cases.

First I heard about that.  I hope this is true.

However, even when a precedent is set by the US Supreme Court, it takes many years for this percolate through the entire justice system.  States and localities have enacted laws and created a massive infrastructure around the DV industry.  If you live in a blue state, you are more at risk and I'm not sure that risk goes down until these local laws are challenged all the way up to the US Supreme Court.  That could take many years and, in fact, might never happen.

It's a dangerous environment out there for men.  That will last for many years, certainly throughout our lives.

[jone]

Eximio,

I am going to give you some friendly advice that you might wish to take to heart. 

When I first came on the forum, I spent a lot of time determining what was fake and what was sincere.  I was very harsh in my evaluations of the FSU women.  I see the same qualities in your posts.  There is much about what you won't accept and not enough tolerance for the vagrancies of life. 

I heard this from many men pursuing the FSU Women dream:  When an FSU woman is into you, you will receive love in a way that you never have experienced it before. The woman provides an all-encompassing love.  I didn't quite know what to expect until I experienced it for myself.  I can tell you that many of the things that concern you and you write about in your quest pale in comparison to this love. 

People ask why I have pursued and will marry a Russian woman?  It is because a love like this is a platform on which to build the rest of your life.  The little warts that are talked about on the forum will never overshadow the true goal that I believe you are seeking.

Good luck in your continued quest.

[2tallbill]

Ochka is really flummoxed that every time she sees medical people for anything, they ask her if any men are beating her, etc.

I tell her that I think they are required to under some law or at least some program.

But man . . . talk about planting seeds . . . .

It's part big brother too. Since Mini-Me was born we are asked if we have
any guns in the house. Since we refuse to answer the question pops back
up every couple of months. We were asked last time if we thought anybody
might be abusing him.

[Miquel Westano]

It's part big brother too. Since Mini-Me was born we are asked if we have
any guns in the house. Since we refuse to answer the question pops back
up every couple of months. We were asked last time if we thought anybody
might be abusing him.

It has to be about money somehow.  I get the same thing every time I go for medical exams at the VA.  Are you depressed?  Are you being abused mentally or physically?  Do you own/have firearms in your home?  Do you think of harming yourself or others? 

Odd since I am not on or have ever been on depression meds, been treated for depression, reported or been treated for abuse or ever contemplated harming myself. 

I assume this is tied to some medical funding by the government, but don't really know.

I am not sure if all VA hospitals ask these question, if every patient is asked or if it is random?  But they ask me that every year and have for the last several years. 

[Boethius]

It probably is related to litigation mitigation.


A woman claims she was too afraid to tell her physician she was being abused.  So, she sues the physician who didn't ask her that.  The family of someone who is depressed sues the physician for not recognizing the depression, and the fact the guy had access to firearms.  Or, the victims that guy shoots up in a mall/theatre/school/post office sue the physician who didn't recognize his depression, and didn't ask if he had firearms, thereby not notifying anyone that he could be a danger to himself/his family/the public at large.

[Maxx2]

Hey Maxx welcome back

How is your Georgian adventure shaping up?

I leave in 9 days.

[Maxx2]

Eximio, I went through a similar experience similar to Gary's 12 years ago. I was in a state of shock and in a condition that could best be described as PTSD. The tendency at those times (similar to combat) is to see danger behind every corner. Normally however it is not a good idea to be too reactive or quick to pidgin hole people and groups. To take that defensive combat mindset into finding a wife is a recipe for failure. This story really is something people should keep in the backs their of minds and not something kept before them with every woman they meet.   

[Slumba]

It's part big brother too. Since Mini-Me was born we are asked if we have
any guns in the house. Since we refuse to answer the question pops back
up every couple of months. We were asked last time if we thought anybody
might be abusing him.

They are required by law to ask.  Thank goodness we live in the land of the free!

[Eximio]

Eximio, I went through a similar experience similar to Gary's 12 years ago. I was in a state of shock and in a condition that could best be described as PTSD. The tendency at those times (similar to combat) is to see danger behind every corner. Normally however it is not a good idea to be too reactive or quick to pidgin hole people and groups. To take that defensive combat mindset into finding a wife is a recipe for failure. This story really is something people should keep in the backs their of minds and not something kept before them with every woman they meet.   

Maxx, I do not disagree with you at all on this.  The problem I see, however, is that most men do not even have this in the BACK of their minds.

My advice is simply to go into things well-informed and with your eyes wide open.

[jone]

Eximio, I went through a similar experience similar to Gary's 12 years ago. I was in a state of shock and in a condition that could best be described as PTSD. The tendency at those times (similar to combat) is to see danger behind every corner. Normally however it is not a good idea to be too reactive or quick to pidgin hole people and groups. To take that defensive combat mindset into finding a wife is a recipe for failure. This story really is something people should keep in the backs their of minds and not something kept before them with every woman they meet.   

This is very important.   You are traveling halfway across the world.  To not have an implicit belief that a woman is telling you the truth and acting out of good faith is a recipe for failure.    If you are sniffing around about her motives, you have already condemned a relationship with an FSU woman.  My observation is that you only get so many chances at success in this venture.  So screen the women ahead of time, but when the time comes to make a trip, do not show any hint that you may suspect the woman of some nefarious motives.

In the movie, Hitch, the main character says that you must leap.  At some point that is true in this pursuit.  My suggestion is that you make the leap the moment you get on the plane.  Even in the case of a WMVM trip, the benefit of the doubt must always remain in the favor of the woman.

[ML]

In the movie, Hitch, the main character says that you must leap.  At some point that is true in this pursuit.  My suggestion is that you make the leap the moment you get on the plane.  Even in the case of a WMVM trip, the benefit of the doubt must always remain in the favor of the woman.

But actually, if you plan and execute a WMVM trip properly, you don't have any of these worries.

As the meetings occur, you drop any gals that give you any trouble or raise any red flags or even yellow flags.

You will be left with a pretty good group of Gals that don't give you any worries at all.

It's pinning all your hope on one Gal before even meeting that causes the problems.

[Miquel Westano]

It probably is related to litigation mitigation.

The avoidance of legal expense, would be about money.  I agree with you this is very likely one of the reasons.  I suspect there are others, especially with the VA and the current political views on firearms.  But ultimately most things in day to day life come down to money.

[2tallbill]

But actually, if you plan and execute a WMVM trip properly

ML, I resurrect an old thread so that the merits of each strategy can be discussed
rather than get buried here.

Personally the VM vs VO thread should be a sticky because it's discussed in
so many places then gone and buried.

http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=151.new#new

[2tallbill]

I leave in 9 days.

Why don't you start a blog on your experiences. You can keep the personal details light
but I am sure that many of the guys here would like to know how things go. There is
another guy who has been talking about a similar type adventure and many sit and
think about it (myself included)

Since you are living the dream, maybe you can give us a voyeurs window into how
things go?

I have a number of friends in Tblisi and Kutaisi if you need any additional contacts there.