Please assess this Russian Woman for me guys ///

[jb]

Neil, 

You didn't tell us her age, just that she's 15 years younger than you, it was your use of the word "cute" that got my attention.  Perhaps it's just my perception of things, but young girls are "cute", a more mature woman can be attractive, beautiful, stunning, etc., but rarely are they described as cute.

Just curious, where in Russia does she live?  The stated $450/mo salary is probably good money for a city in central Russia, but it would be starvation wages in Moscow or Petrograd.  You didn't give enough information for us to form a perspective, but I'm pretty sure she doesn't live in Moscow or St. Pete.   I also have some problems with the "head of car sales" notion.  I can't say for sure, maybe her dad or a uncle ownes the car business, but it also might be considered unusual for a woman, especially a young woman, to head up a car sales department in such a male dominated culture.   I can't say why, but I have a negative feeling about the employment issue.

The fact that she still lives with her parents is not unusual, young women typically don't leave the family nest until they marry, that she will not give you the home phone number is not a good sign.  She lives there, I assure you she recieves personal calls at that number.   You might have to limit the length of your calls to some shorter amount of time, like 1 hour instead of 3 hours, but I'm certain her parents are accustomed to her friends calling the house.  Any woman who has a sincere interest in a man is wanting him to call, after a couple of weeks, she is complaining that he doesn't call often enough.  As Bruno pointed out, if she does earn an upscale salary, having a cell phone would be considered de rigueur, it's as much a part of her outfit as her shoes, no young woman would be caught dead without one these days.   Why don't you have her cell number?

I can't say for sure since we are not privvy to the e-mails and photos, but from where I sit, I'd say you are being played like a fat trout.  Slowly being reeled in and made to feel comfortable before she guts you and hangs your wallet on the bedpost.

[Turboguy]

Frankly I think some of the things jb has asked might help us to help give you better advice.   Now let me say this.  Every girl in Russia over the age of 12 has a cell phone.  High paid executive or unemployed student.   It is just like here.  That does not rule out a lot of the ones under 12 but she DOES have a cell phone.

Ok, is she trying to scam you?  No, she has a boyfriend she does not see a future with.  That is my guess. Maybe he is married.   Maybe he is just not someone she really wants to spend her life with.  She is interested in you she just does not want to get the shit kicked out of her.   I think her plan is when the time is right the boyfriend will go but in the meantime she needs to play games with you.  Am I right?  I don't know but it would explain things.

[neilhardy]

Hi JB, kindof you to reply.

Your thoughts are much appreciated.

Ryazan about 100 miles se or Moscow. I imagine not a great area aive looked it up on the net and it does not look like the hamptons shall we say.

Shes 26 yo.

Anymore thoughts much appreciated.

[BC]

Leslie,

 Love The New Avatar! You've got yourself one real Beauty there!

Ken

I keep avatars turned off.. but had to sneak a peek.  Yep a real cutie there Leslie!

[neilhardy]

TURBOGUY>>

Thanks TURBO sosuch for your take on this, very good advise indeed, Im learning fast.

If she replies I'll happily say "look cell number of no more e-mails", - idont think she will however.

Shes from Ryazan about 100 miles se or Moscow, by the looks of it quite a poor area, what is your opinion of the antiscam checks where you send a single red rose and the courier checks her out for 25bux??

Neil

[Turboguy]

That is not bad money for Ryzan.  It probably is about right for a good job and a little more than average.   My former fiancee lived in N. Novgorod and was making $ 200.00 a month in the workshop before she came to America and working as a secretary for a large company for $ 120 a month after she returned.  Ryzan is a bit closer to Moscow so it might move the pays up a tad and perhaps not.  In Moscow itself that would not be good money.   My former fiance could have moved to moscow and made $ 650 but her cost of living would have been more.  Hope this might put your gals pay into perspective a bit.  By the way even working for $ 120.00 a month she had a cell phone.  She also had a home phone.

A little more on pays.  The gal I have been seeing from Rostov which is a fairly prosperous city works in about an identical job to your gal.  She has never told me exactly how much she made but I have guessed it to be about what yours says she makes.

The flower thing with photos.  Without a phone number they could have trouble pinning her down to deliver them.  Some guys have done it with luck.

I think if it were me, I would just play along and while I was writing her I would look hard at other available women.  No harm in writing her, just don't get your hopes to high and don't make a trip just to visit her unless things change with her.

[BC]

neilhardy,

I had to go back and read your initial post again.. I sort of get the impression you wrote only to this girl?

If so what was it in particular that impressed you with her listing?

Not to discourage, but first I would think over the years scammers have learned to build great custom 'lures' that will be quite convincing.  If you only wrote to one or just a very few chances are greater you get snagged.  Second figure another gazillion guys competing with you for the same reason you did.

An idea I have suggested in the past is to start in your normal dating age range and work down instead of the other way around.

BTW I didn't go the correspondence route so I could be spouting total bs.

p.s. Guys please don't turn this thread into one of those WMVM/WOVO maratons.. 

[Turboguy]

First off you are around 42 she is 26.  That is not a bad age difference.  I am not saying it is a good one just that it is not a bad one.

Let me through this out for consideration.   First off.  She made the initial contact through Match.com.   Just as a side note a gal contacting you first from Match.com is like being matched with someone by an agency in Lugask.  None of the gals that do that are real.

Now she tells you she does not have a cell phone or a phone.  OK, no big deal even though every other woman her age there does.  Now lets talk about this a little.

She contacted you first from Match.com.  To do that she has to have a membership.  Right?  To have a membership you have to have a credit card?  Right!  Virtually everyone in Russia has a cell phone.  Virtually no one in Russia has a credit card!  That is starting to change but as of now that is accurate.   There is no way she is real.

Sorry, I know that is not what you want to hear.  Just keep in mind.  Russia is full of wonderful women.  You can find a great one and you are at a good age to do just that.

[neilhardy]

Superb insightfull post Turbo thanks so much!!

[neilhardy]

ATTENTION BC...

Thanks for your take on it BC, its appreciated.

Now Im not an idiot and a pretty good looking guy, but I vowed after two long term partners were unfaithfull to me that I would never entertain a british **slag** again. So I tried match.com.

I put on match.com no women from the UK but Russian European only, I got 50 replies,
I conversed with about 10, 5 stopped writing when I said I would prefer to meet in person after a few months to see if we were a real match.

two told me they would need some help with the visa and airfare, she didnt like it when I said I would pay for her on my credit card, they said no Ill need the money, I told her to stop writing.

This girl and one other are left.

Thats the story......

[Turboguy]

Neil,

Here is my honest assesment.  I think you can end up with a gal that you would normally only dream about.  A gal that would not give you the time of day where you are but I think you need to take a hard look at how you are going about it.

I see no reason to stop writing to the gal or gals you are just when they ask for money and they will, dump them.  Instead of forgetting about the gal, forget about Match.com.  It is not a viable way to meet a good Russian gal.

Read a lot of the posts here about how to do it.  If you want to start with correspondene hook up with someone like Elana's models or Bride.ru or many of the others.  If you want to start in with no investment try one of the free sites like freepersonals.ru.  Look at alternate ways to go about it.  Making a trip somewhere and working with some local agencies.  There are good and bad ones and reading the posts here will give you some clues.   I would wish you good luck but I don't think you will need luck to find your dream girl, just a change in technique.

[PeeWee]

Neil, you are not out of pocket yet and if you have time you can play this one out. In the meantime it does not harm you to have two or three other correspondences. JB detailed it out for you pretty well. Proceed with caution, ask questions, be aware, give the benefit of the doubt until there is a doubt. It seems to me that the scammer only has to play the percentages. One fish out of a sea of many is all it takes for her to add to her income base.

In my experience every scammer that I have met were the ones who contacted me. I have written to several from agency lists and did not find any of those to be scammers. I have had three women recommended to me by ladies who belong to the Russian ladies forum. Their girl friends who are still living in Russia and they wish to help them find a man. Those three were all of good standards. I have said before that I have yet to be scammed. I have been contacted by scammers but because I took my time and because I used my brain I was able to determine what was going on.

Good luck to you and keep asking the questions both of us and of her, or them. You have a wealth of knowledge here. I would guess that every man who posts here has had some experience with the scammer.

Peewee

[Jooky]

Hi Neil, can we assess you instead? Your Russian scammer is too easy. 

[BillyB]

A final update, she has now given me her address, but says only her parents have a phone number, seems unlikely that a sales exec would not have a phone in her flat,  Im most suspicious.

Too bad Western Union doesn't require a working phone number with that address. It might prevent a lot of repeat scammers if they were harassed by the men they scammed.

Insist on calling her at her parents house on a regular basis so you two can develop your relationship further. That should get her excited!!!

To answer your question, I've heard good and bad about Elena's Models and Bride.ru But most bad comes from customers findings of questionable women but that's normal. NO site is scammer free. But for the most part, you aren't going to be scammed by those two companies themselves.

Just remember, if a woman is into you, you are going to have little resistance in getting what you want.

[Bruno]

A final update, she has now given me her address, but says only her parents have a phone number, seems unlikely that a sales exec would not have a phone in her flat,  Im most suspicious.

A sales exec who work internationaly have certainly a phone at work... ask her when she take her midday pause and her work phone... call her during these time... but maybe she will find some excuse about work phone too !

[Todd]

I missed the part about the lack of a cell phone.  It definitely sounds fishy.  After skimming through all the good advice, it might be time to simply lay down the law.  You might want to write something short like....Here is my contact information, please send me yours, and I will be happy to call you.  If you feel that you can't entrust me with this information  and do not wish to call me, then I wish you all the best...."  Match.com AND no cell phone just doesn't add up.

After sending the e-mail, you might want to consider Elena's Model's.

Todd

[Marc Dayton]

I just looked over this didnot read all, but feel I must say something you might not like.

You set the stage of not trusting her then you want her to trust you?

Think about how she might see your post as one other person told you Cheep.

Know my thoughts any good Russian Woman would think what if I need tolit paper will I need to beg my husbain to get it. A good RW would just say next and not waist her time she would say your the man you take care of me!!!

any bad Russian woman might just look at your e-mails and say O please let me teach him a lesson? some RW would wait 10 years to get a man they think is an ? you set your self up to fail you will!!!!!

Start over do it right is my best advice.

[Durk]

      Neil.
 
             I am new to this as well. I think Turbo gave you the best advice. A group of us have
been looking at this industry for some time and we find that most of the sites are very questionable.
             Some of the members have listed EM as a possibility. I think you have to go platinum
in order to really have any success there. Turbo,how many girls did you meet from EM? We profiled
EM and found some very strange results. Emails were sent to the per. email w/a receipt. They
were never opened yet the girl tells the profile inside the site that she replied. Really??? I think
you might want to get an at work phone number. Call her on the job and verify her workplace if
you can. My advice would be to contact Mark or Jack and get started with them. There are plenty
of woman to choose from you just have to make your time really count. Remember that only
about 5 to 10 percent will be worth dating. Keepers are not on every corner!! My progress has
been very slow but I would rather walk than run with this part of my life.

                                                                                               D

[Turboguy]

Durk, you asked how many girls I had met through Elana's.   I really couldn't put a number on it.  I had to cancel a trip a few weeks ago do to health problems and was going to meet about 7 girls I had met on Elena's on that trip.

I would not consider a problem to find girls that I would like.   The biggest problem I have is that there will be one I really like in Kiev, one I really like in Odessa, one I really like in Lugansk, one I like in Simferpol, one I really like in Novisbirk, One I really like in Kazan.   They are scattered all over the place.  There is a good side to it in that you can meet someone and spend a few days and not loose too much time on any one girl yet still give them enough time to see if there is chemistry.  All of them seem like the type of gal I would like to find.   There have been a ton more that wrote for a while but stopped writing after a few months when there was no plan for a meeting.  I can spend all my free time writing quality gals thanks to Elena's.   I have a hard time keeping up with the correspondence. 

I think the Platinum membership is the one that works the best but the Silver membership may work as well.   I also write a few gals from FreePersonals.ru but I think they get more swamped with letters.  I have heard gals talk about getting letters from 500 guys or more. 

I have been happy with Elena's.   You really don't want to be doing Match.com for Russian women.  You are wasting your time.   There are other good sites as well.

[BillyB]

You set the stage of not trusting her then you want her to trust you?

Marc,

Neil and all of RWD's finest are first trying to establish if we're dealing with a "her" or a "him".

[ronin308]

On the phone thing,

My fiance gets upset if I don't call her every 2 days.  We haven't written a letter or email in over 6 months. 

I am suprised she won't give out any number.  While mobile phones are as common there as the UK or US I do know of a few women who didn't carry them.  The first Ukrainian girl I ever met didn't carry one and she lived in the most modern city of Ukraine (ie Kiev), I only asked for her home number when I was on my way to Kiev.

[PeeWee]

Marc,

Neil and all of RWD's finest are first trying to establish if we're dealing with a "her" or a "him".

Could also be a he-she. Where is your money going, Billy?

Peewee

[Jumper]

not that you need to hear it yet again,,but-

I asked to speak and write to her, she says she wont give me her phone or address yet - Bad sign ??

 She tells me tentatively that she loves me ? bad sign after 3 months ??

and... she contacted you FIRST on Match.com


never entertain the idea someone is being truthful with you if they are unwilling to give you contact info..

especially someone who CONTACTED you ,
initially ,showing interest in you.

you dont find it bizarre?

*she* could easily arrange a phone conversation, thru friends, or even over the computer,as some  i-net cafes have that option..
if she can afford a match.com membership,she can call you.
and if she loves you, she shouldnt mind you calling her!

[PeeWee]

not that you need to hear it yet again,,but-


and... she contacted you FIRST on Match.com


never entertain the idea someone is being truthful with you if they are unwilling to give you contact info..

especially someone who CONTACTED you ,
initially ,showing interest in you.

you dont find it bizarre?

*she* could easily arrange a phone conversation, thru friends, or even over the computer,as some  i-net cafes have that option..
if she can afford a match.com membership,she can call you.
and if she loves you, she shouldnt mind you calling her!

AJ, have not seen you for a week or so. Your info on Prague was most helpful.

Regarding this thread. Neil, this pattern may unfold. She will claim her love. Next will come an urgent email that she has realized that she must meet with you in the UK. She has checked with a travel agent who tells her for 700 Euro she can fly to you with in the next few weeks. Next you may get a letter from the agency explaining that she has contacted them and that if you will send the money to them they will make all of the necessary arrangements.

Or, she will tell that it is unusual for her but she is asking for your help. Her mother was struck by a car and needs urgent medical care. Can  you send money. Or her computer broke and until she can fix it she must use Internet for one month can  you send money. At some point in this there may be a money request.

I had one lady contact me with a letter and a photo of Heidi Klum. Most guys my not have realized it but I know Heidi Klum when I see her. Knowing it was a scam I went with it for a few letters and when the money shot was fired (her mom was hit by a car, she claimed)  I told her that I would be in her city the next week and that I would deliver it to her in person. The letters stopped coming that next day.

Just be aware at all times. I have communicated with a lady now for 5 months. So far no money request but I listen and watch for any inconsistancys in her talk and actions all of the time. I am growing more trusting but until I meet her for the first time I will retain some doubt in her. She may well doing the same with me.

Peewee

[beattledog]

Jist tke your time with this lady.  Her notgiving you her phone number would be of concern to me.  My woman gave me her phone number when I requessted it after 4 weeks of correspondence.  She did hang up on my the first time that I called her, because she did not believe that i would call  her. Most men do not call or visit their woman

beattledog