Help! email complications, red flags?

[Photo Guy]

I'm going to Kiev in April to meet Larisa for the first time.
It's time to set up lodgings and arrange for an interpreter.
Larisa is in Mariupol. Larisa is comfortable with the local email
translator we have been using in Mariupol. ($7 per email)
I really need advice about this situation. Here's her recent email:

'Hello, dear Doug!
Thank you very much for your letter! And please, sorry for not replying to
you sooner!
How are you?
Dear Doug, I really hope that we will like each other! I am almost sure in this!
My dear, you wrote that you paid for our conversation 300 hrivnyas… To tell the truth I don't know if it is much!

Well, dear Doug, you wrote me about the interpreter… To tell the truth I would like to come with my interpreter because I know her and she knows everything about our correspondence! And to tell the truth I can't understand why you don't want me bring
my interpreter! Of course I understand that you don't want to pay more, but…. In any case I will think about it!

And as to apartments, I was brought up in other way and to tell the truth I prefer o stay in another apartment. Please don't think that I don't trust you, I do.! But I didn't use to stay in one apartment with the man! I am sure that we will spend much time with you!!!

Dear Doug, I am absolutely agree with you that you can tell everything about me by
meeting my friends! Maybe next time you will come to Mariupol!? Who knows what will happen after this meeting!

My dear, I have that map you sent me! But I didn't buy any other!
Yes, I know where you live, but I wish that one day I will see everything by my own eyes!!!! :-)))

Dear Doug, you have really nice dreams!!!! And maybe one day our dreams will come true! :-)))

Of course it is great to have full family with children! I want to have children very much!!! You know Doug; it is very difficult for me to explain this…. But it seems to me that you will be great father!

My dear, tomorrow we will have the Women's Day. Greatest holiday, I like it very much!!!!

Well, my dear, I will close my letter on this note and I really hope to hear from you soon!!!

Truly yours, Larisa.

P.S. Please, sorry for not writing to you more longer letter, but I have to buy a lot of present to my mother and friends!'

How do I handle this? I need to know the costs involved in using
her interpreter. Should I just state it that way? I'm beginning to
regret using THE AGENCY.  -doug L.

       

[Albert]

Of course there are complications and red flags.  You have been warned of your foolishness in following up with this woman before.

When she comes with an interpreter, stays in a separate apartment, etc., then you will never really get to know her.

Most likely, she and the other woman are just treating this as a way to get a few days vacation in Kyiv.

First mistake you made was pursuing a woman who needs an interpreter.  You really know nothing at all about what this woman is like.  You know quite a bit about what the interpreter is like since it is her words.

Second mistake you are making is going to meet only one woman.

Third mistake is you are stubborn and not listening to those who have attempted to help you, compared to those who are just blindly encouraging you.

[Elen]

Well what was done is  done :?( or how you say that)

I think you just should continue and see at least how it looks like in reality. But don't make any plans for future any more. (yet) Life will not end tomorrow.

BTW I would not stay in the same appartment with guy I don't know at all as well. (though I would not need translator )

[Elen]

7$ per e-mail

:?:?

Damn it!!

Look what you have done PhotoGuy.:X Now I'll not sleep all night about lost gain:D:D:D

[Elen]

Yes, I know where you live, but I wish that one day I will see everything by my own eyes!!!! :-)))

Dear Doug, you have really nice dreams!!!! And maybe one day our dreams will come true! :-)))

Of course it is great to have full family with children! I want to have children very much!!! You know Doug; it is very difficult for me to explain this…. But it seems to me that you will be great father!

 THAT part I don't like most:?

[Bruno]

[line]
First mistake you made was pursuing a woman who needs an interpreter.  You really know nothing at all about what this woman is like.  You know quite a bit about what the interpreter is like since it is her words.
[line]


Don't eliminate any possible candidate for the sole reason that she only speaks Russian. Often she will be a better choice than the 'modern' woman. Language will not be a barrier that you can't overcome. I have found that the ability to speak English, possibly other 'foreign' language, can be a status symbol, leading to an overemphasized feeling of self importance. This is not to say that you should eliminate those who do speak your language, but, I have had equally enjoyable experiences with both. Remember this destiny thing, if she feels that you may be her destiny, you WILL communicate, it might be difficult, everything is difficult in Russia, which is just normal life for her, but it is possible.


Galina have use service of agency for translation the first two month but she have begin learn English herself... Why you lady have not learn English if she really wish build a relation with you and life in US...

When dating Russian women from marriage or dating agencies, the issue of whether to use a translator on the first date will often come up. In fact, the agencies will usually offer it to you, so they can make some extra money. Whether to bring one on a first date or not is a tricky issue, and I can't give a firm yes or no answer. But here are some things to consider.

If you aren't confident of your communication skills, and are meeting a lady who can't speak any English, then it may help you feel more comfortable to bring a translator. However, there are some pitfalls to using a translator on your first date, which I've noticed.

1) First, some women depend so much on the translator, that they only talk to him/her and rarely even look at you. This makes the date very awkward, and you even feel like you're dating the translator rather than your date. And it also makes it hard for you to read the lady's body language as well, since it's mostly geared toward the translator rather than to you.

2) Second, it makes the date more like a crowded three than a romantic two.

3) Third, as I mentioned above, the purpose of the first date is to see if there is enough chemistry or attraction for a second date. A translator will not usually make a difference in that (though some may disagree with me). Chemistry and attraction tend to be subjective things, and finding out more basic facts about each other isn't usually going to influence that.

4) Finally, if there is no chemistry and no second date, then the money you spent on the translator would have been a waste, since you could have found out the same thing without one.

Therefore, what I suggest is that if you can deal with the basic communication, save the translator for subsequent dates, when you two have more serious and in-depth things to talk about.


[line]
Second mistake you are making is going to meet only one woman.
[line]


Reserve plan is always a good advice... You can meet only one woman but be ready with several local adresses of agency in anycase...

Now, for the problem with appartment... have you a one room of two room appartment... a two room is a very good solution, she will have his own privacy... now, have you think to the problem of translator... if the translator is not from the city of your stay, where she go sleep ? In all case, a local translator is needed... too much problem and expense with one from other city...

Propose her a two bedroom appartment and if she need a translator, choice a local one... and i think that a man translator is better that a woman one ( personal experience with first wife, where translator have try to seduce me) ...

[Photo Guy]

Elen,
I think $7 per email is a fair price, no big deal.
So over these past months, she has gone to the agency in
town, to send and receive emails. As a result, she has gotten to
know the interpreter. The interpreter has probably given her
opinions about my emails. Now the interpreter is using that bond with her to get more cash or a free vacation or whatever. All of this is contrasted by the fact that I've met a woman near Irkutsk via
Friendfinder, and she writes and speaks English AND sends me
tons of photos thru her own email address.(probably a cafe')
....so that's EASY.

That contrast, at this particular time with Larisa, is sort of an eye
opener. On the other hand, Larisa may be going along with the interpreter's plan, because they actually are friends, and Larisa
would feel more comfortable with her friend as a companion.
I can understand that.    -doug L.

[Photo Guy]

Yes, I know where you live, but I wish that one day I will see everything by my own eyes!!!! :-)))

Dear Doug, you have really nice dreams!!!! And maybe one day our dreams will come true! :-)))

Of course it is great to have full family with children! I want to have children very much!!! You know Doug; it is very difficult for me to explain this…. But it seems to me that you will be great father!

THAT part I don't like most:?[/quote]

Why don't you like that?  -doug

[jb]

Yeah, I see this post in much the same light as Albert.

Big mistake meeting in Kiev, shoulda made plans for her hometown.  That alone would have saved to cost of one apartment.  in addition, I'll add another thought, how can you meet her friends and family in Kiev?  Always remember, you don't have a girlfriend until you are accepted by her family.  Until then you are just an interesting stranger whose money is up for grabs.

WOVO is very noble, it's also a good way to wind up with nothing, or even worse, it's a good way to wind up married to the wrong woman.  If you have to use an interpreter to communicate, you know absolutely nothing about her that her translator/interpreter didn't want you to know.  Why is she insisting you use *her* interpreter?  There's something fishy going on there.  Besides, if this e-mail was translated by the same person, she's not very good anyway and you are getting ripped off if this is the quality you are getting for $7.00 a pop.

All of this is contrasted by the fact that I've met a woman near Irkutsk via
Friendfinder, and she writes and speaks English AND sends me
tons of photos thru her own email address.(probably a cafe')
....so that's EASY.

Other than the fact that Irkutsk is at the end of the earth and takes 3 days to get there, this is a better option than your little deal in Kiev supporting two women on holiday for a week.  Hell, the translation fees you'd save over the course of a year would almost pay for another trip to see her.

[Photo Guy]

Of course there are complications and red flags.  You have been warned of your foolishness in following up with this woman before.

When she comes with an interpreter, stays in a separate apartment, etc., then you will never really get to know her.

Most likely, she and the other woman are just treating this as a way to get a few days vacation in Kyiv.

First mistake you made was pursuing a woman who needs an interpreter.  You really know nothing at all about what this woman is like.  You know quite a bit about what the interpreter is like since it is her words.

Second mistake you are making is going to meet only one woman.

Third mistake is you are stubborn and not listening to those who have attempted to help you, compared to those who are just blindly encouraging you.

Your 'good' advice sucks. Aren't you the guy who said Larisa is
probably a prostitute?!!!  Now that was 'helpful'!  Your blanket
statement/condemnation about the interpreter is also too
extreme, too much of a generalization. Take your helpful
advice elsewhere. Thanks.   -doug L.

[Bruce]

Dear Doug,

     Tell her that you are coming to Kiev only for her and that you agreed to meet only her in Kiev.  You will provide a separate apartment for her and only initially ie. make it clear that the time period is up to you (I would hope if things work out she will insist on moving in with you).  Tell her that you will have an excellent interpreter / guide in Kiev who you have contracted to work with you already and you have no need for two interpreters ie. be very clear with her that you already are paying for an interpreter to work with you and your girl from Maripul and you have no need to pay for two interpreters.  If she balks at what I wrote above tell her these are your conditions for meeting.  Chances are if she balks it is because she is a scammer anyway, looking to get a free vacation for both her and her interpreter (perhaps friend). 

     I hope you contact reputable people in Kiev to help you search ie. for your backup plan which now appears to me you will be using at least at some point in your vacation.  Do not fret - Kiev is a great place to visit.  You will have a great time.  I believe you are much better off meeting many women.  Narrow things down - learn what is real and then write letters.  In any event do not let this Maripul girl manipulate you! 

[tim 360]

Honestly,  for a good interperter/translator your friend's translator does not have a very good command of English.  The letter's English is quite simplistic.

It's your nickel,  but your Kiev date appears to be well manipulated.  Hope you have a good back-up.

[GregfromGa]

I see no reason for renting 2 apartments. This is a grown woman. There has got to be a certain amount of trust here. Dont bring the translator either. You'll find they'll do more talking than you. You can rent a 2 bedroom flat and she can have a room and you can have a room. You will need to let here know on day #1 if things arent working out. Dont waste a trip when you already know the answer. I'll be in  Kiev from 13th-27th of March too bad or I would've tried to hook you up with some good people there.

[Marc Dayton]

Photo guy,

Bruce has a good point. I also think an Interputer from the city your going to is good, but for a another reason. She is not your girls trusted freind. If I went one on one I think I would like someone that was working for me not the girl ?

This might or might not give you an advange if the interputer is working for you ? not out of a freindship for your lady.

[Photo Guy]

All of this is contrasted by the fact that I've met a woman near Irkutsk via
Friendfinder, and she writes and speaks English AND sends me
tons of photos thru her own email address.(probably a cafe')
....so that's EASY.

Other than the fact that Irkutsk is at the end of the earth and takes 3 days to get there, this is a better option than your little deal in Kiev supporting two women on holiday for a week.  Hell, the translation fees you'd save over the course of a year would almost pay for another trip to see her.
[/quote]

jb, I couldn't find Irkutsk on my map, it didn't quite go THAT far east.
On a different map I found it, way east of Novosibirsk. Yikes!
Heck, maybe I could meet her (and her 'translator') in Tokyo. Ha.
What's amazing is communicating with her has these advantages:
1- direct emails, no agency
2- her English abilities require no translator
3- she's from a small town (a plus OR minus?)
No, I won't be supporting two women on a Kiev Holiday, thanks to
the advice here at RWD.   -doug

[Muzh]

Doug:

A few questions:

How long you've known her?

How old is she?  She sounds very young.

Why didn't you plan a trip to Mariupol?

Not knowing the above, my guess is that you her "know" very little.  Your conversations with her are somewhat superficial because of her age.  She may try to get a free vacation for her and her friend.  And finally, you are deeper into this than she is.  I don't think she is serious at all and you are going to get your butt spanked, nothing wrong with that especially by a young girl:P

Kidding aside, I really think tha she is not serious at all based on her response.  Sorry bud, but this happens when you post your private email in a public forum.

Now, please listen to yourself, not the other guys.  What's the name of this topic?  HELP, RED FLAGS!  It seems to me that you don't want to trust your own judgement.  Take a few steps back, take a deep breath, and start again.

Whhen are you going to Kiev and what are you going to do there?  Don't answer to anyone but yourself.

[Photo Guy]

Muzh,
We've exchanged dozens of emails since early December.
She's 28. I chose Kiev rather than her home city, because
some people at RWD suggested that, as a way to see if the
chemistry is good, before meeting her friends and family at
a later date. I guess I could make last minute changes and
go straight to Mariupol. Should I do that?  -doug

[Photo Guy]

7$ per e-mail

:?:?

Damn it!!

Look what you have done PhotoGuy.:X Now I'll not sleep all night about lost gain:D:D:D
[/quote]
It's funny?  ...Thanks.

[Muzh]

[user=134]Photo Guy[/user] wrote:

Muzh,
We've exchanged dozens of emails since early December.
She's 28. I chose Kiev rather than her home city, because
some people at RWD suggested that, as a way to see if the
chemistry is good, before meeting her friends and family at
a later date. I guess I could make last minute changes and
go straight to Mariupol. Should I do that? -doug

Doug my man.  You don't ask me what to do, just do it.  It's your girl and your trip.

I'll give you the best advice anyone on this list will ever give you.  When dealing with Russian girls, stop the wishy-washy.  Nice is one thing, the other is having people walk all over you.  RW want a MAN and by this I mean they want what they have known all their lives.  A tough HOMBRE. An American pussy-whipped guy is not going to make it, ESPECIALLY if there is a big age gap.  If you think I'm busting your balls, think again.  I'm on YOUR SIDE.  I know it is hard for many AM to be undoctrinated by the PC femenine crowd, but for heavens sake be a man.

A real man will open the door for a woman, he will not ask if he may open the door.

A real man will tell a young babe, honey I'm meeting you at Boryspol and then we are taking a taxi to my apartment and we are going to get to know each other very well.  I'm not talking about jumping on her.  I'm talking about being assertive and tell her what you are going to do when you meet her.  Then you are going to charm the living dayights out of her by being you, THE MAN.  Later that night, SHE will be the one telling you to hurry up to the appartment.  Translator who?

Now you have a very short time to re-program yourself out of the pussy-whipdom.  Get going.

And if you think this is BS, ask some RWs for their opinion of what I wrote.

[Photo Guy]

Muzh,
Good one. I completely agree.  -doug

[KenC]

Photoguy,

 Muzh just gave you great advice in his last post.  Whatever you decide, just let your Russian friend know how it is going to be.  I for one do not like the idea of meeting a girl any place but her home town on the first visit.  However, Keiv is probably a better place to be if you have to go to plan "B".  And you damn better well have a plan "B" before you leave.  I am sure Jack or someone else here could hook you up with a good agency or two to contact should things go south on you.  Just remember that it is a bit like finding a needle in a haystack, rarely do you find it on the first look see.  Best of luck to you.

KenC

[Photo Guy]

Hey thanks. Yes - plan B,... Jack.  Okay!   Got it!
Thanks,  -doug

[Todd]

Find out if the interpreter is cute... insist on an apartment with a king size bed...and let the good time's roll.  Besides, you would be amazed at how quickly you can learn a foreign language under some conditions.

Sorry, I couldn't resist.  You should NOT let her bring an interpreter.  I would have one in reserve in Kiev if it is needed.   I'm sure someone on the board can recommend one.  I agree with the others on the board; she is definitely testing how far she can push you.  Until you say something, she will walk all over you.  It is just human nature to test boundaries, and she is definitely testing yours.

[Elen]

Why don't you like that? -doug

Because that is "pure flattery" It does not look like her own thoughts but like  just what you want to hear

 Уж сколько раз твердили миру, 
(How many time the world was told

 Что лесть гнусна, вредна; но только все не впрок,
that flattery is foul and harmful  But it won't profit by it 

  И в сердце льстец всегда отыщет уголок.
And a flatterer alwasy finds his way into your heart
  

We studied this fable " A fox and a crow " by Krylov  in primary school:D
http://lib.userline.ru/178 Though many have not understood the "moral " until now

The only one hope for you in that is may be such letters were written by "experienced" translator but not by your girl herself

 

[Elen]

What is that fuzz about her home town?. It's only 1,5 hour by plane between Kiev and Mariupol'

And what's wrong with two separated rooms in hotel? I think it's not much less "privacy" but easy to organise than to find two separated appartments next to each other