Elen, RWDMA, BC, and RW's Attitudes

[Elen]

who said it's wrong? It's just someting that will never change...no matter how hard you try to change

well your "unfortunitally" spoke for itself And to my mind if some advanced people at Russian rudder didn't try such hard to change "sovkovyi' mindset according to western standarts we all HERE would have a better life. Just my opinion wich you can't change because there could not be any "FACTS"  here - just a politic opinions.

[Elen]

I could see Elen in the smoldering ruins of Stalingrad with her AK-47 battling the Nazi 6th Army and she is typical RW. Scarry.

Maxx   

  Imagine me better in front of a screen in some missile station counting a trajectory for a strike ( in return of course  )  It would be more close to reality. And be sure I would manage to get you a decent answer  , Americans

[SANDRO43]

I could see Elen in the smoldering ruins of Stalingrad with her AK-47 battling the Nazi 6th Army

She would have been wielding a Parabellum, more likely. I think the 47 stands for the year the AK was first produced (1947). Elen might chew you up for this gross historical inaccuracy in Russian military lore . Stalingrad was late 1942-1943, and the German 6th Army surrendered the day I was born.

[SANDRO43]

I guess you have adopted that favorite Italian pastime of pinching, ha-ha.

Alas, no more. I believe it has been considered a misdemeanour for some time, and indeed a felony if you leave a tell-tale trace on the crime scene (so to speak ).

[Wild Orchid*]

I discussed this with Olga over dinner last night. She said that she (Olga) is probably a little bit unusual for a Russian woman of her social standing in that she did not already have a carpet crawler when I met her (Lord knows a lot of Russian guys tried very hard to bring her within the norm); but that this was deliberate and the result of strong "parenting" by her Mom, who wanted her daughter to have a different (and presumably "better") life than she did. (And don't forget that it was this same MIL that pushed Olga to look for a husband abroad. Thank God the Turkish boys didn't get her, Elen!)

This is very strange statement. She was only 20 when you two met! What children could she possible have?  I was almost 23 when I had my son and I was the only mom in my circle of friends for a while. Most of them had children when they were 25-28. And I’m talking about women who are middle aged now. Younger generation is not in a hurry to become a parents at all.

[dostogirl]

if some advanced people at Russian rudder didn't try such hard to change "sovkovyiz' mindset according to western standarts we all HERE would have a better life

You say "sovkovyi" set of mind is better?  All I'm saying, Russia is inevitably changing. To have a better life, one's mindset has to change as well. I think most problems people have in Russia are due to the unwillingness to change inside first. For some people on this forum you may represent that feeling of unwilligness and resistance. No matter how hard they try to prove their point, no matter what facts they provide, you still don't want to see and accept that there's something beyond the way your mind is set. (no offence) 

[Taz]

Elen - I post however I want as long it is with the TOS. You are not my boss. I can paraphrase your posts if I wish. 'Nuff said.

Bruno- I suggest you recheck your stats. The average birthrate per Russian couple is 1.2-1.3 (depending on who you believe). Normal amount to ensure the population doesn't decline is 2.1 per couple. I suggest you recheck your facts. It would be a different situation IF Russia was over populated or wasn't already suffering the effects of this. It was such a problem that even the mayor of Moscow was suggesting "incentives" for people to have more children. This totally contrary to what you think is normal.

The stats I quoted came directly from the UN's websites. If all of this is so "normal", then why did Putin make it his highest priority during his May 10 state-of-the-nation address. Honestly, I don't know where some of you people come up with your stuff. To have 65 year olds and more to only 14.2% of the total population in Russia may not seem really like much to compared to most countries Put it in the context that most men are dead by 60 and woman maybe in the 70's with the average being Russians will be dead by 67 (on a generous statistic). That is a pretty big chunk of people that are going to die off pretty soon.

If the middle class is doing ok, then the others must really be suffereing. Last year, 2005, abortions outstripped the number of births. According to Vladimir Kulakov, vice president of the Russian Academy of Medical Sciences, the economic situation for most in Russia is dire and the birth of a first child can push young couples into poverty. With a population half the size of the US, in 2004, Russian women had 24% more abortions than their American counterparts. This really sounds like they are on the right track, eh Bruno?

I am amazed at some of you, the real deal is staring you in the face yet you choose to ignore the facts. Drink the Kool-Aid or whatever some of you need to do to maintain the party line. Russia has some SERIOUS issues confronting it. How do they secure the nuclear weapons in Siberia. Answer is; they don't very well. America is sending money to help with that since Russia can't seem to do it on their own. Can you say biological weapons? Ditto, they need help there too. Lets just say I have intimate knowledge in some of these areas and leave it at that. However YOU can do your own research and see what is available for public consumption and it will validate what I am writing.

Hey, you don't have to believe me, maybe you'll at least believe what Putin was man enough to admit. Russia has a serious demographic problem!

[jb]

Doug S.

I know not how the other married men here will react to your rather long and painfully boring tale, but all I can say is; "Boy, you sure are full of yourself".  If you intended to insult us all, you certainly achieved your goal. 

I have spent the past several years attempting to dispell the MOB agency myths, to get men to see RWs for what they are, not that Fairy Princess the MOB agencies make them out to be.  Your lovely young bride was only a child when you met her, face it, you had no idea what she was going to be like when she grew up.  She could have just as easily turned out to be a shrew.  Even more to the point, whatever character she now exhibits, you had a direct hand in shaping.  Not every one wants to take a kid to raise the way you did. Further, she may still hold a surprise in store for you yet as she continues to mature and you advance into your dodder age.  Now, had you married a woman, say,,, 30'ish, and survived the ensuing 5 years with a happy, cozy home with a new child, you might have some bragging rights to those big gonads you so proudly proclaim.  As I see it, you are more a father figure than a husband figure.  Your wife is not your equal partner in marriage. 

BC on the other hand, has done it with a fully grown woman, there is a difference.

 

[Elen]

You say "sovkovyi" set of mind is better?  All I'm saying, Russia is inevitably changing. To have a better life, one's mindset has to change as well. I think most problems people have in Russia are due to the unwillingness to change inside first. For some people on this forum you may represent that feeling of unwilligness and resistance. No matter how hard they try to prove their point, no matter what facts they provide, you still don't want to see and accept that there's something beyond the way your mind is set. (no offence) 

Judging by where our ( your too or it's already not "your" ) country NOW "sovkovyi" set of mind was better.  When Russia returned from that hole where it appeared thank to those who have "new" set of mind  then we would speak  about how that "sobkovyi" set was worse.

 As for my "unwillingness"  to accept others points then if there were unquestionable FACTS those poples provided then I would change my mind But as it's only their OWN POINTs (supported only by stupid judments of my personality)  I'm not going to change MY ones, as I have the same right to have my POINTs

Ps I have not too many problems here in Russia in comparison to those people who decided to run away from them. So may be it's me (but not "they") have more skills to change inside and to adjust to new reality instead of go to another place where most problems already solve by others

[groovlstk]

Imagine me better in front of a screen in some missile station counting a trajectory for a strike ( in return of course  )  It would be more close to reality. And be sure I would manage to get you a decent answer  , Americans

Elen, that's sadly untrue, a US first strike would destroy any capability of a "decent answer."

http://www.foreignaffairs.org/20060301faessay85204-p0/keir-a-lieber-daryl-g-press/the-rise-of-u-s-nuclear-primacy.html

[Wild Orchid*]

Hey, you don't have to believe me, maybe you'll at least believe what Putin was man enough to admit. Russia has a serious demographic problem!

And you are not helping pinching the best women out of the country

[SANDRO43]

This is very strange statement. She was only 20 when you two met! What children could she possible have?

Wild Orchid, you would probably be as surprised as I was at seeing how many young FSUW (20 to 22 y.o.) on dating sites state in their profiles : divorced, with one child. I do not think they do that to attract more foreign suitors. This could probably make for another interesting thread ("Why Do So Many Young FSUW Become Wives and Mothers So Early ?") but, considering what happened in other threads discussing the FSU milieu, I am not going to propose it

[Elen]

Elen, that's sadly untrue, a US first strike would destroy any capability of a "decent answer."

destroy any capability  - how opinionated Americans  Well belive in what your free press feed you with  I have my own sourses of information - and it's not mass media  And trust me - вам мало не покажется  )

PS You may take this my post like you "proved: me something - I'm just not going to discuss this particular isue with you 

[Wild Orchid*]

Wild Orchid, you would probably be as surprised as I was at seeing how many young FSUW (20 to 22 y.o.) on dating sites state in their profiles : divorced, with one child. I do not think they do that to attract more foreign suitors. This could probably make for another interesting thread ("Why Do So Many Young FSUW Become Wives and Mothers So Early ?") but, considering what happened in other threads discussing the FSU milieu, I am not going to propose it

I guess it all depends. In my family girls go to the Universities after school not to make babies. Though one of  them became a single mother at the age of 23, she is a student never the less.

[Elen]

Elen - I post however I want as long it is with the TOS. You are not my boss. I can paraphrase your posts if I wish. 'Nuff said.

If you can;t get by yourself that for to prove that someone's opinion was wrong you should first of all to quote word-by word that opinion and post your variant exactly under that quote but not just speaking in general - she is wrong because she thinks - blah-blah-blah - demonstrating your skills in reading my mind  - then it's your problem. Just don't wonder that you can't prove me anything with such metode. And don't accuse me in things I never said


Ps BTW I say nothing about facts you wrote there in your long posts - I simple didn;t read them.  I just have not idea how problems with biologicals weapons , AIDS, Russian space progamm and etc could affect girls'  decision to marry abroad ( or my wish not to do that) 
 If it's your way to prove me that Russia faces problems then better you would quote me where I doubted that instead of wasting such many efforts to answer to your own "ideas"  which you "paraphrased" like you wish from my posts.

[groovlstk]

destroy any capability  - how opinionated Americans  Well belive in what your free press feed you with  I have my own sourses of information - and it's not mass media  And trust me - вам мало не покажется  )

PS You may take this my post like you "proved: me something - I'm just not going to discuss this particular isue with you 

Elen, I find it hard to believe you'll allow me to get the last word in!

You can't blame all your disagreements on biased or wrong "american mass media." The people who wrote this piece work for a nonprofit think-tank, and they're not smug about their findings. In fact, it's just the opposite--the conclusion is that without nuclear parity there is a much higher risk of an accidental first strike.

At the risk of sounding PW'd, this is my last word on the subject but we can take this up over kotlecki and pivo when I return to Moscow in October, if you're interested

[Elen]

well it's just a case when I have an idea from first hand so to say  due to my personal experience    and to experience of my friends I simple know about thois ussue not from newspapers

Ps I don;t drink pivo And I 'm not going to cook kotlety to all foreigner who came here to visit me  Better bring your famouse gumburgers which I such poor Russain thing have not idea about and a botle of martini  and I'll put your on my waiting list

[SANDRO43]

Better bring ... a botle of martini  and I'll put your on my waiting list

Aahh, so here's the origin of George Clooney's famous "No Martini ? No party !" TV commercial .

[JPjr]

Hellen, you are a class act my dear. I am surprised at you though. You know Russian hospitality is the best there is.

[Elen]

Hellen, you are a class act my dear. I am surprised at you though. You know Russian hospitality is the best there is.

Russian hospitality because of which I should cook  kotlety for foreigners?  - that's one of outstanding lie desined by dating agencies about RW 

BTW I am only RW but not RWDMA  - so better bring martini 

[Taz]

Bruno – I ran out of time to add something as to my previous post to further illustrate your lack understanding key parts of the demographic situation in Russia and Ukraine. In case you didn’t know, Russians and Ukrainians receive their pensions sooner than in the US. For example in Ukraine, women can receive a pension at 55 and men at 60. There is a very large portion of the population that is 55 and up. With a declining population base there are less working people left to fund the pensions.

Elen – since you fail to see the correlation with the facts I presented and it why it could affect women  A lot of these facts could greatly affect women if you take the time to analyze them, especially of women of child bearing age or who have children. They point to issues of serious instability in many areas that can affect what people think are the future prospects for their country. Most women who want children or have children, want to have them grow up in a good environment. Most parents want a better life for their children than they had for themselves.

These facts that you chose to ignore address directly why many women search for men in other places than their own country. There are more women than men in Russia by a rather substantial amount in the population at large over 25-30 years old. So if I had a chance to leave a country that had a rather bleak future and could move someplace substantially better for my children’s sake or to have children in a safer environment I would seriously consider it.

You are too old for it to really matter that much. Women in their 20’s and 30’s have much more at risk. Why would I want to raise my children in a toxic environment? Why would I want to worry about the threat of aids? Why would I want to worry about the issues with money or being able to feed my family? These all speak to the issues why Russia has a big problem right now and the government is scrambling to try and find a solution. Not to mention how many Russians worry about their sons being drafted into the army.

What this means is that women will continue to look for an exit from Russia as long as the opportunity exists and the internal situation needs help. That is why it matters. That is what gives men here that are close to being losers a chance to find a woman that is potentially more attractive than he is. She is trading her youth and beauty for his economic and environmental stability. It’s been that way since the beginning of time and now the Internet just makes it easier. The more the men understand the real dynamics and forces at work they better they can tailor their quest to find what they are looking for.

[dostogirl]

  When Russia returned from that hole where it appeared thank to those who have "new" set of mind  then we would speak  about how that "sobkovyi" set was worse.

 

So, you do agree that Russia is in "the hole" right now?  

your too or it's already not "your"

why do you think it was ever "my" country?

I have not too many problems here in Russia in comparison to those people who decided to run away from them. So may be it's me (but not "they") have more skills to change inside and to adjust to new reality instead of go to another place where most problems already solve by others

That's the whole idea, Elen. As I said before, Russians do not change..There's no way I can ajust to Russia. Besides, what's there to ajust to? Theft? Bribes? Racism? Disrespect of the Law? Hell yes I "ran away". I left the country as soon as I got a chance, cos there's  nothing that can attract me to living there. And believe me, I was financially much better in Russia than in the US, it's just that hapiness is not measured by money..

[Elen]

  Okay find me even one RW who would put in her profile, wrote in her letters or somehow else expressed that when she considered a choice of marriage abroad she thought about biological weapones and AIDS 
yeah I'm going to belive such women that  it's their main concern

 As for thinking about better life style then WHERE did I deny such intensions?
And if I tell you the simple FACT that FAR from all RW have a wish to move abroad it's not that I close eyes on problems Russia faces now  and refuse to admit there is any of them. It's just those problems do not play that   role yu are trying to implay here in decision to go abroad for those RW who decided to stay here.

[dostogirl]

It's just those problems do not play that role in decision to go abroad for those RW who decided to stay here.

That's may be cos they don't see the problems. If they don't see them, it doesn't mean they do not exist..

[Elen]

So, you do agree that Russia is in "the hole" right now? 
 why do you think it was ever "my" country?

I do agree And I think that's right because somebodies started to think in deRmocratic way .And many of such people who takes advantages now about what were built in that "sovok" by people with "sovoK" set of mind never thought about Russai like THEIR country - And THAT"S is one of main reason why Russian is in a hole now.

That's the whole idea, Elen. As I said before, Russians do not change..

Really ?  That's depends on how to look at this I do see changes - and those changes in dropping morality in comparision to "sovok" on all levels after changes which happened in minds in new reality.

I left the country as soon as I got a chance, cos there's  nothing that can attract me to living there. And believe me, I was financially much better in Russia than in the US, it's just that hapiness is not measured by money..

And happinest for all other people is also not what you personaly think .  For some people happiniest includes a conception of Motherland too for example.

  Good luck for you in your new country built by not your struggles. 
But there is still Russia , there are people who live here like they can and now it's not a business of yours to give instructions from abroad what Russains should to do as well as to judge what set of mind would be better for Russians  - like it's practices at this board and in western foreigner politic about Russia