Are Russian/Ukrainian women really the best?

[wiz]

I've heard a lot of different stories and claims over here that women in FSU are simply the most beautiful and the most kind in the whole world.
 
Personally I have my doubts - whether it is really so, or they are desperate and just very kind to those who have money?

As for the beauty - I think it's a subjective opinion of each person and I think there are a lot of beautiful women all over the world.

In my experience and I was also told by many Russian and Ukrainian women I have met in the past that the Society there is male orientated, they decide with which woman to have sex, treat women in any level, as nothing more than a sex object for their sexual desires and also as second class. Women on their part are submissive and happy to accept theirs offers and in most cases feel obligated to accept the sexual orders and advances of men in positions above them as a matter of survival. They don’t have a choice but to accept.

I don’t think under the conditions of Master and sexual object, which is prevalent there that in their relationships there is real love between them. That is probably also the reason that FSU women accept so easily to meet and marry a man from the west with such, in most cases, age difference.

I think apart from the financial reasons, that also the main reason why western men find it so easy to have sex with women they meet when travelling in FSU.

What do you think?

[jb]

I think you've been reading too much MOB Agency hype.

[Jet]

As for the beauty - I think it's a subjective opinion of each person and I think there are a lot of beautiful women all over the world.

Agreed

In my experience and I was also told by many Russian and Ukrainian women I have met in the past that the Society there is male orientated, they decide with which woman to have sex, treat women in any level, as nothing more than a sex object for their sexual desires and also as second class.

I've heard this as well, but it's not exclusively a sexual thing. I tend to view it as more of a male/female roll reversal from what we're accustomed to in the west.

Women on their part are submissive and happy to accept theirs offers and in most cases feel obligated to accept the sexual orders and advances of men in positions above them as a matter of survival.

All depends on the woman and her sense of self esteem.

They don’t have a choice but to accept.

Boolsheet!

I don’t think under the conditions of Master and sexual object, which is prevalent there that in their relationships there is real love between them. That is probably also the reason that FSU women accept so easily to meet and marry a man from the west with such, in most cases, age difference.

Women actively seeking a husband abroad are merely a VERY small subset of "Russian women". By and large, just like in the west, most couples live what we'd consider very normal married lives. The problem for visitors is, you rarely get any exposure to these women.

I think apart from the financial reasons, that also the main reason why western men find it so easy to have sex with women they meet when travelling in FSU.

What do you think?

The main reason men find it easy to have sexual relations with FSU women is because they are WOMEN, not girls. It's a maturity thing, not so much a culture thing I believe. I read somewhere that a woman (any nationality) will decide within the first minute after meeting, whether she's interested in a man as a sexual partner.

[wiz]

I think you've been reading too much MOB Agency hype.

Actually I don't visit these sites JB

You must know by now that I have not use MOB agencies but FREE web dating sites.

Your imput will be appreciated as you have more experience from me.

[wiz]

AgreedI've heard this as well, but it's not exclusively a sexual thing. I tend to view it as more of a male/female roll reversal from what we're accustomed to in the west.
All depends on the woman and her sense of self esteem.

Boolsheet!

I made these comments because I have been told by several women this happening and is the men in power who use their position to get sexual favours and I am not talking about uneducated women.

I heard this from 3 very well educated women and in good positions. Any way that is my experience

Of course other people may have different views.

[Turboguy]

I've heard a lot of different stories and claims over here that women in FSU are simply the most beautiful and the most kind in the whole world.
 
Well, having walked through a lot of cities all over the world, to my ideas of beauty I would agree with the beauty part.   

Personally I have my doubts - whether it is really so, or they are desperate and just very kind to those who have money?

I don't think it is just money.  I don't know that I agree with the "kind" part.  intelligent and smart enough to make themselves seem like the kind of gal every man dreams of yes.  I am not saying they are unkind, Just manipulitive might be a better word. 

In my experience and I was also told by many Russian and Ukrainian women I have met in the past that the Society there is male orientated, they decide with which woman to have sex, treat women in any level, as nothing more than a sex object for their sexual desires and also as second class. Women on their part are submissive and happy to accept theirs offers and in most cases feel obligated to accept the sexual orders and advances of men in positions above them as a matter of survival. They don’t have a choice but to accept.

I think it is more common than many of us realize.  I think it was worse a few years ago.  There are a few more options now.  My own # 1 gal dresses down at work so she will not attract the attention of powerful men.  One former friend told me that in the 1990's part of her job was to take care of the boss and any important clients and it was not her choice.   She either did it or had a life of hell and no job.   She also said this was standard in the late SU and FSU

I don’t think under the conditions of Master and sexual object, which is prevalent there that in their relationships there is real love between them. That is probably also the reason that FSU women accept so easily to meet and marry a man from the west with such, in most cases, age difference.

I think apart from the financial reasons, that also the main reason why western men find it so easy to have sex with women they meet when travelling in FSU.

I see sexual pressure in the workplace as a non issue for gals interested in departing the FSU.   I do see treatment of women by men as an issue.

I think the financial and life style side of things are changing.   The life in many parts of the FSU really seems quite good.  On my recent trip based on 4 days I would consider Dneper as livable as San Antonio or San Diago except for weather.   I went from there to Zap which I would consider about as livable as Gary Indiana well, maybe a little better.   People there don't seem to worry much about putting bread on the table any more.

[Gator]

Wiz, sexual harassment is much more prevalent in FSU because it goes unpunished.  So maybe this is what you mean.

Are you suggesting FSU women are submissive?  Understand this – they are not subservient and compliant. 

I agree with Turbo's comment - "I see sexual pressure in the workplace as a non issue for gals interested in departing the FSU.   I do see treatment of women by men as an issue."

[wiz]

Wiz, sexual harassment is much more prevalent in FSU because it goes unpunished.  So maybe this is what you mean.

Are you suggesting FSU women are submissive?  Understand this – they are not subservient and compliant. 

I agree with Turbo's comment - "I see sexual pressure in the workplace as a non issue for gals interested in departing the FSU.   I do see treatment of women by men as an issue."

No I heard the same as Turbo said:

TURBO
I think it is more common than many of us realize.  I think it was worse a few years ago.  There are a few more options now.  My own # 1 gal dresses down at work so she will not attract the attention of powerful men.  One former friend told me that in the 1990's part of her job was to take care of the boss and any important clients and it was not her choice.   She either did it or had a life of hell and no job.   She also said this was standard in the late SU and FSU

Turbo that is exactly what I was told.

One of the women told me that despite her proffessional position she had to submit to her boss demands otherwise she would have a lot of problems and loose her job.

I think it is still going on Turbo, from what I was told from another woman today!

She is a proffessional accountant and her boss expects her to have sex with him and if an important clients comes to town she has to entertain him!

Now I understand the secrecy habbit about their personal life and who can blame them.

Another one told me the other day that women in FSU are treated like animals and not humans.

[groovlstk]

I made these comments because I have been told by several women this happening and is the men in power who use their position to get sexual favours and I am not talking about uneducated women.

Wiz, I have discussed this with a number of Ukrainian/Russian women, and each seems to have little or no sympathy for women who succumb to the advances of men in power. My fiancee works with a Ukrainian girl who has slept her way through her company's six directors (all of whom are married, incidently). Her take is that if a girl says "no" to her boss's advances, he'll simply find easier prey, and that any girl compliant enough to give in reaps what she sows.

[Shadow]

Wiz,

As I have seen in a post elsewhere it says more about the women you associate with than with the society in Russia.
If these women tell you they 'need' to do it, it means that they are willing to do this to improve their job positions. Take it as a warning sign that they are willing to use sex to improve their position in life.

[wiz]

Wiz,

As I have seen in a post elsewhere it says more about the women you associate with than with the society in Russia.

If that is a reference to the way I started my relationship with Sofia then I can assure you that I have no problem with that because it was me who created the preconditions for her to say " I want to stay with you tonight". Now that she come to realise the game I played to her, because I fancied her a lot, she calls me "Fox"!
It was a very difficult  game to play the Gentleman and at the same time making sure that Sofia was getting very interested in me!
Looks that I have succeed it and now our relationship continues but early days my friend.

If these women tell you they 'need' to do it, it means that they are willing to do this to improve their job positions. Take it as a warning sign that they are willing to use sex to improve their position in life.

I am fully aware that these women use sex to improve their position in life as a matter of course but from my experience I have seen that is widespread.

To be honest every woman I met during the past 2 years and before from the FSU, I had very little difficulty in bedding them!

Did by any chance knew in advance that they are ready to use sex with me when we meet?

I don't think so.

[Shadow]

Wiz,

Bedding them is one, keeping them is another.

[jb]

wiz,

I don't think having, or not having, sex is a good yardstick with which to measure behavior among grown up adults.

IIRC, the last four meetings I had with AW before I got serious with my RW wife, those four different women hustled me off to bed within minutes of meeting.  Healthy grown up adults can have sex without having to give it a lot of thought if the spirit moves them.  The same might be said about the spirit of advancement in the work place.

If you equate sex with having either good or bad morality, I believe you are measuring the wrong thing.  People have been engaging in sexual activities for all kinds of reasons for centuries.  And yes, women have been known to sleep their way to the top of the workplace for as many years as there have been women in the workforce.

Sometimes it's even just because they want to do it for the fun of it. 

[Admin]

I've heard a lot of different stories and claims over here that women in FSU are simply the most beautiful and the most kind in the whole world.
 
Personally I have my doubts - whether it is really so, or they are desperate and just very kind to those who have money?

As for the beauty - I think it's a subjective opinion of each person and I think there are a lot of beautiful women all over the world.

To my eye, women with dark clear complexions - the sort you might expect to see in  Med country such as your native Greece, and with raven dark hair, are the most attractive. Far from the 'norm' one finds in most FSU countries. I've mentioned several times my trip to Andalucia and the absolutely gorgeous women found at La Feria - and then the Indian lady at the US Embassy in Delhi for July 4th a while back.

Over at Planet-Love there are periodic debates over which region of the world has the most beautiful and most passionate women. Looking at some of the photos over there, the Colombian women will knock your socks off - *if* you are inclined toward the dark hair and tanned skin tones.

As for the question of passion - I will withold any datailed personal experiences as I still have a vindictive ex-wife who monitors the board and draws irrational assumptions about ANYTHING I write - but I will say this: I lived in Asia - I lived in Western Europe - and have traveled extensively. I honestly do not believe any geographic group has 'cornered the market' on passion. It is highly-individualized - and even situational. That is, a person may be extremely passionate one day - and the next, for whatever reason, much less so. Situations can determine, or at least influence, passion levels - in my experience.

Having said all that - there is a warm place in my heart for Edinburgh - and for Penang. Make of that whatever you like - I am sure my ex-wife will.

- Dan

[Gator]

Wiz,

What is your thesis?  It sounds as if you got lucky in the FSU and you wonder if it was because of you or because of their culture.  

I agree with JB that there is no difference with sex between AW and RW.  In each group there are those who want to please, those who want to be pleased, and those who want both.  All three end up in bed.  God bless them all.

JB,

"within minutes"?!?!  You are THE MAN!  Is that a typo?  I remember the free sex of the 1970s, but even then it would take at least half an hour for me (from my opening line to penetration - where is Smooth Operator).

Dan,

Edinburgh?  Were your eyes dilated that day?  The Vikings took all the good looking women back to Norway and Denmark, and left the ugly ones to pass on their genes.

How long before this thread degenerates?

[Admin]

Dan,

Edinburgh?  Were your eyes dilated that day?  The Vikings took all the good looking women back to Norway and Denmark, and left the ugly ones to pass on their genes.

Like I said, I am not going into details. We shall just leave it that ALL major cities have some beautiful and passionate women, I suspect. Disclaimer: The foregoing is said on the basis of logical deduction and in no way represents any personal first-hand experience of the author.   

How long before this thread degenerates?

Hopefully, it won't.

- Dan

[Albert]

"I've heard a lot of different stories and claims over here that women in FSU are simply the most beautiful and the most kind in the whole world."

Simply not true.

Where are the most beautiful and most kind in whole world??  They are everywhere in every country.  Beautiful depends on your criteria.  I like my women tall and slender.  So, even though there are some cuties, say in the Philippines, I don't spend much time there because the women are on average not very tall.

Many men fall into the trap of thinking FSU women are more beautiful than AW . . . simply based on the way the FSU women dress and present themselves and by their making themselves more available in terms of opportunities to 'trade-up.'

Last week I went to a theatrical play at a major university.  The performance was by the theatrical students.  I watched the female students (not the performers) as they walked in and took their seats.  Most were wearing jeans and sweatpants, no makeup or lipstick, etc.  At first they just sort of blur before you and I took no notice of any attractiveness.  Then I started looking closer at their faces and bodies and realized they were just as stunning as any you will see walking down the main streets of FSU cities on Fri and Sat nights.

The big difference . . . they were not at all interested in attracting the eye of any man . . . and they sure as he!! weren't going to be considering dating any of us guys on these boards.

These young AW are looking first for careers in business, law, medicine, etc., and they know they have a good shot at financial security all by themselves.

So the FSU women only seem more attractive to us because they work at making themself look attractive . . . and they are attainable to those of us on these boards.

As far as passionate . . . this truly is worldwide (some are and some aren't in every country), as looks have nothing to do with it.  I have found rather plain looking women to be the most passionate . . . probably because they 'let it all hang out' when they get the chance; whereas the 9s and 10s know they will have an over abundance of chances and want to be somewhat aloof.

With respect to kindness, I can without reservation say that FSU women are far from the top.  The Asian women have a lock on the top spot in this category.

[PeeWee]

Place three women of different cultures in a room and you have three different women. Place three women of the same culture into a room and you still have three different women. Cultural influences may tend to give a group of people a general personality that is different from those of another culture yet the individual people are still individuals. What we may tend to gravitate toward, or what might appeal to us, is that cultural personality. We then have a tendancy to personify and generalize it. All RW are feminine and beautiful...not so. All African women are black..not so. In the end we are attracted to that which most nearly fills or ideal of the ideal mate.

Peewee

[wiz]

Wiz,

What is your thesis?  It sounds as if you got lucky in the FSU and you wonder if it was because of you or because of their culture.  

I agree with JB that there is no difference with sex between AW and RW.  In each group there are those who want to please, those who want to be pleased, and those who want both.  All three end up in bed.  God bless them all.

My question and not thesis was, according to what I was told that, in the West women make the decision to have sex with us or not where in the FSU I was told the man make the decision and is accepted by the women as normal practice, because of all the reasons mentiomed before.

Sorry my friend I did not have the need to go to FSU to get lucky. As it happens during my life I have been lucky enough in the West and meeting women from FSU is another new direction. Like everybody else who looked and found a woman from there I follow the same pattern too and for the same reasons and not because I can't get on for sex here.

[BC]

The decision to engage in sex is mutual wherever you are. This is my experience in the US, Germany, Spain, Italy, France, Turkey, UK, RU, train, bus, plane, car, etc etc..

The first step though is usually up to the man, even if it only implies turning off the TV and avoiding the beer in the fridge.

[Albert]

The decision to engage in sex is mutual wherever you are. This is my experience in the US, Germany, Spain, Italy, France, Turkey, UK, RU, train, bus, plane, car, etc etc..

The first step though is usually up to the man, even if it only implies turning off the TV and avoiding the beer in the fridge.

BC, yes, of course you are right that (except for rape) consent is mutual.  However, you missed or ignored the specific but subtle points that Wiz made:   ". . . in the West women make the decision to have sex with us or not where in the FSU I was told the man make the decision and is accepted by the women as normal practice . . ."

The difference between western and eastern women is how often they go along even when it may not be at the top of their priority list at a given time.

[Michelangelo]

I've heard a lot of different stories and claims over here that women in FSU are simply the most beautiful and the most kind in the whole world.
 
As for the beauty - I think it's a subjective opinion of each person and I think there are a lot of beautiful women all over the world.

At the recent beauty contest (miss world or miss universe?), Ms. Chez Republic won.  But Miss USA was in the top four.  So yes, indeed, the USA has some of the world's most beautiful women.

I do think young FSU girls are very attractive, mostly because of dress. Better in bed?  I'd say yes 

Are they really the best?  I'd say no.  It depends on the girl and the man.   The country has little to do with it.

I find this out now that I'm living with an FSU girl (who is wonderful in every way). 

But I truly believe it is her personality and not her country that makes her great.

[Albert]

Mike says:  "Better in bed?  I'd say yes  "

Not bragging at all, but only to give perspective; I have been intimate with over 45 FSU gals and over 100 on a world wide basis.  These numbers won't even register on any scales of high number guys.

The two most highly sexed gals I ever experienced were from FSU.  One was Russian and the other was half Russian and half Ukrainian.  However, beyond those two, I cannot say FSU women are 'better in bed.'  Some of them were pretty terrible, just as were women from many other areas of the world.

But the FSU women do seem to have a slightly higher interest, compared to others world wide, to get better in bed if you give them some guidance.

[Turboguy]

Better in bed is really an individual thing too.   Everyone has their likes and dislikes that comprise "better".   Some may like a highly agressive gal, some may like a more passive one. 

Of the few FSU gals I have hopped in the sack with two were into pain, and the pain was mine.  Some guys might find that a real turn on, I didn't.  I could well have considered marrying either if I was into that.

My point is someone that one guy may find the best partner in bed in his life another could find to be terrible.

[CaptB]

This is all just conjecture. Let me get it straight from the "horses mouth". "Honey.......are Russian women really the most beautiful, kind, intelligent in all the world"? My wife "do you want to be let into the bedroom.....this month?"
Me......."uh yah"  And there you have it

Capt B