Experiences with American women -- a question from jen

[MaxxumUSA]

Like the orginal challenger to my post, your whole intention was to insult me. Anything else you want to add? Just be a man about it and jump right to the name calling next time.

If you are referring to me as the original challenger I can assure you I have never - and probably will never - post anything her for the whole intention of (offensively) insulting another person.  I have defended myself from attacks here with some harsh words, but not from you.

I may defend myself or bring to someone's attention that they are out of line - but rarely in life do I get upset and outright insult another person just for the sake of it.

CLB...  I am still at a loss as to why you think AM caused some of the problems we have with AW.  Maybe your point is coming a little tiny bit less fuzzy...  but it is not clear.  And for the record...  I am honestly curious about your thoughts on this.

[CLB1973]

their demanding spoiled nature and the outright stupid concept that a man should love them for who and what they are ill regardless if they look like a bowling ball with legs.

Yet they continue to be accepted by men in this country. Are you still not seeing where this a two way street?

Women and men get what they are looking for, nothing more nothing less, if a man is willing to fish in a sewer then he will only catch crap.

Which is why many of us have expanded our borders in search of wife? yes or no?


What you CLB1973 fail to see and accept is the basic cultural differences, between America and the FSU, comparing the two is difficult at best as the culture, lifestyle and history are vastly different.

The bottom line here is everyone wishes to point the finger at feminism and media as 100% responsible, and not to the male participants who reward, enable and empower these women with their bad behavior,then wonder why they have so few good choices available for a wife?

"AM have been complacent in the whole rise if the women syndrome in America largely driven by the media, so to that extent yes AM are part of the problem which is why men began seeking brides from other countries, AM were tired of their choices here in America. "

Not to nitpik your statement there, but only a few are leaving the country. The rest are content to settle for the first bad attitude, overweight yenta that says "yes." And god forbid she happen to be above average and thin....

Your thoughts are welcome even though they are flawed it.

I think some of you are taking this way to personally as if I was speaking to you directly. Do you feel guilty of the actions I speak off? If not then quit playing victim here. You feel my thoughts are flawed becuase as a society our decaying family system you want to blame women only, where as I have lay the blame additionally on our peers here. We can agree to disagree?

[TigerPaws]

their demanding spoiled nature and the outright stupid concept that a man should love them for who and what they are ill regardless if they look like a bowling ball with legs.

Yet they continue to be accepted by men in this country. Are you still not seeing where this a two way street? To a point yes because AM are accepting the status quo and not demanding something better of AW. The down side is if the AM do voice their opinion then they are chastised by society and even face the risk of legal action against them for their views. In the U.S. we do not live in a friendly environment which accepts criticism well.     

Women and men get what they are looking for, nothing more nothing less, if a man is willing to fish in a sewer then he will only catch crap.

Which is why many of us have expanded our borders in search of wife? yes or no? That is what i did and presumingly what those on this forum have or are doing. 


What you CLB1973 fail to see and accept is the basic cultural differences, between America and the FSU, comparing the two is difficult at best as the culture, lifestyle and history are vastly different.

The bottom line here is everyone wishes to point the finger at feminism and media as 100% responsible, and not to the male participants who reward, enable and empower these women with their bad behavior,then wonder why they have so few good choices available for a wife? I NEVER said feminism was 100% responsible but the feminist movement was the catalysis for the changes we have to put up with now and the media is largely responsible for fostering the feminist movement.

"AM have been complacent in the whole rise if the women syndrome in America largely driven by the media, so to that extent yes AM are part of the problem which is why men began seeking brides from other countries, AM were tired of their choices here in America. "

Not to nitpik your statement there, but only a few are leaving the country. The rest are content to settle for the first bad attitude, overweight yenta that says "yes." And god forbid she happen to be above average and thin.... I would say that is good for those of us who have and are going over the pond to hunt in better pastures, if a man is not intelligent enough to look outside of the box and is willing to fish in the current pool of crap then he gets what he deserves. If a man is unhappy with what he has go then divorce the bitch and look for something better, otherwise he should stop complaining as he made his own bed. 

Your thoughts are welcome even though they are flawed it.

I think some of you are taking this way to personally as if I was speaking to you directly. Do you feel guilty of the actions I speak off? If not then quit playing victim here. You feel my thoughts are flawed becuase as a society our decaying family system you want to blame women only, where as I have lay the blame additionally on our peers here. We can agree to disagree?

Possibily it is the manor that you are trying to make your point that is the issue and not the meaning of what you are trying to say?

TigerPaws

[ScottinCrimea]

Many things have created what the AW is today, including the feminist movement and the media. Unfortunately many AM see no other choice and so try to conform with what is perceived is expected of them. Often this means giving in to the wants of the AW at the expense of their own. This only fuels the fire. In that way I suppose you can say that men are to blame in some part for the problem. It seems that the general picture in the US is that the wants and needs of the woman are paramount and that the role of the man is to provide these.  When a man discovers the women of the FSU and sees that there is another option, of course he will want to go in that direction, as it provides for another option where he is an equal partner and not just a player in the AW's search for personal fulfillment.  In the FSU I found a woman who wants to be my equal but nothing more.  She understands the clear roles of women and men in society and doesn't think that either role is inferior to the other.

[KenC]

Many things have created what the AW is today, including the feminist movement and the media. Unfortunately many AM see no other choice and so try to conform with what is perceived is expected of them. Often this means giving in to the wants of the AW at the expense of their own. This only fuels the fire. In that way I suppose you can say that men are to blame in some part for the problem. It seems that the general picture in the US is that the wants and needs of the woman are paramount and that the role of the man is to provide these.  When a man discovers the women of the FSU and sees that there is another option, of course he will want to go in that direction, as it provides for another option where he is an equal partner and not just a player in the AW's search for personal fulfillment.  In the FSU I found a woman who wants to be my equal but nothing more.  She understands the clear roles of women and men in society and doesn't think that either role is inferior to the other.

Scott,
Great post.  My thoughts exactly!

I have a funny story about Lena and femnazi's.  She signed up for a course called "Women's study" or something like that.  When she entered into the classroom, there were a group of huge, ugly women dressed like slobs. (Lena's words) One very fat woman had a milkshake and a bag of chips she was munching on.  When the instructor came in and began to extol her femnazi views, Lena packed up her books and began to leave the classroom.  The instructor asked her where she was going?  Lena said "I'm sorry, I made a mistake and I don't belong here."  To that I say "THANK GOD!"

CLB,
It is not an insult to disagree with your ideas or find fault in your conclusions.
KenC

[Jet]

Like the orginal challenger to my post, your whole intention was to insult me. Anything else you want to add? Just be a man about it and jump right to the name calling next time.

My whole intention was to reply to your assessment that American men are at the root of the problem and American women are all blithering idoits, and frankly I find your pontifications off base and mean spirited. If I were merely interested in insulting you I would not have wasted this much time with extending replies.

Go back and think about one of the points you were trying to make with me where you basically want to make feminism synomomous with spoiled. You even admitted this is not true, so what causes another female away in Russia, Brazil, China, etc to become spoiled? Are they making calls to the 1800feminazi number?

You are either gonna need to go back and show me where that is, or actually read what I DID write -which was:

 I do think the radical "feminazis" (that believe woman are SO superior as to render the males of the species totally irrelevant) have done some damage, but at the core, I've got to say the conspicuous consumerism that is the way of life in America has done FAR more damage to "family values" than anything else.

What causes them to become spoiled is a universal principle that they are products of their environment, which is made up of many influences besides just men who condone bad behavior  Usually starts with the parents 

BTW The Russian feminist movement had a 65 year head start on the American movement 

[catzenmouse]

Methinks CLB is trying very much to act and write like a man but does not have the plumbing to make it work.

There is a word that describes this... can't remember now... starts with a "T".... hmmm...

[Wayne B]

   A 'Tally-whack-less

[TigerPaws]

CLB is sounding more and more like an angry AW with every post.

TigerPaws

[Jet]

Methinks CLB is trying very much to act and write like a man but does not have the plumbing to make it work.

There is a word that describes this... can't remember now... starts with a "T".... hmmm...

I'm not so sure. I went back through some older posts and found a lot written in the "What is this lady's motivation?" thread which would suggest it is indeed a guy who is indeed in the search, and has spent time in Kherson and Odessa.

[2tallbill]

Jet, I am trying to figure out your new avitar. Is it a shark eating a jet? Maybe you explained it somewhere else.

Take care,

Bill

[Jet]

Is it a shark eating a jet?

Actually it's a cat with a sniper rifle 

[catzenmouse]

I'm not so sure. I went back through some older posts and found a lot written in the "What is this lady's motivation?" thread which would suggest it is indeed a guy who is indeed in the search, and has spent time in Kherson and Odessa.

Perhaps true. Just seems to be a very peculiar thought process which added to the "instant attitude" makes me wonder about the genuineness of the poster.

Ken

[Turboguy]

After following all these conversations I have come to the conclusion that I am the only one doing it backwards.   

My ex-wife (AW) was pretty much a traditional wife and was content to stay home, be a mother, watch soap operas and have coffee with the neighbor women and of course her mother who was pretty much her Shadow.   She never had an interest in doing much including working and was very content in that life until our divorce forced her to find a job.

VWRW is more a feminist.   She has little interest in staying at home and the domestic side of things.   Getting an education and a rewarding career are the important thing to her.   When she would write guys she would sort of act like she did not know how to cook so they would not think of her as someone with traditional values.   I don't think she is as money driven so much as security driven and perhaps some self actualization thrown in to boot.

[MaxxumUSA]

VWRW is more a feminist.   She has little interest in staying at home and the domestic side of things.   Getting an education and a rewarding career are the important thing to her.   When she would write guys she would sort of act like she did not know how to cook so they would not think of her as someone with traditional values.   I don't think she is as money driven so much as security driven and perhaps some self actualization thrown in to boot.

Ahh...  but T/G...  Ask her this - or maybe you already know.  Throughout the process of her education and career path, what does she believe your role in her life will be?  What does she believe her role in your life will be?

What I am getting at is this:  I have met many AW that are career oriented.  ONLY career oriented.  These women had no interest in "caring" for their man, or "receiving care" from their man.  They wanted to be independent - not only financially - but also emotionally and physically.  Touch, affection, love, deep communication, and closeness were not important - even though sex might be.

I would have NO problem whatsoever if I met a FSUW who had the same career desires your woman has - as long as we met eye to eye on those other issues.

[I/O]

After following all these conversations I have come to the conclusion that I am the only one doing it backwards. 

Ding Dong......Half the board has been telling you that for a lot longer than I have been posting here.

I/O

[Turboguy]

Ding Dong......Half the board has been telling you that for a lot longer than I have been posting here.

I/O

Yes, but not about the traditional/feminist part I/O   

Good point Maxxum.   We have a nice relationship together.  We enjoy being together and what she wants is fine with me.    I sort of look at helping her get her eduction and learning about American business as fun, something that I will enjoy more than her because she has to work at it and I only have to help her with it.   I think we will keep our close relationship and I think we both think part of what we will have together is for me to be her mentor and her to be a bit of a student and yes sometime she will have learned what she needs to know and I can sit back and take some satisfaction from helping to make her dreams come true.

I also was always attracted to her drive.   My ex had no drive at all and was about the laziest person you could want to meet. 

[jen]

Hi all,

Wow - a lot has been happening here since I last checked in. Thanks, everyone, for the responses. There certainly seems to be some variety here, with many of you answering "yes" to the first question about dissatisfaction with AW being a definite reason to look abroad, while others were simply open to a new experience and ended up pursuing this option or just happened to meet the right FSUW.

Turboguy, your experience does sound different from some others'...had you been hoping to find someone who was different from your first wife in those ways, or did it just happen that VWRW was the one you fell for?

[Turboguy]

Hi Jen,   I would say it was more that she was just the one I happened to fall for but I did like her drive and my ex's total lack of drive was a turn off for me.   I don't think traditional or feminist was much of an issue for me and I can't say that I found AW to  be bad people either.   Just once you get past the 20 year olds they seem to have their life or their waistline a little messed up.   

VWRW is my second RW fiancee and my first was much more traditional just also very wacky.   I would have been happy with a traditional wife and with VWRW who is far from that I find the things we plan to do very interesting and like an project that I will enjoy.   

I have heard that women look at men as a "fix em up" project and I have to say that VWRW definitely looks at me that way but with her I can do the same.  It gives us both projects to work on.

[KenC]

What is that old saying?
Women marry men hoping they will change and men marry women hoping they will never change.
KenC

[catzenmouse]

What is that old saying?
Women marry men hoping they will change and men marry women hoping they will never change.
KenC

Men marry women with the hope they will never change. Women marry men with the hope they will change. Invariably they are both disappointed.

[TigerPaws]

Men marry women with the hope they will never change. Women marry men with the hope they will change. Invariably they are both disappointed.

catzenmouse,

If your definition is true then everyone is disappointed in each other?

TigerPaws

[catzenmouse]

TP,

 It's not my definiton. It is a quote that is attributed to Albert Einstein. I have also seen it attributed to others as well.

[TigerPaws]

TP, It's not my definiton. It is a quote that is attributed to Albert Einstein. I have also seen it attributed to others as well.

Yes I have heard it before but that does not make it true.

TigerPaws

[catzenmouse]

Yes I have heard it before but that does not make it true.

Did I say it was true? Did I say that I believed it? KenC asked what the saying was. I provided it.

Your comments here seem to show that you just like to hear yourself speak. Maybe a shot of "get over yourself" wouldn't hurt from time to time. 

But as usual I am sure that this is really what I am doing with this response.