So confused,, Ok experienced one's, I need advice!

[Mishenka]

William3rd,  No I don't date married women. NEVER!

Let me clarify some misinformation,  mixed from other posts.

I was married 22 years. never cheated.
  
Lena was the youngest,  26, from Lviv UA.  She was the one who cheated and bragged about it.

Vika from Piter, (2002) just dating and learning Russian language. nothing serious.

Aussie girl from Sydney 1/2001 (38)  
For 5 years I was with a Kiwi Girl  J. (45) in New Zealand from  2/2002 until NOV 2006.

Nadya (44) was divorced for 2 years,  I dated her from Feb 2007 to June, 07 -  5 months. Finally broke up in July. Nadya never cheated on me.  We spent large amounts of time together and also on the phone for hours each day before and after work. in USA 12 years.

Anya (45)was divorced for 6 years (2007) In USA 6 years.
Natasha -(46) divorced 2 years. (2007) in USA 17 years.
Tanya (37) has been divorced for 1 year. August Sept and October 2007.

Nadya, .... Nadezhda,, means Hope.  :-)  but our relationship was hopeless.

no need to mention others.

Misha

[Mishenka]

Yeah I agree with Billy, typical scammer posts. Why was she writing all that to someone who lives near?Well maybe she was writing to other long distance admirer/s and copy/pasting to Misha.

Are there any posts that talk about you touching her where it matters? That would be her inner feelings.

Is this another 'Dilemma' thread in the making?

Mir, I also agree with Billy ,

RE: are then any posts that talk about touching etc,, I can't get that personal here.  I posted lighter things, mostly for your entertainment. I'm not going to post anything about "touching herself where it matters"   or "kissing her where it matters"  that  is TMI,,  to much information.   I believe she traveled in and out of fantasy /reality more than I did.  I'm sure she enjoyed that role play.  looking back this whole time with her has been a role play. Like I said earlier, she is a good actress.  Aren't we all?

For those who are curious, No, I never forgot anyones name or called another woman by another's name...  thank God I didn't mess up there.  That's immediate dismissal!

Misha

[Misha]

Like I said earlier, she is a good actress.  Aren't we all?

Misha

Actually, no. I do not believe that we are all good actors and actresses. The goal is to find a woman who is not an actress and you yourself have to be sincere and avoid acting IMO.

[Mir]

I'm not going to post anything about "touching herself where it matters"   or "kissing her where it matters"  that  is TMI

Actually I meant touching by nonphysical means, you know emotions, thoughts etc., they are more important then sexual fantasies for a long term relationship

[Mishenka]

Actually, no. I do not believe that we are all good actors and actresses. The goal is to find a woman who is not an actress and you yourself have to be sincere and avoid acting IMO.

I disagree.   When I say everyone is an actor, I meant it,  Look at all the actors on this forum.   I bet if you met them in person they would be quite different.  Probably much nicer and might even get along better. Why? Because people act totally different in person when they can't hide behind a computer. Some of us have posted photo's here so it does seem more personal, other's haven't.  Some are more confident sitting behind a computer than they ever will be face to face.

We all say what we think the other person wants to hear. It doesn't matter if its a job interview or meeting a new women or man on a first date.  People will act according to what they think this person wants to see,  and say what they think this person wants to hear. It's human nature. People flirt, show off, hold themselves differently, send messages by their body language,  clearly, we are all actors. Some better than others,  yes, especially women and they deserve that Oscar for their performance!

[Misha]

I disagree.   When I say everyone is an actor, I meant it,  Look at all the actors on this forum.   I bet if you met them in person they would be quite different.  Probably much nicer and might even get along better. Why? Because people act totally different in person when they can't hide behind a computer. Some of us have posted photo's here so it does seem more personal, other's haven't.  Some are more confident sitting behind a computer than they ever will be face to face.

We all say what we think the other person wants to hear. It doesn't matter if its a job interview or meeting a new women or man on a first date.  People will act according to what they think this person wants to see,  and say what they think this person wants to hear. It's human nature. People flirt, show off, hold themselves differently, send messages by their body language,  clearly, we are all actors. Some better than others,  yes, especially women and they deserve that Oscar for their performance!

I agree about the "acting" that occurs on the forum, but that is a bit different. We do not see each other face to face in most cases and you can create an online persona.

But, dating is different. Yes, the first date is an awkward thing and we don't reveal everything. However, the goal of dating is to get to know someone as best as we can. Yes, a woman can act for a while, but the goal is to avoid the actresses and to look for a woman who is sincere and who is not into acting. And, as a man, it is also important to be yourself. You want a woman to fall in love with the man that you are, and not the man that you are pretending to be.  It avoids a heck of a lot of problems later on.

So, from what I gather, most of the women that you have dated have been good actresses?

[Mishenka]

Actually I meant touching by nonphysical means, you know emotions, thoughts etc., they are more important then sexual fantasies for a long term relationship

Thanks Mir, sorry for my misunderstanding.

She was touched often by the letters I wrote her and expressed this to me,  she was touched by the small things I did for her, like making her coffee and adding the perfect amount of cream and sugar. She said no one had ever done this for her before.  She made a big deal out of this.  She was touched that I was so interested in her and Russian culture, that I was open and honest. She loved when we held hands and said how sweet it was that I love to cuddle,, so she named me her "cuddle bear",  she was touched that I took the time to write her nice romantic songs and sing to her.  That first song was our first kiss.  What a kiss that was,,  so,, sure, she was emotional and didn't hide it. When she was touched emotionally, she would tell me.  As she said, I was her kind of man. She was impressed that I got along so well with her friends here in the Russian community, especially Lena's family.

I came in here confused and asking advice because she told me I did everything right, I was handsome, she was attracted to me,  I was very romantic, affectionate, etc she had feelings for me but they were not the " intense fire" she was looking for.  I don't get it.  When I had this much going for me it still wasn't enough. I don't have any bad habits, we were equals personality wise, and in every way except for income level. This has never been a problem for me before.

I wonder what these women are really looking for in a man.  For someone to say you are the complete package but,, you don't light my fire hot enough,, not enough passion,,or whatever, is a contradiction of sorts.  I can only surmise that she wants more passion, hotter flames.  I can accept that, just the same way other women are attractive to me but just don't "do it" for me.  No chemistry.

[Mishenka]

gabaub

Let me say it in a more simple way.  When first dating we always put on our best appearance and best behavior. After we know each other a while, we revert back to who we always were.

Misha

[groovlstk]

I wonder what these women are really looking for in a man.  For someone to say you are the complete package but,, you don't light my fire hot enough,, not enough passion,,or whatever, is a contradiction of sorts.  I can only surmise that she wants more passion, hotter flames.  I can accept that, just the same way other women are attractive to me but just don't "do it" for me.  No chemistry.

Mishenka, there is ENORMOUS contradiction between what this women told you through letters and in person and then used as an excuse for breaking up with you. Her letters are so full of passion they may as well have been cribbed from some bad romance novel. No chemistry? Not enough passion?

You're accepting everything she said to you as utterly truthful, but there is a big lie at the center of all this and as difficult as it is for you to accept, you'll never be free until you see it.

[Misha]

gabaub

Let me say it in a more simple way.  When first dating we always put on our best appearance and best behavior. After we know each other a while, we revert back to who we always were.

Misha

Misha,

You never did answer one of my questions. Where and how did you meet Tanya and these other Russian women?

[Mishenka]

Maybe actress isnt the best word to use here.  Women are more emotional and dramatic by nature.  Many are Drama Queens, while others are not. So let's hope to find one who is more even tempered and maybe not as much a drama Queen. If you can find someone who is both genuine and emotional thats great.

here is an example of an actress,  

Nadya was Bi polar- manic depression. She has extreme highs and lows.  DPD, dual personality disorder.  When she didn't take her med's, her personality became un predictable. She can be happy one minute and a complete monster the next.  She wil be agreeable one minute and then start picking fights for no reason.  She would pull things out of the sky to create an argument.  She could be so loving and caring, then act like she doesn't know you. She didnt know the difference between telling the truth or a lie.  She would make up stories to cover for her conditon. She lied to her kids about me, hiding that I brought her flowers or was over at the house, or stayed the night. For a long time she hid this disorder well.  She took her meds and only allowed me to see her happy.  It wasnt until I saw the meds in her cabinet and went online to research the name that I found out, and then later when I called her, Anya answered and said mom is asleep, she alwasy falls asleep at 6 PM, or 7 PM,, then I knew she had taken her meds, as this is a typical side effect.  Anya also mentioned if she doesnt take her pills she is always so angry and hard to get along with.  Anya is 11. As much as I loved Nadyushka and her kids I could not live with her. Sadly it was over.

Misha

[Mishenka]

Misha,

You never did answer one of my questions. Where and how did you meet Tanya and these other Russian women?

gabaub, I met Tanya at Starbucks while standing in line, I hear her talking, recognised her Russian accent and  bought her a coffee, we sat and talked, we clicked and started dating.

I also met Nadya at Starbucks, beginning of February, same thing, as soon as she spoke I knew she was Russian, I said Privet!  kak Dela, Menya zovut Misha, Kak vas zovut?  Tbi takaya krasivaya,  Tbi glasses takaya krasivaya, (your eyes are so beautiful)   and thats all it took. We became addicted to each other. We met 3 or 4 times a week after that from Feb to June. Women always seem so surprised that an AM knows Russian,  this is the first question they ask,, how you know Russian? So it seem's Privet! is the best "one word" pick up line for RW in America. 

Natasha I met on Yahoo personals and was the nice one, best personality, easy going, etc,, nothing wrong with this girl except I dint feel anything for her.  I was goofing around one night and typed in Russian in the search and got her profile, she called me and we dated 3 times, spent time on the phone. I think it was her 4 kids that scared me off.  ???

Anya I met in my own city, as a friend,  and took to dinner at Ruth Chris for my birthday because Nadya wouldn't come with me. Anya teaches at the local high school, ESL classes.

There are a lot of Russian women in my city,, there is one working at the local deli that is very pretty, married to a school teacher.  They are easy to meet as they stand out among other women, not only in looks, but in personality. I can pick them out of a crown a mile away. I see she is Russian,,and think,  go meet her. So I do.

Lena I met on her birthday. She just turned 26 that night. and no one had a party for her, no gifts, so we started talking and hit it off.

Does it matter how I meet these women? 

[ScottinCrimea]

After dating for awhile, I developed what I call the 90 day rule.  That means that I would not form any deep emotional attachment or make any commitment to a woman until I had known her for at least 90 days. There are indeed many women who put on an act, who hide their true self and show what they think you want to see.  I found that most can do this for a couple of months, but not many can sustain the act for more than 90 days.  Usually if there are going to be red flags, they will show up by then.  We're talking here about those cases where much time is spent together, not intermittent long distance meetings intersperced with translated phone calls and chat sessions.  In those cases it's going to take a lot longer.  With my wife it took nearly two years.

Misha,  It's apparent that you are seeking out RW and seem to be finding the flawed ones.  You're craving the beautiful angel who's a devil in bed.  As is typical, you're finding the devil who acts like an angel.  The fantasy girl you seem to be trying to find or create from those you meet just doesn't exist, especially in an Americanized RW.

[Misha]

gabaub, I met Tanya at Starbucks while standing in line, I hear her talking, recognised her Russian accent and  bought her a coffee, we sat and talked, we clicked and started dating.

I also met Nadya at Starbucks, beginning of February, same thing, as soon as she spoke I knew she was Russian, I said Privet!  kak Dela, Menya zovut Misha, Kak vas zovut?  Tbi takaya krasivaya,  Tbi glasses takaya krasivaya, (your eyes are so beautiful)   and thats all it took. We became addicted to each other.

Does it matter how I meet these women? 

Yes, it matters in that you seem, based on what I have read, to repeat a pattern when it comes to the women you date. You used an interesting word in the past post: "we became addicted to each other." I have never heard anyone refer to someone they met or were dating or had dated quite in this way. Why addicted? Are you addicted to the rush that certain women give you? Perhaps you need to recognize your "addiction" to certain types of women and then break the cycle. You have to recognize the addiction for what it is before you can deal with it.

[Mishenka]

After dating for awhile, I developed what I call the 90 day rule.  That means that I would not form any deep emotional attachment or make any commitment to a woman until I had known her for at least 90 days. There are indeed many women who put on an act, who hide their true self and show what they think you want to see.  I found that most can do this for a couple of months, but not many can sustain the act for more than 90 days.  Usually if there are going to be red flags, they will show up by then.  We're talking here about those cases where much time is spent together, not intermittent long distance meetings intersperced with translated phone calls and chat sessions.  In those cases it's going to take a lot longer.  With my wife it took nearly two years.

Misha,  It's apparent that you are seeking out RW and seem to be finding the flawed ones.  You're craving the beautiful angel who's a devil in bed.  As is typical, you're finding the devil who acts like an angel.  The fantasy girl you seem to be trying to find or create from those you meet just doesn't exist, especially in an Americanized RW.

Excellent advise Scott!

I just meet them and realize "dating women is like a box of chocolates, you never know what's insde till you take a bite".

What's your recommendation? Shall I fly to Moscow or Kiev to find my love and not look for a RW in America? I agree the longer they have been here the more American eyes'd  they become, even Nadya said I am American now, and she didnt mean she was celebratiing her citizenship.

[Misha]

Excellent advise Scott!

I just meet them and realize "dating women is like a box of chocolates, you never know what's insde till you take a bite".

What's your recommendation? Shall I fly to Moscow or Kiev to find my love and not look for a RW in America? I agree the longer they have been here the more American eyes'd  they become, even Nadya said I am American now, and she didnt mean she was celebratiing her citizenship.

I am not into Forrest Gump philosophy, and believe that you can pretty adequately judge what is inside a chocolate based on where you bought it, based on what is written on the package and simply by reading the paper inside the box that tells you what is inside the chocolate.

It seems to me that you have to sort out a few things before flying anywhere. First things first: what exactly are you looking for in a woman (other than sex)?

[Jumper]

does it matter how i meet these women?

no, it matters what thier situation is when you meet them

if they are a  recent divorcee, *expect* it a rebound relationship at best.
Dont expect it to be anything more then physical in nature initially,
and yes,
 two or three months is "initially"
 
it's not that complicated.


where you meet ultimately isnt very important.
but hey,
if you keep having troubles with women you meet at starbucks,
 and strike up a converstation just because the have a russian accent,
i'd try different place, or different women..

We all say what we think the other person wants to hear.

i disagree..

for example:
If you think my wife and i are not straight with each other about any issue ,
your crazy.
I would venture to say we are FAR more direct with each other
than any of our married friends are.its the nature of a cross cultural relationship.


while i agree some online personas are probably not accurate..

I also think there are more than a fair share of people here,
 that will tell you, IF YOU ASK THEM,  
plainly what they think.
this is regardless of face to face, or a message board.

most people involved here  have learned that accurate communcation in these type of relationships is probably even MORE important than it is in a more traditional one
(and lack of good communication is  a huge reason traditional relationships fail)

that said: most know that acting or ,not being straightforward about all issues,
 isnt going to help anything long term,
and actually is more like an immediate kiss of death to most of these relationships.

because of the nature of this..you will find far less actors and actressses here..
unless they have ulterior motives

[Mishenka]

Yes, it matters in that you seem, based on what I have read, to repeat a pattern when it comes to the women you date. You used an interesting word in the past post: "we became addicted to each other." I have never heard anyone refer to someone they met or were dating or had dated quite in this way. Why addicted? Are you addicted to the rush that certain women give you? Perhaps you need to recognize your "addiction" to certain types of women and then break the cycle. You have to recognize the addiction for what it is before you can deal with it.

Why I felt we were addicted to each other?  The chemistry we felt between us was the strongest I've ever felt with a woman, to the point of addiction. The love between us,  the way we kissed, the passion we felt. She could not stand near me without having her hands all over me.  She would take her hands and go up inside my shirt sleeves and grab the hair on my chest and not let go.  She didn't want me to move away. She did this often.  She would be so passionate as we made love she would dig her fingernails into my back Uriel I was bleeding,  very freaky! She also would bite me, also a bit freaky,, but,, I felt the same passion.  The fact that it took us nearly 3 months to break up, because we were so close, it was like as if we were married. she called me at least 4 times a day and sometimes 7. We talked till all hours of the morning. In spirit we were inseparable. We always looked forward to going out on  dates and she would call as she was driving to meet me to make sure I was going to be there when she arrived at the location.  If she was going to be 5 min late she called to say so. She was very responsible. We walked on the Beach ofter and kissed and held each other. It was deep, romantic and as sweet a first love as you can get, except for the bi polar issues. The devil in bed describes her well. The word Angel does not apply when describing this woman unless you mean looks, She was 5'2" ballerina girl (her nick name) Moya rosa,  very petite and slender

[Mishenka]

I am not into Forrest Gump philosophy, and believe that you can pretty adequately judge what is inside a chocolate based on where you bought it, based on what is written on the package and simply by reading the paper inside the box that tells you what is inside the chocolate.

It seems to me that you have to sort out a few things before flying anywhere. First things first: what exactly are you looking for in a woman (other than sex)?

I'm not into Forest Gump either, it's not as easy to read a RW as easy as ingredients in a box of chocolate. I was using that to lighten up a bit.

I will answer your question here:

Looking for My "once in a life time love" my equal, my best friend who will spend quality time building a relationship. She's intelligent, affectionate, not afraid to love and be loved. She wants and accepts me for who I am, not for what I have. She knows the meaning of love, devotion and becoming ONE with her partner at all levels.

We are complex people. We connect on all levels. Spiritually, Emotionally, we know each others mind, will and emotions and read them well. We connect intellectually as equals. Physical attraction is a must. We will know the moment we meet. It all adds up to chemistry. Does all this exist? Yes, I've had it before and expect to find it again. We start as friends, take it slow and see where it leads.

We are a great match because we reflect the love and beauty we find in each other. We are intelligent, book smart & street wise. We are passionate about life. Intimacy is a top priority for us. Our kisses knock each other off our feet, our touch sends us soaring into heaven! We are good listeners, not afraid to share our hearts in complete honesty. We are sincere, loyal and value integrity. We are givers, creative, romantic and playful! We carry very little baggage or bitterness from past relationships. We have no "control" issues. God is in control and does a great job of it. We are positive nurturing people, building up one another. We have no secrets, nothing to hide.

By the way,, of all these girls I've dated,  Nadya was the only one I was this intimate or passionate with.  Most of the others were just dates.  For the exception of Lena the first one, who I suffered a broken heart and Tanya the last one,  who I expected the relationship to grow much deeper and feel I am already over her. Nadya had a much longer lasting effect on me.

[Misha]

Why I felt we were addicted to each other?  The chemistry we felt between us was the strongest I've ever felt with a woman, to the point of addiction. The love between us,  the way we kissed, the passion we felt. She could not stand near me without having her hands all over me.  She would take her hands and go up inside my shirt sleeves and grab the hair on my chest and not let go.  She didn't want me to move away. She did this often.  She would be so passionate as we made love she would dig her fingernails into my back Uriel I was bleeding,  very freaky! She also would bite me, also a bit freaky,, but,, I felt the same passion.  The fact that it took us nearly 3 months to break up, because we were so close, it was like as if we were married. she called me at least 4 times a day and sometimes 7. We talked till all hours of the morning. In spirit we were inseparable. We always looked forward to going out on  dates and she would call as she was driving to meet me to make sure I was going to be there when she arrived at the location.  If she was going to be 5 min late she called to say so. She was very responsible. We walked on the Beach ofter and kissed and held each other. It was deep, romantic and as sweet a first love as you can get, except for the bi polar issues. The devil in bed describes her well. The word Angel does not apply when describing this woman unless you mean looks, She was 5'2" ballerina girl (her nick name) Moya rosa,  very petite and slender

Simple solution: control your emotions and avoid getting addicted. This has been pointed out a number of times, but you still have not really addressed the issue. Other than sex, did you really share anything in common with this women? Could you spend an evening talking without having sex or without talking about having sex? I mean a real conversation, a conversation that involves more than saying that she is beautiful and has pretty eyes. Romance and love is more than chemistry, kissing and sex. Are you looking for a woman that you want to spend the rest of your life with or are you auditioning a woman for your own private porn film? Sex is an essential part of any committed relationship, BUT IT SHOULD NOT BE THE ONLY THING YOU SHARE!

[Misha]

I'm not into Forest Gump either, it's not as easy to read a RW as easy as ingredients in a box of chocolate. I was using that to lighten up a bit.

I will answer your question here:

We are a great match because we reflect the love and beauty we find in each other. We are intelligent, book smart & street wise. We are passionate about life. Intimacy is a top priority for us.

How can you reflect love and beauty? From what I gather, you talk the talk when it comes to finding the right woman, but deep down, your main priority is finding a beautiful woman who will be wild in bed. That is your addiction.

[Jumper]

there's this movie,  9-1/2 weeks.

ever seen it?



it's part of life?
(and a  person in this scenerio  can consider themselves lucky or cursed.. its up to them )
 

misha you are old enough to recognize a fling wether its one night or 9 weeks..

the whole post is about how you dont understand how she can say
and do  one thing..
and then later say ,and do another

basically finding you *great*, but
not *great* enough.

you admit youve been on both sides of the equation.


yet are looking for answers here because this woman, is russian


she likes you one moment ,then changes her mind..

it has nothing to do with her being Russian.

it can have a million OTHER explanations..
many of them elaborated on here..

the main reason is probably , that's just how she is as a person.


but really what does it matter?

the main thing is that she isnt that into you ANYMORE..
regardless of a past 9 week fling

and you seem to understand it....


you seem to have the answer,
 but still asking the question..


maybe if the answer to such a dilima lol, is
 more plainly stated,,i dont know?

but here goes:

you wether great ,or the best man in the world,
 are not the perfect match for this woman


thats all regarding her,that  you really ultimately need to know?
or are likely to find out.



 

[Mishenka]

True story Aj, right on.

[Mishenka]

Simple solution: control your emotions and avoid getting addicted. This has been pointed out a number of times, but you still have not really addressed the issue. Other than sex, did you really share anything in common with this women? Could you spend an evening talking without having sex or without talking about having sex? I mean a real conversation, a conversation that involves more than saying that she is beautiful and has pretty eyes. Romance and love is more than chemistry, kissing and sex. Are you looking for a woman that you want to spend the rest of your life with or are you auditioning a woman for your own private porn film? Sex is an essential part of any committed relationship, BUT IT SHOULD NOT BE THE ONLY THING YOU SHARE!

Excellent gabaub,  I have never been in love this deeply, so I use the term " addiction"  It may not be the best word to describe the relationship.  Feelings  were equal on both sides, I had never been with what I thought was the "perfect" woman for me. I really thought she was "the one"   I fell deeply in love with Nadya, we were soul mates of the closes kind. We were like mirror twins. I have twin daughters and Nadya is also a twin with her sister.  she said we were as close as her sister she has known for 44 years. This is HUGE. 

I mention in more than a few post that we talked for hours, our Saturday dates lasted 12+ hours, starting at breakfast  7:30 AM walking on the beach talking about our families, our life experience, our hopes and dreams. We had the same dreams for our kids and the future. We would have lunch together and talk more, we would hike in the hills and talk more, then go to dinner at nice restaurants.  Nadya worked as a RN giving chemo to cancer patients.  Her job was very depressing and worked in a negative environment.  In her words  "when I'm with you I feel like we're on vacation".  This was important to me. She needed time away from work, time away from her active kids to just rest.   

Anytime her Ex had her kids we spent time together. Monday nights, Wed nights, Saturday , and I spent time with her and the kids Sundays.  Did I mention this guy still had a key to her house and I had to change all the locks?  All the doors were locked while we were alone one night and guess who enters with a key in the front door?  Yea, this is the guy that her daughter had to call 911 on while trying to save her mom.   A 3 year restraining order was not enough.  She should have called the police that night too,  and had him arrested for breaking the order, she doesn't want to experience that kind of sick disgusting fight again. The restraining order is up next year. I hope for her sake she renews it.

Misha

[Misha]

Excellent gabaub,  I have never been in love this deeply, so I use the term " addiction"  It may not be the best word to describe the relationship. 

Do not confuse falling in love (driven by hormones and lust) with being in love. The falling in love is addictive: our brain creates chemicals that fuel the "high" we feel when falling in love. Being in love means that you put the needs of the other person ahead of your needs. This is a much longer process and it takes years to truly develop and in some couples it is never there.