On Line Dating Sites

[groovlstk]

True enough, but then again not all methods suit all men. I had no problem doing it on my own, but I knew Russian.   Presumable, Eduard is already filtering out the women who would be insulted by refusing to meet with any many who is using an intermediary: when he sends the first message, Eduard presumably lets the woman know that he is acting on someone else's behalf. Those women that prefer that a man do it all on his own are those that will immediately turn Eduard down.

I wholeheartedly agree. I'd further argue that Eduard's self-promoting posts outnumber his useful posts by 8 to 1, but I know the Russian government's statistics say otherwise 

[Ronnie]

Groovlstk,

On your following of my logic and the "Casanova" comment:  What did I really say?  I said you need to have the good judgment to know when you should tackle something alone and when to employ assistance.  If one can't have that judgment no woman should be interested in him.  Are you really following my logic?

Please update your profile.  It is obviously out of date where it says you've never been to the FSU, though I must say your comments are indicative of the probability that your profile is indeed current.

[groovlstk]

Groovlstk,

On your following of my logic and the "Casanova" comment:  What did I really say?  I said you need to have the good judgment to know when you should tackle something alone and when to employ assistance.  If one can't have that judgment no woman should be interested in him.  Are you really following my logic?

Please update your profile.  It is obviously out of date where it says you've never been to the FSU, though I must say your comments are indicative of the probability that your profile is indeed current.

Ronnie, if you can't see why some women would want a man - particularly an American man who many Russians seem to think are not much more than little boys - to make his own decisions and carve his own path when courting her rather than relying on a stranger, then I doubt there's much more I can do to explain things.

Your choice of metaphors and your wacky observations (was it yesterday that you posted that the reason why American women don't travel far to look for their mates was because they lack the hunter's instinct?) are humorous, I just hope the newbs are smart enough to leave it at that.
 

[Ronnie]

It's all for your entertainment, Groo..

[Jumper]

ronnie said

Cell phones are expensive and still a luxury.  My wife took her sister a cell phone last year.  Her sister is in her early 50s.  Scammer?  I dated two doctors who didn't own cell phones..  Scammers?  How far does an income of $200 per month stretch when food and shelter take all of that?

OTOH, I did meet a gal whose best friend owned an Audi and a cell phone.  She WAS and pro scammer.

IMHO- you are painting with a very broad and mostly outdated brush..
at least in any typical Ukrainian city, or women in the 20 to 40 age bracket.. which most men are looking??

(doctors are notoriously underpaid,,but a kiev or larger city doctor with no cell?strange)

The average salaries in cities like Dnepro or Kiev are certainly nowhere close to $200
(though you would have been right a few years ago)

The average young RW certainly has a cell phone,, in fact likely a better model than
her American sisters..of the same age.
It  has long been a very important item that few can do without..lol

The amount of luxury cars in those cities is astounding..
long gone are the old ladas,
 replaced with lexus, merc, bmw, porche ,range rover, hummers, etc etc etc..
heck there seem to be more bentleys on the dnepro streets than in  chicago..

I'm not sure when your last visit was ,or to where within ukraine..
but walking down kreshatik in Kiev, or karl marx in dnepro,
isn't any different than chicago..
as far as the number of RW with cells and people with decent cars..
(or bad traffic)

If a guy contacts some RW, that says she doesn't have a cell or house phone, or email ,.its bizarre.(it may be true, but it would be  unusual in that typical age range)

They may be *cough* "luxury items" ,but very dang few go without them..
( personally i don't know any of my wives many friends ,
who don't have a decent job, nice cell, and email access -
and many younger RW anymore have a decent car even..
(unlike a few years ago , credit has come into its own in ukraine)

BTW- 7 years ago when i met my wife ,she had a cell and an email..
and wasn't something even close to unusual at that time, (much less now)

On the ground in the FSU , i've honestly  never met a RW without a cell..
i think they are permanently attached to most of their ears..

 

[wxman]

Not only do most adults have mobile phones in Ukraine, most teenagers do as well. Ukraine is one of the most saturated mobile phone markets in the world. Less than 6 months ago I read an article that there were 51 million mobile phones is use in Ukraine. The population of the country is 48 million. Of course that is probably overestimated. This article states 73% of the population owns mobile phones.  http://www.factum-group.com/pr8 The US is not even close that percent yet.

Incomes have gone up. My fiancee live in Lugansk and earns around $500 a month. Probably not much considering inflation over the last 12 months has averaged 15-25% in Ukraine based on who you talk to. http://www.unian.net/eng/news/news-248324.html

[Simoni]

ronnie said
IMHO- you are painting with a very broad and mostly outdated brush..
at least in any typical Ukrainian city, or women in the 20 to 40 age bracket.. which most men are looking??

(doctors are notoriously underpaid,,but a kiev or larger city doctor with no cell?strange)

The average salaries in cities like Dnepro or Kiev are certainly nowhere close to $200
(though you would have been right a few years ago)

The average young RW certainly has a cell phone,, in fact likely a better model than
her American sisters..of the same age.
It  has long been a very important item that few can do without..lol

The amount of luxury cars in those cities is astounding..
long gone are the old ladas,
 replaced with lexus, merc, bmw, porche ,range rover, hummers, etc etc etc..
heck there seem to be more bentleys on the dnepro streets than in  chicago..

I'm not sure when your last visit was ,or to where within ukraine..
but walking down kreshatik in Kiev, or karl marx in dnepro,
isn't any different than chicago..
as far as the number of RW with cells and people with decent cars..
(or bad traffic)

If a guy contacts some RW, that says she doesn't have a cell or house phone, or email ,.its bizarre.(it may be true, but it would be  unusual in that typical age range)

They may be *cough* "luxury items" ,but very dang few go without them..
( personally i don't know any of my wives many friends ,
who don't have a decent job, nice cell, and email access -
and many younger RW anymore have a decent car even..
(unlike a few years ago , credit has come into its own in ukraine)

BTW- 7 years ago when i met my wife ,she had a cell and an email..
and wasn't something even close to unusual at that time, (much less now)

On the ground in the FSU , i've honestly  never met a RW without a cell..
i think they are permanently attached to most of their ears..

 

Excellent post, AJ!

And about monthly income-- most of my wife's friends make 800 to 1000 a month.    The times they are a changing.

[Jumper]

Simoni, no doubt!

truth is that salasries are what you posted and higher, but sadly they have to be,
the cost of kliving has increased to US standards.


while things are getting better,
and a credit system is now actually somewhat  in place and working..
 inflation is staying up with the very increased salaries...it seems.

waxman,, i actually wouldnt doubt  that there are 51 million mobile phones,
 for 48 million people! LOL
(few places on earth is a persons worth and status  derived so much from
 what car they  have ,and what phone they carry?  )

[wxman]

waxman,, i actually wouldnt doubt  that there are 51 million mobile phones,
for 48 million people! LOL
(few places on earth is a persons worth and status  derived so much from
 what car they  have ,and what phone they carry?  )

Perhaps that could be a new thread! Why is their so much status on cars and phones in Ukraine?  ??? Is that the only thing of material value there? Is a car and phone the measuring stick for success?

[Simoni]

Perhaps that could be a new thread! Why is their so much status on cars and phones in Ukraine?  ??? Is that the only thing of material value there? Is a car and phone the measuring stick for success?

Well, you have clothes... 

[wxman]

Well, you have clothes... 

Doh! forgot that one!

[Ronnie]

Yep, you guys are right.. wages and prices have gone up considerably according to my wife who was there last year and keeps up with weekly calls to her sister in Dnepr.

I haven't been there in 4 years and when I was first there, I met plenty of people making under $100 a month.  My wife didn't own a cell phone till she got here in 2004 and her son had just purchased one in 2003.  I figured something had changed by I didn't realize by how much.

I wonder if they still have to pay an average of 13% of their income per year in assorted bribes. 

[Jumper]

clothes,,of course!
but how dare you forget shoes!

I'm joking on all this of course,
but certainly as a culture it has its "stereotypes"


Ronnie-
LOL at the bribes, my wife just today was trying to get thru one of those long governmental document type lines..

(bribing ,even slightly  still seems to have its advantages ,
 despite the radical changes in most things..)

4 years can be a pretty big change..
(i remember things there 6 years ago and things are radically different)

anyway you should visit Dneper now, (my wife ,and simoni's ,are both from there as well) huge new mall/center area..
redone karl marx(but they chopped all the beautiful large trees down..which really stinks)
food prices at US grocery  level.. restuarants higher..
luxery cars everywhere,
flats selling at big prices, luxury  houses being built outside in the 'burbs'
salaries (considering few pay proper taxes) at near midwest US levels..
etc etc
you might hardly recognize the same place you once visited...

[HazyKnight]

Works for finding women, too.   I have two friends here who are VERY happy with using a dating company here in the US to set up dates for them.  The girls are screened and you meet quality women.  There are several companies that do this; one example is "It's Just Lunch."   http://www.itsjustlunchtampa.com/

I used these guys. It sucked, big time. Sure professional women, but none of them were attractive in the slightest.

So now that this thread has been completely hijacked into another dimension, I'm going to try and get it back on track...

Someone listed russianwife.net as a place. I've been looking at it, anyone had any dealings with them? Good or bad?

[Pike]

Quote: "Not only do most adults have mobile phones in Ukraine, most teenagers do as well. Ukraine is one of the most saturated mobile phone markets in the world. Less than 6 months ago I read an article that there were 51 million mobile phones is use in Ukraine. The population of the country is 48 million. Of course that is probably overestimated. This article states 73% of the population owns mobile phones.  http://www.factum-group.com/pr8 The US is not even close that percent yet."


Yes, it is going beyond the heights of silliness here in Kyiv where I am now.  One of my lady friends has 2 children.  They both have mobiles, and she has purchased mobiles for her father and mother.  Back in USA, I have no mobile as do none of my siblings or my mother.

Another of my lady friends bought mobile for her son; and they have plans with MTS where calls between them are low cost.  But now son finds that most of his friends have KyivStar; so mother buys him a second phone to keep the KyivStar SIM chip in.  So he carries two mobiles, as do others, hence the 51 M Mobiles for 48 M people.





- - - - - -

Quote:  "Perhaps that could be a new thread! Why is their so much status on cars and phones in Ukraine?   Is that the only thing of material value there? Is a car and phone the measuring stick for success?"

And others mentioned the phobia with clothes.

I have discussed  this with many FSU people.  The general idea was that 'in the beginning' no one could buy a house or car which are the 'big' expenditures in USA.  So how to show your relative affluence and 'express' yourself in FSU?  First, buy clothes, shoes, etc.  Then buy a mobile phone.  Now . . . try to buy car also. 

Many inherited apartment when these were signed over to the occupants by the government in 1990s.  But those who didn't get an apartment from that procedure have little hope of purchasing one.  So trend is to still spend, spend, spend on clothes, shoes, mobiles, etc.  Hope for the car and only dream about the house.  In USA young working professionals save for down payment on home.  Here, they buy new mobile frequently.

[Dennis]

Hi All,

I am I guess the "Newbee"  and I have some questions.  I recently lived in Vienna for 5 years and just returned to the USA.  I had some great relationships there with the last one being with a Slovak woman who was just entirely to young.  I do however like the style and attitudes of European women and there is no comparason to anybody I have met in America.   My next contract will be in China, northern China to be precise.  I am interested in a serious relationship at this point in my life and I have been scanning the RU web sites.  I recently sent a "token" purchased letter to a woman on Globalladies. com and I am still awaiting a reply.  This is the only person I have contacted so far.

I have some questions... 

I am 51 and I am in great shape. I have been dating mostly women in the 35 year old range in Europe with the above exception.  I was just not comfortable with a 29 yo. 
Some of the information I have read said that older women (35 - 45) who spoke good English and who were from Russia or Ukraine were not good choices.  that they were "cold" and set in their ways and if they spoke good English this means that the woman is "high society" and will therefore be "high maintenance".  I cant believe there is any truth to this but then I feel I must ask someone with a little more experience. I jsut want a normal relationship with a normal woman....who is not american!!

My second question is my job.  I live in Vienna for 5 years...a great place!!  I will live next in China which I am sure is not anywhere like Vienna.  What are the chances of someone I meet from Russia or Ukraine wanting to live in China?  Along the same lines would it be prudent to invite her to me for the first meeting as no sense in going back and forth if she cant take China?   

I have made some mistakes in relationships in my life, have taken some time to reflect and I am not interested in making the same mistakes again. I would really like to have a healthy and permanent relationship and I am not into wasting time so any input would be greatly appreciated.


PS....I know the easy answer here but I really dont have any desire to be with an oriental woman.

[Pike]

1. Don't send letters to any single woman and then wait for replies.  For hundreds of reasons, many never reply and many never even get your msg.  You need to do mass mailing to all women who fit minimum criteria who are listed on dozens of sites.

2. Don't deal with any organization that requires purchase 'by the gal' or 'by the letter.'  Go with match sites that give unlimited access to all ladies for a monthly fee.

3. "older women (35 - 45) who spoke good English and who were from Russia or Ukraine were not good choices.  that they were "cold" and set in their ways and if they spoke good English this means that the woman is "high society" and will therefore be 'high maintenance'." 

No truth at all to this, except for individual cases of course.  I have been with hundreds of women in that age range who spoke passable to excellent English.  Only a small percentage were cold or high maintenance.  In my opinion, women in 35-50 year age range are the best there is overall.  All that is missing is the totally tight body, but other pluses far overwhelm that variable.

4. "What are the chances of someone I meet from Russia or Ukraine wanting to live in China? "

Not sure, but probably not high.  But if you could show and tell them of fabulous apartment, good shopping for food, clothes and household goods, good entertainment, etc., then it might fly.

Hopefully some of the mature women here will respond to this question.

5. "I am not interested in making the same mistakes again."

You probably won't.  They will be entirely new types of mistakes.


6. "I am not into wasting time so any input would be greatly appreciated."

It won't necessarily be wasted time, if you just try to date normally and enjoy yourself, but it will take a ton of time for sure.

7. "PS....I know the easy answer here but I really dont have any desire to be with an oriental woman."

Try it; I think you will like it.  There are many highly educated such in China now who are looking for good treatment from Western men that they don't get from their own men . . . just as are FSU women.  Many are also Christian.  Not that you need or want a religious woman, but the Chinese Christians have a little better mind set for us compared to the Oriental religions.  A little less of the Oriental inscrutability that can be so maddening  and confusing to us.

A poster from years ago used to say something like:  "Look guys,  they are all pink inside."

[Misha]

3. "older women (35 - 45) who spoke good English and who were from Russia or Ukraine were not good choices.  that they were "cold" and set in their ways and if they spoke good English this means that the woman is "high society" and will therefore be 'high maintenance'."

No truth at all to this, except for individual cases of course.  I have been with hundreds of women in that age range who spoke passable to excellent English.  Only a small percentage were cold or high maintenance.  In my opinion, women in 35-50 year age range are the best there is overall.  All that is missing is the totally tight body, but other pluses far overwhelm that variable.

A woman by her late 30s will have fewer dating options. Russian men in her age bracket or older will be seeking younger women. Most foreigners will also be seeking women in younger age brackets. Consequently, if a woman is still looking to be married (i.e. has not given up hope), you won't have much competition if you are seeking women in that age bracket.

4. "What are the chances of someone I meet from Russia or Ukraine wanting to live in China? "

Not sure, but probably not high.

Don't forget that Russia shares a long border with China and lot of Russians in the Far East travel to Russia. Convincing a woman from St. Petersburg to move to Russia might be a stretch, but for a woman who is already living on the border, it would not necessarily be that big of a deal.

[Ronnie]

I would start communicating with ladies living in Siberia or the far east.. Khabarovsk or Vladivostok.  It will be easy for you to visit them from Northern China.  You can then make your own comparisons between the two cultures.  What you read about women over thirty-five is almost 180 degrees off the mark.  They have far more virtues than vices. 
The fact that you will be living in China for 5 years will be a good test of her wanting to live with you or simply wanting to live in the United States.
I never used Gobal Ladies but they strike me as expensive.  Locate agencies on the ground in the East and work with them.  Usually there is a monthly fee you can arrange and get unlimited letters and translations.  Don't be afraid of a lady who doesn't speak English yet.  (I found fewer problems with them than with the ones who did).  She will learn in times and you should learn Russian anyway.

[ScottinCrimea]

A woman by her late 30s will have fewer dating options. Russian men in her age bracket or older will be seeking younger women. Most foreigners will also be seeking women in younger age brackets. Consequently, if a woman is still looking to be married (i.e. has not given up hope), you won't have much competition if you are seeking women in that age bracket.

While this is true for the average FSUW, a quality FSUW in her late thirties or early forties will have plenty of options, and don't we really want quality women?

[Dennis]

I would start communicating with ladies living in Siberia or the far east.. Khabarovsk or Vladivostok.

This makes perfect sense..!!



Locate agencies on the ground in the East and work with them.  Usually there is a monthly fee you can arrange and get unlimited letters and translations.

Anybody have any expereince here or can recomment any agency who has the monthly flat rate?

Really appreciate the help.   thanks

D

[Misha]

While this is true for the average FSUW, a quality FSUW in her late thirties or early forties will have plenty of options, and don't we really want quality women?

Go ask your average 40-year-old woman in Russia how many dates she has been on lately. I will take the case of my sister-in-law who is now 35. From what she has told my wife, she hasn't had a date in close to a year and the phone certainly isn't ringing off the hook with eligible bachelors calling her.

[ScottinCrimea]

Go ask your average 40-year-old woman in Russia how many dates she has been on lately. I will take the case of my sister-in-law who is now 35. From what she has told my wife, she hasn't had a date in close to a year and the phone certainly isn't ringing off the hook with eligible bachelors calling her.

So your sister-in-law is an average woman.  Nothing wrong with that.  To compare, we have a friend in Crimea in her early 40's who is an above average woman and has more suitors than she can handle.  I have personally met two of them, one an OB/GYN and the other owns his own construction company.  Both nice looking, both very wealthy and both wanting to marry her.  My point still stands.  From what I have personally seen, an ABOVE average woman in this age range still has plenty of options

[Ronnie]

.... I have personally met two of them, one an OB/GYN and the other owns his own construction company.  Both nice looking, both very wealthy and both wanting to marry her. 

Ahhh yes, if it weren't for those pesky wives they already have...

[ScottinCrimea]

Ahhh yes, if it weren't for those pesky wives they already have...

Yeah, she has had her share of those suitors, too.  Unfortunately there are all too many RM who want to go that route, but as I said before, a QUALITY woman has enough options that this isn't tempting.