RW what do you think of this guy??

[Ooooops]

What's wrong with men wearing shorts in Moscow?   I think it's very acceptable now....  Summers are killers there.

[Ronnie]

What's wrong with men wearing shorts in Moscow?   I think it's very acceptable now....  Summers are killers there.

Yulki Palki!  It was the man's first meeting with a lady! 

Furthermore, if you look at the video he's the only one wearing shorts except for some kid about 17 years old.  I think the lady was mortified.

People (me included) wear shorts all the time in Arizona and when I met an AW for the first time at the local outdoor cafe the temp was 40 degrees centigrade.  The misters were going full blast...still I wouldn't have dreamed of wearing shorts even then nor would she.

[mspanky]

 Great article !

http://www.couplescompany.com/Shopping/Dating3.htmOT. 
 

In summary, dressing for a date is about presenting the best you possible.  Let's face it.  When dating we go to places we usually do not go, wear clothes we usually don't wear and talk about things we usually don't talk about so we can get to know "The real you".  Yes, it is silly, (keep this in mind if you get nervous...it will give you a good chuckle and relax you) but courting can be silly and this is part of being a human being.

Dating is about having fun and getting to know new women.  Don't forget to smile. It's your best asset. Women are turned on by different things than you are.  We seek security, intelligence, ambition and someone who we can place enough trust and respect in to allow him to lead us through life.  These are basic instinctual needs that society has attempted to minimize and call old fashion. Society's message doesn't alter the truth.  Like clothes, stick with the classics in attitude and goal.

Your looks are important to women in a different way than how looks in women are important to you.  We don't get aroused (usually) by looking at a man, which is why an average or even ugly man with the right attitude, charm and confidence can win over the most beautiful woman in the room. Meanwhile the six pack abs in the corner may turn her head. However if he opens his mouth and a lack of etiquette, substance, intelligence or a nasally voice emerges, he's history.

For women, attraction it is all about emotion and being seduced mentally. We need affection, (Not sex.  Communicate you like her and find her attractive  by touching her hand, shoulder and other non-threatening parts of her body periodically throughout the night.  Stay away from below the waist (leg, knees, hips etc) on the first few dates.  This shows you respect her and your not trying to get laid, (even if that is your hope in the near future)). Women need to know you think we're special and worth protecting. Mostly, we need to feel safe: financially, emotionally and physically.  Give most healthy women these needs and you'll win her heart.

Your job for the first several dates is to show her you can be trusted, counted on, add to her life and be someone she can be proud to be seen with.  How you dress and present yourself verbally, through posture and the condition of your clothes, home and car gives her substantial information about who you really are.  Modern society continues to mess with the underlying truisms about men and women, confusing dating and leaving a lot of men and women single longer than they would like simply due to efforts to appear independent, politically correct or liberated.  Society may change, but men and women, the basic instincts, needs and wants do not.  Better to error on the conservative or polite side than to attempt to look hip.  Hip will be out of style next year and replaced by a new 'hip'.  Manners, good grooming, confident posture, correct grammar and politeness never go out of style. Stick with these, remember to smile and dating will quickly become enjoyable and second nature.

And remember to HAVE FUN!

[Ooooops]

Yulki Palki!  It was the man's first meeting with a lady! 

Ne Yulki, a Yolki, like in "yodeling".   

Well, that's who he is.   It's better not to hide it, otherwise there may be some disappointments later...

PS.   I just can't believe that our Fighting Irish is a high position IT manager...   They are much geekier than that.   

[msmoby_ru]

 I just can't believe that our Fighting Irish is a high position IT manager...   They are much geekier than that.   

My Dad had an economics degree, but ended up managing loads of " geeks", too. That's because we Irish seem to be able to MANAGE geeks - so they pay us, accordingly.

[Ooooops]

My Dad had an economics degree, but ended up managing loads of " geeks", too.

And his haircut is just as military as John's?   

[msmoby_ru]

And his haircut is just as military as John's?   

I wish he was still around to look and compare  ( note I did say he "HAD" a degree !! ) .... he dropped dead playing golf on Millennium Eve !!!  Oooops.. ( same course as Bing Crosby - but a different hole ) ... so I don't play golf as it is too Dangerous

We never did find out if it he was too worried about the "Millennium bug", or if managing geeks was too much stress or if it was having me as a son

[SANDRO43]

That's because we Irish seem to be able to MANAGE geeks - so they pay us, accordingly.

Must be a result of their experiences with elves, goblins, and other similar weird creatures .

[mspanky]

And his haircut is just as military as John's?   

  John has that country bumpkin Lyle Lovett haircut. http://www.dansmithartist.com/gallery_files/lovett.jpgWhich unfortunately gives his head a very unbalanced look. I bet if he got a good haircut that's up to date(as he's not that old) he would look a lot better and his head more in proportion.

 Even though women are not as harsh as men, guys should know to keep up to date and try to look stylish. The younger and prettier she is, the more likely she ill be to notice these things at first meeting and judge you by that.

    So many men will argue the fact they don't want to misrepresent themselves to the lady because that's who they are. Most of these women will begin to see you as a project to fix if she does look beyond the first impression. So then what happens after you marry her? She will try to change your clothes,tell you to lose weight,get a decent haircut etc. Most guys will eventually have to conform to be who they are not anyway one way or the other. Unless he is stubborn.

  Probably why the divorce rate is so high amongs RW and AM. RW have strong sense of fashion and most with class will never appear in public looking frumpy. They may marry an AM in hopes they can change the Sows ear into a silk purse. Once they realize what they saw initially is what they're stuck with and there is no changing him, many will not be happy. Some here will claim we should not care what society thinks and we should look into the person's heart. Well that's a true fact. But how many men here are willing to walk around YOUR town with an ugly woman (with a great heart and job,)who clings to you with affection even if she's just a friend? Not many. Why? Because we care about what others think of us and our mates no matter how kind we claim to be.

[ScottinCrimea]

I think, naturally, that a woman will expect a man's presentation on a first date to be above his average appearance.  When he appears in his "normal" attire, she can only assume that this is the best he gets and it's all downhill from there.  How he was dressed in his apartment between dates suggests that, at least in this case, her assumption would be correct.

[Ronnie]

Let's not forget... for RW there are "inside clothes" and "outside clothes."   An RW once told me the way man dresses when he is in public with his woman is a reflection on her.  I'll repeat that... it's a reflection on HER.  Would not Eduard know these things and counsel his clients accordingly?

    Probably why the divorce rate is so high amongs RW and AM..

Where does this come from?  I've heard the opposite but can't find any authoritative source for it either way.

[mspanky]

  Ronnie,

 I posted this a while back.
12 Reasons Why International, particularly Russian-American Marriages Can Fail
http://russianwomenspeak.wordpress.com/2007/01/07/some-reasons-why-international-russian-american-marriages-fail/

[Ronnie]

mspanky,
I went to the link..saw lots of opinion but no data.  Did I miss something?

[Ooooops]

.... he dropped dead playing golf on Millennium Eve !!!  Oooops.. ( same course as Bing Crosby - but a different hole )

Sorry....   but it's not a bad way to go ...   

[mspanky]

mspanky,
I went to the link..saw lots of opinion but no data.  Did I miss something?

Announced is translation from:
- a Russian Ph.D. (Psychology) Olga Makhovska, practicing therapist and Senior Researcher at the Institute of Psychology of the Russian Academy of Sciences, which has first brought up the statistics of 80% international divorce rate in the recent time of Internet-facilitated dating spree. Author of a frank and well-grounded book on East-West marriages, written upon field studies of 1998-2002 (US, France). Some observations already incorporated into this post;

[Misha]

Announced is translation from:
- a Russian Ph.D. (Psychology) Olga Makhovska, practicing therapist and Senior Researcher at the Institute of Psychology of the Russian Academy of Sciences, which has first brought up the statistics of 80% international divorce rate in the recent time of Internet-facilitated dating spree. Author of a frank and well-grounded book on East-West marriages, written upon field studies of 1998-2002 (US, France). Some observations already incorporated into this post;

I read a while back that the statistics for divorce in Russia: in 2002, a couple getting married in Russia had a 3 in 4 chance of getting divorced. So, though high, the "internet-facilitated dating spree" is not far off the Russian marrying Russian divorce rate.

[Ooooops]

  John has that country bumpkin Lyle Lovett haircut.

C'mon, how can you compare Lyle Lovett with our hero???    :evil:

[Simoni]

What's wrong with men wearing shorts in Moscow?   I think it's very acceptable now....  Summers are killers there.

Let's not forget... for RW there are "inside clothes" and "outside clothes."   An RW once told me the way man dresses when he is in public with his woman is a reflection on her.  I'll repeat that... it's a reflection on HER.  Would not Eduard know these things and counsel his clients accordingly?

I'm with Ooooops on this one.

Last year I coached Marc, an old high school friend on his trip to Moscow.  I told him about the more formal dress in the fsu, but he rejected my advice with "I"m going to be myself."  He went on to say that he did not want a girl who would be a clothes Nazi to him for the rest of his life, and that he wanted to be judged on his personality and strengths as a man--not on his clothes.  He has a good point.  I continue to advise men to dress up when meeting FSU women, but I get Marc's point.

Ed knows this too, and is not going to tell a 43 year old man how to dress.

BTW-- I live in Florida now and I damn sure wear shorts.  In fact, Marina is on the couch beside me now "patching" up my favorite pair as we watch the Bob Dylan flick "I'm not There."  Today coins fell out of my pocket;  she just told me just now how she felt embarrased and like a "bad" wife.    LOL

[Ooooops]

Last year I coached Marc, an old high school friend on his trip to Moscow.  I told him about the more formal dress in the fsu, but he rejected my advice with "I"m going to be myself." 

Exactly!   Because the carriage will turn back into pumpkin at the struck of clock and person can't pretend to be somebody he or she is not for the rest of the life.   

[Ronnie]

I read a while back that the statistics for divorce in Russia: in 2002, a couple getting married in Russia had a 3 in 4 chance of getting divorced. So, though high, the "internet-facilitated dating spree" is not far off the Russian marrying Russian divorce rate.

Well, I think all the purported stats on divorce rates are just a lot of malarkey and bad math.

Here's why..

A lot of people don't know how divorce rates are compiled.  Well I looked it up and here it is in all it's simplicity:

Divorce occurring in a given year a are divided by the number of marriages in the same year.

And this formula is supposed to tell us the probability of a marriage ending in divorce?  Ahhhhh not quite.  In Russia where there are 3 divorces for every 4 marriages in the current year can be explained by as dramatic slowing in the number of marriages which can be brought on by demographics...ever fewer numbers of young people due to lower birthrates.  None of which means people are getting divorced at a faster rate.

One survey was done by a researcher named George Barna, author of The Future of the American Family.  What he did was poll more than 3,000 adults and asked, "have you ever been married and if so, did the marriage end in divorce?" He then tallied all the marriages against the divorces and, rather than coming up with the often publicized 50 percent rate, he got only 25 divorces for every 100 marriages. 

This statistic comes closer to the observations of most people.  It also comes close the the numbers offered by immigration lawyers who say that international marriages have about a 20 percent failure rate.  That figure also matches my own experience with RW/AM couples I personally know or know of. I know of only two divorces out of at least 20 marriages.  I grant that the average duration of those marriages is about 5 years so I would expect there to be a few more divorces in that small sampling over the next 10 or 15 years.

[mspanky]

  An immigration lawyer William3rd(?) who is a member of this forum says it has been an observation by himself and his colleagues FW and AM marriage rate is low. He also says "Especially with RW. Perhaps he will come out here and tell us how he came to this conclusion.

[groovlstk]

  An immigration lawyer William3rd(?) who is a member of this forum says it has been an observation by himself and his colleagues FW and AM marriage rate is low. He also says "Especially with RW. Perhaps he will come out here and tell us how he came to this conclusion.

I think any stats about AM-RW marriages need to be taken with a grain of salt - and I don't mean because they may be inaccurate.

Sadly, nearly every AM/RW couple I've met in my area are one-week wonders. I firmly believe most who go through this don't have the benefit of the collective wisdom found on RWD, and they should be put in a completely seperate bucket.

[msmoby_ru]

Exactly!   Because the carriage will turn back into pumpkin at the struck of clock and person can't pretend to be somebody he or she is not for the rest of the life.   

Haha.. !! This talk of dress sense reminds me of meeting my wife in mid-winter  Siberia.. we had already met before, but we were debating whether I would stay in a hotel or apartment... *IF* it was going to be a Hotel, we were worried about how it would look if "Madam" was going to come up to my room - not to stay over, of course !! - and how Hotel Security would react...

"Don't worry" says Veta, " I will be dressed like a Cabbage, dull and un-interesting, in many layers of warm clothes" .. Well it was minus 30C (-22F)...  Now, I have a very good ( bright orange ) Parka, which doesn't get too much use in Cyprus, and I quipped " OK, so you'll be the cabbage and I'll be the Pumpkin....   these are nick-names we now use...


SOooo, "Oooops", I put it to you that "turning back into a Pumpkin" is no bad, thing


http://www.flickr.com/photos/veta_mark/445875718/ ..only -25C (-13F)this night..

[mspanky]

This statistic comes closer to the observations of most people.  It also comes close the the numbers offered by immigration lawyers who say that international marriages have about a 20 percent failure rate.  That figure also matches my own experience with RW/AM couples I personally know or know of. I know of only two divorces out of at least 20 marriages.  I grant that the average duration of those marriages is about 5 years so I would expect there to be a few more divorces in that small sampling over the next 10 or 15 years.

   Ronnie,
 You may be looking at your stats from a group of "normal" RW/AM couples. But if you look around at the guys who go thee, there are plenty of social misfits,1 week wonders and men who are so broke they begged and borrowed to get there. Many are marrying women way beyond their league . Many can't communicate in a common language at all. Along with a mess of other baggage some guys have. The adjustment for the ladies. It is any suprise the failure rate would be high? I think it takes about 5 years or so for many of the women to adapt and feel they can financially take care of themselves and have a support system. Hence why 5 year mark would be about the length of time  a majority these marriages will last before the woman feels secure enough to spread her wings and leave Prince Charming who turned into a complete toad when she got here.

[Admin]

   Ronnie,
 You may be looking at your stats from a group of "normal" RW/AM couples. But if you look around at the guys who go thee, there are plenty of social misfits,1 week wonders and men who are so broke they begged and borrowed to get there. Many are marrying women way beyond their league . Many can't communicate in a common language at all. Along with a mess of other baggage some guys have. The adjustment for the ladies. It is any suprise the failure rate would be high? I think it takes about 5 years or so for many of the women to adapt and feel they can financially take care of themselves and have a support system. Hence why 5 year mark would be about the length of time  a majority these marriages will last before the woman feels secure enough to spread her wings and leave Prince Charming who turned into a complete toad when she got here.

mspanky,

Maybe you are correct - but in the absence of any valid data, yours is a speculative conclusion based on deduction.

Hopefully, soon, there will be hard data available from which we can draw definitive conclusions.

- Dan