Economic Mournings

[wxman]

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/10/11/business/EU-Iceland-Who-Will-Help.php

"Deregulation and a 1990s stock market boom fueled the rapid growth of Iceland's banking sector, which came to dwarf the rest of the economy and provided financing for deals that snapped up businesses around the world. When global liquidity markets dried up, the banks struggled to refinance their heavy debts."

Iceland's banking investments were 9 times their GDP. It was a disaster waiting to happen. As their PM said last week, Iceland should not have been playing with the big boys by trying to be a global bank.

[kievstar]

Single men on this board may want to visit Iceland with the currency worthless there - iceland has the prettiest white women in the world and very nice hot springs. 

[I/O]

What is the fundamental intrinsic value of the monkey to the "users"....do they eat the monkey...do they keep the monkey as a pet....do they make clothing from the monkey....does the monkey work picking apples at a lowwer cost than people....

Monkeys...........interbank bonds, whatever, they are "Stuffed Monkeys". If you are the last blindfolded kid in the pass the parcel line and you end up with the parcel, it's yours to keep, warts (Read value or lack thereof) and all.

What continues to amaze me is the ridiculous running from quality that goes on in these situations, even by those who should know their stuff. A micro example. As part of my little investment portfolio, a simple, solid Au stock I have held for a while (more than 3 years) as I tend to take a fairly long view of things and seek out only stock of actual substance. This is the bluest of blue chip holding. (I can't afford to risk garbage) This stock is highly capitalised, carries about 7% (Of equity) debt, returns a dividend on $29.00 (I paid slightly less) of 7% fully franked. Has a fully subscribed staff salary sacrifice to share at $31.00 scheme (Hint the staff including directors think it is OK even at $31.00). FY09 EADIT heading for a 17-20% increase. It has been trading in the mid $30's over the last 2 years and in the last week has dropped to $21.80. For once, I gambled, (Calculated gamble) I jumped at $30 and bit again at $22.20. The stock will go ex dividend in about 3 weeks from now, I am more than happy to receive EXACTLY the same dividend / share on 2600 of the little suckers (Eh em, lovelies) as I would have on 2000 of the .......... hmmm where are the kiss emotions. What is wrong with this picture? I gained so someone lost, someone who shouldn't have lost, someone who doesn't even know the market even exists and relies on a fund manager or similar.

What was wrong with the stock @ $30? Particularly when it formed a large part of someone’s retirement investment one is supposed to be managing for them? Sold on the way down and not bought back again whilst the "Fund Manager" runs in never decreasing circles saying, "trust me, it will be OK, the fund needs liquidity" when in fact there was no justification for selling in the first place, meanwhile budding retiree is now down xyz on capital and getting jack schit return on reduced cash interest rates. Seems to me that some poor beggar who was about to retire is about to find out that in a small way, he has funded some good "luck" for me. Again, where are the kiss emotions.

700 billion dollars or pesos, it will make no difference in the longer term until the financial advisers, traders and fund managers are scrutinized / regulated a lot more heavily. 4 years in Uni, crack a decent job and I am "Your" man. Quality control among these groups is almost nonexistent. IMO, that should change, it should change rapidly and extensively. Somehow, I doubt it will. This may have started in the sub prime area, but it has sure as hell also been fueled by the fund managers. I recall hearing how we would never see this again after the 87 base over apex. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

The key to this mess around the world is to get the money flowing again.  I assert that fully developed Western societies will find this easier to do than developing countries, and those same societies will care less about Ukraine and Darfur.  Nevertheless, whenever the global economy starts cranking again, the developing countries will again be on the forefront.

Gator: I beg to differ just slightly. Short term we need money flowing again, but is that the long term solution, for what? More of the same? Throw these monkey managers (Both bank and fund) who were the the ones driving bad credit decisions more money to play the same old game with? The developing countries will only do exceedingly well if decisions makers among banks and funds in the developed countries continue the risky policies of the last decade. I've come through this current cycle OK thus far (Touch wood), however one thing which is firmly locked into my strategy (If it wasn't already) is no, zip, zero money in stocks, funds or banks pursuing high risk performance in developing countries. BP TNK was a huge red alert for me and some are pushing the envelope much further than BP.

BTW, oil is down (In US D's) but the USD is up so the emerging exporters may not suffer quite as much as some suggest.

I/O

[Gator]

This stock is highly capitalised, carries about 7% (Of equity) debt, returns a dividend on $29.00 (I paid slightly less) of 7% fully franked. Has a fully subscribed staff salary sacrifice to share at $31.00 scheme (Hint the staff including directors think it is OK even at $31.00). FY09 EADIT heading for a 17-20% increase. It has been trading in the mid $30's over the last 2 years and in the last week has dropped to $21.80. For once, I gambled, (Calculated gamble) I jumped at $30 and bit again at $22.20. The stock will go ex dividend in about 3 weeks from now, I am more than happy to receive EXACTLY the same dividend / share on 2600 of the little suckers (Eh em, lovelies) as I would have on 2000 of the .......... hmmm where are the kiss emotions. What is wrong with this picture? I gained so someone lost, someone who shouldn't have lost, someone who doesn't even know the market even exists and relies on a fund manager or similar.

Because you do not need the funds now, you have gained by adding to your position at a much lower price per share.  Your stock is selling at $21.80 (9.3% dividend) because the investing community is concerned whether your company can continue to pay the dividend.  However, because it is well capitalized it should weather the storm provided demand for its product does not irreversibly change.

Gator: I beg to differ just slightly. Short term we need money flowing again, but is that the long term solution, for what? More of the same? Throw these monkey managers (Both bank and fund) who were the the ones driving bad credit decisions more money to play the same old game with?

Right you are mate.  My thinking is that it goes without saying that regulatory controls will become much stronger, especially with a Democratic Party sweep (they love their big government).  Greenspan rejected more Fed controls because he believed the intelligence of a free market would make the correct decisions.  One big problem:  executives making policy decisions had perverse incentives (huge personal rewards if the risky decisions paid off, and if not, the personal rewards were still plenty).  There is nothing wrong with sub-prime loans provided the equity requirements and interest rates are higher, yet many top tier decision makers said "Not necessary." 

It would be interesting if McCain said, "If elected this is my Secretary of Treasury who will determine which executives created this mess.  And this is my Attorney General who will penalize them to the full extent of the law." 

Did you see this?  Would be funny if not true.

The developing countries will only do exceedingly well if decisions makers among banks and funds in the developed countries continue the risky policies of the last decade. I've come through this current cycle OK thus far (Touch wood), however one thing which is firmly locked into my strategy (If it wasn't already) is no, zip, zero money in stocks, funds or banks pursuing high risk performance in developing countries.

And who will be making the lowest cost versions of those products that we will need in the future?  Not saddled by protective labor laws, not having national health insurance, not having highly protective environmental restrictions, etc.  The world will continue to change.

[IAmZon]

Quote: "Single men on this board may want to visit Iceland with the currency worthless there - iceland has the prettiest white women in the world and very nice hot springs."

Really?  Do tell ...

[kievstar]

Icelandic beauties as there called.  I went there once but I was married.  No place on earth compares not even areas of Brazil like Betim where 70% of all children born are female and girls learn at an early age if your not hot and nice your not married.

Per internet not my words:  Iceland is the most developed society in the world, ranked first on the United Nations’ Human Development Index. Icelanders are the second longest-living nation with a life expectancy at birth of 81.8 years, and Iceland was recently ranked the fourth happiest country in the world. It is also rumored that Ryekjavik is populated with an excess of beautiful blue-eyed women. It is also said that the women out-number the male population which might account for a lot of these very happy Icelandic men. http://asdisran.com/articles_54122.html  We have a lot of blue eyed blondes but also all kinds of natural beauties who are very mixed and not just blonds. I think though that we probably have more natural blonds than most other countries.

More from internet:
An Icelandic man of my recent acquaintance drew my attention to the following fact:
His homeland supplied the Miss World competition with three winners:
Holmfridur Karlsdóttir (1985) Linda Pétursdóttir (1988) and Unnur Birna Vilhjálmsdóttir (2005).
I checked. It's true. With that record, Iceland has the highest population of Miss Worlds per head of any nation on earth. I think that needs a personal verification.

You don't need a husband to have some kind of a status," Svanhildur says. "I don't think sex is that big a deal in Iceland. It's probably just because everyone is having it. So it's not something you have to talk about and be ashamed of. If a girl is starting to have sex [at] about 15 years of age, she isn't looked at as promiscuous and the boys aren't looked at that way either. Icelandic women are very independent—they don't wait for someone to ask them out, they just phone them."

[I/O]

Your stock is selling at $21.80 (9.3% dividend) because the investing community is concerned whether your company can continue to pay the dividend.

Gator, if I honestly thought that was the case, I would be much less scathing of the fund managers etc. If the fund managers had sold the stock at or near the top of the slide I would also see sense. They didn't, they are/have sold nearer the bottom (Although I doubt we are at the bottom of the market yet, not by quite a ways actually). All of your logic is spot on, but in practical terms, that logic is rarely being applied in current markets.

What I have seen here and I think it is not so different in USA is junior fund managers with little experience making paniced decisions and at the other end we have banks or Quasi banks extending ridiculous credit into the housing market. Example, "Step up folks, your first house and land package made simple and affordable". What a crock..!! The land at say $150K, The house at say $220K, the contents package which of course MUST include the new 52" Plasma and other tricks to impress the Jones next door at lets say $40K = Total $410K. "10% down folks and it is all yours...TODAY". (Yes I am well aware of the 100 and 110% deals in USA, but that is too stupid to even discuss)

So we have the bank with it's 3rd level loan and 90% equity. 90% of what? The "trick" package is worth NOTHING..!! So what we have left is the total real value of $370K (If it was even worth that.....hello due diligence on the lenders part went missing here somewhere). The banks risk on the real value was/is $369K. IF and I stress IF they could even get close to retail, they have $1K up their sleeve. We all know in a depressed market they are on a hiding to nothing. They will get much less than retail. WHERE THE HELL did the bank manager with the balls to say to a client, "you can't afford to borrow this money" go?  Where did the people who did something similar to me all those years ago, saved until they had 30%, bought the basics and then did the rounds of garage sales in order to put plates and cups in the kitchen, used hand off TV's (If I had one at all) from parents or others? NOBODY, including banks can live forever on OPM (Other people's money).

If we (In this case you) end up with big government regulating heavily as a result, we have but ourselves to thank. Who of us haven't sold a piece of land at an over inflated price simply because some fool and his "more fool" banker was prepared to take the plunge? IMO, it is high time these underqualified, so called professionals were scrutinised a lot more closely BEFORE they are allowed loose in the market place. Rant almost over, if you hadn't noticed, I am very opposed to injecting huge amounts of public money, borrowed money at that into the hands of proven failures and leaving the bill at the foot of the American taxpayer.

BTW, what effect in Russia? I have first hand knowledge of high level medicos in Moscow (And other cities) who haven't received their salary which fell due on the 1st of October. Are they nervous along with all their lower level assistants? You bet your boots they are nervous..!! Little wonder RU is about to lend Iceland $5 bn to unfreeze some of the banking system. No prizes for guessing where a fair amount of private and municipal Ru money is invested. I'll not be surprised if Putin attaches the cash to one of those ICBM's they seem to keep testing in order to get the cash over there quick smart. I wonder how many $bn of his own is at risk? Quite a few I would guess.

I/O

[Gator]

If the fund managers had sold the stock at or near the top of the slide I would also see sense. They didn't, they are/have sold nearer the bottom...

One type of "fund manager" is the manager of mutual funds.  In these times, fund managers have little control.  Individuals upset by the news will redeem their shares in a fund.  The fund around 3:00 pm (one hour before the market closes) estimates the total redemptions, and to raise the necessary cash the fund then sells, sells, sells across the board to include your favorite stock.

Other fund managers are the managers of institutional funds (pensions, insurance, etc.).  Those managers are not compelled to sell and do so only to preserve capital.  Remember that for every seller, there is a buyer.  So an equal number of people, who have preserved their gunpowder as you did and who have a long-term outlook, relish the discounted prices for their favorite stocks.

Where did the people who did something similar to me all those years ago, saved until they had 30%, bought the basics and then did the rounds of garage sales in order to put plates and cups in the kitchen, used hand off TV's (If I had one at all) from parents or others? NOBODY, including banks can live forever on OPM (Other people's money).

The world needs people like you (and your assets and earning power) to bail out the reckless.  However, you will pay via increased taxes and inflation (after deflation stops) because the money printing presses around the globe are gearing up for a period of long overtime.

That fact really upsets people who managed their finances in a conservative manner.  Then again, those overborrowing, conspicuous consuming neighbors of yours drove the economy upwards (in America consumer spending accounts for 67% of our economy).

Europe has decided to follow the Pommy Gordon Brown plan for banks and that has relaxed market concerns.  The DOW opened up today at +366.  If the market closes today at an even higher level (on high volume), we quite possibly have defined the bottom, until the next wave of bad news.  Now we can look forward to an extended recession.

With regard to Russia, they should do better because of their cash reserves (nearly a trillion dollars).  However, the factors of corruption, managerial inexperience, etc. will inhibit the effect of government initiatives.

[Ronnie]

Putin's offer to help Iceland is a transparent attempt to buy a friend or airbase within NATO.  At least he got Iceland and the U.K. talking to each other...looks like they'll be grown-ups and work things out.  Thanks Vlad.

[kievstar]

more good news.  http://www.kyivpost.com/business/30307   

Also, read how several Russian billionaires are going to go broke - they leveraged to much debt with their ownership of stock price which stock price is gone.  Putin will buy back and make private these companies.  Looks like assets are going back to Russia.  Some billionaires are doing well who have sold there companies for cash and now buying back cheaply. 

Very rich Ukraine builders are going broke right now as no buyers for their apartments and huge housing complexes south of Kiev.  This is great.  Sorry I like when countries outside the USA go bankrupt.    Plus is going to drive housing prices down in Ukraine / Russia which is good for the majority of people in these countries who can not afford good housing.

Only third world countries base economy on commodities and oil.  When prices decrease causes big problems you can not fix unless you get prices back up. 

In the long run, Russia will own more assets and Ukraine will be a wasteland unless a new political leader emerges who really cares about the country and it is not Yulia,Yan, or Yu.

[groovlstk]

Sorry I like when countries outside the USA go bankrupt. 

Is it even remotely possible for you view any upheavals or current events in this world -whether political, social, or an act of God - without the primary concern being your personal enrichment?

[Ronnie]

Is it even remotely possible for you view any upheavals or current events in this world -whether political, social, or an act of God - without the primary concern being your personal enrichment?

Groov...I didn't get what you seem to have gotten from that post.  But even if you are correct, why the personal jab? 

Kievstar...There is nothing wrong with a real estate correction, it is a healthy function of the market be it in the USA, Ireland or Ukraine.  My wife sold her apartment in Ukraine last year at a price that was 400% higher than it's market value just 3 years earlier.  The price was clearly unwarranted by income standards of the average Ukrainian.  Prices had to peak. 

If prices fall back it is not devastating...it will only bring more buyers into the market, just as we saw in the stock markets today.

[groovlstk]

Groov...I didn't get what you seem to have gotten from that post.  But even if you are correct, why the personal jab? 

If the shoe fits, wear it. Every time there's a discussion about political or economic upheaval in Ukraine or Russia, Kievstar chimes in about how it's tough fiddlesticks for the average Ukrainian but he's thrilled because it means more profit for him and more desperate dyevushkas to choose from.

There's something more perverse about this than a 70-year-old man drooling over photos of 20ish agency girls in Kiev.

[Ronnie]

Groov,
Well I confess I haven't been following all of Kievstar's posts so I don't know the history there.  I would suggest though that comments be limited to what is posted immediately prior so we can follow the logic a little better and understand the context of the response. 

[kievstar]

Groove, if you read my post it is for the best of most people in Ukraine as right now majority can not afford current prices.  I did not mention anything about my personal gain.   Most of my friends in Kiev cannot afford to buy an apartment so buy cars instead.  Realestate is way over priced just like New York where you live.  Maybe your a little nervous about housing prices in New York when many of the wall street jobs go over seas in the next few years. If you have ever lived in Ukraine you would understand how hard it is for most younger people with the high prices. I am less than 40 years old by the way.
  
Groove regarding women my ex girlfirend of two years in Ukraine dated very rich local and foreign men before me.  I am no where in these guys league in making multi millions a year.  I do not like desperate women and like women very close to my age.   I could never date a girl more than 10 years my age.  I do make references to other guys on bad economy is good for many guys who like women more than 10 years there senior.  I like women close to my age who have many local and foreign guys interested in them.  I also am going to live permanently in Ukraine in future so I date a girl there.  I am not dragging a women from her country to USA.  If  I was going to live in USA, I would marry a woman from USA.

I have also posted many times that it is very easy to find a girl in Ukraine.  There are few good men going there and thousands of good women in the agencies.  A women who leaves there country is a little desperate. Just like a man going to a foreign country to find a wife.

I work around the World and for past 10 years I hear a lot of negative stuff about USA and how many people hope it fails.  There happy with jobs going overseas, weak currency, etc.  It is nice to see countries who are not USA friends fail.  Groove, are you a democrat?  Russia is not a friend of the USA and Ukraine after next election will have very close ties to Russia.  It is better for the USA to have a weak Ukraine and Russia.  I work in Brussels mainly and most of the people I meet here are politicians from Europe.  USA is not very popular here and I get a feeling France and Germany like Russia more than USA.  

Ronnie, in my post I mentioned good for Ukraine people on realestate.  I also hope house prices continue to fall in USA so the poor and young can afford housing without big mortgages.

[IAmZon]

A king ordered his wisest men to come up with a thing that would be true and timeless ... after a long while the side men returned to give the King this sentence: 

"This too will change."

And so the financial world is; and so it appears a new political chapter in America.  Despite the detail, I hope for the best.  There is much good in both candidates. In the near future, it will be the CONDITION that creates the agenda.  These are not inconsequential times.

It would be most interesting if we could keep an eye towards this this theme as it plays out in Russia and Ukraine. It would be expeically interesting to see how these changing times affect AM travel and who the philosophy / motivation of RW may change.

[msmoby_ru]

Groove, if you read my post it is for the best of most people in Ukraine as right now majority can not afford current prices.  I did not mention anything about my personal gain.  

May be not in this *particular* post ! But within the last 24 hours you have in another thread...( Ambach's T.R to Kiev!?)

If you have ever lived in Ukraine you would understand how hard it is for most younger people with the high prices. I am less than 40 years old by the way.

..and I guess you'd be the guy who "helps" these Ukrainians by offering them crazy LOW  prices and then boasting of selling them for 100% profit within a week .. ;-o ? ! .. You were aiding driving the market up ! ...

I have also posted many times that it is very easy to find a girl in Ukraine.  There are few good men going there and thousands of good women in the agencies.  A women who leaves there country is a little desperate. Just like a man going to a foreign country to find a wife.

Whoops- you *may* "regret" those words.. speaking personally, I'm one of the "desperate" men who went to a foreign country to find a wife .. I just don't *choose* to live in UA or RU full time..!  ... and I'm pretty sure my wife would tell you that she wasn't "desperate" to leave her friends or family..she could have married guys at home, or in the USA, who have / had deeper pockets than me .. not quite sure what "yanked your chain".. but I've been "worried" about you, since you told us you'd met Ambach and told us he was an "OK" guy !!!  ..Now we know that he's just another "desperate" guy seeking a "desperate" woman !..

I work around the World and for past 10 years I hear a lot of negative stuff about USA and how many people hope it fails.  There happy with jobs going overseas, weak currency, etc.  It is nice to see countries who are not USA friends fail.  Groove, are you a democrat?  Russia is not a friend of the USA and Ukraine after next election will have very close ties to Russia.  It is better for the USA to have a weak Ukraine and Russia.  I work in Brussels mainly and most of the people I meet here are politicians from Europe.  USA is not very popular here and I get a feeling France and Germany like Russia more than USA.  

Where you "under the influence" when you wrote this? !!  ....  There's one HELL of a lot of generalisations, and "interesting" Foreign Policy perpectives..

Ronnie, in my post I mentioned good for Ukraine people on realestate.  I also hope house prices continue to fall in USA so the poor and young can afford housing without big mortgages.

This comment doesn't seem to "fit", seeing you are the guy who publically stated he bought houses off locals and sold them on for 100% more in a week.. either you have a "social conscience" - or you don't !!!!

How's the hangover this morning... ?

[kievstar]

Msmoby, good points.  So lets have an interesting discussion.   I was sober at work.  Was busy with democrat economic strategy.  Just my current views but I can change, not a stubborn man.

Regarding Ambach.  You have me confused with the guy (greg) who lost his money in the airport who met him and complained about going to Ukraine. So your facts are off here.  If you have a problem with Ambach, take it up for with him.

I also said a little desperate.  Little desperate is different than being very desperate. Every person at times is a little desperate.  Definition of desperate can mean "wanting or needing something very much" - you never wanted something a little???  That is the problem with the internet.  Words have many meanings.

I like cheap housing.  But if someone is going to list there apartment for sale at a certain price I will not give them more than they listed.  Do you go to the store and pay more than listed price?  But I do think it would be good if housing prices around the world dropped and never went up again.  Also, on news today people in USA save 1% of disposable income but have 129% debt.  In 1990 they had 75 or 77% debt.  USA was bad in 1990 too on savings.  Since people just are going to keep spending and  no saving, low house prices will help keep debt down.  I do not feel sorry for anybody that over spends like a fool and loses there house.   I also do not feel sorry for people who flip houses for gain and than get caught in the downturn.  In Ukraine many people got free housing and now are taking loans on it.  This is a long discussion.  If your ever in Kiev, let me know and I can show you in person what is happening.

I do consulting on the side for politicians in Kiev on economy also in USA (actually for democrats eventhough I am Independent / Republican).  Ukraine has a lot of issues and needs a strong government who is not worried about personal gain.  Yu, Ya, and Yul are not getting it done.  There is a growing concern about excluding USA from Europe.  This discussion is really for another board so will not continue it.  But the future of USA in the World does not look good.  Biden and Palin was brought up as a better president / vice president combination. 

But my views change a lot as I talk with many people.  I am an open person and also ok with 3 or more views on an issue.

Regarding my social conscience.  I do not like when men talk bad about AM or AW.  I also do not like when a man wants a prenup with a RW.  RW gives up a lot to leave there country and  think the prenup is a way to control her.  I also do not like smooth talking politicians or lazy people.  I also have seen many foreign men in Ukraine who should not be dating at all looking for a wife.  I also do not like illegal aliens in the USA and think they should be rounded up and told if they come again they will be shot.  I also think men who rape or molest a child should be killed.  I do not like people who abuse animals but I hate PETA. 

In order for the World to work you have rich, middle class, and poor.  You can not have everybody being happy and welloff.  Just does not work. 

 

[msmoby_ru]

Msmoby, good points.  So lets have an interesting discussion.   I was sober at work.  Was busy with democrat economic strategy.  Just my current views but I can change, not a stubborn man.

Hi KS, so you WERE sober- my 1st apology - there were SO many Their( there) and your ( you're) in your posts I assumed something was distracting you

Regarding Ambach.  You have me confused with the guy (greg) who lost his money in the airport who met him and complained about going to Ukraine. So your facts are off here. 

SECOND apology - and I was sober, too

If you have a problem with Ambach, take it up for with him.

I don't have a problem with Ambach .. I'm just upset he "ignores" me   I find his posts ( when is is an expert having never been to the FSU until recently) very entertaining.

I also said a little desperate.  Little desperate is different than being very desperate. Every person at times is a little desperate.  Definition of desperate can mean "wanting or needing something very much" - you never wanted something a little???  That is the problem with the internet.  Words have many meanings.

Naw, I don't buy that, KS.. I like what you post ..but I think we saw your real feelings come through ...sometimes I feel / felt a little "superior" when I saw guys coming to visit FSU women in Cyprus - particularly if I had a pretty good idea about WHO they'd be meeting and how they'd probably be on a WMVM and reckomned they could visit more than one lady during the visit

I like cheap housing.  But if someone is going to list there apartment for sale at a certain price I will not give them more than they listed.  Do you go to the store and pay more than listed price?

No, of course not - but this is just a "smart" retort - I wouldn'yt have picked you up, if you hadn't been in "denial mode"... after what you'd just posted in t'other thread !;)

Regarding my social conscience.  I do not like when men talk bad about AM or AW.  I also do not like when a man wants a prenup with a RW.  RW gives up a lot to leave there country and  think the prenup is a way to control her.  I also do not like smooth talking politicians or lazy people.  I also have seen many foreign men in Ukraine who should not be dating at all looking for a wife.  I also do not like illegal aliens in the USA and think they should be rounded up and told if they come again they will be shot.  I also think men who rape or molest a child should be killed.  I do not like people who abuse animals but I hate PETA. 

In order for the World to work you have rich, middle class, and poor.  You can not have everybody being happy and welloff.  Just does not work. 

Did I ask for all that ))?   

I know you  are an interesting guy and I wish I got to Kiev more often -I love to chat over a pint of the black stuff in O'Brien's - have you ever been to one of the British Embassy "garden parties" ? Try and swing an invite .. I love and miss Kiev .. I used to go 6 times a year - but now I'm "concentrating" on W.Europe  and don't travel to UA so often.. just Russia.

But one day.. I just hope I catch you on a interesting day





[/quote]

[ScottinCrimea]

Wow kievstar,  You're a man after my own heart.  I agree with every one of your views that you just mentioned and I am also one who loves Ukraine and plans to live there.  We definitely need to meet up sometime.  It would be a very nice break from most of the Westerners that I run into there.

[kievstar]

MsMoby, I will admit I am a little full of myself on women.  But women have made me this way.  Nicknames for me in the past were Hollywood, John Kennedy, etc.  Every where I go women hit on me (worse in America).  Even in Ukraine girls ask me out often.  Even my friends set me up for the Bachelor (television) which the representatives of the Bachelor were going to pay me good money to go on the show.  But I am old fashioned with women which keeps me from dying.  Meaning no sex for a long time and formal meeting with parents first.  Kind of strange for a guy who dated one of the most famous porn stars in the World for 4 years in college.

My only experience in England is I lived in Stratford for 3 months and worked in Leamington Spa back in 2001 (but I worked 16 hours a day 90 days straight) and I go to London for business usually in the airport.  Never been to a garden party.   Never been to Obriens either - I like Miami Blues on the porch in Kiev.

I am very open person so if you ask me something you may get more than you were looking for.  I have a ton of stories as I have been to more than 100 countries in this decade alone.  My poor ex AW wife - good lady.  

[Makkin]

  Iceland is now in a fallout for sure. Nobody wants to trade the Krona so it's gone from the market and the hopes are with Russia..lol I'm amused that Russia may loan the money at a much higher interest rate and also amazed that they will probably not see a return on the money for many many years if at all.
  No...I don't think Russia will loan the money unless and until they get a secured contract in place somewhat keen to ownership of the country of 320,000 people.

  Petrol prices have gone down recently but so has the Euro and pound...This means the price of petrol has stayed the same in Europe due to the purchase made in dollars while the cost of petrol has gone down some 25% in the states. What does this mean? I think it means the typical manipulation of monies that cover the globe. Not long ago the Australian dollar was hanging around 95% of the US dollar and has gone to .66 and lower recently.

  The way business is done on an international level is mixed and confused but the formula that works in the past for smooth global operation is usually at this level but slightly different due to the loss of the pound and Euro. Historically to a large degree the pacific may stand stronger than Europe in six months time depending of three factors we all are familiar with.....Blah blah blah...I know it's all boring stuff.

Buy Silver as it's gone up again and lags wayyyy behind as usual until the big players jump in as they are doing now.

Makkin

[kievstar]

Scott,

I love the Crimea.  My ex girlfriend was from Sevastopol and we went there often.  Do you live in Simferopol now?

[groovlstk]

Groove, if you read my post it is for the best of most people in Ukraine as right now majority can not afford current prices.  I did not mention anything about my personal gain.   Most of my friends in Kiev cannot afford to buy an apartment so buy cars instead.  

Kievstar, if I've been misreading your posts you have my sincere apology.

Realestate is way over priced just like New York where you live.  Maybe your a little nervous about housing prices in New York when many of the wall street jobs go over seas in the next few years. If you have ever lived in Ukraine you would understand how hard it is for most younger people with the high prices. I am less than 40 years old by the way.

Real estate here is outrageous, we could have bought a place twice the size for half the price by driving 30 minutes in any direction. However, our condo hasn't lost it's value (at least not yet), while homes 30 mins. way in the suburbs have.

Groove, are you a democrat?

No, but living in a city makes me lean further to the left than most Americans on RWD, I'd guess. I'm considered a heretic among our local friends for expressing admiration for McCain.

 Russia is not a friend of the USA and Ukraine after next election will have very close ties to Russia.  It is better for the USA to have a weak Ukraine and Russia.

I would disagree here. I don't think it's in our interest to have a weak Russia, particularly because there is a plethora of plutonium and enriched uranium just waiting to be liberated and sold to the wrong people. William Langewiesche wrote a great piece in The Atlantic about how easy it would be (which later became a book, The Atomic Bazaar).

[ScottinCrimea]

Scott,

I love the Crimea.  My ex girlfriend was from Sevastopol and we went there often.  Do you live in Simferopol now?

Sevastopol is a great city.  I lived in Simferopol for a couple of years but now we're back in the States for a couple of years so my wife can experience life here before we return to Simferopol for good.