Need advice on winning my girl back.

[Blues Fairy]

A good girl will want her family and friends to meet you, and to get their feedback on you. It does work both ways.

A good girl most likely works 40+ hours/week and only has 28 calendar days of vacation per year; it's cruel to make her spend her precious vacation time in her home town entertaining a guy whom she sees for the first time, after a most likely very brief correspondence.  Moreover, if the girl is an adult 100% weaned from her parents, she will NOT want them to meet a guy before she's sure herself this is actually going somewhere.

The "meet her first on her home turf" strategy may be the safest scenario for the guy but certainly not so for the girl.  Those girls who agree to this instead of meeting first in a neutral location like two equal responsible adults have my sincere pity.  

[groovlstk]

A long-departed female poster had an interesting take on meeting family, also. If you are meeting multiple women, you have no right to expect to meet a girl's family or friends. I think that's pretty fair.

[Misha]

Moreover, if the girl is an adult 100% weaned from her parents, she will NOT want them to meet a guy before she's sure herself this is actually going somewhere.

I agree, but you can still date a woman in her city and not meet her parents until she is ready. I met my wife's family 3 weeks or so after dating and we were seeing each other every day.

Also, my wife was working when we were dating. We would meet after work or on weekends. I did not need a babysitter to take care of me during the day as there were plenty of museums and bookstores to keep me busy So, she did not have to take days off simply to date me.

[GoodOlBoy]

That is REALLY bad advice to give newbies, GOB. 

Not true.

As a gentleman from Virginia, I learned a long time ago NOT to invite myself to somebody else's house.

If the RW does not want to meet you in her hometown for the (FIRST MEETING) it is OK.

Scenario #1

You go to RW hometown. Things don't work out. Then what? Back up plan?

Great for you, but what about her? She is suppose to stand there with egg on her face while you go "hunting" in her backyard?  Her family, colleagues and friends laugh at her?  Then you get on your airplane and go home to the GoodOl' USA?

NICE for you!..... But what about her?

Now if she invites you to her hometown for your first visit, that is another story all together.

Of course if she doesn't want you to meet her family by the second visit, BIG RED FLAG.

I may also add, always have a backup plan (NOT a backup girl).


GOB

[Misha]

Great for you, but what about her? She is suppose to stand there with egg on her face while you go "hunting" in her backyard?  Her family, colleagues and friends laugh at her?  Then you get on your airplane and go home to the GoodOl' USA?

Again, unless it is a small village or unless you buy a large add in the leading newspaper stating "I am dating X" who will know? You can date discretely in anything but the smallest city and unless you go out on dates where you know your friends and family members hang out, nobody will know. Also, unless she is married or in a relationship, it won't be the end of the world if somebody does spot her in a restaurant on a date. If they ask, she can share with them as little or as much as she wants.

[GoodOlBoy]

The "meet her first on her home turf" strategy may be the safest scenario for the guy but certainly not so for the girl.  Those girls who agree to this instead of meeting first in a neutral location like two equal responsible adults have my sincere pity. 

IMO, it is just a matter of respecting each other.

Thank you Blues Fairy.  

GOB

[Gator]

I met four RW who traveled from provincial cities to one of the Big Three.  All meetings went well.  I also met RW initially in their hometown.  My typical experience:

1.  To meet in the Big Three cities, a provincial RW cleared her schedule to spend all of her time with me.   Also, there was more to do so the meetings were more fun.  [Warning - a pro dater will come to a large city knowing there is better shopping.]  

2.  Meeting her first in her small hometown usually meant that she did not clear her schedule and met me only when she could get away from work (understandable considering all knew I was a WMVM man, even though I was VO in her city).  Result - much downtime with little to do.   Meeting the parents was not high on her list, although I did on occasion meet her child.  I never noticed any concern about dating a foreigner as most guided me to active, public places.

[Misha]

I never noticed any concern about dating a foreigner as most guided me to active, public places.

Ditto. If she is single, people expect her to be dating. Even a small city has restaurants and other very public places where she can have a date without meeting all her loved ones and nosy neighbors.

[GoodOlBoy]

Ditto. If she is single, people expect her to be dating. Even a small city has restaurants and other very public places where she can have a date without meeting all her loved ones and nosy neighbors.

I understand your point Misha, but why would you even want to take a chance of embarrassing your girl in her own hometown?

Russian women are VERY proud ladies and their families do not accept "failure" very well. It is a stigma, for the woman, in Russian society if the relationship fails.

Also you have to ask yourself, how would you feel about your daughter having strange men coming and going from overseas. Wouldn't you like her to "shelter" you from this behavior by meeting these men in another city?

If you meet in a neutral site and things don't work out, you go to your backup plan for "that city", not her hometown.

But on the other hand if things workout at the neutral site, you may get invited home right away (this happened to me).


GOB

[OlgaH]

It is a stigma, for the woman, in Russian society if the relationship fails.

GOB

Are you talking about a concrete woman with a stigma? As I have been living in Russia for more than 30 years I don't know any woman with the such stigma 

[Gator]

I understand your point Misha, but why would you even want to take a chance of embarrassing your girl in her own hometown?

Most seemed happy if not proud to be with me and I recall one getting a "Go Girl!" signal from her friend we encountered.  

It is a stigma, for the woman, in Russian society if the relationship fails.

What relationship?  I was not staying in their apartments.  No PDA.  We walked around like new acquaintances - not friends, not lovers.

[Gator]

I should add that I had many RW decline to meet me when they learned I was meeting others.  Perhaps those women were expecting a relationship and would have been uncomfortable walking around with nothing serious in mind.

[GoodOlBoy]

Are you talking about a concrete woman with a stigma? As I have been living in Russia for more than 30 years I don't know any woman with the such stigma

No Ma'am.

I am talking about Russian Women bearing the brunt of "guilt" when a relationship fails.

This is due to the RM mentality in your country.

Simply put RM (Russian Men) make no mistakes in Russia. RM are perceived to be "perfect".

So, if a relationship fails, it is the woman's fault.

Of course, I do not subscribe to this theory.


GOB

[GoodOlBoy]

I should add that I had many RW decline to meet me when they learned I was meeting others.  Perhaps those women were expecting a relationship and would have been uncomfortable walking around with nothing serious in mind.

PERHAPS? 

Come on, it's not a competition to meet as many women as possible.

But hey, at least you were honest with the one's you did meet. 

[groovlstk]

Maybe she doesn't want everybody at her work and in her hometown to know she is looking for a "foreign man". There is a stigma attached to this you know?

I'd agree 100% w/this (and it's at the heart of my photos position).

For most of us guys who are married, we've come to terms with the fact that the media and our ex-girlfriends/wives are all too happy to call men who marry RW "losers" and refer to our wives as either green card girls or scammers.

But it's also present on the other side, there's a stigma in Ukraine and Russia for women who use marriage agencies that cater to foreigners as well as women who date/marry foreigners. Blame it on sex tourists, dishonest agencies, scammers, or simple jealousy. Someone posted long ago that the industry was a "dirty barrel" and while I don't completely agree w/him, most laypeople in the US and FSU are unwilling to look beyond the stereotypes.

[OlgaH]

No Ma'am.

I am talking about Russian Women bearing the brunt of "guilt" when a relationship fails. This is due to the RM in your country.

Simply put RM (Russian Men) make no mistakes in Russia. RM are perceived to be "perfect".

So, if a relationship fails, it is the woman's fault.

Of course, I do not subscribe to this theory.


GOB

Really? That is just a surprising news for me.   Who feeds you with such tales... most likely trying to arouse your compassion ?    

[Misha]

But it's also present on the other side, there's a stigma in Ukraine and Russia for women who use marriage agencies that cater to foreigners as well as women who date/marry foreigners.

Again, how will people know? Will she have a sign around her neck saying if she goes on a date at a restaurant stating: "I am dating a foreigner I met at an agency, please call my mom"?

[Simoni]

Well, then...let's take it a step further.

Not only would I not recommed taking a girl on a romantic vacation before you meet her, I would not even recommend scheduling one week with a girl you have not even met  

My advice--  write several girls, simply saying you are traveling through Ukraine (or wherever) and would like to meet them.  Meet half a dozen girls, and then schedule your next visit with the girl that you connect with.  Then spend a week with her.  Any place  

[Simoni]

Again, how will people know? Will she have a sign around her neck saying if she goes on a date at a restaurant stating: "I am dating a foreigner I met at an agency, please call my mom"?

Good one!  LOL 

[Simoni]

 I never noticed any concern about dating a foreigner as most guided me to active, public places.

My experience, too.

[Diplomacy]

Good Ole Boy

I thought we working on tolerance for New Years

Bashing others, to appear in a better light is not being a Southern Gentleman.  Being the better man and not saying you are is a Southern Gentleman.  Your actions speak for you, not the words .  You attacked a poor innocent woman in another post.  I am certain you believe what you are being told as Gospel.  

There are reasons we have Deadbeat Dad laws here, there are plenty of men not paying child support in the USA.  There are plenty of men here that cheat, and have substance abuse issues.  

What is important is your wife found someone that truly loves her and she loves you.  I do not see what a crusade against RM on a board that is main purpose is to help us be a better option for FSUW.

[Simoni]

... there's a stigma in Ukraine and Russia for women who use marriage agencies that cater to foreigners as well as women who date/marry foreigners.

This is not completely true.  For example, our marriage was made possible because the dating agency got us together.  Since then, half a dozen of Marina's friends, seeing how good and successful our marriage is, joined the same dating agency.   Dating agencies are not a stigma to all.   Myself included.

I never noticed any concern about dating a foreigner as most guided me to active, public places.

My experience, too.

[GoodOlBoy]

I thought we working on tolerance for New Years

BUSTED. 

Back to the wood shed.


GOB

[groovlstk]

Again, how will people know? Will she have a sign around her neck saying if she goes on a date at a restaurant stating: "I am dating a foreigner I met at an agency, please call my mom"?

Misha, probably much of it is paranoia, but if it's a girl's home town I can't say I blame her for being cautious. One thing Serebro mentioned about this (and I'm not sure if it was from personal experience but I'm inclined to believe it was) is that it's very awkward for a girl to introduce a foreign guy to her family and friends, then have him meet other girls and dump her, then have this cycle repeat itself. Relatives and friends will ask her the status of her relationship and it's embarrassing - sure not humiliating but I can understand wanting to avoid such awkwardness by waiting to see if the guy is semi-serious or not.

[groovlstk]

This is not completely true.  For example, our marriage was made possible because the dating agency got us together.  Since then, half a dozen of Marina's friends, seeing how good and successful our marriage is, joined the same dating agency.   Dating agencies are not a stigma to all.   Myself included.
 My experience, too.

It's absolutely not completely true, but if you date outside the agency pool you will learn that there are women who would never set foot in an agency office because they believe all the stereotypes. For this reason I always recommend that guys use various outlets to meet women (agencies, free personals, Russian dating sites, chat clients) because if they stick w/one method they are exposing themselves to only a tiny segment of available women.