Need advice on winning my girl back.

[mies]

I never said she should have her investigated. He only has her cell phone number. He needs an address to go get on his knees to ask her to take him back. She does not need to know how he found her, only that he put forth the effort and did. What else will he do? Go door to door asking for her? A bit time consuming don't you think?

if the girl does not want to see a guy so much that she does not want to set a meeting with him, or give him her address - do you really think she will be thrilled to see him without notice at her doorstep one day?   

To "ask somebody back" you need to have the relationship first. I am not quite sure they had any relationship at all. It does not look to me like that.

If I specifically don't want to give my address to somebody, and then i see this person at my door - now that's stalking.
I don't have to think what I would do hypothetically. There were two different guys in my life who at different occasions did it. They didn't use the detective, but all the rest - collecting information, getting my address, meeting me at doors kneeled with roses - they did it all. It totally freaked me out. And I am not married to either of them. So. You may want to draw some conclusions from my humble story.

Now imagine that the girl does have a boyfriend, or a girlfriend. Or even got married a week ago. And instead of calling her and having all these things discussed - the OP just gets her address and comes to her home with flowers and ring. You know what will happen then? The variants could be anything starting from him being laughed over, or beaten up by jealous bf/hubby, and up till bf/husband breaking the relationship with this particular girl. And for the silly caprice of one romantic american who decided to use detective instead of talking to girl directly - the love/life of a particular girl can be destroyed.

Dear original poster - don't come uninvited. You have her phone / e-mail - figure everything out directly with her. If she wants to see you - she will tell so. If she doesn't - no point for you to go there. In russian we say "насильно мил не будешь"

[kievstar]

Just a little update.  Rattlehead has not been on this board since November 20th, 2008. 

[mies]

Just a little update.  Rattlehead has not been on this board since November 20th, 2008. 

we know it.

my opinion about using detective service by any man stays unchanged.

[groovlstk]

we know it.

my opinion about using detective service by any man stays unchanged.

I agree completely. I shudder to think what would have happened if I had asked a detective agency to check out my wife while we were dating - she'd have dumped me in a moment and been 100% justified.

Unless you have problems with paranoia, any guy who has doubts should either jump ship or invest the time and effort into resolving the situation.

[Faux Pas]

I agree completely. I shudder to think what would have happened if I had asked a detective agency to check out my wife while we were dating - she'd have dumped me in a moment and been 100% justified.

Unless you have problems with paranoia, any guy who has doubts should either jump ship or invest the time and effort into resolving the situation.

Or get on a plane and go meet, learn her and know for one's self. I had seen the detective agency ads and read the advice to partake. Even saw where some said it was a sure thing she has checked us out in some similar way. An obvious attempt to drum up business I was sure. It never crossed my mind to have a lady checked out. It sure doesn't sound like the way to start off what hopes to be a lifelong relationship, with the shroud of suspicion.

[JR]

we know it.

my opinion about using detective service by any man stays unchanged.

No one asked you to change your mind It's an open discussion, thats all. BTW my Ex's uncle was/is a colonel in the KGB/FSB or whatever they are calling it these days.  Anyway, her father had him 'investigate' me. My Ex told me things about my family I had long ago forgotten. I was not offended in the least. So while others say what they might feel if put into that particular situation but haven't actually "been there, done that" (at least to their knowledge) I can state from experience it was no big deal. Actually I thought "Cool, she knows all about me and my family and still accepts me, thats a good thing."

[Muddy]

Last week, out of the blue, she sent me an email simply expressing that she felt the same as I told her I would about the result of the US Presidential election.  A few weeks ago she wouldn't answer my emails at all anymore.  I guess this means that she wouldn't mind talking with me.  I haven't responded yet.  I'm not sure what to say.  What do you think?

I had a relationship with a ukrainian girl and I did what you did, I wrote a bad email, and should would not write me or talk to me, I send her some emails but she would not answer. My last email to her was on Nov 4 22:50, exactly one month after my last email to her she emaild me on Dec 4 22:55. Maybe she has a one month "no-contact" policy

I think your girl might have found a boyfriend, I hope you answered her email, keep it short but interesting, and see if she replies, keep your email interesting and if you are really interested in her you must go see her. Also, she does not know what you do here, maybe she thinks you have a girlfrind here too. If you really like her and thinking marriage then you should tell her that and what you want from her

[Shadow]

Or she found someone interesting enough to meet and pursue, but it did not work out so she is back to plan B..... 

[Muddy]

Or she found someone interesting enough to meet and pursue, but it did not work out so she is back to plan B..... 

Maybe, mybe, maybe, .....
maybe this, maybe that
who the f-ck really knows

[Muddy]

So much doom and gloom over nothing in this thread.

Rattlehead, it seems you have many questions running around your mind.

Did you misread the tone of her message thanks to the online translator? Probably, it happens all the time.

Do you have a chance with this girl in the future? Sure. People have had much worse arguments and ended up happily together. I've known guys that won over a girl (but not with gifts and flowers) who initially had no attraction and they ended up happily together. The sure way to fail is to not even try.

What exactly was running through her mind when she broke things off? Did she not like you so much? Does she have a boyfriend? Did her friends and family put ideas in her head about the futility of a long distance romance? Was the communciation really frustrating her? Could be any or all of the above. Don't worry about it. You'll never know exactly and you'll go crazy trying to figure it out. It's in the past, move on to the present.

Can she forgive your insult? Women in Russia forgive their husbands and serious boyfriends who beat them and cheat on them all the time. You offended this girl during a heated email argument. No big deal. She already broke the ice and sent you a message. People seem to have missed this. Do you really think she wants to compare thoughts about the election? Hell no. She regrets what happens and used the opportunity as an excuse to rekindle a conversation with you. She's already half way forgiven you. Now it's your turn to take a step.

I've often read on these boards how "Russian Women" are stubborn and unforgiving. They don't say sorry, and they don't say thanks. Funny, that's hasn't been my experience living more than half the year in Russia. I've heard sorry. I hear thanks all the time. Yes, I've met difficult, demanding and unforgiving women in Russia. These are the women Russian men avoid, and so do I. I can see why many women like this would end up on bridal sites. They're not much of a catch back home.

My advice:

Save the romantic flower surprise for a girl you're dating. Don't use it as a way to 'win' a girl's heart. You've already insulted her saying she was using you for gifts. Don't use gifts to get her back. It won't work.

Email her back. You've got nothing to lose by doing so. She wrote to you a week ago, don't let too much time go by before you respond. Tell her you're sorry about what you said, but don't overdo it. There's no need to beg forgiveness on your knees. Tell her you're coming back in January if you really intend to do so. Tell her about your plans to live in Ukraine and simply keep in touch with her. Be friends.

I'm sure she'll be willing to see you again if indeed you end up living in Ukraine. Then take things as they come. You'll also have plenty of chances with other nice women if you end up living in Ukraine. If this girl really liked you, and she probably did, you'll get your chance.

About working in Ukraine, one option is to find work that you can do online, from anywhere. How much time have you spent in Russia or Ukraine? You might be disappointed living there full time.

Take it easy and good luck!

Sharp post

[2tallbill]

 But then quite suddenly (less than two weeks after I returned to the US) she stopped talking to me. 
she sent a response telling me quite casually that she no longer wanted to talk to me because it was difficult to communicate on the phone and she needed dictionaries to write messages and this frustrated and irritated her. 
She also mentioned how it didn't make sense to continue because I was so far away and she didn't know when I was coming back (I promised to in January).  She said she doesn't want to live in America (I think she misunderstood that I went back here for a promising job offer  that I got before I met her and that I don't want to stay here to live).  I was very disappointed and hurt.  What upset me the most was how quickly she gave up, and how cold and emotionless her message seemed.  I wondered how someone could give up so easily and write such a message if they ever cared for me to begin with, so I questioned if she was only pretending to care for me, and then I wondered why someone would do that, and the only reason I could think of was to get a free trip and a few gifts that I gave her.  So I was rather quick to write an email back basically accusing her of doing this.  She said that I was wrong and I must not care for her if I could say that (but I think it's obvious that I was so upset because I cared for her).  She also said that she hated me now.  I was very upset but I tried to forget about her.

You aren't going to win her back, that doesn't work in real life. My advice is to move on.

[2tallbill]

But then quite suddenly (less than two weeks after I returned to the US) she stopped talking to me.  I realized that something was wrong. 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.  Thank you!

--Rattlehead

Rattle,
You've been bitten by the hot FSU woman bug. Don't worry, there are literally millions of women
in the FSU. Pick a different one. An FSUW really cares for you up until the point that they don't. 
Then you are milk turning into cottage cheese.

Find another, easy peasy.

[Trenchcoat]

Privet All,

Things went wrong for me in a very new relationship with a beautiful young Ukrainian lady and I am determined to win her back.  I need some advice about how to proceed and I would greatly appreciate the opinions of the Ukrainian and Russian ladies on this board.  I'm 29 years old and the lady's age is 25.  I met her in Ukraine after I had made all my travel arrangements to visit Kiev and St. Petersburg before returning to the US to take a promising job offer.  I met her just before I left.  I'm back in the US now.

In September I met her, in Ukraine, at a restaurant by chance.  Two days later on the day that I left that city we met there again and we talked.  She speaks English but is shy about it.  She understands me very well in person, and I understand her very well when she speaks English (I speak Russian very poorly).  We were both interested in seeing each other again so I invited her to go to Kiev with me.  I left that night (Wednesday), and she waited until Friday and then went to Kiev and spent two days with me there.  We had such a good time that I invited her to come to St. Petersburg with me.  She went home for about a week and then flew to SPb and spent four days with me there.  I, of course, paid for her ticket because I'm the man and I believe that's what's right.  When she went home everything was fine and we agreed to keep in touch.  We talked on the phone every two days when I got back to the US.  But then quite suddenly (less than two weeks after I returned to the US) she stopped talking to me.  I realized that something was wrong.  I emailed her and she sent a response telling me quite casually that she no longer wanted to talk to me because it was difficult to communicate on the phone and she needed dictionaries to write messages and this frustrated and irritated her.  She also mentioned how it didn't make sense to continue because I was so far away and she didn't know when I was coming back (I promised to in January).  She said she doesn't want to live in America (I think she misunderstood that I went back here for a promising job offer  that I got before I met her and that I don't want to stay here to live).  I was very disappointed and hurt.  What upset me the most was how quickly she gave up, and how cold and emotionless her message seemed.  I wondered how someone could give up so easily and write such a message if they ever cared for me to begin with, so I questioned if she was only pretending to care for me, and then I wondered why someone would do that, and the only reason I could think of was to get a free trip and a few gifts that I gave her.  So I was rather quick to write an email back basically accusing her of doing this.  She said that I was wrong and I must not care for her if I could say that (but I think it's obvious that I was so upset because I cared for her).  She also said that she hated me now.  I was very upset but I tried to forget about her.

The trouble is that I can't forget about her.  There was so much about her, like her personality, beliefs and opinions that made her perfect for me.  The more I thought about it, I began to consider that perhaps she didn't mean for her letter to sound so cold and emotionless.  Perhaps it seemed that way because she used an online translator to write it.  Maybe she was sad about her decision but thought it was best to avoid feeling worse in the future.  And maybe she didn't mean for her letter to seem so cold but it did because of the translator, like I said.  Maybe there's more to it, maybe she met someone else, I don't know.  However, I know that I need to find out.  I want to move back to Ukraine anyway, (it's just a matter of me finding a good job over there--if anyone has any ideas let me know!), and we were able to communicate quite well in person.  If there's any chance to fix things with her I want to apologize for what I said and go back to communicating with her.  I'll try to write mostly in Russian if she wants that.
I came up with a plan to change her heart (at least enough to talk to me as a friend again) which I would like your opinion on (as Ukrainian and Russian women).  I have no mailing address for her home or job to send her flowers and a letter, so I thought of a way to send flowers and a letter without knowing this.  I asked my friend if he could pay (with money I will send him) for some services at a beauty salon (like hair, nails, massage) for her.  And then the salon girl would call her mobile phone and tell her that through market research they randomly selected her phone number and she's won these free services at the salon.  The salon girl would make an appointment with her and on the day of her appointment I would have 11 (or should it be 15?) roses delivered to the salon for her with my letter.  After her salon treatments she would be presented with the bouquet of roses and my letter and she would know that it was a gift from me.  The letter isn't very romantic.  Rather than try to rekindle our romance right away I decided to just ask for her forgiveness for what I said and resume communications.  I think that this might make her realize that I really do care.  My friend who has offered to help me with this has a PayPal account and so do I, so I can send the money to pay for all of this.

One of my friends here thinks that I should keep it more casual and just send my letter in an email (which his Ukrainian wife translated into Russian for me).  He thinks being too romantic at this point may scare her away.  I certainly agreed with him as much to make the letter less romantic than I would normally be inclined to.  Last week, out of the blue, she sent me an email simply expressing that she felt the same as I told her I would about the result of the US Presidential election.  A few weeks ago she wouldn't answer my emails at all anymore.  I guess this means that she wouldn't mind talking with me.  I haven't responded yet.  I'm not sure what to say.  What do you think?  Should I go the casual route and just send my letter in an email, or should I be more romantic and give her this gift as a gesture to show that I care?

It's been over a week since she emailed me.  I want to send her something soon.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.  Thank you!

--Rattlehead

A fair bit to unpick here and so sad to see promising relationships go south.

Firstly, I would say if you invited her to SPB (Any holiday location) and voluntarily pay for her then you can't blame her for being after that as you voluntarily decided to do this.

Secondly, it's a bad idea to take a girl away on holiday shortly after meeting, as you're creating a trap for yourself as in you start thinking - maybe this girl is just with me for this. She is then placed in a situation not if her doing where the guy starts doubting her interest in him. While a holiday with a newly met girl may sound exciting & great it risks dooming a genuine relationship for this reason.

Thirdly, if you mess up and end up insulting your woman, just apologize and leave it at that. She may just see that you were frustrated at the time and that you care and forgive you. The FSU isn't western Hollywood, strange and bizarre romantic ploys are not needed and may even backfire with her wondering what the hell is going on and getting suspicious, thinking you're wacko, etc and running off. I would just say keep it simple with an apology and either she will be interested or she won't anymore.

Fourthly, some FSW have a life where they are, they may not have intended to meet a foreigner or get serious. They may have never had a wish to leave their area and move abroad. They will probably have family, friends, possibly a job and a place/city, etc they love all at hand. They may have plenty of dating opportunities all at hand locally. So moving to the other side of the world and giving all that up may not be what she wants. In theory there is no telling if she doesn't have a boyfriend/love interest locally. Perhaps there was you and some local guy in play and the local guy won through because he was at hand and living where she was. At this point you are just some guy living abroad where she doesn't wish to go who seems more attached to some promising job offer and in that you give the impression that your life is projecting away from her to that job rather than moving to her in her country.

Lastly, good paying work is hard to find in a lot of the FSU as compared to western exchange rates most jobs are on poor pay. That creates a conundrum for the western guy as few WM wish to move to Ukraine or wherever for poor pay. To date IT jobs have been a possibility working remotely but AI looks soon to take most of those. In some big cities like Moscow & Kyiv jobs in finance might pay well, but the Russian language is normally needed for that, etc. That leaves teacher if a foreign language, English, etc but unless you get real good it might not pay so well and AI is taking done work their also. Then there is possible work at the Embassy of your home country if you can find a job opening. Other than that there is any independent income from abroad if you can rent out your property, business opportunities online and anything else you can think off.