Concern about scam red flag

[Al_C]

Hello Folks,

I have been corresponding with a lady who might be a scammer.  I do not have enough to condemn her or even point a finger at her yet.  She might be legit, so I don't want to mess this up by doing any finger pointing until I have more to go on.

I would appreciate any insightful analysis anyone might have on this.  Please do not tell me that there are scam red flags here.  I already know that.  Also, please do not tell me to forget about her and move on.  I can figure that part out as well.  What I am looking for are thoughts that will help me slice through the fine lines here and figure out if the red flags I am about to tell you about are real fires or false alarms.  I don't want to mess up what might be a good relationship, but I also don't want to fall into a scam.

Here are the facts:

The woman is from Kyrgistan.  I met her on EM in November.  We exchanged a few letters, about 20 or so by this point.  And we spoke on the phone four times.  We exchanged full names and addresses.

Sounds good so far.  But here is where it gets thick:  She says she has a U.S. green card that she won in a lottery.  It is a plausible claim since there have been such lotteries.  She says she has been to New York, my home city, and she has detailed geographic knowledge of the streets, restaurants, and other attractions.

Not thick enough yet?  I mentioned in a phone call in December that I was planning a trip to Russia in May and that I would consider a stop in Kyrg to see her.  Her response is that she did not want to wait until May for us to meet and that she would like to come here in February.

YELLOW FLAG #1:  After talking to a guy for one month, she wants to arrive in his city and stay in his house with him for a week.  We never talked about anything personal, and when I try to do so, she shuts the topic down and moves on to surface matters, such as my plans for the weekend or how my work is going.  Living in my house with me for a week sounds like a quantum leap for this lady.

YELLOW FLAG #2:  She wants me to buy her the plane ticket.  Not out of the ordinary, considering the culture she comes from and the lack of income in Kyrg, but where did she get the money from to fly to New York the first time she was here?

YELLOW FLAG #3:  I offered to send the plane tickets to her home address, but she declined and asked me to send them to the local Fed Ex office, where she will pick them up.  She also declined my offer to send the tix to her job, where there is somebody to sign for them throughout the business day.  I am now wondering if the home address she gave is accurate and why I cannot have her work address.

RED FLAG:  She just got a "better" idea for the plane tickets:  She will get the tickets from her local travel agent as soon as I deposit the money for them into her U.S. bank account.  This one is so obvious that it is hard for me to believe that she didn't see it and as a legit woman would know better than to suggest.

Before the red flag went up, I did not see the yellow flag items, but looking back on the whole thing, it is not too good.  She pushes hard to get here despite hardly knowing me, she is non-responsive to my personal questions, and now she raises a red flag so big that it can be seen from a mile away.

Could a legit woman be that oblivious to the effect she is creating?

Also, does anyone know of a service I can use to verify her address?

[Faux Pas]

Al

She certainly appears to be experienced at targeting travel money. From your given information I'd say the red flags turned all the yellow flags red. Mostly because of her "hurry" to spend time with a man she doesn't know. A US bank account for a Krigz woman who doesn't have any seemingly legitimate purpose for it and I don't believe the lottery green card for one minute. Run and throw rocks would be my advice. Are you sure she is in Krigz? Sound more like one of those Liberian scammers

[Vaughn]

Hi Al,

  It seems you know what's coming but want irrefutable proof. Send her flowers, dude,
and wait for a reaction. Does her phone number jive with her stated city and country?
Have you searched her stated name in Cyrillic? Many here can help you with that via PM.

As for verifying her address, Google kyrgyzstan flowers and get it over with.
As Faux Pas noted, she's in a hurry. You should be, too.

Vaughn

[Gator]

Al,

If she does have a green card, it is odd that she did not stay in the US when she came.  A green card is for permanent residency in the US, not brief periodic visits.

If her story is true (doubtful, but assume it is true) she may have had to return to her country (ill mother, etc.) and became stranded there with no financial means to return.  She could be looking for a generous man to buy her a ticket so that she can return to the US and be with her FSU boyfriend from her first visit.

Also, do not overlook the EM factor.  EM wishes to maintain its good reputation so they do not tolerate scams.  Report your Kyrg woman to EM, giving them some excerpts from your correspondence as evidence of the graduated scheme you presented to us.  EM will research the episode.

As another check, you can google her first letters and her name to see if there is a history.

You will probably lose your woman, but there are many more.  Keep looking.  Although not recommended, some people do wish to meet a woman somewhere other than her home.  [I have done it three times and all three women showed (one time I wish she hadn't  ).]  You do not have to send her money for tickets.  Instead, you can purchase her a ticket through the airlines that she would claim when commencing travel.

[Simoni]

I'd say your chances of her being a scammer are 50/50.   But if you are willing to take a risk, go ahead and meet her.  But DO NOT send her money for tickets. Rather, follow this advice from Gator:

You do not have to send her money for tickets.  Instead, you can purchase her a ticket through the airlines that she would claim when commencing travel.

Be sure to get refundable tickets.  If she does not fly to you, you will have your answer, and not lose all your money.

It is better to risk and to know than to wonder for the rest of your life if she is for real.

Note to other guys:  Don't get in this predicament.  Instead, get to the fsu and meet the girls there, in real life.

[wxman]

This clearly sounds like a scam. One of your yellow flags that you stated that she would stay with you for a week in your house. Now you may think the yellow flag is her lack of fear staying with a total stranger. The actual yellow flag is she is just saying that to get you to send her the money. She has no intention of staying with a stranger, because she has no intention of traveling to the US.

[BC]

Why not just ask your service provider about it?

[kievstar]

Tell her you will visit her in May in her city first and from there you will see where the relationship goes.  Remember before you actually see her face to face you really have no relationship. 

Others have posted about this but I think it is good advise.  Do not write letters to far in advance of you actually meeting someone.  I think by May she will have somebody else who she has met in person.  Your still 5 months from visiting.

[Al_C]

I'd say your chances of her being a scammer are 50/50.   But if you are willing to take a risk, go ahead and meet her.  But DO NOT send her money for tickets. Rather, follow this advice from Gator:

I know.  That is the maddening part.  On one hand, she is beautiful, intelligent, worldly, speaks fluent English and comes with an added bonus of no need for the fiance visa.  On the other hand, I look around my house at things that need to be done, and $1185.00 will go a long way.  If I were Derek Jeter and making $20 mil a year, this would be easy, but for me we are talking major money.

I know enough to not send her money.  Direct buy of the tickets will be the only way that I would do it.  But now, even if she goes for the direct buy, I will wonder why she wants to come to New York.  Is it for me, or is there something else she wants here?

Oh yeah, one more yellow flag:  She says that her whole family is excited about her traveling to New York, and she tells me about a cousin who lives in Brighton Beach (in NYC for those unfamiliar with NY geography).  So I said "Great!  Let's visit her when you are here".  Her response was that she wants to keep her family out of this for now.

Does this cousin exist?  I know she has a family in Kyrg because I saw their photos with her in them, and one time when I called, a young girl, probably her daughter, answered the phone.  But who is this cousin?

The questions keep piling up.  I wish the answers would come nearly as fast.

[Bruce]

If you want to buy this girl a ticket to NY, go ahead - thats all you would be doing.  Chance of her using you - 100%.   Next, next, next.   Just go to Brighton.  There are a ton of illegal FSU girls working just about every restaurant and shop job.   

[Shadow]

Plain and simple.

1. Ask her for a copy of her passport and green card. Tell that you bank requires it for sending the money or the airline needs it for issuing the ticket. If you are not skilled in determining photoshop work, contact US immigration or Embassy to verify the numbers on the visa and green card. I can take a look at the scan and tell if they look leigt ot photoshopped if you wish not to involve official channels.

2. Once it is clear that these are legit, make sure you get a non-refundable ticket. Not delivering to home or work address is not a big red flag. The babushka network at home does not need to know she gets international mail, and at work her boss could fire her for it.

3. As Gator said, the green card lottery is for permanent residence, which means that she should have some permanent residence and should be able to tell where she lived and why she went back.

This reminds me of the story of Prince_Alfie, who paid for the ticket of a woman in the same way. She met him at the airport and dumped him right away.
 

[Gator]

This reminds me of the story of Prince_Alfie, who paid for the ticket of a woman in the same way. She met him at the airport and dumped him right away.
 

Shadow, I forgot about Prince Alfie.  Both hilarious and sad.   

Hmmmmmm.......Al_C.......Prince Alfie.......connection?

Al, you admit that you do not have much money to do the RW wife search.  You must be careful with your limited funds or you will not have a RW wife but just memories of a RW escapade.   To do this one needs at least $10,000 in discretionary funds, more dependent upon several factors.

I suggest that you start over with new RW.  By the time you get close with another RW, it will be May and time for travel.

Does anyone think $1185 is too cheap for a flight from Kryg or does this reflect global deflation?

[Mila]

I completely agree with Shadow and i think you have to follow his advice. I have a feeling, she wants to go to New York, because she has a man here. But you still have time till May and she may disappear and find another victim and use him in her purpose. So, you have two choices: to disappear and feel safe from scam or to check her, but while you are cheking this girl, you can get burnt. So, be careful and don't take a big risk!

[ConnerVT]

Does anyone think $1185 is too cheap for a flight from Kryg or does this reflect global deflation?

Flying all the way (OSS to JFK) RT starting around $3150 USD.

[GoodOlBoy]

Hello Al_C.

You seem to have enough supporting evidence that the girl is "real" and not "Fat Yuri" or the "Slim Nigerian".

I guess the question I have is what will she do when her feet touch the GoodOl' USA soil?

If she actually comes here.  

Maybe I am being a "little judgemental", but I am not sure I would want to get involved with any woman who would stay at my house after a few emails and some telephone conversations?

Put another way.... If it were you flying thousands of miles to meet her and she said: "Oh yeah, you can come to my house and shack up with me".

Wouldn't you find that a "little" strange, given your very brief history?

Tread lightly.



GOB

[Gator]

Maybe I am being a "little judgemental", but I am not sure I would want to get involved with any woman who would stay at my house after a few emails and some telephone conversations?

Put another way.... If it were you flying thousands of miles to meet her and she said: "Oh yeah, you can come to my house and shack up with me".

That's the hook.  Lonely man in America hears this from a beautiful RW and his sexual fantasies become uncontrollable - he must have her so he sends money in the hope that the fantasy is true.

[groovlstk]

Al,

Airplane tix aside, it seems obvious this girl is a cold fish towards you. She's willing to take your money for a trip to the US and to live under your roof while she's here - yet she doesn't want to introduce you to her family and doesn't bother to answer your personal questions? If I remember correctly, you have very limited vacation time and if $1100 is a stretch for you, why even bother? The writing is on the wall in 10-ft. high block letters. 

[HiTech]

If she is not interested in your life.
If she does not speak about her life.

Why do you wish to see her, because you already know deep inside you, that it can not work between the 2 of you, and hence is only a fantasy.

So if it is scam or not is irrelevant ( even though it is obviously a scam) , there is no reason to spend any more effort on this woman.

HiTech

[UTRO]

Sorry, too few emails, phonecalls and personal interest shown in you. This is not someone seeking a relationship.
Forget about it (her)..... Next.

[Faux Pas]

Does anyone think $1185 is too cheap for a flight from Kryg or does this reflect global deflation?

I booked a flight yesterday to Moscow for $875. I still have another leg to Siberia to book for roughly $550

[Shadow]

Searched on Expedia.com

Bishkek, Kyrgyzstan (FRU) to New York, NY (JFK)
   
Aeroflot-Russian Airlines
1 stop from $1169

[ambach123]

I believe one can buy a ticket directly through an airlines; she would not have any monetary benefits from it, if not used. If unused, the credit would go to the credit card.

Is the above correct?

I have seen many posts in which AM met their RW in a third country for the first time, stayed together, and it all worked out fine.

[GoodOlBoy]

I booked a flight yesterday to Moscow for $875. I still have another leg to Siberia to book for roughly $550

Hello FauxPas.

Marina (my wife) just returned last month from her annual pilgrimage to Omsk (Siberia). I booked a ticket for her online at Aeroflot.ru .

Total cost was $371. RT from Moscow SVO to OMS.

I just checked their website and the price is still the same.

BTW...If you enroll in their Skymiles program (same program as Delta) you get air miles credit when you show your Aeroflop card.

She gets upgrades to First Class/Business after enough trips to Omsk.

Now granted First Class/Business on a Tupolev TU154 isn't anything to write home about, BUT.... there is more leg room. 

Enjoy your trip.



GOB

[BC]

I have seen many posts in which AM met their RW in a third country for the first time, stayed together, and it all worked out fine.

Was one of them.  Totally unplanned and never knew each other before.  Did however spend quite a bit of time over two trips in her home town and even living with her family.

IMHO there is a big difference between meeting in a third country and planning to meet in a third country.

Sure, this woman could be legit, but the green card and US bank account is a bit 'fuzzy'..  His service provider (EM) should be able to clarify things. hint hint hint hint......

They have a 'detective' side of of their house that served well to supply me with my wife's address just from her telephone number.. I was too embarrassed at that time to let her know I had misplaced her address.  I ended up with a lot more information that I had asked for, i.e. names, birthdates etc of others living in the same apartment etc.

I did 'confess' down the road and showed her the information I was provided by EM and even she was quite surprised.

In any case.. as I said before, contact your service provider Al...

[ambach123]

BC, if you don't mind, could you please elaborate on your experiences of meeting in a third country? How did it came about? How did it go? etc.

Thanks.