IP tracing? is this an exact science?

[bingolingo]

Hey Bingo, I may have missed it but are you paying for the correspondence? Is a translator involved by any chance? Has she given you her phone and actual physical address? as has been repeated here MANY times, everyone has access to a phone (cell or regular) to receive calls and only some gal truly squirreled away at some farm in the Siberian tundra can't get to an internet cafe.

Ecocks, No I havent been paying for correspondence, and 'she' claims to have studied english at school and then during her 5 years at university so no need for translation. I have now been given a phone number, but havent asked for an address, (under what pretence do you approach that?) if she asked for mine i wouldnt give her it!  I have also asked to chat on IM, but she says she cant do this because of slow internet speed at her home? references have been made that suggest she corresponds from her home, (just returned from the gym and had a bath). Which begs the question, why is her ip masked and the bat! in use? (as sculpto discovered on my behalf) If it wasnt for this i wouldnt be particularly suspicious, natural photos and is responding specifically to e-mails.
I will try and get her to an IC and on skype, as suggested.
thanks all, I/O, your comments have been noted!

[Shadow]

Bingo, having read the topic so far you have gotten some good advice.
The first thing you should know is that because of scammers many EU dating sites do block Russian IP's. Which makes it normal for RW to use a proxy and thus get an IP in London. Do not think that RW do not have the knowledge to find proxies, they are faster and smarter as Western men who have the luxury of being able to access the whole world.
Regarding The Bat!, it is the second most popular mail program after Microsoft Outlook. Which makes that it is being used by a lot of people, including many scammers.
While meeting in a neutral place would not be something most women would say 'no' to, being invited to stay in a man's private apartment certainly might be 'to soon' for a sincere woman after just a couple of mails. It is hardly neutral terrain for you.

Without going the MI5 route, there are some simple things you can do to see if she is really answering your questions, or that the letter is just so generic that it 'hits' answers.
Find information on her home town (Omsk) and see if there is some interesting news or something equal in her city. Ask her a specific question about it.
Then look at the reply. If the reply is there, but seems written in a different style as the rest of the letter, or if it is just 'overlooked', then forget about her.

Also suggest that you might visit Omsk instead of meeting her in Turkey, and see what the reaction is.

You have some flags waving, so do not get lost on the pictures and letters. Work towards a fast meeting, and do not invest a lot of emotions in her until you meet face to face.

[bingolingo]

Bingo, having read the topic so far you have gotten some good advice.
The first thing you should know is that because of scammers many EU dating sites do block Russian IP's. Which makes it normal for RW to use a proxy and thus get an IP in London. Do not think that RW do not have the knowledge to find proxies, they are faster and smarter as Western men who have the luxury of being able to access the whole world.
Regarding The Bat!, it is the second most popular mail program after Microsoft Outlook. Which makes that it is being used by a lot of people, including many scammers.

thanks shadow, now this puts things into a better perspective. It had occured to me that a proxy server and uk e-mail addy would have been neccessary for her to list a profile on this particular site. And that if she were a little more nousy than your average, she would have invested the time to go straight to a UK site, rather than get lost in a million other profiles on a RW site, and if she doesnt need a translator, why would she?

While meeting in a neutral place would not be something most women would say 'no' to, being invited to stay in a man's private apartment certainly might be 'to soon' for a sincere woman after just a couple of mails. It is hardly neutral terrain for you.

Point taken. It wasnt something I have suggested yet and was just bouncing the idea. geographically it would seem to make sense, but i wasnt planning on suggesting it until things have developed a little further,(if she turns out to be real!)

Without going the MI5 route, there are some simple things you can do to see if she is really answering your questions, or that the letter is just so generic that it 'hits' answers.

When listing golf as one of my hobbies, I asked if she had ever played, and got a response that she hadnt, she also elaborated that there were 'no such places where it is possible to play golf' No, of course there arent! but the question had served its purpose!

Find information on her home town (Omsk) and see if there is some interesting news or something equal in her city. Ask her a specific question about it.
Then look at the reply. If the reply is there, but seems written in a different style as the rest of the letter, or if it is just 'overlooked', then forget about her.

OK, I'll try that, Update soon with the responses!

Also suggest that you might visit Omsk instead of meeting her in Turkey, and see what the reaction is.

You have some flags waving, so do not get lost on the pictures and letters. Work towards a fast meeting, and do not invest a lot of emotions in her until you meet face to face.

Meeting up has only been touched on, something like 'maybe we could meet each other someday', she reponded in her next letter that she thought it was too soon to think about meeting? I/O thinks this is highly suspicious, but I have no experience of the behaviour of RW; I would expect to exchange a fair few e-mails with an English girl, and talk on the phone a few times before planing to meet?

Thanks again for all this great advice folks!

[Faux Pas]

Bingo

BAT! is a fairly common email client in the FSU. Yes it is used for multiple mailings by many different companies for many different reasons. It is the client of choice for many scam operators and also other work from home applications. It is also free if lifted from work and available to many who wish to put a copy on their home computer. The BAT alone wouldn't mean diddly. Nor would a proxy server mean anything even if coupled with BAT. It would be need for caution but, not point any fingers. It would seem you just don't have enough information to form any conclusion at this juncture. The two together usually doesn't end in good result but is not the end all.

You said you have her phone number. Have you called her? When I first starting communication with my fiancee, she had dial up internet connection at home on a PC that was running Windows95.  Her modem was a 14 kps. It was unreliable as a computer but most chat software wasn't compatible with the outdated Windows95. Her computer situation along with the dial up and antiquated phone system in Siberia made her set up good for nothing but email and it was questionable.

Nobody can give you an honest answer as to this lady's intentions and if you are content with the flow of communication stick with it a while longer before looking for an absolute verdict, one way or the other. I never put to much stock into the "technical investigations" that many seem to fly in and out of the forum with. There are many many different reasons why different people communicate on different softwares and at best only leaves it very inconclusive.

[I/O]

Bingo: I'm married to an Omsk lady (As are a few others around here). I've spent a bit of time there. Am in constant touch with people there. Will be back there in less than 3 weeks. We have regular visitors from there. All the girls who have visited have been happy to go on a date with a total unknown in a second. To them, dating is not putting out on the first night, it is simply a date. They are highly social creatures and will go out every night of the week given a chance. Slow internet, urgh!! I don't know one who isn't on high speed (Usually prepaid), Skype, Facebook, every IM known to man and then some along with a host of Russian social sites. Omsk is no run down Siberian city. It is a fairly vibrant place with all the modcons.

From the UK, you are 6 hours or less flying time plus connections to Omsk. I can't fathom why you'd contemplate meeting in another country when direct access is so simple. If you are detirmined (IMO you're wasting time and emotions) to run all the checks and balances, ask how many bridges across the Irtysh, ask about the relatively recent reconstruction of the main church (Look for detailed knowledge because they all know about it), ask about the relatively new hockey stadium....................You have the perfect cover when asked why. "Oh Serg darling, I'm interested to learn all about you and your city."

I'd be recasting the net if I were you..................There is plenty of real Tittyanas out there, no BS attached, even in Omsk.

I/O

[bingolingo]

HaHa! I/O, Sculpto give yourselves a big pat on the back!                                                                          Letter(s) from Anastasia Mirgarodskaja to Alex (UK)


Letter 1.

Hello Alex. How are you today? It's good to hear from you! I'm Anastasiya but my friends call me Nansy! I'm from Russia, i live at city Novocheboksarsk. I'm sorry that I have not told to you earlier about it. i registered my profile on dating site as a citizen UK, i had problem at registration as the citizen of Russia. I came casual to dating site by spam message in my email inbox, to me was interesting to try new experience of dialogue with men. I hope that you forgive me. I did not want to deceive you and I speak you the truth from the beginning. I can speak English and I hope that you understand my words. I would like to practise more my English and I hope that you can help me. I'm 26 y.o. i have not been married and have no kids. I live with my Family. I have work the seller of sportswear and footwear. i like my work! I have a hobby - play sports: tennis, skating and ski during winter time. We have no ski resorts here and I like to go on a ski through a winter wood. here very beautiful in winter and all trees in snow! I like to waste time on fresh air. I like jogging in the park with girlfriends in summer. I try to behave in the good form, on it I eat the healthy foodstuffs. Now I have no relations with man. I think my life here good. But I have no my soulmate and it make me sad. My last relations came to end one year ago. Our relations came to end, because we wanted different things in a life. I'm not so successful with men. I have decided to use I-net to meet the man. i think here possible firstly to speak, find out more about each other and to see how we approach each other. It is new experience for me. I send my pic to you. I hope that you like it. It would be interesting to me to see your photo also. i would like to hear more about you? I look forward to hear from you! Your new friend Nansy.

I have just found this on stop scammers.com, almost identical to the letters I recieved from 'her'!
As you can see it has moved from Novocheboksarsk to Omsk since it was corresponding with Alex!
As I read on, its parents still have the same jobs, but curiously their names have changed!
The money letters come in at 12-14.

thanks to all who helped!

[Sculpto]

Bingo.. its a pity you had to go through this and wasted your time corresponding with a ghost.

However.. there can be a silver lining.

I believe there are numerous guys here that got interested in FSUW after surviving a scam attempt.  So, if you are not too turned off by the whole thing consider giving it a try using legit sources. 

To my detractors... my scamdar (scam radar) has become highly attuned after my escapades in Kherson.  I think I have read every site, every forum, tons of scam letters and have researched the technology to a sufficient extent to be able to identify with a reasonable amount of accuracy when something doesn't smell right.  You might not agree with my politics or lifestyle but... flushing out scammers is a whole different ball of wax.

[Faux Pas]

Bingo.. its a pity you had to go through this and wasted your time corresponding with a ghost.

However.. there can be a silver lining.

I believe there are numerous guys here that got interested in FSUW after surviving a scam attempt.  So, if you are not too turned off by the whole thing consider giving it a try using legit sources. 

To my detractors... my scamdar (scam radar) has become highly attuned after my escapades in Kherson.  I think I have read every site, every forum, tons of scam letters and have researched the technology to a sufficient extent to be able to identify with a reasonable amount of accuracy when something doesn't smell right.  You might not agree with my politics or lifestyle but... flushing out scammers is a whole different ball of wax.

You called it but, I'll stop short of proclaiming you King Scamdar. You understand theres always a 50% chance you're right?  :evil:

[Sculpto]

Faux.. kiss this ----------------------> 


 

[bingolingo]

Bingo.. its a pity you had to go through this and wasted your time corresponding with a ghost.

However.. there can be a silver lining.

I believe there are numerous guys here that got interested in FSUW after surviving a scam attempt.  So, if you are not too turned off by the whole thing consider giving it a try using legit sources. 

I'm pretty philosophical to be honest, its cost me a few minutes a time to send a few e-mails, and an evening chatting to you guys where i've learnt a great deal.
Shame because the girl in the photos was truly gorgeous, I wonder who she is? she might like me!
The investigation trail has opened my eyes to some incredible looking women though, can you recommend any legit sources?

Just one more thing, should I be at all concerned that I have sent pictures, disclosed my mobile number, and that my e-mail contains my full name?

[Sculpto]

I'm pretty philosophical to be honest, its cost me a few minutes a time to send a few e-mails, and an evening chatting to you guys where i've learnt a great deal.
Shame because the girl in the photos was truly gorgeous, I wonder who she is? she might like me!
The investigation trail has opened my eyes to some incredible looking women though, can you recommend any legit sources?

Just one more thing, should I be at all concerned that I have sent pictures, disclosed my mobile number, and that my e-mail contains my full name?

There is an ongoing debate regarding the best method for finding legit ladies.  After a bad run with agency sites I stopped using them and had good success using yahoo, icq, russian language free dating sites and social networks.  I met my fiance on yahoo.  Some guys have had good success using Elenas Models.  There are some other legit agencies that others can advise on.

I don't think you have anything to worry about in regards to having given your photos, name and number.  Just don't piss of the scammer.  End the correspondence with a good excuse like ou met someone or something of the sort.  Whatever you do DO NOT let them know you discovered the scam.  That can result in problems as small as them flooding your email with why they aren't scammers to getting added to some nefarious email lists that can result in every scammer from nigeria to shanghai having your email. 

[Shadow]

I'm pretty philosophical to be honest, its cost me a few minutes a time to send a few e-mails, and an evening chatting to you guys where i've learnt a great deal.
Shame because the girl in the photos was truly gorgeous, I wonder who she is? she might like me!
The investigation trail has opened my eyes to some incredible looking women though, can you recommend any legit sources?

Just one more thing, should I be at all concerned that I have sent pictures, disclosed my mobile number, and that my e-mail contains my full name?

As recent events show, you can never be sure that something which seems fishy is a scam. But mostly it reveals itself in short time.
Be happy that you have been given an eye opener in to a new world of dating. Girls like the one in the picture are out there, and some of them might want to date you.
And contrary to your experience, there are a lot of sincere women who would leave you no doubt of their intentions.

I found MrsShadow on http://www.merrydating.com though not sure how there are operating at this time.

[I/O]

Bingo: The wording is so clearly as I've seen about 7000 times before. Put your name up on any introduction site and you'll receive a wedge of those. Anyways, the real problem is you have now been "bitten" by curiosity and will now embark on a long and interesting battle avoiding scams and finding the real deal. You will, I assure you, follow this path, they all do, perhaps the scams win in the end?

I'm not here to tell you all about it because like everyone else, I don't know, in fact I don't have much of a clue altogether. Nevertheless, there is a few simple things I do understand and there is a few things to look out for.

1) The first thing IMO to get very clear is that looking for a reliable source is a waste of time. Hence the ongoing, unsolvable debate about the best sources. Certainly, some sites etc are better than others, but the trap is you are hoping the site will be fine and you can take the soft approach. As long as you are involved in this caper, every morning, sit on a hot knife, it will wake you up and sharpen your senses to risk. You need to be alert all the way until you have been east a couple of times and then you'll start to spot things from miles away. Bottom line, it's up to you to be aware.

2) No PC, no internet, no money, bla bla is all BS, even the poorest of girls I met and I did meet one very poor (although very attractive) girl, would never admit or even hint at their economic issues until or if there was a bite for money coming. The one you want simply wont "go there".

3) Russian women are highly social and for the most part, skilled daters. They will genrally spot a loser a mile away so make sure you are on your metal.

4) Russia is NOT overflowing with excess women kicking the border gates down to escape west. There is an abundance of nice women with a somewhat different view of life than "some" western women. Their approach to life is quite refreshing once you come to understand it somewhat.

5) Russian women are not (generally speaking) stay at home, look a million dollars, bow to your every whim and fancy, baby makers who will run after you because you have a foreign passport. They are TOUGH to the very core, tough in ways I have come to very much admire but if you happen to be a pushover, you will be pushed over every step of the way.

6) There is no good men in Russia is complete and utter BS, if you see that you have a scammer or loser on your hands. IMO, my wife sums it up very well when she says (words to the effect), there is plenty of good men in Russia but due to certain social issues such as alcohol and historical opportunity, the numbers of available good men doesn't give a woman who sets her sights a bit higher quite the same opportunity to pick and choose as she has when she sets her target range to include the opportunity to find a life partner further than simply Russia. Wouldn't you say the same about your opportunities in the UK, yes I can but maybe there is more if I look afield?

7) You, as a foreigner are NOT a highly sought after creature for Russian women. They will scope you into their thinking in the same way as they will scope other opportunities but you are at a disadvantage over a local because she will have to turn her life upside down to marry you, therefore, at the end of the day, you'll have to offer much more (I'm not speaking financially here, although that can be an issue to some extent) than she can see in her local dates.

8.) You'll need a little "coin" to pull this off. It is not a poor man's hobby. Likewise, it is not beginner level dating.

9) Despite all the crap I read about Muscovites vs Sumburgers, I haven't generally speaking found a dime of difference between women from the bigger cities vs the provincial cities when it is all boiled down. In some cases the bigger city women may be a little more choosy because they have had some more opportunities but I don't count that as a negative because a good wife is a "Hard Won" creature and I never minded having to "Go Hard" for what I wanted.

10) "Lurve don't come easy". No decent Russian woman will be falling in love with you after a handful of letters. They are tough nuts to crack but once you do, the experience is different. 18 Y/O Russian girls don't "Put out" for 50 Y/O guys unless there is a payment plan, either overt or covert.

Lot's off waffle there but I hope you do take something on board and do some general reading around. My personal advice to you, if you are seriously interested or even trying to decide on that is this. Pick out 7 Russian cities which might include perhaps Moscow, St Pete, Yekaterinburg, Ufa, Omsk, Novosibirsk, Irkutsk, Kursk, Sochi, there is a host of others but they are few that spring to mind quickly. Get a visa and plan a short trip to visit maybe 2 cities, one of the majors and one of the provincials. Line up a lady to meet or an agency to introduce you to a few women, don't be afraid (if using an agency) to take a different one to dinner each night, doing it privately is another matter IMO but doing so from an agency platform it is a given as they are probably doing the same thing. Doesn't mean you need to be breaking your neck to get in their pants, it's a dinner date and a learning experience for both with no strings attached. Repeating what I've said up thread, Russian women WILL meet and go out in a heartbeat, you simply need to ask, it isn't rocket science. Once you talk to a Russian woman for an hour, you'll spot the BS in letters and letter styles in a second. I would suggest, particularly as it is so close for you, this was done a couple of times over 3 to 6 months, you'll be amazed what you trip over along the way. DO NOT launch "Project Getawife".

All the best, it can be a ton of fun, real long term fun that is.

I/O

[Sculpto]

Brilliant post I/O

[bingolingo]

Brilliant post I/O

Yes, and thanks for taking the time to write such a hugely informative piece, dispelled a great many myths.
This has whetted my appetite for some further investigation and I love a challenge, so I'm going to have a dig around and see what I can find.
For the record I'm only 33, so in no desperate hurry to 'seal a deal', but I'm sure I can have some fun with this as you suggest.
sure I'll be checking back with plenty more questions soon!
thanks again.

[mies]

Register on a Russian site as if you are a Russian man? and see what kind of women you meet. Most likely scammers won't get attracted to you, and you can disclose your nationality in 3rd or 4th message. Also if woman will start conversation with you while you are "russian" - you can be sure she's interested in you and not in your nationality.

As for Bat - it was an official system used by my ex-employer in Ukraine - a huge company of 9'000 employees. The company was not related to scamming business. at all.  

A few suggestions to Lingo:
if you want to ask for address - ask for it directly. Tell her you want to send her a postcard and do send her a postcard.
if you get her number - call her right away. No harm in it and why waiting?
The more you try to "walk in circles" around the issue of your concern - the more obvious and unpleasant it will be for a normal/honest woman.
I would not go as far as calling and msn-ing same time. You can always use skype or msn video-call. If a guy tried to call me while i'm talking to him on skype video - I would most likely think he's a nutcase. More than I am. I do video-skype my husband sometimes when he's sitting 40" from me, or chat with him - sending him XXX. Or talk to him by phone standing just 2 feet away and facing each other which often confuses people around. But that's different story. This is fun. Checking somebody's legitimacy in weird ways is no fun.

[Faux Pas]

Register on a Russian site as if you are a Russian man? and see what kind of women you meet. Most likely scammers won't get attracted to you, and you can disclose your nationality in 3rd or 4th message. Also if woman will start conversation with you while you are "russian" - you can be sure she's interested in you and not in your nationality.

Very difficult for those of us whom don't know the language, and pull it off

As for Bat - it was an official system used by my ex-employer in Ukraine - a huge company of 9'000 employees. The company was not related to scamming business. at all.  

A few suggestions to Lingo:
if you want to ask for address - ask for it directly. Tell her you want to send her a postcard and do send her a postcard.
if you get her number - call her right away. No harm in it and why waiting?
The more you try to "walk in circles" around the issue of your concern - the more obvious and unpleasant it will be for a normal/honest woman.

Good stuff and right from the source.

[mies]

Copy an intro phrase from the ad of a russian man. Insert your age. keep it short :-) Choose a location like Moscow. Or some other city.
See what will woman write to you. (use a translator to read her message). For the second letter - also may copy from internet.
In the third one - write that you are in fact a foreigner.


even not doing it seriously - you can use it as a reality check. See whether there is difference in what/how many women write to you when you present yourself as a foreigner vs. russian man 

[Sculpto]

Mies..

When Russian women do that it frustrates me and usually disqualifies them.  I have seen it on the free sites.. some change their locations all the time.  I would search San Francisco.. think I was communicating with someone who is actually here only to discover they are in fact in Ekaterinaburg or Krasnoyarsk.  Very frustrating.. I can see the value in a guy doing it just to see the difference in communication styles between a real woman and a terp of an agency.. but otherwise its not honest.

Besides.. there are more than a few ladies who can and do speak English so why bother with the deception?

[mies]

Sculpto, work on your humor in addition to working on spying technologies and IP tracking.  

i am joking in 90% of the time when I am talking. Though I am serious when saying that it will save you from scammers and will show you whether 20yo younger hotties are interested in your personality and physic, or they are interested in your passport.
Plus, how comes all those multiple "checking" techniques aren't considered lie (while they are in fact a deception), and composing profile in russian is a lie?

You can make an experiment even more interesting - post 4 profiles:
1) foreigner living abroad
2) foreigner living in Russia
3) Russian man living in Russia
4) Russian man living abroad.

Post same photos and identical introductions - first 2 in English, last 2 in Russian. Identical content.

[Sculpto]

Sculpto, work on your humor in addition to working on spying technologies and IP tracking.  

i am joking in 90% of the time when I am talking. Though I am serious when saying that it will save you from scammers and will show you whether 20yo younger hotties are interested in your personality and physic, or they are interested in your passport.
Plus, how comes all those multiple "checking" techniques aren't considered lie (while they are in fact a deception), and composing profile in russian is a lie?

Sorry Mies.. didn't get your humor.. and what is wrong with "trust but verify"?

[mies]

Sorry Sculpto, I have bad humor.

Profile in russian qualifies as "Trust but verify".
I am not sure you can verify a person. You can verify a scientific finding, a theory. A human? not so sure.


 

[Sculpto]

Sorry Sculpto, I have bad humor.

Profile in russian qualifies as "Trust but verify".
I am not sure you can verify a person. You can verify a scientific finding, a theory. A human? not so sure.

I dont know if that is totally true.. I have done a lot of searching on vkontakte and there are definitely some suspicious profiles there.. however.. I think the intent is for porn spamming more than scamming..

you can verify someone has consistent behavior and are who they say they are.. I mean there is no point in going to visit a ghost.. so if there are methods to verify someone you are writing is in fact the person writing back.. any man would be foolish not to use every tool available.. dont you think?  For that matter, I dont think the ladies should take anything for granted either..

[mies]

Most likely we just have different approaches with you.
You sound like you are verifying a supplier "I am going to spend my money on a trip so I want to be sure that the supplier/potential business partner a woman I am going to visit will provide me the services I am looking for is indeed the woman she is claiming to be".
I do not put too much responsibility on other people in case of friendship/dating/etc. If I am going for a trip - I am doing it for myself, if one person appear to be wrong/does not exist - i can easily find other people around, or find the ways to enjoy myself. I do not see it as "I am paying money so you owe me something" - this isn't the right approach Sculpto. Other people don't owe you anything, you want to find a wife, you take a risk and risking your money. It's not a problem of the woman that you need a wife and you decided to risk your money. So from a woman's point of view - you have no right to be checking/verifying her in any way. This isn't business. Now, since I know you come from a USA, I am not surprised you have this business-like approach to marriage/dating. I am surprised that you use business approach on your side, but you want to find a woman who isn't using a business approach on her side - you want a woman to love you, and not view you as an opportunity to get funding and Greencard. 

[Sculpto]

Most likely we just have different approaches with you.
You sound like you are verifying a supplier "I am going to spend my money on a trip so I want to be sure that the supplier/potential business partner a woman I am going to visit will provide me the services I am looking for is indeed the woman she is claiming to be".
I do not put too much responsibility on other people in case of friendship/dating/etc. If I am going for a trip - I am doing it for myself, if one person appear to be wrong/does not exist - i can easily find other people around, or find the ways to enjoy myself. I do not see it as "I am paying money so you owe me something" - this isn't the right approach Sculpto. Other people don't owe you anything, you want to find a wife, you take a risk and risking your money. It's not a problem of the woman that you need a wife and you decided to risk your money. So from a woman's point of view - you have no right to be checking/verifying her in any way. This isn't business. Now, since I know you come from a USA, I am not surprised you have this business-like approach to marriage/dating. I am surprised that you use business approach on your side, but you want to find a woman who isn't using a business approach on her side - you want a woman to love you, and not view you as an opportunity to get funding and Greencard. 

Mies I think you are really misunderstanding me and the approach I took.  My first trip I just went and spent an awesome month in Donetsk.  Coincidentaly on that trip I met a nice woman with whom there was possibility of a future.  However, she worked on cruise ships and got an opportunity to work a Miami-Rio route and was out of touch for 9 months.  By the time I got back in touch with her my heart had changed and I had already started trying agencies. 

I struck out three times with agencies.  One with the infamous CC, once with Natashaclub and the worst was through HRB which I have already written about extensively.  In all those scenarios I just went with the flow and not until it was too late did I realize I had wasted my time, money and most importantly hopes and emotions.

During that entire time I was constantly getting unsolicited scam attempt letters.  If I remember correctly I must have dealt with no less than fifty scam attempts.  Some were obvious from the start, but, others were far more sophisticated and did involve telephone calls and even a web cam chat or two.  I don't know how they found me but a rather smart lady scammer, who may or may not have been part of a larger group, persistently tried and failed. 

I was at the point of just giving up and had a very bad taste in my mouth regarding the FSU and the entire idea of marrying someone from there.  Then, very much right out of the vapor I happened across my now fiance.  At first I didn't even realize she was Russian, and then, once she told me it was a couple of months before I realized she didn't really speak English and was using translation software.  Against the advice I have heard here many times regarding how much time between contact and visit I made her wait about 14 months total before I finally went to see her.  I could have gone earlier, but, I wanted to have a high level of trust that she was really the person she portrayed herself as before I got on another plane, and, let my heart open to her.  She earned my trust and I went to see her.  What I found was a very real woman with a very interesting and complicated life and psychology and she caught my heart.  She has since challenged my love on more than one occasion as I have finally understood it has taken her even longer to extend her trust to me and open her heart to me than it did for me to do for her.  But, now that we seem to be on stable ground its going really well, though, I still worry too much.

Most men are not making these trips for cultural reasons.  While Russia is an interesting country, if not first for my ancestral curiosity I never would have gone.  I don't mean to offend but there are a lot of places in the world that are much more interesting to me, plus, I hate cold weather.  So, when speaking about the processes men use to find a match I think there is a distinct difference between being business like in certain parts of the process and the actual feelings someone will discover when they do actually find the right woman.  I also believe there is a distinct difference between being methodical and objective in process and going on a shopping trip.  The difference is in what the real motivations of a man are.  Not many will ever admit it, but, a lot of men want the arm candy.. they want people to eye them with envy as they walk down the street with a much younger and very beautiful wife on their arm.  They want the trophy wife and they really don't care about feelings.  I think my posts clearly indicate that I am all about the feelings I have for my women and the feelings she has for me.  I made it to 45 years old without getting married because of one simple reason.. I never felt anyone deeply enough to marry them.  Probably that was something in me.. and maybe whatever that was has changed and I might have found what I was looking for much closer to home, but, being the demanding and often difficult person I am, I sought out, found, wooed and fell in mutual love with someone who understands me and has the same kinds of complexities which probably no one else would ever find attractive but I find to be something I can not live without. 

So, as I said in the first paragraph.. I think you have misunderstood me.  I advise men to be methodical and objective during the searching part.  Once they have found someone that meets their fundamental criteria they need to open their hearts completely and do everything possible to woo the lady and give her the emotional security she needs to be able to make the giant life changes we are asking them to do.  Men who go on shopping trips for trophy wives and men who go on multiple trips bedding down women who may be somewhat desperate are a totally different category of visitors and I think you already know how I fel about such men.