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Author Topic: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?  (Read 90837 times)

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Offline ECOCKS

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #225 on: August 11, 2009, 06:32:59 PM »
Between stories like GQ's, which is pretty much standard around the country, most people have workable insurance with solid doctors and hospitals. For the remainder, there are systems in place to take care of them when needed.

So, IMO, our system isn't broke.

There are a great many more things that need fixing before they get around to the healthcare system.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 06:34:59 PM by ECOCKS »
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Offline OlgaH

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #226 on: August 11, 2009, 07:09:49 PM »
If 5% of our citizens need insurance, then by gawd provide it. But to overhaul an entire well-functioning system because of the needs of the 5% of the citizenry is absolutely asinine. The other 5% of that ten percent is made up of the elite and illegal aliens.

Several studies estimate the number of uninsured Americans. According to the U.S. Census Bureau, nearly 46 million Americans, or 18 percent of the population under the age of 65, were without health insurance in 2007, their latest data available.1
• The Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality, using the Medical Expenditure Panel Survey (MEPS) estimated that the percentage of uninsured Americans under age 65 represented 27 percent of the population. According to the MEPS data, nearly 54 million Americans under the age of 65 were uninsured in the first-half of 2007. 2
• A recent study shows that based on the effects of the recession alone (not job loss), it is projected that nearly seven (7) million Americans will lose their health insurance coverage between 2008 and 2010. 3 Urban Institute researchers estimate that if unemployment reaches 10 percent, another six (6) million Americans will lose their health insurance coverage. Taking these numbers together, it is conceivable that by next year, 57 to 60 million Americans will be uninsured.
• The Urban Institute estimates that under a worse case scenario, 66 million Americans will be uninsured by 2019. 4
• Nearly 90 million people – about one-third of the population below the age of 65 spent a portion of either 2007 or 2008 without health coverage.

The large majority of the uninsured (85 percent) are native or naturalized citizens.6
http://www.nchc.org/documents/Kellogg%20General%20Coverage%20Fact%20Sheet%2008-11-2009.pdf

Offline ECOCKS

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #227 on: August 11, 2009, 07:34:26 PM »
Sort of ironic that everyone keeps saying, "but they're not insured!" when trying to make this point.

In fact, as the sign at the clinic down the street indicates, they get their healthcare or could get it if needed, from the variety of public systems in place. That's one thing that makes some states better places to live than others. There are public hospitals everywhere which provide both emergency and routine care. Dozens of Federal programs, like WICS, ADC, Medicare, Medicaid and others supplement the local systems as well.

Certainly they should cleanup those dozens of systems and get the freeloaders, double-dippers and fraudsters eliminated, but instead, like most bureaucrats, they decide to simply establish still another monolithic agency which will intrude in our lives and become as bloated and screwed up as the others.

It is becoming more clear that the citizens are reaching their point of tolerance with increasing government intervention. As stupid as the concept of spending our way out of bankruptcy was, at least it was a concrete problem which the masses can identify with. Healthcare reform is a classic case of a solution desperately seeking a problem and people are balking at the lack of planning and the enormous pricetag of this project.
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Offline OlgaH

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #228 on: August 11, 2009, 07:48:38 PM »

Quote:

The UK spends less per head on healthcare but has a higher life expectancy than the US. The World Health Organisation ranks Britain's healthcare as 18th in the world, while the US is in 37th place.
 



http://www.who.int/en/

                      Life expectancy at birth (years)              Healthy life expectancy (HALE) at birth (years)
                                   (both sexes)                                            (both sexes)

Sweden                            81                                                           74
United Kingdom                  80                                                           72
United States of America     78                                                           70


                   Age-standardized mortality rates by cause (per 100 000 population)

                                 Cardiovascular                Cancer                  Injuries
                               
Sweden                          171                              115                        32           
United Kingdom                175                              147                        26             
United States of America   179                              133                        50
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 07:58:04 PM by OlgaH »

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #229 on: August 11, 2009, 07:52:04 PM »
Several studies estimate <snip>

 :D OlgaH, sorry but I did not drink the koolaid.

Quote
Life expectancy at birth

Impressive. How did Russia fare in that study? This  study was done in 2008. Russia is just above Botswana I believe. Then, at the very bottom of the page, there's a tiny little qualifier that reads:

European Union   77.32 years 
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 08:09:25 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline OlgaH

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #230 on: August 11, 2009, 08:07:39 PM »
Cheesy OlgaH, sorry but I did not drink the koolaid.

yeah,  especially with ice it is too costly to treat quinsy  ;D


Impressive. How did Russia fare in that study?


I guess you know  :) but I'm still alive  :D
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 08:10:57 PM by OlgaH »

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #231 on: August 11, 2009, 08:10:17 PM »
I guess you know  :) but I'm still alive  :D

Welcome to USA!
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline OlgaH

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #232 on: August 11, 2009, 08:13:33 PM »
Welcome to USA!

I keep my fingers crossed to continue survive and stay healthy especially after last medical bill that Robert received in spite of his health insurance  ;D
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 08:17:45 PM by OlgaH »

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #233 on: August 11, 2009, 08:22:31 PM »
I keep my fingers crossed to continue survive and stay healthy especially after last medical bill that Robert received in spite of his health insurance  ;D

I don't know what Ins. Co. he's got but if it's beyond what my coverage is, maybe time to consider supplemental? As for you, being in Mr. OlgaH's care, you have so many more years ahead of you... ;D
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline OlgaH

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #234 on: August 11, 2009, 08:48:10 PM »
I don't know what Ins. Co. he's got but if it's beyond what my coverage is, maybe time to consider supplemental?

Oh no no. His insurance is enough.   Why you should to fatten a turkey for slaughter if it is not for your Thanksgiving Day plate  ;D More over he doesn't visit doctors to often (knocking on wood). But you know... they try to milk you using every possible way. "Oh sorry  this procedure are not included into insurance package ".  I'm surprised they don't charge for a piece of cotton in clinic, though...   ::)  at least they don't put it openly into bill  ;D

As for you, being in Mr. OlgaH's care, you have so many more years ahead of you... ;D

I try to do my best. But philosophically  it is a pity to die being healthy even in your 80s  :D
« Last Edit: August 11, 2009, 09:08:57 PM by OlgaH »

Offline kievstar

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #235 on: August 12, 2009, 12:00:12 AM »
On the Europe news this morning they were talking about how in one country they had 6 million missed appointments for old people in one year which costs the system about 500 million Euros.  I wonder what is going to happen under the Obama plan with missed appointments?  Currently most doctors charge you now which makes sense if last minute cancellation.

Offline Blues Fairy

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #236 on: August 12, 2009, 08:27:12 AM »
                     Life expectancy at birth (years)              
Sweden                            81                                                           74

The Swedes historically have very good genes. :)  They smoke like chimneys and let their kids run in sandals in winter and nothing happens to them.

Offline OlgaH

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #237 on: August 12, 2009, 02:27:58 PM »
Coffee, various teas and hot chocolate are available FREE at a self-serve bar in the waiting room.


Only cheese in mousetrap is free  ;)

The cost of available "FREE" coffee, various teas and hot chocolate in the waiting room is already  included in price you pay for medical services  :)

Offline ECOCKS

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #238 on: August 12, 2009, 03:04:02 PM »
Only cheese in mousetrap is free  ;)

The cost of available "FREE" coffee, various teas and hot chocolate in the waiting room is already  included in price you pay for medical services  :)

Milton Freidman would be proud of you.

Just for you (and thinking of MIlton), I went down there again today and had a coffee, WITHOUT PAYING!

Muwahahahahaha!

Next time, I will use their toilet and get some kleenex to blow my nose!

That will teach them!
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Offline OlgaH

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #239 on: August 12, 2009, 03:23:57 PM »
Milton Freidman would be proud of you.

Just for you (and thinking of MIlton), I went down there again today and had a coffee, WITHOUT PAYING!

Muwahahahahaha!

Next time, I will use their toilet and get some kleenex to blow my nose!

That will teach them!

For coffee that you had for free today the next patient  will pay even if he will not have one  ;)

Where do you think they get money from for coffee, for flyers, for napkins and for all other freebies for you?  ;D  
« Last Edit: August 12, 2009, 03:28:51 PM by OlgaH »

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #240 on: August 12, 2009, 03:54:23 PM »
For coffee that you had for free today the next patient  will pay even if he will not have one  ;)

Where do you think they get money from for coffee, for flyers, for napkins and for all other freebies for you?  ;D  

Olga
Yes the cost of daily coffee and donuts is being passed on to the consumers of the clinic. Everyone will pay for them rather they partake or not. They are offered as a courtesy and to help alleviate the wait. Do you suppose if they quit offering coffee and donuts they would also reduce the price of a Doctor visit? I don't.  :D

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #241 on: August 12, 2009, 03:56:42 PM »
Where do you think they get money from for coffee, for flyers, for napkins and for all other freebies for you?  

OlgaH, must be a slow day, eh?

Anyway, let me try and answer your Q. I presume from their Accounts Payable, who in turn get it from their accounts receivable, who in turn gets it from various entities such as insurance companies, patients, etc...as payments for services rendered.

It was once called 'Capitalism'. Your provide services, goods, trades, etc... in exchange for payments mostly in the form of currency and notes. You're not only able to meet your cost in those provisions but hopefully also make profits from it.

We used to have this in USA, then too many lazy people started to complain and wonder why they don't have as much money as those people who made the effort despite receiving monies, subsidize housing, free education, free medical care, food stamps, etc.. from the government. So now the government of the new USA is deciding to take monies from those folks, under the notion it is for their own good, and giving more monies to the likes of Peggy Joseph so she doesn't have to put gas in her car and pay her mortgage. From what I understand, there's even a program now where those who didn't pay for taxes will somehow get tax rebates. How cool is that?

It is said to be the 'Wright' thing to do.

So now the US is trying to adopt a very successful system called socialism. For example of successful accomplishments, you may look on the system of USSR, North Korea, Vietnam, Cuba, and most importantly China, outside of the free trade zone that's actually praticing that ugly system known as capitalism of course.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2009, 04:07:30 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Sculpto

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #242 on: August 12, 2009, 04:14:43 PM »
GQ.. nice try.

Ultimately unfettered capitalism results in monopoly and corporatism which is the antithesis of capitalism.  There is no way around it.  As long as we are talking about Mexico in the other thread. take a look at Carlos Slim.  He is one of the megaoligarchs of the world.  IN Mexico, almost nothing is bought or sold that he doesn't get a piece of.  Why should one person have so much power?  By the same token, why should insurance companies in this country have so much power?

In the distaste for government involvement in health care you guys blatantly overlook and ignore the fact that health insurance is a gigantic cash cow.  It might not have a giant margin, but, it has an enormous efficiency of scale.  Make a dollar from every American and you just made 300+ million.  Why do you think a corporate executive motivated by profit is a better person to decide what health care you are entitled to?

Everyone is supposed to be guaranteed the right to pursue happiness.  Isn't good health therefore a basic guarantee as without good health it would be impossible to pursue happiness?  And if so, despite the aversion all of us have for bloated government, does it not stand to reason that a government system based not on profit but on providing a fundamental and basic service might in fact end up being a better provider than the corporatist CEO making 300+ million from "your" lack of getting sick?

Really they are just gambling on us not being sick.  They pay out only reluctantly and with how many disclaimers and subjective clauses?  Its a broken system that adds additional penalties to the poor.

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #243 on: August 12, 2009, 04:36:24 PM »
Sculpto-

So let me get this straight, you're masking your jealousy (hate, envy, or whatever else you'd like to call it) for people making millions to slide over to people who have an appetite for entitlements as somehow the balance we need? Are you kidding me?

All things being relative, exactly how much of life's worth have you freely given up for the greater good of mankind? I am willing to bet ~ hardly at best but more likely 'none'.

Unfettered capitalism is scorned only by those who didn't, couldn't for whatever reason they could not.

Let me ask you another question, if a complete stranger broke into your home, kick his feet up in the air and demanded full entitlement of everything in your household, would you be willing to submit to it? I am willing to bet I know the answer to that question.

People need to start to take pride in themselves and strive to make something out of it instead of idly screaming injustice at every which turn because of their own ineptitude.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2009, 04:45:32 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline JR

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #244 on: August 12, 2009, 04:47:43 PM »
Here's a question for you: How many jobs does a welfare recipient create?

Answer is: NONE!

Oh wait, that's not true. It takes a whole bunch of bureaucrats to get that check to him so he can do nothing.

Well there goes my whole damn theory!!!!
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Offline Sculpto

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #245 on: August 12, 2009, 05:09:21 PM »
Sculpto-

So let me get this straight, you're masking your jealousy (hate, envy, or whatever else you'd like to call it) for people making millions to slide over to people who have an appetite for entitlements as somehow the balance we need? Are you kidding me?

All things being relative, exactly how much of life's worth have you freely given up for the greater good of mankind? I am willing to bet ~ hardly at best but more likely 'none'.

Unfettered capitalism is scorned only by those who didn't, couldn't for whatever reason they could not.

Let me ask you another question, if a complete stranger broke into your home, kick his feet up in the air and demanded full entitlement of everything in your household, would you be willing to submit to it? I am willing to bet I know the answer to that question.

People need to start to take pride in themselves and strive to make something out of it instead of idly screaming injustice at every which turn because of their own ineptitude.

No GQ.. I understand you haven't read my threads so you aren't aware of my history.. but I come from a wealthy family and region.  I grew up around people whose families often had incredible wealth.  Then my peers went off to college, joined certain fraternities at specific universities and thereby guaranteed themselves positions of power and influence far beyond their skill or ability.  I know how the game works and I find it to no less corrupt than the BS that has gone on in Russia the last few years.  In some ways it is even more insidious because it is all done with an air of legitimacy.  But, when transparency is requested, all of a sudden the doors come slamming shut.  Yeah, I know how the game works.  I spit on it.

I had a nice little fund when I graduated.  I didn't earn that money.  It was given to me as some sort of a birthright.  Every penny of it was given to found a school in Mexico.  When I arrived in SF in 1990 I had less than $100 in my pocket and 0 in the bank.  In the following 11 years I built a little empire, just to see if I could.  I was MISERABLE chasing big $ all the time and working in the homes of the richest people in SF as a trusted and respected artist/craftsman.  I commanded top dollar and was worth it.  (though I did learn later I could have charged even more and gotten away with it)  In 2001 I decided again to do what made me happy and screw the rat race.  I am a lot better off for it and my health and outlook has improved considerably.

Sorry, but, I don't see the top level of corporate America as being the people who created the wealth.  The Sergei Brins and Bill Gates and Steve Jobs of this world are few and far between and I do not begrudge those talented and brilliant people anything because they earned it.  But, the country club frat boy network is exactly the source of the problem in this country and the sooner those idiots are knocked off their high horse the sooner this country stands a chance at returning to its roots and providing real opportunity for people to better themselves and improve their situations.  Corporatism is anti capitalist because it is monopolistic in its aim.

I once witnessed the father of a friend feed his dogs filet mingon.  That same man espoused the same beliefs about the poor as many of you guys do.  Sorry, I see filth and greed and a desperate lack of humanity in such actions and I see the same in the corporate leadership that is bankrupting this country.  And, the worst offenders are the health insurance companies followed closely by the oil companies with the speculative investment banks in a photo finish for third.  

Offline OlgaH

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #246 on: August 12, 2009, 05:10:36 PM »
Olga
Yes the cost of daily coffee and donuts is being passed on to the consumers of the clinic. Everyone will pay for them rather they partake or not. They are offered as a courtesy and to help alleviate the wait. Do you suppose if they quit offering coffee and donuts they would also reduce the price of a Doctor visit? I don't.  :D

That exactly what I was saying about the cost  :) that the courtesy actually is not free.  ;)

Regarding reducing the price... $3 for coffee hidden in the $200 bill is not so much  :D

BTW here is a Russian website that offers 100% discount.  ;D
http://www.4komnati.ru/promotions/archive/8/

I remember the time in Russia when  the stores were flashing with red 100% discount advertisements and some part of population were so excited about it  :D
« Last Edit: August 12, 2009, 05:23:41 PM by OlgaH »

Offline GQBlues

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #247 on: August 12, 2009, 05:21:59 PM »
Every penny of it was given to found a school in Mexico.

The issue today in the US is having the government determine what they should do with YOU, YOUR LOT and appoint those to whom they feel they need to do so - NOT - where YOU think it should be so.

That little school in Mexico doesn't do anything for the Peggy Josephs. You are obviously not getting this.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2009, 08:29:47 PM by GQBlues »
Quote from: msmob
1. Because of 'man', global warming is causing desert and arid areas to suffer long, dry spell.
2. The 2018 Camp Fire and Woolsey California wildfires are forests burning because of global warming.
3. N95 mask will choke you dead after 30 min. of use.

Offline Sculpto

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #248 on: August 12, 2009, 05:27:21 PM »
The issue today in the US is having the government determine what they should do with YOU, YOUR LOT and appoint those to those to whom they feel they need to do so - NOT - where YOU think it should be so.

That little school in Mexico doesn't do anything for the Peggy Josephs. You aren't obviously getting this.

Might it be that individuals have shirked their societal responsibilities for too long and there is a backlash occurring as a result?  I am asking.. I don't have an answer in mind.

Peggy Joseph?  Did i miss some mass media thing?

Offline ECOCKS

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Re: Ladies, are you receiving better healthcare in the United States?
« Reply #249 on: August 12, 2009, 05:29:30 PM »
Sigh...

Yes Olga, ultimately all those people getting healthcare pay for their "free" coffee. That includes my free cup this afternoon.

However, the original point was that our tea and coffee required no additional payment so it was part of the value received for the $163.00.

Very reasonable IMO.
Pick and choose carefully among the advice offered and consider the source carefully. PM, Skype or email if you care to chat or discuss

 

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