The Good, the bad, the ugly,... Get the truth.

[Amerkanski]

First, why would you give advice if this applies to 'some' ?
Second, I am not the one who has been asking 'what do you mean' a number of times, there for I doubt that my English comprehension is limited.

As far as 'our cultures', what exactly do you know about my culture ?

First, why would you give advice if this applies to 'some' ?
You serious? ...honestly? Because the thread is directed to American males. As mentioned a 100x that you can't comprehend. My Point!

Second, I am not the one who has been asking 'what do you mean' a number of times, there for I doubt that my English comprehension is limited.

Yes, yes it is.. my point again. You just effectively answered your own question and did not comprehend it.

As far as 'our cultures', what exactly do you know about my culture ? My Point-Not to marry Russian women and the fact, you just can't comprehend my posts.

[Shadow]

First, why would you give advice if this applies to 'some' ?
You serious? ...honestly? Because the thread is directed to American males. As mentioned a 100x that you can't comprehend. My Point!

Second, I am not the one who has been asking 'what do you mean' a number of times, there for I doubt that my English comprehension is limited.

Yes, yes it is.. my point again. You just effectively answered your own question and did not comprehend it.

As far as 'our cultures', what exactly do you know about my culture ? My Point-Not to marry Russian women and the fact, you just can't comprehend my posts.

1. Talking about failure in comprehension. 'Some' refers to Russian Women, not to 'American Men'. My point. 

2. You did not comprehend my question, yet you accuse me of lacking comprehension.

3. What exactly does that have to do with my culture.

[Amerkanski]

>>but why wake the admin?<<

No worries there. The Mods, and other members, have been doing a very credible job of responding to your arrogance and condescension - not to mention the provocations.

To this point, and with a couple of exceptions, I admit to finding the exchange mostly amusing. I do believe you were disingenuous with your "clarification" to UTRO, and do not for a moment believe your comment was 'innocent.' That sort of behavior is repugnant and will not survive at RWD.

I also find your experiences to be vastly different than my own while living expat - and vastly different than the dozens (hundreds?) of expats I remain in contact with today. That is NOT to say your experiences (as described) are not shared with some - I know of some expats who live in-country as you do. Just not many.

To the extent your expat experiences are atypical - and they ARE atypical - then for you to be trumpeting "the truth" is most than a little suspect. In fact, I feel confident in stating that much of what you have described is downright BS. Others have been pointing out the same fact.

OTOH, I do find a few points in your posts worthwhile. Unfortunately, your arrogance and condescension serve only to blunt any productive contribution you might otherwise be capable of making.

Unless you demonstrate the capacity to change this trajectory of exchange (and make no mistake, it is YOUR obligation to make the change), not only will the Admin remain awakened, but the Admin and the Mods will begin limiting your disruptions.

Up to you. Choose wisely.

- Dan

Dan, I live here you don't. So calling me out as BS referring on others opinions as possible facts shows me a more concerning signs of your ignorance.

[Admin]

First, why would you give advice if this applies to 'some' ?
You serious? ...honestly? Because the thread is directed to American males. As mentioned a 100x that you can't comprehend. My Point!

So is your target audience all American males - or is it all single American males - or is it single American males who might be interested in RW - or ??

Second, I am not the one who has been asking 'what do you mean' a number of times, there for I doubt that my English comprehension is limited.

Yes, yes it is.. my point again. You just effectively answered your own question and did not comprehend it.

Rather than continue to harp on your contention that someone may not be able to "comprehend" your point - make the effort to help them "comprehend" it - in a civil manner.

As a new member of RWD, you may not have yet read the RWD Vision. You will find it here -- http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?pid=33, and it provides you of the tenets we built RWD upon. To the extent your agenda differs from those tenets, you are at cross-purposes with the objective of this site, and should expect to encounter resistance, at least.

As far as 'our cultures', what exactly do you know about my culture ? My Point-Not to marry Russian women and the fact, you just can't comprehend my posts.

To the extent you can articulate a coherent and persuasive argument in disfavor of marriage to a RW, there are some who are interested in your position. As may be seen in the RWD Vision linked earlier, we welcome diversity of opinion. I should also provide you one more link to an important post you may have missed, here -- http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=7223.0. It addresses civil discourse, and would be worthwhile reading for you.

- Dan

[Doll]

Had he told it to you, I might agree as well. 

I said it years ago and still are standing on it. After 8 years there still are many cultural differences between my husband and I and between Americans and I.
I see it at home and work every single day. One more time- 8 years here.

[Misha]

My opinion differs from yours because I'm NOT looking for a wife or trying to build personal relations.

Reading your posts, Aesop's fable of The Fox and the Grapes comes to mind.

My primary goal is to make money period. This changes all dynamics you could ever possibly understand and my true core opinion.

I explains to me the kind of people you meet as well. If your only passion in life is money, then the only women you will find will only be interested in your money. It also explains to me your inability to form any friendships with Russian men as well. You claim that they only want to talk about money and how to make money. As they say, birds of a feather flock together.

Now also add it's 1.5 hours away from Mexico when there was no drinking age and betting donkey shows. The first time I ever seen a dead body is when her Mexican pimp beat her to death for talking too long with a John. I was 15 and the John.

So, how exactly did you end up in Mexico when you were 15 without your parents?

Now let's add the American guy from a small town anywhere who is surfing the net and meets a RW. Now imagine him falling and for her ...  He is a perfect gentlemen and tries to hyper pace a relationship and gets a bit emotional amongst the culture shock, jet lag, or physical bonding time. It is an emotional toxic disaster waiting to happen. ...

You tell this story like it is your own....  

In these smaller Russian towns I've had them ask me if I was there to take their women to go work clubs in America? Matter of fact, Svetas father asked me that.

Sveta's father did not really like you much did he. However, as others have noted, it is pretty common now for Russians to believe that women will be taken away and forced to work as "sex slaves" in their new homes.

The vast majority of cities and towns look like rundown projects of Detroit.

Yes, the exterior facades to most Russian buildings are not very nice, but people will put a lot of time, energy and money into having the nicest homes possible. I am curious, when in Russia, other than your girlfriend or her family, did anybody ever invite you to their homes for a meal? Reading your posts, it seems to me that you are incapable of connecting with Russians.

Russian people “in general” hate each other and will argue at a drop of hat.

If numbers confuse you in a store, you know very little if any Russian and are incapable of truly understanding when people are truly arguing and likely have little understanding of what normal conversations are like in Russian.

Most people have ZERO chance of bettering their lives or economic status.

Not true either. Close to everybody that I know in Russia has been putting much effort into bettering their lives. Some bought apartments, some moved to bigger apartments, some renovated their apartments, many bought computers, others went to university, and the list could go on and on. You are clearly judging Russian by your own values and judgments. They have their own definitions of what a better life is.

There is a constant tense feeling everywhere and Russian don’t trust each other period.

Again, you clearly did not succeed in making any close Russian friends. If you  had, you would have quickly understood that people behave quite differently in their homes when they are with friends and family than the appearance they have on a bus or metro.

Life there is exhausting even to do the simplest things like food shopping or transit.

Exhausting? You always exaggerate.

Russians are horribly stricken with greed and envy.

Russians don't hold a monopoly on either greed or envy. I would say that this is an other example of you exaggerating when you resort to such terms as "horribly stricken."

I find most Russians to be incredibly ignorant about American culture or politics

They live in Russia don't they? Why should they have a deep understanding of American culture? Nonetheless, I would wager that your average Russian will know much more about the USA than your average American will know about Russia or any other country for that matter.

They have a problem admitting when they’re wrong and will cause a scene if need be.

Interestingly, I could say the same thing about a certain poster  :evil:

I find their life in general to be boring and bland like their food.

Reveals your ethnocentrism. Why should Russians or anybody else care? If you don't like the food, don't eat it. Problem solved. As for their life in general, my conclusion is that other than hanging out in cafes and doing your work, you know little if anything about the life of Russians.

I truly think they like to see people suffer. They don’t truly live a free life, but endure and just simply exists.

More of the same. The more you write, the deeper you pile it.

The RW will tell him anything to get out of there and why he needs to take the steps I’ve mentioned to have a successful relationship.

Must have missed those steps. Besides, from what I gather, you have yet to have a successful relationship.

This is why I would never marry a RW because it’s just simply easier to marry a American women.

Then, marry one. Nobody is stopping you from doing this. To be honest, you should be the last person to marry a Russian woman given your prejudices. If after three years in Russia you can't find anything good to say about Russia, then do every Russian woman out there a favor and don't even thing about getting married to a RW.

Something positive for a change

There is apparently a first for everything...

WTS, he agrees with me that Americans should never marry RW. I asked him why and he gave me a simple answer. Because your culture is not tough enough….

Perhaps he is just being polite and trying to explain to you that you should not get married   But, you have to keep in mind that Russians have a widespread belief that they are strong and resilient. They have a century old saying that states that what is healthy for a Russian will kill a German. He statement is in many ways simply conforming to how many Russians see themselves and their culture. It should not be taken literally.

[Doll]

So is your target audience all American males - or is it all single American males - or is it single American males who might be interested in RW - or ??

single American males who might be interested in RW, of course

[Shadow]

I said it years ago and still are standing on it. After 8 years there still are many cultural differences between my husband and I and between Americans and I.
I see it at home and work every single day. One more time- 8 years here.

But as the French say: "Vive la difference !"
The differences are certainly there, but while for some they are a threat, for others they are an opportunity to open their mind.

[Misha]

our two cultures are so very different to form a true understandable bond to set a solid foundation to grow a meaningful relationship

Are cultures different? Yes. However, people can learn about other cultures, with time can put the effort needed to learn a language, to learn a culture, to truly understand another. It does take time and it also requires one to shed one's belief that one's culture is inherently superior. In other words, it can be done, but you have to be open to it and willing to put in the time and effort.

[Admin]

Dan, I live here you don't. So calling me out as BS referring on others opinions as possible facts shows me a more concerning signs of your ignorance.

Amerkanski,

While true that at this moment I do not live expat - it is also true that I have lived as an expat in multiple countries on two continents. I daresay I have considerably more time in-country as an expat than you do. Do you REALLY want to get into a pissing match about who has more expat experience? I assure you I am not ignorant, and if pressed, am able to provide compelling evidence - though I won't, as I do not wish to dedicate the time and proving that to you is not among my priorities.

Moreover, I cannot help but notice that your IP resolves to a US location. I may have missed your explanation upthread, but even if so - please explain.

While providing explanations, in this post of yours -- http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=11248.msg219511#msg219511, you made this comment:

"I just pulled off a 24 coding an Internet marketing bot"

Another of our members asked you about the comment, but you were silent. I am curious as to what "an Internet marketing bot" is. Please explain.

- Dan

[UTRO]

There was no response because it would mean more if you did it publicly because our disagreement was not in private.

Here is the problem I have with you.. "your" Sveta.. she's not property and why we could never get along or have a mutual understanding.

The "Your Sveta" is an Expression and is not an implication of Property. Yes it does sound ambiguous.... but, if you are indeed a Westerner you would know this. I said this to differentiate my wife from your girlfriend. My wife is Sveta too.
My Sveta (.... ooops there I go with the ownership/property thing again, "My"!) calls me "Her Dave". It doesn't bother me.

However, regarding Women as Property.... I never went out with a Woman who I call "my Girlfriend" with the preconceived plan to never marry her. I quote you below....

Some quick answers: Have I ever been married to a Russian women? No, and never would. Do I have a Russian girlfriend. Yes, I have had more then a few. Do I like Russian women? Yes, I like all women.

Does Sveta know how you feel about your intentions? Is she okay with it??

[Amerkanski]

Reading your posts, Aesop's fable of The Fox and the Grapes comes to mind.

I explains to me the kind of people you meet as well. If your only passion in life is money, then the only women you will find will only be interested in your money. It also explains to me your inability to form any friendships with Russian men as well. You claim that they only want to talk about money and how to make money. As they say, birds of a feather flock together.

So, how exactly did you end up in Mexico when you were 15 without your parents?

You tell this story like it is your own....  

Sveta's father did not really like you much did he. However, as others have noted, it is pretty common now for Russians to believe that women will be taken away and forced to work as "sex slaves" in their new homes.

Yes, the exterior facades to most Russian buildings are not very nice, but people will put a lot of time, energy and money into having the nicest homes possible. I am curious, when in Russia, other than your girlfriend or her family, did anybody ever invite you to their homes for a meal? Reading your posts, it seems to me that you are incapable of connecting with Russians.

If numbers confuse you in a store, you know very little if any Russian and are incapable of truly understanding when people are truly arguing and likely have little understanding of what normal conversations are like in Russian.

Not true either. Close to everybody that I know in Russia has been putting much effort into bettering their lives. Some bought apartments, some moved to bigger apartments, some renovated their apartments, many bought computers, others went to university, and the list could go on and on. You are clearly judging Russian by your own values and judgments. They have their own definitions of what a better life is.

Again, you clearly did not succeed in making any close Russian friends. If you  had, you would have quickly understood that people behave quite differently in their homes when they are with friends and family than the appearance they have on a bus or metro.

Exhausting? You always exaggerate.

Russians don't hold a monopoly on either greed or envy. I would say that this is an other example of you exaggerating when you resort to such terms as "horribly stricken."

They live in Russia don't they? Why should they have a deep understanding of American culture? Nonetheless, I would wager that your average Russian will know much more about the USA than your average American will know about Russia or any other country for that matter.

Interestingly, I could say the same thing about a certain poster  :evil:

Reveals your ethnocentrism. Why should Russians or anybody else care? If you don't like the food, don't eat it. Problem solved. As for their life in general, my conclusion is that other than hanging out in cafes and doing your work, you know little if anything about the life of Russians.

More of the same. The more you write, the deeper you pile it.

Must have missed those steps. Besides, from what I gather, you have yet to have a successful relationship.

Then, marry one. Nobody is stopping you from doing this. To be honest, you should be the last person to marry a Russian woman given your prejudices. If after three years in Russia you can't find anything good to say about Russia, then do every Russian woman out there a favor and don't even thing about getting married to a RW.

There is apparently a first for everything...

Perhaps he is just being polite and trying to explain to you that you should not get married   But, you have to keep in mind that Russians have a widespread belief that they are strong and resilient. They have a century old saying that states that what is healthy for a Russian will kill a German. He statement is in many ways simply conforming to how many Russians see themselves and their culture. It should not be taken literally.

You serious? This post at best is speculation. Again, another person on this board who is not brave enough to cover the rest of the topic thread. The bad, the ugly. Will you ever be able to take those blinders off?

[Amerkanski]

Amerkanski,

While true that at this moment I do not live expat - it is also true that I have lived as an expat in multiple countries on two continents. I daresay I have considerably more time in-country as an expat than you do. Do you REALLY want to get into a pissing match about who has more expat experience? I assure you I am not ignorant, and if pressed, am able to provide compelling evidence - though I won't, as I do not wish to dedicate the time and proving that to you is not among my priorities.

Moreover, I cannot help but notice that your IP resolves to a US location. I may have missed your explanation upthread, but even if so - please explain.

While providing explanations, in this post of yours -- http://www.russianwomendiscussion.com/index.php?topic=11248.msg219511#msg219511, you made this comment:

"I just pulled off a 24 coding an Internet marketing bot"

Another of our members asked you about the comment, but you were silent. I am curious as to what "an Internet marketing bot" is. Please explain.

- Dan

I've already explained many many times I am home in the US. I've designed a custom bot to feed my RSS blog feeds into all my SBM. www.ping.fm

[Daveman]

You serious? This post at best is speculation. Again, another person on this board who is not brave enough to cover the rest of the topic thread. The bad, the ugly. Will you ever be able to take those blinders off?

So reiterate for us, with examples from your personal experience, exactly what you see as the bad and ugly.  Prison mentality of women, run down buildings, one (?) woman who chatted behind your back, misconceptions of American culture, hmmm, those come to mind from memory. Perhaps if you'd elaborate a bit more then your delivery would be more consumable.  I'd like to read (and perhaps participate) in some real discussion of these notions.

[Amerkanski]

The "Your Sveta" is an Expression and is not an implication of Property. Yes it does sound ambiguous.... but, if you are indeed a Westerner you would know this. I said this to differentiate my wife from your girlfriend. My wife is Sveta too.
My Sveta (.... ooops there I go with the ownership/property thing again, "My"!) calls me "Her Dave". It doesn't bother me.

However, regarding Women as Property.... I never went out with a Woman who I call "my Girlfriend" with the preconceived plan to never marry her. I quote you below....

So how many times have you been married?

Does Sveta know how you feel about your intentions? Is she okay with it??

I don't lie to women. She has told me more then a few times she can change me.. I don't feed into it.

[Amerkanski]

So reiterate for us, with examples from your personal experience, exactly what you see as the bad and ugly.  Prison mentality of women, run down buildings, one (?) woman who chatted behind your back, misconceptions of American culture, hmmm, those come to mind from memory. Perhaps if you'd elaborate a bit more then your delivery would be more consumable.  I'd like to read (and perhaps participate) in some real discussion of these notions.

Then re-read the thread and posts because it covers most of the questions you're asking. It's as about as personal as I am going to get because it's not the main topic of this thread but a part. You guys are really trying hard to get me off here aren't you.. Or how about you share some of your personal stories similar?

[Misha]

You serious? This post at best is speculation. Again, another person on this board who is not brave enough to cover the rest of the topic thread. The bad, the ugly. Will you ever be able to take those blinders off?

No, legitimate comments that you fail to address. What blinders? I am happily married to a wonderful Russian woman. I am happy with my life. Can you say the same about yours?

[Vaughn]

It's as about as personal as I am going to get because it's not the main topic of this thread but a part.

Then I would say this thread has more than run its course.

I've got to admit - I'm hard pressed to recall a new poster who took up so much bandwidth to make
a few points. Stick around and read, dude. You might learn that others' experiences, while vastly different
than yours, also have validity.

[Doll]

But as the French say: "Vive la difference !"
The differences are certainly there, but while for some they are a threat, for others they are an opportunity to open their mind.

You're right.

[Doll]

Hey, Amer, are your parents together or divorced? How old are they? And you?

[Amerkanski]

No, legitimate comments that you fail to address. What blinders? I am happily married to a wonderful Russian woman. I am happy with my life. Can you say the same about yours?

I am delighted with my life and I think it's obvious I am delighted to be me. So let me throw a little armchair Freud back at you.

The Blinders:

You refuse to answer or contribute to: The bad, The ugly the topic of theme of the thread. Want to know why? You are afraid to admit there could be possible cracks in your relationship or RB marriage. You remind me of a guy who buys a nice used car that turns out to be a lemon and pours more money into the vehicle then it's worth so he does not have to admit it was a bad choice. So when anyone asks about your car you will always have positive response.

Then when I point out your blinders you go full defensive.

[Amerkanski]

Then I would say this thread has more than run its course.

I've got to admit - I'm hard pressed to recall a new poster who took up so much bandwidth to make
a few points. Stick around and read, dude. You might learn that others' experiences, while vastly different
than yours, also have validity.

I've read many others threads and the "validity" appears to be lacking responses. Greatly.

[Misha]

You are afraid to admit there could be possible cracks in your relationship or RB marriage.

Why? I will be the first to admit that neither my wife nor I are saints. She has her flaws, so do I. However, we still have a happy marriage. She loves me, I love her. Y

Then when I point out your blinders you go full defensive.

Well, I would say that you are the one incapable of holding a forum conversation and you seem quite adept at lashing out and insulting other when we start questioning you.

[Jumper]

I've read many others threads and the "validity" appears to be lacking responses. Greatly.

The Validity lacks responses?  



As mentioned, my experience there is different than yours,,
this may be from having some close friends  and extended family.
I am divorced after a 6 year marriage (8 year relationship) to a RW, so your continued thrust that anyone not sharing your exacting view is "protecting" their dream ,or their current situation, doesn't fly with me.

Again I will say that I have seen the traits you've mentioned..
but have a much different general view than your own.

My thoughts of why your experiences are different ..
and it is relevant to a thread telling newbies "the truth"


*No matter where you go , you take yourself with you*

Now that could be in reference to me ,or you, or both..

Having lived in several cultures happily..  i have my doubts you could live in any other culture happily long term.
Certainly not the Russian one, as you have clearly indicated you will leave as soon as possible,
. that biases your perspective of  "the truth". You can't recognize that?

Someone that could relocate and be happy ,in that culture, will have a very different perspective than yourself.
Not every new guy taking his first trip would be a sheep to the slaughter


Your primary  message seems to be to  warn new guys that RW are not what the agency hype sells..

Fair enough, I totally agree, and I cant imagine anyone disagreeing with it.
 

so think of *why* we have 16 pages.

[Amerkanski]

Why? I will be the first to admit that neither my wife nor I are saints. She has her flaws, so do I. However, we still have a happy marriage. She loves me, I love her. Y

Well, I would say that you are the one incapable of holding a forum conversation and you seem quite adept at lashing out and insulting other when we start questioning you.

I lash out at people who refuse to read the thread in total and continually ask the same questions over and over. Our better yet, the personal assumptions like you that have zero relevance to the topic with laced validity claims. How can it be remotely valid if it's not on topic? I did not start a thread directed towards AM who are already married and have wives that live here, but that's what the majority of what you want to talk about in comparison. Meaning, why are you questioning me in the first place when you do not fit the main criteria of the topic?