Life Changes...Part Deux

[GQBlues]

I guess since no mention of what can and can't happen with the J-1 in your last post GQ and considering you or I don't have the complete answer on what can or can't happen with the J-1 visa the RW has that's coming to visit me, you now agree a J-1 recipient can live and work anywhere they want outside of an agency agreement if they have their own finances to do so?

Nope, neppers, nyet. I didn't respond to it in my last post because I already have on at least 6-7 previous posts.

[BillyB]

I went on two dates yesterday. One at noon and the other in the evening.

My lunch date was a first date. The RW is older than I. About half my regular dates are with women older than I ages 42 on up. Half my dates are older because it's my choice on who I want to call and go out with. Older women know how to take care of a MAN better probably because they have more life experience. Do not believe anyone who tells you older women 40-50 has a reduced sex drive.

My lunch date told me she preferred RM since they are from the same culture but I told her people from any culture can get along if they bring their best. Usually relationships don't work because of individual differences and problems people bring into their relationships. I mentioned the high divorce rate in the FSU to prove to her marriages within her own culture has a poor success rate.

We talk about the needs of a man and woman and physical intimacy which has to be brought up delicately especially on a first date but I was sure she could handle it after reading her. She tells me most RM she goes out with ask what kind of sexual position is her favorite on a first date. She does not like when they ask that so soon. She tells me her first husband who was Ukrainian had multiple affairs during their marriage and she is currently not looking for marriage but open to finding friends or a lover. She is okay if her lover is married as long as he takes care of her.

She is very impressed with my intelligence, manners, and knowledge of her culture.

After lunch we walk in a nearby park and I offer her my arm and she takes it.

At the end of our date she tells me the date with me was better than any date she's had with RM but she feels she needs a taller man. She's my height so my physical appearance pertaining to height is an issue to her so my guess is that I can only be friends with her, not a lover.


After my last trip to Ukraine, I sent out about 3500 intro messages/letters on dating sites. I got about 900 responses back and that's not so bad considering most of the ladies I wrote too were not looking for a foreign man. One site I used is based in the FSU.

Since I wrote to many ladies, I did not have time to read their profiles. Some of the ladies I wrote to were married or prostitutes.

Some people like to think prostitutes are not much different than other women but I don't think so. Once I realized I wrote to a prostitute, I would tell them I'm in their town and ask them how much for sex. They would happily respond 3000 rubles average and let me know what times they could see me throughout today or the next few days. I'm sure they are busy people and have other clients to tend to. I've never used a prostitute but it was interesting to learn how happy they became once I gave them the impression I will be a paying customer.


There were 3 types of married women I encountered.

Some married women were simply looking for friends.

Some married women were looking for their soul mate and will divorce their husbands when they find him. Maybe they are looking for true love or just want the bigger better deal financially.

Some married women were looking for lovers. When it came down to Q & A about what we were looking for in our lives. I would tell them I'm looking for serious relations that may lead to marriage. At that point they would lose interest in me and ignore me. Curious to understanding more about them I would write "Although I'm looking for serious relations, I'm still a man and I have needs. It may take years to find a woman worth marrying so I'd consider having a lover in my life". By writing that it brings them back into a conversation with me. It never fails.

I know studies show women commit adultery mostly because they are starving for emotional support but after communicating with married women, I doubt it. Women can get emotional support from other women. They can have their friends tell them they're wonderful and beautiful. Why married women want a man? Because he has the equipment a woman does not have.

One RW told me her American husband visited her a 3-4 times a year in the FSU. After 4 years she finally had sex with him. She wasn't in a rush and came to America about 8 years after they initially met. She's now thinking of divorcing her husband as soon as she gets the green card but currently she wants a lover in her life.

I'm not blaming her husband for anything because I didn't hear his side of the story pertaining to their failing marriage but he failed to understand from the very beginning his woman was never physically attracted to him. She told me recently her husband asked her "What's wrong? Something has changed in you." If any of you are dating a woman, ignore the signs at your own risk if you plan on proceeding with a long term relationship with her. If any of you are married and your wife suddenly lost her sex drive, get headaches or gets tired a lot, don't dismiss it as fact. You may have some problems you need to address.


I don't think I've encountered any racism that I can identify when I communicated with RW. I'm half Asian and half Caucasian. I'm sure some ladies didn't write me because of the color of my skin but it doesn't bother me. I know there are enough women attracted to my looks to keep me happy that I won't live a lifetime full of rejection. I'm at a point in my life where I can get multiple dates with RW living in America each day and everyday. I would have an easier time getting dates if I were in the FSU.

I did get a few responses such as "F U Biatch" and "F U IDIOT" but I think the ladies were just trying to scare me away. The one who said "F U IDIOT" was a lesbian I learned after I read her profile so maybe that was discrimination against my sexual orientation?

One RW living in an American city far from me said she doesn't like blacks.

One RW I'm dating said she throws all mail she gets from Asians and blacks in the garbage. Funny thing is this woman likes me so much I'm sure she'll marry me. I'm the first minority she's ever been with and she very happy with the results.

[BillyB]

I'd estimate about 20% of my first dates with RW get cancelled. I think some RW may have a real reason to cancel but I think many of them are testing me. I guess they want to see if I'd get upset or angry but with my calm demeanor, I handle it well and my "next" first date with them actually happens.

I've been tested in other ways. One RW who mostly dates RM tested me. We were at dinner on a first date and as the waitress laid the check on the table, she grabbed it and said:

RW: I'll pay for half.

Me: Thanks but I'll pay for it because I'm the one who invited you out.

RW: It's okay really, I will pay for half.

Me: Maybe you've been Americanized and believe in equal rights but I'm going to have to disappoint you because I'm old fashioned and the man always pays the bill. (I then reach over and grab the check out of her hand).

RW: She smiles and says "You've passed the test"

Me: A test? Did I get an A? If I didn't pass the test, what would you do?

RW: You would never see me again.

Me: I guess I'll be seeing you for a second date then. Did you ever have some of your dates let you pay for half?

RW: Yes, some guys were happy when I offered to pay for half and I even had one guy calculate every item on the check to see who was suppose to pay for each item.

[BillyB]

Someone started a thread mentioning that older RW don't age well. Some do as a matter of fact. One I dated this weekend and she's near 50. Beside looking good and slim, she has a wonderful personality and excellent sense of humor. She shared with me some of the stories of the wackos that write her. Mostly RM write her.

Man1: Could I touch myself when looking at your photos?

RW: Sure you can touch yourself. 99% of the men who look at my photos touch themselves.

Man1: Could I stroke myself?

RW: Sure, have fun!



Man2: What do you think about incest? (man is 20 years younger than RW)

RW: I don't think about it.

Man2: Could I tell you a story about a situation that happened between my mom and I?

RW: Keep those stories to yourself!



Man3: Do you think we'll kiss if we ever meet?

RW: I don't know, it depends.

Man3: Do you think we'll have sex?

RW: Probably not.


She has more stories but that's all I'll say for now. She said a few guys asked her if they'll get a kiss on a first date and the next question is usually about sex. I guess there are a lot of insecure men out there.

[kievstar]

It is rare for a woman to cancel a first date.  20% seems very high.

[BillyB]

It is rare for a woman to cancel a first date.  20% seems very high.

That is why I think I've been tested. It's not a bad test for women to do if it helps a lady figure out the guys that get angry and throw a temper tantrum.


Some guys who are currently communicating with RW may not understand how valuable communicating with RW can be before a visit. It's not only used to figure a little about who you are visiting but also used to eliminate those women you have nothing in common with or who display hostile attitudes to you or others. It won't guarantee chemistry but it will save you time and money from visiting a woman you have no business associating with.

My first visit to the FSU was to Novosibirsk Russia. The lady wrote to me, happily spoke to me on the phone with me and asked me to visit. That was a mistake I will not make again. My mistake was to visit her without gaining more knowledge about her. Also just because a woman invites you to the FSU, it doesn't mean she's into you. It doesn't take much for a RW to send tons of men an invitation. Most men in this endeavor or have completed it went to the FSU to visit a stranger(s). Reduce your reliance on luck and talk to the women on the phone often before visiting and figure out if she's into you.

My second visit to the FSU was to Tashkent Uzbekistan for my ex fiancee. I learned a lot from her during communications on how sincere women write. She is an exceptional woman and will always be so.

Here is a message I got from a RW 2 days ago. I wrote to her like everyone else. If she's good looking in my eyes, I write not reading her age or profile. She's 18 but I've gotten letters like this from older women too. The reason I'm showing this message is to give some of you an idea how a sincere family oriented woman writes regardless of age. I first wrote to her in December 09 and because of her age, she gets hundreds of letters from men and many local boys asking her out everyday. It is a fact that very young women do get the most men hitting on them.

She never showed interest in me for a relationship and she only talked to me as a friend and I responded to her as a friend with no romantic words involved. When she tells me her opinions on certain issues, I will disagree as I see fit and I'm never a "yes" man to any RW agreeing to everything they say. I help her with any problems in her life with answers if she asks for help. A few days ago she writes me that I'm her best internet friend. I respond I'm not looking for friends but I've been writing her for a long time because I think she's a good person too. Then she sends me this message:

Hello Bill__
thank you so much.! i want you to come to Ukrania.. just try.. i promise that we will meet. and you will see my mom ...i mean it's more easy to to come here.. i will be in ukrania in august ... i think it's possible for you.. and if you will find me not interesting for you , so you can see just a country or somethin more..My family are very good and my mom!(she is the best woman on the world).
take care...

She lives in another country but she is Ukrainian. Her letter tells me a lot. I never asked to meet her family since I never planned to visit her but she offered it. She comes from a happy family which is good and she thinks highly of her mom and that is good. She is hoping I will approval of her. If I go to Ukraine and I look the same as my photos and conduct myself well, I'm pretty sure this woman will be my wife.

There are a few women in my life that want my approval but I'm not ready yet since I haven't found what I'm looking for. Why do they feel they seek my approval? Because they feel I'm a quality man after talking and/or meeting with me.

So far I like the family oriented attitude of the lady who sent me the message and the fact she wrote me for months never showing desperation, anger toward people in her life, and always talking to me politely. She also says she's a virgin and if true, it shows she can make present day sacrifices for the benefit of her future husband. Her behavior patterns through correspondence show me she's mentally and emotionally stable and not stupid enough to fall for the guys who are throwing themselves at her feet and boasting. I don't boast about myself...except for you special readers. 

After her message to me, I go from friendship mode and proceed to more serious questions such as how she wants her future family to be. She tells me "i would like to have a family where will be respect and love" and "i know that i will be a good wife.. it's in my blood.. even my mom says that:-)) what else do you want to know?" She also wants 2 kids with a boy first and girl next. Almost all young RW I've talked to wish for a boy first because it's important that the brother is older to protect the sister.

I then sent her a message on what roles should a husband and wife should play. I will wait for her response and if I like it, I will proceed to tell her what I think and WANT. I tell RW what I WANT all the time. There is nothing wrong with telling a RW what you WANT. It's a strong word and will give a RW the indication you know what you want in life without wavering and potentially changing your mind. They don't want a man who changes his mind often and I don't want a woman who has a habit of changing her mind either.

In another thread I recently said "I'm sure I'm a better person and a lot smarter than most guys my age and even older".  I will continue to lose internet friends saying things like that but this is good for a woman to know who seeks a life partner. If you are a better and smarter person, you will directly benefit the closest people in your life the most and thus, you will be attractive to lots of ladies. There's nothing wrong with improving your health, attitude, and continually getting educated over the course of life and in marriage as long as doing activities to improve your life doesn't consume the bulk of your family time.

I don't boast about myself with the ladies. They sometime ask me why I'm the best man for them and I tell them roughly " I like myself and who I am. I don't need drugs or alcohol to change myself into a different person etc..  but whether or not I'm the best man for you is your decision, not mine. They usually respond with "that's a good answer" or "that's the best answer I've ever heard".

At one of the dating sites I'm on, there are 40% more men than women and so the competition is heavy yet I get letters like the one I submitted above every once in a while, a few girls are interested coming to stay with me and I meet one or two new local RW every week so it's my guess that the competition has some improvement to make because there is not a single girl to go around for every guy. I don't want to live my life like this forever though.

[Miri22]

I've found that going outside into the sunshine away from the keyboard for hours a day can help change ones perspective and overall health. Golf and fishing are nice.

[BillyB]

I've found that going outside into the sunshine away from the keyboard for hours a day can help change ones perspective and overall health. Golf and fishing are nice.

Miri22, I have other things I do better in my free time than golf or fish. Have you read this thread? I know you think I talk a lot but I average 2.25 posts a day and you are right behind with 1.7 posts a day I learned after clicking on your profile. Most of my posts are positive and helpful. Most of your posts are negative and target people you don't like such as me. I hope you're not like this in real life but the first impression you made at this forum won't get the girls turned on.

My thread has brought forth many colorful attitudes unfortunately risking disrupting other threads. I do not want to get involved in an off topic mud slinging contest and enter into a fools game with certain people. Maybe some people feel the need to take cheap shots or insult me because they are jealous, not happy at home, or just angry with what I've said. Why get so emotional with someone who doesn't affect your life? Find a woman that will make you happy so she can make the pain go away or take some anger management classes.

Some people felt a need to insult the quality of the RW I've dated in this thread and others. I won't stoop so low to insult their wives or girlfriends in retaliation. In real life if a guy walks with a woman who may be a mother, sister, daughter, friend, girlfriend, fiancee, or wife and you are rude to the woman, you will probably get your face smashed in. It's seems to be okay for some brave men to take shots at another man's RW behind the safety of their computer monitor.


I met a J-1 visa girl this weekend. She was at Virginia Beach for a week and said the agency couldn't find her a job so she flew to a city nearby mine to live with her mom's friend. She doesn't work and doesn't seem eager to find a job but just wants to enjoy her vacation in America. She won't get in trouble with the agency if she's not working because they themselves can't find her a job and they know the economy is slow.

She is not the J-1 visa girl I wanted to meet. The one who was coming to visit me from Russia by way of  NY has decided to accept a job in NY. She told me I was more important than work but in the end, work was more important. Lucky I did not put my life on hold many months for her but I did lose other opportunities to invite J-1 visa recipients to my city to work. The others are now in America and situated in various cities throughout.

The girl who wrote the message in my previous post now wants to speed up the meeting with me and not wait for Ukraine. She wants me to come to Libya but I tell her by the time Libya approves my visa, if they approve it at all, you will be in Ukraine in August. She says her mom would like to speak to me on the phone and that is a good sign her parents care about her. I told her she has permission to show her mom our 6 months of correspondence to understand me and how I communicated with her. Her profile isn't based in Libya, USA or Ukraine so don't go looking for her. Some guys may enjoy getting me in trouble or some guys are only looking for virgins. Her parents travel a lot for work and are all over Europe and Africa.

I met a Ukrainian lady for lunch yesterday on a first date and we were together for 3 hours. She is in her 30's and is a green card lottery winner. She wrote me a message and called me “stubborn”, said a few things and ended the message with her phone number. I called her up in the morning and set up a lunch date same day. She is not the first RW who called me “stubborn” and ended up giving me her phone number. Many RW like an aggressive man who is persistant in a way that doesn't reflect desperation.

She has a son 14 yo and he called her on our date asking where she was. She did not tell him I was with me. He was checking on her every so often and sometimes she didn't answer the phone. I told her “pick up the phone and talk to him and tell him you're with me. Your son cares about what momma is doing.”  I've dated a few RW who have teen or young adult sons and it never fails, those boys are calling momma up on our first date. Those RW are at a loss for words to explain to their sons what is going on. I tell those RW “As soon as your son gets his first girlfriend, they are going to forget about you and you'll be calling them up late at night asking what they are doing with some girl.”. One RW I dated a month ago was getting calls from her son all night up to 1 AM in the morning but she wouldn't answer because she didn't know what to say to her son. I told her “tell truth that you are safe with me and we're holding hands.(RW laughs) If you don't answer, he will worry all night. He's going to hammer you with questions when you get home anyway so why make him worry all night?”

My RW lunch date and I talked about all range of subjects. Life, domestic violence, Russian and American men, sex, goals and values.

During her only marriage to a Ukrainian man, she suffered massive physical and verbal abuse. Everytime her parents visited their flat, she had bruises on her face and once she had a broken jaw. She told her parents she fell down but that excuse lasted only so long before they understood the truth that their daughter was hiding the abuse the best she could and trying to give the impression she is happily married. Her husband ended up getting thrown in jail for 4 year for beating people on the streets. Only then she was able to escape. She had low self esteem and felt worthless for years believing what her husband said in that she was no good, bad wife, and ugly. It took years for her to finally feel comfortable with men again. One of her first dates after marriage touched her hair early on and she pulled back away from him semi-frightened.

She tells me with some of her dates she feels comfortable to hold their hand and with other dates she prefers to be 5 miles from the man. I liked her during lunch so I asked if she wanted to go for a walk and she did. I offered my arm and said “take this, I need to learn if you're comfortable with it or going to run 5 miles away from me.” She laughs. Later she grabs my hand. When I go out with ladies, I try to control the flow of things and the atmosphere. When they are with me, they will quickly understand that I genuinely care about them and treat them like a lady. We may not get married and the feeling may not last forever but during that day and time, they are in my care and they will be treated with respect and like a lady.

She came to America 4 years ago but went back to Ukraine last year. She encouraged her son to mingle with the neighborhood kids. 30 minutes later her son comes back to the flat and tells what happened. All the kids smoked and he refused. They wanted to go get some beer and he refused. They asked him “How are the American bitches?” and he left back to the flat.

She didn't realize it before but Ukraine is not a place she wants to raise her son. She said her son grew up to be a good kid and growing up in America for a few years, he would not survive in Ukraine.  I told her growing up in an environment that is more secure with less worries does that to people. In the FSU, one has to be tougher to survive and become more alert of those trying to take advantage of you.

Being a green card recipient, the US government chose the location she is to live and put her on welfare to start life for her. She does not want to live on welfare and does not want to her son to learn to get comfortable with free handouts in life so she opened her own business. It's slow but she is surviving and her dignity is intact.

At the end of the date I asked her how I compared to her RM dates. She said  I'm better than them. She said our conversation was great and I didn't touch her in an unusual way. She says most RM will do that on the first date and are ready to go to bed with her. She now wants to avoid the FSU community all together in America. I haven't asked yet but I already know I have a second date with her.

[groovlstk]

She is not the J-1 visa girl I wanted to meet. The one who was coming to visit me from Russia by way of  NY has decided to accept a job in NY. She told me I was more important than work but in the end, work was more important. Lucky I did not put my life on hold many months for her but I did lose other opportunities to invite J-1 visa recipients to my city to work. The others are now in America and situated in various cities throughout.

Billy, wasn't this the 20ish college chick whom you claimed was sizing you up to be the father of her children? And she had accepted that you were the boss and would make all decisions because you had more life experience, etc.?

FWIW, I know some Bulgarian chicks who do this every year. (And no, they are not looking for older men to romance, just a nice place to stay, and they usually find a few men willing to help them out after a little flirting.)

[BillyB]

FWIW, I know some Bulgarian chicks who do this every year. (And no, they are not looking for older men to romance, just a nice place to stay, and they usually find a few men willing to help them out after a little flirting.)

The ladies I talk to don't flirt, they talk serious and respectfully otherwise I won't ask them out or invite them to my house. If I invite a lady to my city, she pays for her own hotel/apartment. If she wants to stay in my house, she pays rent. Did you read this thread? All women are my friends first. I don't promise them romance. If they want to romance me, that is their choice.

Billy, wasn't this the 20ish college chick whom you claimed was sizing you up to be the father of her children? And she had accepted that you were the boss and would make all decisions because you had more life experience, etc.?

20th college chick? You guys do get worked up and refuse to comprehend everything. Half the dates I go out with are older than I because of my choice to do so. Young chicks don't have all my attention.

Does it really bother some of you some young ladies like me? Does it bother you the 18 yo virgin is inviting me to Ukraine and Libya and her mother wants to speak to me?

It bothered some people when I said on page one "From my experience, once a RW determines that you're a MAN, she will listen to what you have to say and accept it." yet you guys failed to hear what Lily said on page one. She's classy, polite, intelligent and highly educated yet she can accept my attitude. What I said is truth but some of you have not experienced it and jump on me from the beginning since you think this is not possible.

I'm trying to tell my experience here and some of you want to point out the events/dates that didn't blossom. I can't win all the women. Do you prefer I come here and tell you I had 100% success on every date? I won't get along with every RW. I won't get along with a lady like Doll and she probably wouldn't get along with a guy like me but I look for ladies like Lily and there are ladies that will like a guy like me. Instead of mocking my experiences that weren't successful, wouldn't it be wise for a guy to figure out what works for me may work for them? If I want a woman to treat me like a king, don't you think I'd treat her like a queen?

If you're getting angry thinking I'm having lots of dates and sex everyday... sometimes multiple times a day with different RW, then you are almost right. I can do that with multiple women or even one woman since I believe she's a nymphomaniac but I don't. Sex is not the most important thing for me and if I did do that I would not have time to focus on finding a woman to spend my life with. I've already said goobye to some RW who are willing to sleep with me simply because I don't see a future with them and won't use them for selfish reasons.

Are those RW bad for associating with me and it's why some of you want to degrade them? They have their needs to be taken care of and it's not my or your place to choose who gets to be in their beds. They may invite me to their bed and they may see me as husband material although I may not feel they are wife material for me so now... I remain single and it's not the worst thing in the World.

Before marriage, people go out and date and they get to know each other and there is a chance they sleep together. I have been open with my experience and what guys could and should expect from some RW. I could be a lot more graphic but you are free to use your imagination. A lot of men who are decided to write RW or go to the FSU have it in their minds what kind of women they want but they don't know what to expect. It's quite possible while some guys WO and their lady is dating many until he show up or she finds a husband.

The 30 something yo from my previous post just accepted and invite for a date Friday night with me. She's not a 20 yo college chick so don't get your panties in a bunch. I'm now off to lunch with another RW I've known for over 4 months in her 30's too.

[groovlstk]

20th college chick? You guys do get worked up and refuse to comprehend everything. Half the dates I go out with are older than I because of my choice to do so. Young chicks don't have all my attention.

Billy, read again. That's 20-ISH, not 20th.

Does it really bother some of you some young ladies like me? Does it bother you the 18 yo virgin is inviting me to Ukraine and Libya and her mother wants to speak to me?

Not at all, Billy. But you've been bragging about your dating exploits for some time now and you've been using the J1 chick as some sort of yardstick of your manliness and appeal to much younger women in several other threads. Just pointing out the difference between perception and reality.

[BC]

Billy, read again. That's 20-ISH, not 20th.

Yeah, that was a hoot.. had me ROFL here.

[BillyB]

you've been bragging about your dating exploits for some time now

You say I'm bragging and SJ thinks all the women I associate with are garbage. I can't win can I? Why do you think I'm bragging? You were a single man once. What is your normal dating experience being single? Do you think my dating experience is exceptional, average, or poor?

I don't know how many times I'm going to say this here. I'm writing down my experiences and advice to help others with some dating tips, gaining confidence and understanding the variety of RW they may encounter. I knew I was going to lose internet friends when I started this but that is a sacrifice I"m making. Some of your reactions to my posts have been interesting to say the least.

If I mention and/or date an older woman, nobody says anything but they may secretly think "Yuck! Why would BillyB do that? I'd never consider an older woman" and nobody pats me on the back for doing that.

If I mention and/or date a slightly younger woman, nobody says anything.

If I mention and/or date a younger woman, some people here go into a rage, quote me, and explode and I get called names, mocked, and everybody focuses on those posts of mine with young ladies. The funny thing is many of you are married to much younger women and if you aren't married to one, many of you secretly want one if one would have you. I've been around the sites long enough to know which women get the lion's share of attention.

I am probably one of the very few people who honestly mention that I've communicated with and dated much younger women. Most of you won't admit that unless you're already married and confessed. Many of you may say your goal is to target RW near your age but what you do may be a different thing.

Unlike many of you, I don't target young ladies. I write to every woman who is attractive to my eyes. I don't read their profile or age. When they write back, I will read and some happen to be younger and some happen to be older and guess what? Some happen to be my age. If they show enough interest in me, I invite them on a date and I don't discriminate against age.

If I were not dating any young ladies, I doubt I'd have many of the reactions I'm now seeing.

[Jumper]

Billy-
 i'll cut to the chase.
 
yes you ruffle some feathers at times , not because other posters are jealous,
mostly because you post some strange thoughts or ideas.
it's really that simple, read into it whatever  you want.

posting about your thoughts is of course  fine..
and it sparks some good debate.. so why not?




a few oddities?

yes i find any man your age ,, not desperate , who is dating so abundantly  locally ,at all ages.

strange in even contemplating chasing/dating  any 18yo , anywhere ,particularly across and ocean.
If you dated her locally , i would find the situation odd ,regardless the age of consent.
everyone has their very own personal line to cross though ,and i accept and recognize that.

I certainly date younger than myself,  but  i do look at profile ages and eliminate ones that would be so young as to just be silly in my opinion, but that's me .

 Any other poster here (unless quite a young man)  would likely take some flack for dating an 18yo, even if it is just one.
You shouldn't expect to be immune ,just because noone else should *cough* care.

It's a discussion forum , people discuss things.


anyway-
Everyones style and approach is different ,what works for you ,won't work for others.

as example , i have never once asked on a first date with a RW  ,or any other date,
how i compare to a russian man, or to any other man.

To me it just isn't relevant ,and is an odd question.
the only important thing between us at that time , is how she felt or responded to me ..


I wouldn't really expect or appreciate the question asked in reverse.
 
if a RW date asked "how she compared to AW?"
i guess i might find it amusing ,but odd. a lot would depend on tone of delivery ..

but  i wouldn't be comparing her to anyone .. i'd simply be enjoying her company ,and who she was as an individual .. (or not)
and that is how  i would answer.

but of course your dates answer that you are far better than any russian man  she has dated ..

now-
are they being sincere ? or polite?

if you wan't to generate discussion ,cool,
let's put that to occums razor as which is most likely?


Personally I find this type of question leading,  and the answers in my opinion are going to be mostly vague or contrived.
Nothing wrong with that either ,in fact that type of answer would seem most appropriate given a first date circumstance?


it is working for you ,so that's cool.

 

[groovlstk]

If I were not dating any young ladies, I doubt I'd have many of the reactions I'm now seeing.

Can only speak for myself, but if it helps to make a useless if sincere gesture, you have my blessing to date women of any age, subject to local laws of course.  I won't give you a pass, however, when you start speaking from authority about how to date, marry, and remain married for 30+ years to a 20something RW. That kinda bothers me.

[BillyB]

yes you ruffle some feathers at times , not because other posters are jealous,
mostly because you post some strange thoughts or ideas.
it's really that simple, read into it whatever  you want.

If people don't have a problem, they should make a post just like yours.

yes i find any man your age ,, not desperate , who is dating so abundantly  locally ,at all ages.

strange in even contemplating chasing/dating  any 18yo , anywhere ,particularly across and ocean.
If you dated her locally , i would find the situation odd ,regardless the age of consent.
everyone has their very own personal line to cross though ,and i accept and recognize that.

I certainly date younger than myself,  but  i do look at profile ages and eliminate ones that would be so young as to just be silly in my opinion, but that's me .

 Any other poster here (unless quite a young man)  would likely take some flack for dating an 18yo, even if it is just one.
You shouldn't expect to be immune ,just because noone else should *cough* care.

Why would I focus on dating or even marrying an 18 yo? I have eliminated many young ladies because they are immature and/or focused on partying instead of being family oriented. The 18 yo I'm communicating with believes in a traditional family, she believes in God and guides her life by God. She admits she isn't perfect but is always wanting to improve. She values education. She values her future husband and it's very important for her to prove to him she will be a good wife. She's against divorce and will try to build a strong family with her husband. She values her parents and currently her mom is not discouraging her from meeting me but curious to learn if I'm a good man for her daughter to marry. She wrote me six months never saying a bad word or words out of anger. Twice I stopped writing to her because I thought I found someone and didn't think I wanted to travel overseas anytime soon. Twice she asked me why I stopped writing her. 6 months writing me and she never showed any desperation and treated me as an online friend.  She is trying harder for me than I am for her. She already has a lot of fine qualities about her regardless of her age. I have little doubt she will be an outstanding person in life and wife to whomever she will marry. She is currently choosing me. I'm happy with what I see in her and if she is wife material, I won't dismiss her. I have almost 2 months to decide if I want to visit her in Ukraine. I told her have patience and let us figure each other out before a decision is made.

I knew I'd take some flak for mentioning an 18 yo in this thread but the situation is currently happening in my life, this thread is about what is happening in my life, and I'm not going to post everything that people prefer to hear to make myself look like a saint.

i have never once asked on a first date with a RW  ,or any other date,
how i compare to a russian man, or to any other man.

To me it just isn't relevant ,and is an odd question.
the only important thing between us at that time , is how she felt or responded to me ..

I rarely ask women if I'm better than her other dates. Depends on the situation. My question asked is not to learn about me and my performance, but to learn about the other men she's encountered. I think my posting what other men do and how they act, particularly RM, have raised a few eyebrows. I know how I perform on dates. I can see the ladies reaction, in the lady's eyes, her movements, voice, and I can figure out easily if I have a second date before the first date is over. My date tomorrow had her hands shaking occasionally on our first date. Maybe she is excited and nervous meeting me or maybe she has some problems with her nerves but based on her job using her hands a lot, I don't think its a nerve problem.

I hope more people will post like you even if it's with constructive criticism. I don't care if someone wants to come forth bragging how they are successful dating or how they courted and married their RW. If it can help somebody, then brag away.

Someone once told me " most of the guys on the board couldn't get laid in a women's prison with a fist full of pardons. Thats why they go."  Funny and I wished it weren't true but there are guys that need some help. Most guys here I figure are decent guys even if we don't get along and are here, not at the sex tourist forums, because they are looking for love and a family life. They need a few tips on personal hygiene, how to dress, etiquette, customs, do's and don'ts, confidence, attitude, a better understanding of what kind of RW they will be encountering and what they are accustomed to from RM on dates. They just need to improve a little more to outperform the competition. If they got the right stuff, they can go to the FSU or even here and get plenty of attention and have enough women to choose from to make a good decision on one.

As we've read from other recent threads, RW don't have many quality men to choose from. One man's loss is another man's gain if the man can show himself as an attractive mate for a woman.

[Jumper]

Billy- good answers?

and for what its worth  i really wasn't trying to bust your arse  too much
and glad you took it in the correct light .

I was just pointing out that anyone ,including myself ,
posted these type  of things, that  some people are going to NATURALLY question it.


*****************

As far as the 18yo, like said,  i understand everyone has their own situations ...
i can appreciate your candor about it.
 
My point  again was that each poster will have various ideologies ,and acceptable level of this ..
and will certainly comment. why not? it is  a discussion forum.

 i personally could not date such ,it wouldn't matter if she was the
best woman on the planet .This isn't a lack of confidence ,trust me ,
 i was asked out,randomly , by a complete 18yo stranger-  to the *prom* of all things this spring  too funny!  i felt like fonzie lol
 and no i did not go , or even entertain the idea of seeing this girl.(an american girl)
it was flattering and amusing ,not to be taken seriously at all for me.

If you can do so,more power to you.
but yes dating someone that  that age,even once,much less flying to see them if you do,
 you will take some flack , and i do realize you do not concentrate or target that age .

nor realistically should you ,that's the simple truth...
if we cut the PC stuff.
 A lot of men here have 18yo daughters ,if you showed up at he door ,
no matter what quality man you feel you are ,, things would not be comfortable i would bet.
There is a reason for that.

****************************
 
As far as your question  to the women about  RM,
it seemed i had seen a few times in your posts ,wondered about it , as i assumed it was somewhat routine..

As mentioned earlier ,different approaches for different people ,,
but you do tend to be presenting this more than billyb's dating adventures ,
and more as an *ABCs* of dating for guys that in your opinion might need the help.


As such, i'd suggest they not specifically ask about how they compare to other men on a first date ..lol because unless the subject came up somehow randomly ,or by her,
it's generally going to be considered odd by anyone they date , regardless nationality.

and if they are over 30.. and marriage minded ,they should stay away from even the most mature 18 yo's.


so there's my lame input for *dating 101* ,
but i doubt anyone needs such advice.
the ones that do ,would never heed it !

[SMS60]

Billy, Just change your dating stories to a visit 25 trip report and you wont get any flack. . You will have more back slapping than you can handle.

[Boethius]

i was asked out,randomly , by a complete 18yo stranger-  to the *prom* of all things this spring   too funny!  i felt like fonzie lol
 and no i did not go , or even entertain the idea of seeing this girl.(an american girl)
it was flattering and amusing ,not to be taken seriously at all for me.

Too funny.  Kind of sad for the girl, though (no offense intended).  She probably doesn't have a prom date.

If you can do so,more power to you.
but yes dating someone that  that age,even once,much less flying to see them if you do,
 you will take some flack , and i do realize you do not concentrate or target that age .

nor realistically should you ,that's the simple truth...
if we cut the PC stuff.
 A lot of men here have 18yo daughters ,if you showed up at he door ,
no matter what quality man you feel you are ,, things would not be comfortable i would bet.
There is a reason for that.

Yup.  Had he shown up at my door at 18, my 6'2, 200 lb father would have kicked his butt halfway down the block.  Back in those days, he enjoyed doing that.  In fact, one 35 year old guy did express interest in my then 18 year old sister, but it never went further when my father had a very short "talk" with him (wouldn't have anyway, as my sister just thought the whole idea was "gross").   I have a teen daughter, and if a guy Billy's age showed up at our door, he would regret it.



Billy, you have posted the 18 year old is a quality woman, lives her life by God, etc., etc.  You don't know any of this.  You haven't lived with her.  All you have to go by is words on a screen.   Also, an 18 year old who values a good education isn't spending her time trolling for men on the internet.  Finally, if she comes from a "good family", they won't be thrilled to see a man twice her age show up at the door.

[IAmZon]

WOW!  Been gone for a couple months (South America) and I see this flury of intelligence and oddity, page after page - a great unique place on the net is RWD (I am afraid I belong in the birdcage too by my own inclinations and proclivities, if not by destination of my geographic travels).

BillyB holds a special place in my heart - he was the first to welcome me to RWD in the Greetings board.  But, how could I not notice his full disclosure of SEX in many posts - the meaning and importance thereof (and his virility and prowess, of course:)  Men like him are the reason why Futility Gods were invented. (Notice the way he is holding that pole in his avatar ... suspicious huh?   (It's all good, man.  I am just kidding.  I think I am an sexual artist too.)   Besides, sex is often a problem in relationships - so it is good that a guy like Billy will hit the problem straight on - and probably early -in a new relationship. 

But, I caution the more traditional and conservative on the board.  There ARE a million ways to skin a cat.  Some of the best long term relationships I know of (at least as far as I can see from the outside) come from people who are "in the lifestyle" - swingers.  Who am I to judge?   RWD is at its best when being non-judgmental.  And, at the same time, it is hard to see two cars speeding straight on for each other at full speed, and not yell STOP.   

It might help to be honest about our real OBJECTIVES ?  BillyB are you really serious about finding "the one" at this time?  (that is the sub heading of RWD - GMN - "Get Married Now")  If not, then enjoy the journey and live an interesting life. It seems you are accomplishing that.  If you are TRYING to find Mrs. Right at this time, it is going to be complex.  Choices have to be made.

Credits:
- AJ; great clarifying posts that frame and not offend
- Gator; good seeing you still kicking.  How goes the good fight?
- Blues Fairy; your baby is growing fast!
- everyone else - "GLAD"

Just to show how pathetic I am, and how weak the human heart.  A hundred beautiful and interested Latinas and all I could think about was the "most likely to be a SCAM"  Kristina from Omsk.  God, I hate what Russian women seem to be able to do to me so effortlessly!

[Jumper]

Too funny.  Kind of sad for the girl, though (no offense intended).  She probably doesn't have a prom date.

lol certainly no offense taken!  
 i kind of thought that too (no date?as she was quite attractive)
and caught a bit off guard to be honest -  I asked!
 she just said she had seen me at the beach and at this  store a few times and wanted a chance to talk.. I was buying flowers ,and she said they would match her prom dress and she din't have a date ,would i take her..
like i said it was a bit amusing ...  she's outgoing enough! and i'm sure this girl found a date no problem at all, and of a more appropriate age...   I can't imagine what she had thought that whole scenario through lol!!! but how may people that age do? ..
that's the whole point

[Boethius]

Yes, very few.   However, you no doubt look decades younger than your chronological age, and that also was a factor. 

[Jumper]

Riv!
good to see you back

[Daveman]

lol certainly no offense taken!  
 i kind of thought that too (no date?as she was quite attractive)
and caught a bit off guard to be honest -  I asked!
 she just said she had seen me at the beach and at this  store a few times and wanted a chance to talk.. I was buying flowers ,and she said they would match her prom dress and she din't have a date ,would i take her..
like i said it was a bit amusing ...  she's outgoing enough! and i'm sure this girl found a date no problem at all, and of a more appropriate age...   I can't imagine what she had thought that whole scenario through lol!!! but how may people that age do? ..
that's the whole point

Why, yes it is... I've yet to meet an 18 year old who truly had/has a clue about anything much, except for myself of course, I knew anything and everything.... seems I've evolved to higher levels of stupidity since then. 

It wasn't too far in the distant past when young girls of 14 were given in marriage to men of any age for a variety of reasons.  So I guess the age taboo is a rather recent development. Of course, that doesn't address the feelings or desires of the girls involved. 

I look at it pretty much like AJ in his excellent posts above.  It doesn't really make sense to me, and I really doubt that it woiuld work out long term, but it's neither my life nor my decision.  If it does turn out that Billy winds up with the 18yo, and they both are happy, I'll be glad to wish them well. 

AJ, you shouldda gone to the prom, man, you couldda kyped some extra crayons! 

[Ade]

You say I'm bragging and SJ thinks all the women I associate with are garbage.

No Billy, I didn't say that. And this tendency of yours to have hyperbolic and sometimes all too literal interpretations of people's posts is one of the reasons why I think your monologues are next to useless as "guides" to life and reality.

But, for what it's worth, the women that I define as "quality" women, women that are "independent", "strong", "intelligent" and the many other adjectives you tend to use, would not be queuing up for the privilege of joining Billy's harem. It just wouldn't happen. So I guess our definitions of these terms differs quite a lot. Just to be clear, by this I'm not saying the women that do are garbage either but there is a whole ball park of space between how you describe these women and that.

And here's another FWIW; we say these things to you not because we're jealous, in fact, that's far from the truth. I personally grew up a very long time ago and realized that screwing around wasn't at all fulfilling, whereas a long term relationship with commitment and a mutual emotional bond were. So, to be honest, if I have any emotions towards you at all, one of them is pity; pity that you feel it's necessary to screw around with so many women, pity that you think it's a good thing, pity that you have to in the first place, pity (for you and her) that you think any long term good can come from dating an 18 year old, pity that you think your ego trip in this thread could actually help any normal person and pity that you have such a distorted view of reality.

Yes, you amuse me sometimes too, but in a "WTF, did he just say that and mean it   " kinda way, but mostly I feel sorry for you. Now, I know that you're going to think that it's misplaced and that's okay, I wouldn't expect anything else. I will say this though, print out these threads of yours and make an appointment with a therapist and get a professionals take on this. And I mean that in all seriousness.