Life Changes...Part Deux

[mies]

Here is an excerpt from the web site you make reference to mies.

"Although it is not commonly eaten in quantity, parsley herb is a good natural source of carotene (provitamin A), vitamins B1, B2, and C, as well as iron and other minerals. Parsley is therefore a good nutrient, especially when combined with bulgur and other ingredients in the tasty Lebanese salad, tabbouleh, but as a medication, the herb is of little worth."

I wonder what they mean when they say "large amounts"?

I quoted the web site that came up in the top of the search. Parsley can be even toxic for itself: http://www.springerlink.com/content/nx4uv755226xr345/

I think people are forgetting that fact that all good things are good in moderation. Even if a person eats too much carrot every day - he is likely to develop some health issues. But in small amounts carrot is recommended, because it contains vitamin A, and is needed for good skin, hair, and eyesight.

But overall - you can disregard my post. I'm just pulling Billy's leg.

On the other hand, I genuinely admire A's mom: to discuss sex with her future "son-in-law", and give him advices on where and how often to have sex with her daughter.. i bow my head. And still - maybe it's all just a wise plot to keep Billy aroused all the time and reduce his thinking ability while he is in Ukraine, to prompt him to make bad decisions  :evil:

[Jumper]

BillyB:

You are upset I'm not making things clear yet it's your fault.
Read this thread and you will understand clearly what I'm saying.
A's mom and dad isn't divorced. Just because they're separated doesn't mean they're divorced. Even if they were divorced, it doesn't mean mom initiated it. A comes from a long line of women that don't divorce their husbands. I can't make it anymore simpler that that for comprehension purposes.

1. Why the need to continually think I'm upset Billy? I couldn't be further from upset.
 

In my entire post that you took that blurb from,
 I stated clearly that this seemed a small discrepancy that I felt had no bearing at all on your relationship.
Does that sound like a person that's upset?

2.Sense they "isn't divorced" ,your words above are still a little confusing, but I'm glad you cleared up they are only separated ! Can we then clear up how long they have been separated, and who initiated it for validation of your point?
is being long term separated,living in different countries ,while one raises the child ,
 some real difference in an alternate universe I'm unaware of?

Actually it doesn't matter, as I stated in my other posts ,i feel it has no bearing on your relationship.

but hey somehow you know that IF they were divorced it wouldn't have been A's mom who initiated a divorce.

Seems being clairvoyant is another of your powers.
 
Maybe A's mother was impossible to live with? but did not initiate the separation,
would that make things any better?
Maybe A's father was the impossible one ,
or maybe they *separated*  amicably?
As a couple it's likely only they know the exact answers.

During your contact with A ,she has lived with her mother, who is separated from her father.
So to make that out as some long lineage of women who don't divorce their husbands, or stand by their men, is a bit silly in my opinion.

So to the exact issue:
 is A's father enjoying the benefits of a normal marriage to A's mother billy?
a simple yes or no will do ....


My whole point earlier was that A's beliefs ,opinions and commitment levels are all that really matter. Yes it's good if she comes from a home that instilled strong family values.
This is your belief in HER,based on your communications and observations.

Just  leave it at that.

[Daveman]

We are going to give this thread a rest for a few days... as well as this entire subject.  That means in any thread in the open forum area.. get it? any thread, any open area. 

This thread will be unlocked again, however, for now I'd highly suggest to all parties involved to let the topic rest completely... again, including all other threads.  Take a break - everyone.

[GoodOlBoy]

How many times do these complainers state "Yeah, I dated a lot of fat women until I decided I wanted a slimmer one". ? I haven't seen it once

GOB has one better than that FP.
How many RWD member's here have openly stated "Yeah, I went to the FSU looking for a fat woman my age (I'm guessing mostly 50-60+ yo)". 
Yeah....that number would also be NONE.
 
We all know why we go to the FSU (younger and slimmer). 
 
 
GOB


PS.....Unfortunately this scenario also opens the door for "sickos" to stalk their teenage prey. 

[Rubicon]

 
All one has to do is look at the dating pool of domestic women and RW. RW on average look much better, have good education, and more mentally mature. Domestic women more often than RW talk about their tattoos, piercings, being 420 friendly(like to smoke dope) and being BBW(big beautiful woman). Many domestic women let themselves go but have in in their head their failings are accually something to be proud about.
 

There are plenty of attractive, fit, athletic, intelligent American 18 year old girls with a good education and without tattoos or drug habits.  They date within their age/peer groups.  They do not date middle aged men.  If you have found an 18 year old (now 19 years old) slender attractive Ukrainian girl who is willing to date and marry a middle aged man, than perhaps you should ask yourself what her motivations are.

[Anotherkiwi]

There are plenty of attractive, fit, athletic, intelligent American 18 year old girls with a good education and without tattoos or drug habits.  They date within their age/peer groups.  They do not date middle aged men.  If you have found an 18 year old (now 19 years old) slender attractive Ukrainian girl who is willing to date and marry a middle aged man, than perhaps you should ask yourself what her motivations are.

You need to get out more!  From what I've read about AW (and have seen here and in other countries), there are plenty (in absolute numbers) who do date middle aged men.  The proportion, of course, is quite small when you look at the overall size of the dating pool, but it still happens.  One of my primary school classmates eventually married a man 20 years older than her - 30 years later they're still happily married.
 
A's motivations in agreeing to marry BillyB are nobody's business but her's.  I know why Billy generates the reactions that he does but, if he was any other poster, especially a newbie, this forum would be full of sympathy for him, with exhortations not to do such a stupid thing because nobody that age could seriously contemplate marriage.  I actually happen to agree that he shouldn't do it, but from the standard perspective of "she's almost certainly too young to really know yet what she wants," rather than "BillyB is an evil predator who should be locked up for life for contemplating such a dastardly deed."
 
As I've posted before, they are both of legal age to do whatever they want wherever they want - let them get on with it, and worry about more important things in life.  If they fail, everyone on here will quite happily go "na na, told you so!"  If they succeed, how many will have the grace to say "congratulations Billy and A, I was wrong."  I seriously wish them all the best for their future - I just hope that they have the strength to stay airborne, and not crash and burn like so many before them.

[Rubicon]

Anotherkiwi:

You obviously do not live in the United States, and I seriously wonder if you have ever visited for a significant period of time.  I do get out very much, and I can tell you with the utmost confidence that it would be EXTREMELY rare for an 18 year old girl to date a middle aged man.  At that age they are submitting applications to University and dating young athletic good looking men who are 18 to 20 years old.  They are not even remotely thinking about marriage, and the thought of an 18 year old girl who would date a paunchy 45 year old man would draw giggles and YUCKS!! 

Absolutely the only 18 year old girls who would date a middle aged man would be those who are very damaged and were homeless or border line homeless, probably due to some sort of abusive relationship with a father or stepfather at home.

Now there might be 27 year old women who would date a 40 year old man but that is an ENTIRELY different situation, and still rare.  At that point she has finished college and is in the workplace earning her own keep.

If you do not think that A and her mothers motivations are not entirely financial than I think that you are delusional.

[Faux Pas]

You need to get out more!  From what I've read about AW (and have seen here and in other countries), there are plenty (in absolute numbers) who do date middle aged men.  The proportion, of course, is quite small when you look at the overall size of the dating pool, but it still happens.  One of my primary school classmates eventually married a man 20 years older than her - 30 years later they're still happily married.
 

It happens but if I'm guessing I'd say it's the exception and not the rule. Like you I've know of quite a few that worked out and they appear very happily married today. I myself have dated many much younger ladies when I was single. Mostly because they pursued me. Some even gave me pause for thought. The last time I dated an 18 year old I was 30.

A's motivations in agreeing to marry BillyB are nobody's business but her's.  I know why Billy generates the reactions that he does but, if he was any other poster, especially a newbie, this forum would be full of sympathy for him, with exhortations not to do such a stupid thing because nobody that age could seriously contemplate marriage.  I actually happen to agree that he shouldn't do it, but from the standard perspective of "she's almost certainly too young to really know yet what she wants," rather than "BillyB is an evil predator who should be locked up for life for contemplating such a dastardly deed."

Whoaaaaa Nellieee. The age gap itself doesn't seem to bother many. There are a lot of guys here with 10-20 year  age gaps. Billy is his own worst enemy with the chest pounding "I'm the Man" postings and the "If you do it my way, you too can have an 18 yr old". Despite his ramblings, the only success Billy has is extracting sex tips from the MIL. Many before you, Billy and I have traveled to Ukraine and dated, applied for visas and even married 18-19 women. History tells us many of those have been crash and burns. He's going against convention and that is fine. But he wouldn't have had as much static as he has if, he would spare us the details of "WHY" he is different. History will bare Billy out in one form or fashion



 

As I've posted before, they are both of legal age to do whatever they want wherever they want - let them get on with it, and worry about more important things in life.  If they fail, everyone on here will quite happily go "na na, told you so!"  If they succeed, how many will have the grace to say "congratulations Billy and A, I was wrong."  I seriously wish them all the best for their future - I just hope that they have the strength to stay airborne, and not crash and burn like so many before them.

Other than Billy's squabble with GOB few if any have picked the point of legalities. Legalities isn't the point here. I do wish Billy, A and MIL the very best of luck in the future. I sincerely do. I hope it works out the way Billy has so carefully planned. If it does not I will not be the one to say "I told you so" or rub his nose in it in any kind of way. I will happily give Billy congratulations if it doesn't. At what point would you like to see me do that?


Many before Billy were full of the piss and vinegar that he has now. Many of those have since littered the roadway. If Billy is different or better than those, I'll believe it when I see it. None of his incoherent postings on his thread will convince me. But, no matter. Convincing me or anyone on this thread is the least of Billy's problems or worries. Apparently, it is convincing Billy.

[Faux Pas]

Absolutely the only 18 year old girls who would date a middle aged man would be those who are very damaged and were homeless or border line homeless, probably due to some sort of abusive relationship with a father or stepfather at home.

Apparently you just don't know. There are quite a few that will and do. Rarely is love or the chance of love the motivator. It is not that uncommon but, it isn't wide open apparent either.

[Anotherkiwi]

Apparently you just don't know. There are quite a few that will and do. Rarely is love or the chance of love the motivator. It is not that uncommon but, it isn't wide open apparent either.

That was the point that I was making, and why I emphasised that the proportion was small.  But where did Rubicon's post go?  I went to quote from it and got this
 

  An Error Has Occurred!   The post you are trying to quote either does not exist, was deleted, or is no longer viewable by you.

   As for your earlier post:   

Whoaaaaa Nellieee. The age gap itself doesn't seem to bother many. There are a lot of guys here with 10-20 year age gaps. Billy is his own worst enemy with the chest pounding "I'm the Man" postings and the "If you do it my way, you too can have an 18 yr old".

   I had already written that I knew why Billy generated the reactions he gets - you don't need to bang on about it again!

[Faux Pas]

That was the point that I was making, and why I emphasised that the proportion was small.  But where did Rubicon's post go?

board flatulence most likely


 

I had already written that I knew why Billy generated the reactions he gets - you don't need to bang on about it again!

I'll take that into consideration 

[Rubicon]

Apparently you just don't know. There are quite a few that will and do. Rarely is love or the chance of love the motivator. It is not that uncommon but, it isn't wide open apparent either.

"Rarely is love or the chance of love the motivator."  Keywords in this paragraph.  Yes there might be some young women who date sugar daddies for money.  But they generally are not educated and/or have few prospects to go to a ranked University.  There are also the rare few who do it because it is somewhat taboo and turns them on.  This may or may not lead to a long term commitment. 

[Admin]

Dan,

Could I have your permission to post some of my observations from the survey data, along with the statistical data? I can dig these up from my archived emails and as I recall the data was well organized and easy to sort through to find, in my opinion, to provide statistics more relevant to the discussions here.

Yes, of course.

- Dan

[Faux Pas]

"Rarely is love or the chance of love the motivator."  Keywords in this paragraph.  Yes there might be some young women who date sugar daddies for money.  But they generally are not educated and/or have few prospects to go to a ranked University.  There are also the rare few who do it because it is somewhat taboo and turns them on.  This may or may not lead to a long term commitment.

This just isn't true. There are a plethora of reasons why they do. Many of those reasons are likely financial. Many of the girls involved are as educated as one can be at 18-19 and not trailer park trash. The fact is that they do. You earlier stated that they didn't (paraphrasing) Unless there was something wrong with them. Saying it's so, doesn't make it so.


Granted the numbers are much smaller and AK stated as much. It happens guy, frequently. There's no point in denying it just for the sake of discussion. That leads the discussion astray

[HiTech]

Now you can teach your teenage daughter that men over a certain age are worthless but I've learned many RW judge a man's worth based on other more important factors than age. Smart, very smart.

Would gullibleness be one of those criteria? 

HiTech

[GQBlues]

.....All one has to do is compare dating sites. Can ANYBODY show me an American dating site where the average woman looks better than the women of an FSU dating site?....

Hey Billy-
 
I tried a quick exercise and here's what came up...
 
I went into 'Match' (didn't realize you now have to register an email just to surf) and plugged in women in Seattle, ages 40-45 (your likely age range criteria), and got quite a few decent looking women. Mind you, I'm not being selective as this was done fairly randomly.
 
Here's the link .
 
If the link doesn't work, I posted the screen shot below.
 
Then I went to Elena's Models and plugged in the same age criteria, 40-45. The link takes you to a page where the age is already preset and all you have to do is click the tab to get the result.
 
http://www.elenasmodels.com/index.php
 
Screenshot won't work because they don't have the pics on a crossboard format but rather single shot running vertical. I tried the screen shot anyway and was only able to show the first 3 pics....
 
Dunno bro. I don't know exactly what it is you're talking about as I don't really see a huge difference between the groups.

[Donhollio]

If anybody is worried I'm going to marry an 18 yo RW, you need not worry anymore. That WILL NOT HAPPEN. An event occurred in the past month and what has happened is irreversible. I can't change the past nor will I try to change the past because it's not worth my time and effort. My fiancee had a birthday. She's not 18 anymore.
 

 So she was 17 yo teenager when you first wrote to her?      I dunno dude either way its sick. Hope your local school board doesn't read this, you may wind up with a restraining order to stay a certain distance from any highschool. As for how it all went wrong, we'd be interested to read all about it, as I don't know how you managed to lose her being that you have such a high level of confidence. I mean you say they chase you, and it just goes on & on & on. You had a girl in Tashkent that went down the drain as well I recall. If I were you Billy I'd take a close look at yourself, you're fucking up in life and too high on yourself to realise. If you're not marrying her why do you still call her your fiancee?  See, this is what I mean by needing to take a look at yourself.
 

[Jooky]

Jooky, I understand the ways to calculate divorce rate aren't perfect but that is the way it is. Current divorces counted against current marriages.

Yes, but that's not how the cross cultural survey calculated divorce rates, so it's not a valid comparison. I started a new thread on observations from the data.
 

As for how it all went wrong, we'd be interested to read all about it, as I don't know how you managed to lose her being that you have such a high level of confidence.

He's not going to marry an 18 year old, because she's 19 now...
 
You guys need to pay better attention. 

[Boethius]

But he'll still be 40  (the same age he was when he first contacted her), and still doesn't look like the guy above

Billy's "saga" does have one positive for me.  I remembered some poetry that sat far back in my memory.  So, I had the opportunity, after work, to read some poetry, as his description reminded me of a great scene.  For those not fluent, ask a Russian to translate.  I'll try to find a good translation, but I think the effect will be lost:

Морозна ночь; всё небо ясно;
Светил небесных дивный хор
Течет так тихо, так согласно...
Татьяна на широкий двор
В открытом платьице выходит,
На месяц зеркало наводит;
Но в темном зеркале одна
Дрожит печальная луна...
Чу... снег хрустит... прохожий; дева
К нему на цыпочках летит
И голосок ее звучит
Нежней свирельного напева:
Как ваше имя?   Смотрит он
И отвечает: Агафон.
 

[Rubicon]

Hi Boethius,

I put your poem through Google and it is somewhat interesting.  Some pretty girl apparently gets raped and it ends with the girl asking who the man is, and he answers that he is Agathon.  By all accounts Agathon was a unique and successful Greek poet who was handsome, polished and well dressed.   

Well, other than that I really wish you would give a go at translating it into English for us because I am sure that you could bring out some nuance or special meaning that Google is not able to bring about.

[Rubicon]

 So she was 17 yo teenager when you first wrote to her?      I dunno dude either way its sick. Hope your local school board doesn't read this, you may wind up with a restraining order to stay a certain distance from any highschool. As for how it all went wrong, we'd be interested to read all about it, as I don't know how you managed to lose her being that you have such a high level of confidence. I mean you say they chase you, and it just goes on & on & on. You had a girl in Tashkent that went down the drain as well I recall. If I were you Billy I'd take a close look at yourself, you're fucking up in life and too high on yourself to realise. If you're not marrying her why do you still call her your fiancee?  See, this is what I mean by needing to take a look at yourself.
 

Donhollio,

I think you are mistaken that he has lost her because apparently they are still planning to get married.

On a side note I spoke this evening with a lovely and very beautiful girl from Ukraine who is 19 years old who works at my local supermarket.  I have spoken to her before and she has always been friendly, so this evening I asked her if she had a Russian or American boyfriend.  She immediately said American and was quick to say that she does not like Russian guys.  I than asked her how old her boyfriend was and she said 20 years old (perfectly normal!!). 

Now to continue the story I than asked my 19 year old friend what she would think about a 45 year old somewhat short man with a paunch who was going to marry a 19 year old girl from Ukraine.  She immediately laughed and said that the girl will leave him as soon as she gets her green card, no ifs ands or buts.

[nicknick]

But he'll still be 40  (the same age he was when he first contacted her), and still doesn't look like the guy above

Billy's "saga" does have one positive for me.  I remembered some poetry that sat far back in my memory.  So, I had the opportunity, after work, to read some poetry, as his description reminded me of a great scene.  For those not fluent, ask a Russian to translate.  I'll try to find a good translation, but I think the effect will be lost:

Морозна ночь; всё небо ясно;
Светил небесных дивный хор
Течет так тихо, так согласно...
Татьяна на широкий двор
В открытом платьице выходит,
На месяц зеркало наводит;
Но в темном зеркале одна
Дрожит печальная луна...
Чу... снег хрустит... прохожий; дева
К нему на цыпочках летит
И голосок ее звучит
Нежней свирельного напева:
Как ваше имя?   Смотрит он
И отвечает: Агафон.

It's from Evgeny Onegin and there is a website that has translated the whole poem into English, and a few other of Pushkin's works as well.

The link to the stanza quoted above is here:-

http://www.pushkins-poems.com/Yev502.htm

It's about half way down the page:-

The night is frosty; the sky all clear;
 The stars in a wondrous caravan
 Move round so quietly, at peace...
 Tatyana into the garden's space
 Comes out to watch, to guess, to fear.
 She trains her mirror onto the moon,
 But in the dark glass is only seen
 The swimming melancholy of its face.
 Alas! The snow crunches - A passer by!
 She hastens towards him on tiptoe,
 And her voice rings out across the snow,
 More tender than a reed-pipe's tune:
 "What is your name?", but he is gone,
 But not without answering "Agafon".

[Turboguy]

On a side note I spoke this evening with a lovely and very beautiful girl from Ukraine who is 19 years old who works at my local supermarket.  I have spoken to her before and she has always been friendly, so this evening I asked her if she had a Russian or American boyfriend.  She immediately said American and was quick to say that she does not like Russian guys.  I than asked her how old her boyfriend was and she said 20 years old (perfectly normal!!). 

Now to continue the story I than asked my 19 year old friend what she would think about a 45 year old somewhat short man with a paunch who was going to marry a 19 year old girl from Ukraine.  She immediately laughed and said that the girl will leave him as soon as she gets her green card, no ifs ands or buts.

Let me start by saying that it is nice to see Billy posting again.  It keeps things interesting.
 
Rubicon, all your story really tells us is that if your local girl who works in a supermarket married an older man for a green card she would leave him after she got it.  People are all different and it is possible to find a young woman who is sincere about loving and marrying an older dude like Billy.
 
On the poem.  That sorta shows how bad Google translate is and some guys use it to persue their dreams.   
 
 

[GoodOlBoy]

...young woman...

She is a TEENAGER.
 
GOB finds it strange how many male RWD members have used words like "young woman, woman, young lady, legal now ....etc.) to describe "A".
 
I suppose the idea of a 40 something year old man courting a 16/17 yo teenager is a little uncomfortable to think about, so calling her a "young woman" (or whatever) is a little more palatable? eh? 
 
GOB

[GoodOlBoy]

Dunno bro. I don't know exactly what it is you're talking about as I don't really see a huge difference between the groups.

I posted about this years ago, but I will summarize my experiences here.
 
When I went on a dating site looking locally (Miami) for women in my age group (40-47), let me just say that the pictures in NO WAY matched the ladies, when we actually met face to face. 
 
On the other hand, of the few FSUW I did meet before my wife, their pictures were VERY accurate and sometimes (IMO) the FSU ladies actually looked better in person. 
 
JMO, but I wouldn't trust any AW's picture on a dating site as being accurate.
 
GOB