Novosibirsk Doesn't Believe in Tears: TwoBit's Sixteen Days In Novosibirsk

[Boethius]

One of the things that has helped me understand women better is books about evolutionary biology.  The ideal reproduction strategy for a man is that of Genghis Khan: be super alpha have as many children with as many women as possible through any means possible.  Obviously, not very men can do that.  But the men that can are in great demand.

Sorry, but that's one of the stupidist things I've read, and frankly, I don't believe you are stupid.  

Despite all your reading, TwoBit, I submit that you don't really understand women.  All the women on this thread have told you so, in one way or another, but you've rejected their comments.

Women have differing views on what is attractive.  I think most women want a man who projects confidence, but beyond that, everything is subjective.  Ultimately, a woman is going to live with the real you, not what you project, or some evolutionary theory.

[Jooky]

Part of the answer to this is how you define "alpha."

I agree, but I'll illustrate though an example why it's hard for me to buy into the whole evolutionary theory.

I grew up with a guy who since high school has always attracted many hot women.

As a kid he attended remedial schools and didn't go to college.  He's had drug problems since his teenage years and he's been in and out of jail and re-hab throughout his life. He went through a crazy religious cult phase. I'm sure he's gotten laid a million times but he hasn't fathered any children and likely never will.

As far as getting women, he's definitely the confident 'alpha' type.

But, genetically I'd have to say he's extremely deficient and because of this he's struggled through life. In a less caring country or era, this guy would be dead by now. If he fathered children, the mother would likely struggle to raise them on her own while the children would likely suffer from his same genetic deficiencies.

So... from an evolutionary perspective, what about someone like him would attract women subconsciously to him as a good genetic father?

This is an extreme case, but there are many similar guys.

[Jooky]

Boethius was posting as I was writing my last post:

Women have differing views on what is attractive.  I think most women want a man who projects confidence, but beyond that, everything is subjective.

This sums up what I've seen. Projecting confidence is the key.

I actually agree with most of what's taught by these recent schools of dating. I think it definitely works. However, I've never been able to apply it in my dating. I can think or plan ahead, but once I get to the date and I just don't give a sh*. Since I snapped out of a bad dating funk about 8 years ago, I haven't been nervous on a date, and when the moment happens I just go with the flow and enjoy it. In these years only once was I denied a second date. That was in San Francisco and I was a bit surprised. She gave me all the signs of interest, almost a bit too much. I know where I blew it though. I called her the next day and she was expecting me to play a harder game.

No loss. Dating is much easier in Russia. The games work for sure, but are much less necessary and effective than in California.

I have a different view of what's going on in Silicon Valley and much of the US. Women no longer need a leader, provider or good father. What they do need is a thrill, so they'll go for men who are more challenging and sexually exciting. That's about it. 

PS: I think you're doing fine. Your approach does seem to weed out the women that wouldn't be right for you so that you can focus on the one that is. Just don't let yourself get overwhelmed with the many choices!

[Ade]

You admit responding without having read the previous posts.  It was obvious you had not read the OPs' replies.  

Actually, I'd read some of his previous posts and it turned out after reading all of them that my conclusions, as far as I'm concerned, are still valid.

You said to confront the woman about smoking, did you miss his complete reply covering from politeness to wave effect in the community?  

Politeness? You are kidding me, right? Let me refresh your memory a little, he said, "About halfway through the meal Lena asks if she can smoke.  I play it cool and say it’s no problem, but I’m surprised.  For me, smoking is a showstopper." Politeness doesn't come into this. He lied, and lead her to believe that smoking wasn't an issue when in fact, in his words, it's a "show stopper". And, FWIW, there are many ways of remaining polite and honest.

Also you said: "I have to agree with myself. There's no substitute for being totally oneself."  In case you missed this:  It is also possible to change and improve "oneself."  Which for the purposes intended and the outcome presumed, is exactly what TBB is attempting.  Your comments reflect the attitude that "People must take me as I am..."  Just remember, if you are a jerk, that is what people will "take you to be..."

What TBB is describing is going beyond "self improvement" and seems to have more to do with adhering to some twisted "bad guy" ideal that's apparently more attractive to "high value" women. What TBB needed to do is be confident in himself, not let anyone screw him over and find women that really are class acts. These are pretty basic principles that don't require acting like an ass.

In the Kingdom of the Blind the one eyed man is King (though truth be told, his vision is imperfect). The internet is a similar place where: "The pen is mighty..."  and it is often the provence of cowards as there is "...[no] sword."  Such statements as: "playing at being men," really do not add much.  And that particular insult seems the major point of your comments.  It sounds so superior, are you really?

 

[I/O]

I kinda lost track a few pages back, been busy, did our hero catch a serious fish yet or is he still trying to explain / demonstrate how to bait a hook?

[Jooky]

I kinda lost track a few pages back, been busy, did our hero catch a serious fish yet or is he still trying to explain / demonstrate how to bait a hook?

It sounded like just as he narrowed things down, the girl to focus on was too tired for a date and another interesting prospect filled the gap. I guess we'll see what happens today. Now it's the weekend, so it's time for him to get busy. 

[Ade]

Here's a bit of free advice to anyone; the odds are pretty good that if, after 3 dates, the woman in question doesn't let your lips near hers, then it's time to move on no matter how much hair twirling and hand holding is going on. 

[brad5959]

I kinda lost track a few pages back, been busy, did our hero catch a serious fish yet or is he still trying to explain / demonstrate how to bait a hook?

robots with artificial intelligence cannot bait hooks!!!!!!

[TwoBitBandit]

I agree, but I'll illustrate though an example why it's hard for me to buy into the whole evolutionary theory.

I grew up with a guy who since high school has always attracted many hot women.

As a kid he attended remedial schools and didn't go to college.  He's had drug problems since his teenage years and he's been in and out of jail and re-hab throughout his life. He went through a crazy religious cult phase. I'm sure he's gotten laid a million times but he hasn't fathered any children and likely never will.

As far as getting women, he's definitely the confident 'alpha' type.

But, genetically I'd have to say he's extremely deficient and because of this he's struggled through life. In a less caring country or era, this guy would be dead by now. If he fathered children, the mother would likely struggle to raise them on her own while the children would likely suffer from his same genetic deficiencies.

So... from an evolutionary perspective, what about someone like him would attract women subconsciously to him as a good genetic father?

The "cad" strategy can be effective.  Cuckolding is common in many species, including humans.  It's estimated that about 10%-15% of people aren't being raised by their biological father.

Your friend may have children and not even know it.  And even if one of his flings knows that her husband isn't the father, she's not likely to go to her mate and say, "Honey, our son looks just like Jooky's friend from the bar that we met ten months ago!"  And she wouldn't be likely to notify your friend.  Your friend doesn't have any money to garnish and he could cause problems in her marriage.  There's no real incentive for this theoretical woman to notify your friend that he's a father.  For all we know, your friend could have been more reproductively successful than you and I.

Low intelligence tends to be correlated with low impulse control, which can be a desirable mating trait because it looks a lot like confidence.  The age of first intercourse is significantly lower for men of low intelligence than for high intelligence.

In the modern age intelligence matters a lot.  But, in an earlier pre-civilization age, intelligence probably mattered less.  If the warriors from one cave are going to go gang up on the warriors in the next cave and take their food and women, low impulse control will probably help them be successful at that.

[Aloe]

The "cad" strategy can be effective.  Cuckolding is common in many species, including humans.  It's estimated that about 10%-15% of people aren't being raised by their biological father.

Your friend may have children and not even know it.  And even if one of his flings knows that her husband isn't the father, she's not likely to go to her mate and say, "Honey, our son looks just like Jooky's friend from the bar that we met ten months ago!"  And she wouldn't be likely to notify your friend.  Your friend doesn't have any money to garnish and he could cause problems in her marriage.  There's no real incentive for this theoretical woman to notify your friend that he's a father.  For all we know, your friend could have been more reproductively successful than you and I.

Low intelligence tends to be correlated with low impulse control, which can be a desirable mating trait because it looks a lot like confidence.  The age of first intercourse is significantly lower for men of low intelligence than for high intelligence.

In the modern age intelligence matters a lot.  But, in an earlier pre-civilization age, intelligence probably mattered less.  If the warriors from one cave are going to go gang up on the warriors in the next cave and take their food and women, low impulse control will probably help them be successful at that.

Here is a video that shows where this is all headed

[youtube=425,350]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSROlfR7WTo[/youtube]

[I/O]

The age of first intercourse is significantly lower for men of low intelligence than for high intelligence.

And..............so it may be but, when I think back, redneckish though it may be, I wouldn't swap 16 and being laid like a recycled egg for being a 45 y/o virgin because I still managed to have a reasonable education and had a crap load of fun into the bargain.

[Kuna]

I'm going to follow this thread very closely because I/O's comments are bloody funny!   


IMHO some men try to apply too much theory and strategy and they miss the beauty in life and love.  This is quite a call from me as I feel I executed my search "on plan" - probably more than most.

Whilst "game", NLP, "rules of attraction" and all of the other crap we use to get laid at home may work similarly OS (and I have some pretty incredible crap that worked for 10+ years) , I found it refreshing to drop all the BS when in Ukraine - and as a result I found someone, and something, different and lasting.

Everyone decides on their own path and actions...  but if someone is "learning to attract women", he better also consider "learning how to hold on to her" once he brings her home. 

Real relationships can't be managed so clinically.

I'm enjoying your TR TBB...  great writing...  but I'd encourage you to relax.  Eventually it just comes down to two (genuine) people feeling confident and comfortable enough to let love happen.

[Lily]

One of the things that has helped me understand women better is books about evolutionary biology.  The ideal reproduction strategy for a man is that of Genghis Khan: be super alpha have as many children with as many women as possible through any means possible.  Obviously, not very men can do that.  But the men that can are in great demand.
 

Oh yes. Nailed here. I also read about evolutionary biology elaborated by Russian researchers, and this turned my knowledge of male thinking by 180 grad. Before reading that, I though that men think just like I do. They want the best female that they can find. However, it turns out that men want several females who are probably not the best, but who are many and different. The Coolidge effect.

Men want as many different women as possible, because they are predisposed to this by nature. Civilization is created in order, but not limited to, keeping natural urges under control. Therefore, influenced by civilization, some men may adopt civilized thinking and openly declare that they want only one woman. Because they know that they are expected to say so, and that the society welcomes that thinking.

On the other hand, alpha males are in great demand among women. Nevertheless, we seldom see a pure alpha man. Probably, the James Bond would come close to that; but he is not a real person, although incarnated by a real man called Sean Connery More often in life, we see men who combine all alpha, beta and eventually gamma and delta qualities. Their rank potential is something of mosaic. They would also be attractive for women, if they keep the latter qualities unseen and exhibit some alpha behavior.

To this I'd probably add that women, even those who are not going to bear children with the man, still look for a good genes provider. But that's another story. TBB however touched upon the subject in his elaborations, hope people noticed ..

[Gator]

I kinda lost track a few pages back, been busy, did our hero catch a serious fish yet or is he still trying to explain / demonstrate how to bait a hook?

[Blues Fairy]

But, if you remove the constraint of needing the guy to stick around and be the provider, she’ll always go for the alpha male.  This is exactly what feminism has done for women in the west: they don’t need the beta provider. 

Now Russia is a wholly different culture.  The beta-provider frame is a viable strategy.

So you are after a "statistical" simplistic girl, after all.  No deep relationship with a unique, odds-defying person anticipated.  

[Gator]

Here is a video that shows where this is all headed

Aloe, you really impress me.  You are young, a native Russian living in Belgium with a Belgian husband.  Yet, you express much wisdom in subtle ways with English language and in the frame [forgive me] of American/English culture.  

Let us play a "What If."   What if you were not married, were an upper 20s still living in Russia, not listed with a marriage agency, and you went out on a first date with TwoBit?  What would have to happen for you to become really interested in TwoBit and want a second and third date?

Other RW please jump in.

[Gator]

Here's a bit of free advice to anyone; the odds are pretty good that if, after 3 dates, the woman in question doesn't let your lips near hers, then it's time to move on no matter how much hair twirling and hand holding is going on. 

I think the rule is sex by the third date.  Oh wait, that would be for AW.

Seriously, I did not meet a RW who is really interested in you who would wait longer than three dates for mind blowing sex.  My sample size is neither large nor small, and I rarely was dating RW concurrently, serially yes, but not concurrently.

[Ade]

I think the rule is sex by the third date.  Oh wait, that would be for AW.

Seriously, I did not meet a RW who is really interested in you who would wait longer than three dates for mind blowing sex.  My sample size is neither large nor small, and I rarely was dating RW concurrently, serially yes, but not concurrently.

Generally, in a one to one situation I'd agree although there are always exceptions. But in a case like this where all his dates at least suspect he's on a VM kinda trip, I think they're likely to be more cautious. The head turning/lack of a kiss would definitely send negative signals to me regardless of any other positive signals to the contrary.

[Gator]

In reality the guys I've know with the most game, who get the most action, just don't fit the good genes or good father mold.

I do not know what you mean by "most action."  How do you know what the quiet men are getting?  

There are many, many ways to seduce a woman.  I received more than my share of sexual pleasure with women.  I had many "strike outs," yet essentially "received" ("got" sounds too harsh) as much as I wanted excepting a few dry periods when I refused to lower my standards.  And I have always had "family man" values.  

My encounters resulted from seducing her mind with my own recipe for charm:  attention,  wit, and intellect wrapped around relaxed conversation.  I will admit that I do not recall once when the woman was in heat figuratively, so I must have struck out with them.  And I did not talk about it with others.

[Gator]

Men want as many different women as possible, because they are predisposed to this by nature.

Lily, you have written this before.  Please don't assume that this is true.

To paraphrase, Abe Lincoln - all the men may desire such some of the time, and even some men all of the time, but not all the men all the time. 

In my mind, being involved with two women is trouble. 

[Gator]

... but I'd encourage you to relax. 

TwoBit, others are telling you the same.  Its the weekend, enjoy yourself.  This is the time to have lots of fun.

I hope we do not see you back here posting until Monday.  And then tell us about what happened.

[SFandEE]

Here is a video that shows where this is all headed

Good for a laugh.  I kept hoping Clevon would find a way to help Carol out with her need for a child and get Trevor to do the all important nurturing.  It would seem Carol was not within Clevon's very large "frame" of influence. 

Maybe Clevon could have found a way to contribute artificially (a la Peter Griffin--Family Guy style) Alas, perhaps Trevor was helpful in some way in restoring Clevon's potency before he met his most unfortunate reproductive end.

Carol did not seem like a very sexually satisfied woman, poor thing.

[Gtex]

SJ: check your pms...

[Daveman]

Well after reading all of this, all I really have to say is:

Evgenia! Evgenia! Evgenia!  sounds like such a fun girl and can Cha Cha!

Cute and fun beats the living hell out of gorgeous and pain in the ass every time.  

[innakrug]

If i had a choice who to go on a date with - a macho man with tons of women running after him, or a more on the shy side guy, who doesn't go on dates very often, id choose the shy guy, hands down. There is also a lot bigger chance that he will appreciate you a lot more than the macho man with 10 women at his beck and call

+1 Absolutely agree with Aloe. Wouldn't even come close to "Macho man" They are to spoiled.