Cursing women

[Misha]

The Viking settlement in Newfoundland suggests it was there for seven or eight years.  It has also been suggested they made contact with first nations, a tribe long since extinct.  No suggestion the Vikings were driven out.


I think you missed the point about the history, Misha.

No, I did not miss the point Boethius    As for the Vikings in Newfoundland, the epics are clear that the "skraelings" were hardly welcoming.

[Gylden]

The cathedral of Trier, Germany, construction began in 326.

Let's see some pictures of buildings in Canada at that time.

[Boethius]

No, I did not miss the point Boethius    As for the Vikings in Newfoundland, the epics are clear that the "skraelings" were hardly welcoming.

The Vikings were there continuously for 7 or 8 years.

Yes, you did miss the point.  There is a continuity to being  "people" that North Americans don't have.   It's not better or worse, but that is a fact.  Your posts prove you didn't get it.

[Misha]

The Vikings were there continuously for 7 or 8 years.

Yes, you did miss the point.  There is a continuity to being  "people" that North Americans don't have.   It's not better or worse, but that is a fact.  Your posts prove you didn't get it.

Continuity to being a people? All peoples have "continuity" and this is what you do not get. Given that we are all descended from the same ancestors tens of thousands of years ago, and they in turn from ancestors roaming the planet hundreds of thousands of years ago, all histories of all peoples are as old and as ancient.... What differs are the ways in which individuals will try to feed and justify their superiority complexes   

[Gylden]

Misha, where are your family roots from?
 
I think you missed the point as well.
 
 

[Misha]

Misha, where are your family roots from?
 
I think you missed the point as well.

Let's see, French from Normandie, so I am probably part viking as well    However, even if I was, I would still see this fact as meaningless to the person that I am now    However, the point is simple: quite often, people from the FSU will gloss over the "truth" to gain an advantage (real or perceived). That advantage might be material or it might simply be to boost their egos.


As for the proclaimed "thousand year histories" of Ukraine, Russia or wherever, the simple fact of the matter is that 95% of the people living in these countries in these thousand years would have been peasants and serfs doing their best to survive   


But, I still stand by my statement that it is extremely rude to put down the people of another country for their "lack of history" notably when you have chosen to immigrate to that country 

[Misha]

The cathedral of Trier, Germany, construction began in 326.

Let's see some pictures of buildings in Canada at that time.

Should I post a few photos of the pyramids of Egypt and ask you what 3,000 year old buildings or structures there are in Germany rivalling the pyramids  Should I then lecture the Germans as to how they don't have any "history" as their history is not as ancient...

[Gylden]

I agree Misha, it is rude to put down people, in whatever way it is done.
However, the richness of European history is difficult to ignore.It doesn't mean Canadians or Americans (or should I say the United States of Americans, to avoid another distraction) are inferior.
 
 
 

[Rubicon]

Your point being? Sure the Vikings visited, but they fled, certainly driven out by the indigenous peoples 

They were not driven out by "indigenous peoples".  The Templars from Scotland built a structure on the Eastern seaboard which is still there today, and they went as far as Minnesota.  The Templars became The Masons and founded the United States of America.  Most of the founding fathers were Masons and you can see their handiwork on the dollar bill and on Washington DC buildings and more.

[Rubicon]

The Viking settlement in Newfoundland suggests it was there for seven or eight years.  It has also been suggested they made contact with first nations, a tribe long since extinct.  No suggestion the Vikings were driven out.


I think you missed the point about the history, Misha.

There is evidence that First Nations tribe and The Vikings got along just fine.  Neither one was trying to drive the other out.

[Misha]

I agree Misha, it is rude to put down people, in whatever way it is done.
However, the richness of European history is difficult to ignore.It doesn't mean Canadians or Americans (or should I say the United States of Americans, to avoid another distraction) are inferior.

I agree, but I also believe that other regions of the world have rich histories.

[Ade]

Ade,
it can easily be taken as condescending when you  state *you guys* like you are perhaps the only man capable or lucky enough to have met a sincere honest woman.

Well AJ, I never intended to imply that others wouldn't or couldn't be as lucky as I. And you may have missed me saying "some" and "most" and that is probably why you seem to think I'm saying "all", which I'm not. Yes, I think my wife is very exceptional in terms of her character, but exceptional is not the same as unique, and I'm pretty sure there are quite a few like minded women as my wife in the FSU. It's just that from my relatively recent experiences, there are plenty more that aren't.

And yes, bad people are everywhere and all of that. But like I said, or perhaps meant to say, I'm drawing these conclusions from a rather varied sample of women from a wide variety of backgrounds and upbringings. Birds of a feather, you say. Well, no, not really, just a bunch of newly arrived and/or married FSUW that have the FSU as a common denominator that met through language courses, work, friends of friends or some forum or other. To me this seems a little more than an oddity and makes this mindset far more prevalent than I've ever witnessed in Western Europe.

And yes, most of the world revolves on these social little graces otherwise known as "lies" but I don't practice them whether you believe that or not. I do know how to be diplomatic though; not all truths, even hurtful ones need to be worded bluntly.

And as for being able to detect these character traits. lol. Yeah, of course. You are still talking about WM, seeing their wives to be for a few weeks or a few months before getting married and can hardly communicate in full sentences half the time, right? Seriously, here's my guess; most of the women of dubious character that men "catch out" are not very good at deception. The rest end up married to a lot of guys out there. I know quite a few of them now.

Like I said. Good luck.

[Jooky]

Wasn't the original post concerned with being cursed at (bitched at, nagged, cursed out)? He did mention some trip report where the guy was getting yelled at by his tantrum throwing young chick.
Anyways, for JT, nope it's not normal. Some guys will put up with a lot of bs in order to keep a young hottie around (or not so young and not so hottie), but it's not any more common in Russia than anywhere else and it's definitely not necessary.
 

[OlgaH]

I remember one awkward situation happened in our company in Russia. We had a small party and there was a German gentleman in his late 40s among us who was doing some kind of business in our city. While we had a conversation he suddenly "shot" a profanity phrase in Russian from his mouth and started to laugh while we being in shock were looking at him. I don't know who was that kind person who taught the German man and did not explain him the real meaning of the phrase but the German man was sure that the phrase was very funny. When he was politely explained what the phrase meant, his face turned red and he of course apologized.

I also remember when one forum member proudly "inserted" a Russian profanity in his post as he learned a new word from his FSU wife and her friends, but that really grated upon the ears (or the eyes should I say) and I felt sorry for the guy.

[OlgaH]

****

[Ranetka]

I am saying that the contemporary state of Ukraine is not the direct descendant of Kievan Rus. 

While of course modern days Ukraine is not a direct descendant of Kievan Rus there is a direct relation between the two. I realised it when I went to Saint Sofia in Kiev. I have seen the tombs of people who are characters in Russian folk tales and whose names I heard from an early age (like Владимир Красное Солнышко).  So yes to me Kievan Rus is my direct roots as many other things in pre-soviet and pre-Romanov history. Can you say this about Canadian ingenious population history? With respect I do not think so Misha.

[Gator]

Olga,
 
I can not imagine you ever using the F-word.   

[OlgaH]

Olga,
 
I can not imagine you ever using the F-word.   

Gator, I'm guilty. Sometimes I do though not often, sometimes in the jokes ( blaming on comedians and movies) and usually in very very close company of our friends,  and sometimes like WTF when last day I saw a sick almost bold squirrel with terrible bleeding sores all over her small body in my garden drinking from birdbath

But Russian profanity no-no, even when I hurt my toe or elbow I usually use yo-mahyo or word F if it is too bad 

[Misha]

So yes to me Kievan Rus is my direct roots as many other things in pre-soviet and pre-Romanov history. Can you say this about Canadian ingenious population history? With respect I do not think so Misha.

Actually, I can and I will. The oral traditions and practices go back centuries or longer. Though the indigenous cultures have been brutalized in recent history, their history and culture is as old, as noble and as valuable as anything Europe has to offer.

[OlgaH]

In my middle 20s I was working as a deputy principle of the summer camps. One summer I got a camp for children with mental disorders and deviant behavior. My Gosh, I never heard so much profanity in my life. But I should admit that form one boy's mouth it was almost like a song  he did it so naturally and poetic! But sometimes there were such turns that I had to ask him to translate, you should see his face when he tried to find the normal decent Russian words to explain what he wanted to say.

BTW Alexander Pushkin also wrote poems using Russian profanity. But there is a big difference between profanity in literature where the vulgarism disappears due to an author's talent and profanity in everyday life. I met a few Russian women in the U.S. who could not talk in Russian without using profanity. While we were talking in English everything was just fine, but when we were alone and speaking in Russian I felt very uncomfortable, and honestly I had no desire to be in their company again. It was just too vulgar.

But I also know some Russians who know how to use profanity not sounding vulgar and it is a talent and these people are genuine intellectuals, one of them is a professor of Ethics, Aesthetics and Philosophy 

[Ranetka]

Actually, I can and I will. The oral traditions and practices go back centuries or longer. Though the indigenous cultures have been brutalized in recent history, their history and culture is as old, as noble and as valuable as anything Europe has to offer.

I do not doubt their history at all. But can you say their history is yours?
 
I have saying in my language I use going back to 1200s ("незваный гость хуже татарина" for ex). What is left from Indians in your culture?

[Misha]

I do not doubt their history at all. But can you say their history is yours?
 
I have saying in my language I use going back to 1200s ("незваный гость хуже татарина" for ex). What is left from Indians in your culture?

Is their history mine? Partially. For better or for worse, my culture has been interacting with my culture for centuries. The French in Canada learned about nature from their indigenous neighbours, learned how to make a variety of goods from them (including the cliched maple syrop and maple sugar) as well as snowshoes, toboggans) and some say that the Iroquois idea of confederacy influenced the development of North American democracy. Likewise, the European colonizers brought with them a culture that is European and is just as old, while adding to it. Following your logic, we should discount any product of Orthodoxy as it was an import from Constantinople  Oh, and let's not forget the Italian Renaissance architects who helped design much of the Kremlin and many of the iconic buildings that define contemporary Russia     


But, I will reiterate, it is sad when you must put down others to boost your ego whether as an individual or as a culture. To say that Canada has no culture or history because our churches aren't old and musty enough is incredibly misguided and naive. We are all the products of a long history. Some of that history occurred within the national borders, some took place outside those borders, but that history cannot be discounted.

[Jumper]

Ade, Thanks for clarifying.
 
I have seen similar here and there as well of course,
and also in my prior post i addressed *how would western men know* anyway..
We probably agree more than disagree in the topic.
 
I just find there to be enough exceptions, that a generality is very hard to make.I  believe a man (or woman) tends to attract like minded individuals, which includes behaviours,thoughts and ideals (ethics etc)
Yes, I do recognize the language barrier and the amusing bit of trying to really know someone well through that,or in a short time frame.
 
on the flip side, I can say with some certainty while working over there i could read a potential business associate or representative, with pretty good accuracy within one meeting.Would I base a lifetime of marriage on the accuracy of a business meeting time frame ? :lol: no!!
 
 
 
Jooky-
yes exactly.
and  the OPs original question was what i was trying to answer.
I agree with you that if he has this impression from trip reports, they do not reflect the scenario he should find himself in (unless he dates a trucker , sailor, or bar fly)
 

[Anotherkiwi]

Just so you know, Canadians are not Americans    No more than Norway is Swedish  ...

Misha, Canadians are Americans - you live in the continent of North America.  While 99.9% of the world seems to think that only people who live in the United States are "Americans," you should note that I and many others do not - I always try to refer specifically to the USA where it is warranted in the context of a particular post.  This stems from a story I saw many years ago about a diplomat from Argentina who pointed out, when some pompous prat from the USA was going on about how only people from the USA were Americans, that there are many other countries which are part of "America."
 
As for Norway and Sweden...yes, they're separate now, but they used to be part of the same kingdom.  In any case, in this sort of discussion, I think most would be happy (?)/satisfied to be referred to as "Scandinavians."
 
My apologies to the OP - this is so far    that it deserves its own thread. 

[Jooky]

What is left from Indians in your culture?

Popcorn. 
(No joke)